LaxPower Back-Up Stick

Laxattackjack wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 12:02 pm

HooDat wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 9:55 am

Laxattackjack wrote: ↑Wed Apr 12, 2023 4:14 pm

InsiderRoll wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 10:33 pm

Laxattackjack wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 10:17 pm

ODAD wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 10:00 pm No one is disputing Greensboro, southern Virginia and Ohio northern are not good opponents. CPU programs enthusiasts create are cool and all, but when you look at the number of USILA top 20 teams in both OOC schedules, W&L has 4 and HSC has 3. Lynchburg has 6 - that was mainly my point. At the end of the day I would argue that head to head is more important than SOS when comparing teams in general, but I understand that’s not how tournament bids work. The undefeated Pfeiffers of the world will still get in when all top 4 ODAC schools should off of merit alone. That’s the unfortunate part of D3 lacrosse

The goal is to grow the game. Conference winners get in. The at large should really go to non hotbed teams. Sending 4 teams from one conference isn’t growing the sport at all

The goal isn’t to grow the game, it’s to create the most competitive tournament possible. When UNICEF sponsors college athletics then the goal will be to grow the game.

If this were true, why allow low level teams from low level conferences? The NCAA would just take the top 32 teams. They have never done that as long as I have followed the sport.

Because "Cinderella stories" are compelling. And the conference directors demand inclusion at some level.

This debunks your theory of allowing 4 teams from the ODAC. If Roanoke was a Cinderella story, they wouldn’t have a mediocre season, then get knocked out in the semis of the ODAC, just to start the Cinderella run after they fall in. The ODAC playoffs are the time for become a Cinderella.

And beyond the parents of that 4th and 5th seed of each conference, no one else wants to see them in the tourney.

Win your conference and get in. And if you are really good, you get an at large. The same way every other sport does it.

Still not understanding why someone would want to omit a conference champ from the tourney.

I understand the idea of including conference winners but, it dilutes the competition at the D3 level by leaving teams out and including teams that lose by double digits in first round. I understand why they are included- they won their conference but, would be interesting to see a tournament with just the top 32 teams overall.

Laxattackjack wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 10:17 pm

ODAD wrote: ↑Tue Apr 11, 2023 10:00 pm No one is disputing Greensboro, southern Virginia and Ohio northern are not good opponents. CPU programs enthusiasts create are cool and all, but when you look at the number of USILA top 20 teams in both OOC schedules, W&L has 4 and HSC has 3. Lynchburg has 6 - that was mainly my point. At the end of the day I would argue that head to head is more important than SOS when comparing teams in general, but I understand that’s not how tournament bids work. The undefeated Pfeiffers of the world will still get in when all top 4 ODAC schools should off of merit alone. That’s the unfortunate part of D3 lacrosse

The goal is to grow the game. Conference winners get in. The at large should really go to non hotbed teams. Sending 4 teams from one conference isn’t growing the sport at all

Such an astute point, glad someone had the courage to say it. We need to revoke the 2016 and 2018 national championships from Salisbury and Wesleyan, both of whom are hotbed teams that failed to win their conference in those years. We also must asterisk the silver medals in 2019 and 2022 for Amherst and Union for the same reasons.

What I am getting from this thread if that y’all just want to see the ODAC conference winner crowed as the champion.

I guess we will have to disagree.

By the way, if a team like Roanoke, that is currently ranked 39th on the Massey poll. (The only poll I can find that ranks that far back). If Roanoke falls in the first round of the ODAC, to Lynchburg or HSC, they are not going to be a top 32 team. If Roanoke beats Lynchburg in the semis, then loses to HSC in the final, they might move up a little, but probably not breaking the top 30. If a top 15 team loses its conference championship, they are not dropping out of the top 30, and will still get that invite.

I really think the top 30-35 teams are invited. And the bottom 5- 10 are coming from the winners of the bottom bracket. There were a few blowouts once you get past the play in games. But hey, RIT beat TUFTS by 11 in the bracket.

Someone put together a “bracketology” on this board. It lists all 28 automatic bid conferences. I only see 7 or 8 that a 4th seed ODAC team would be favored. And the bottom 12 teams are playing on Wednesday on play in day, so 6 won’t even make it to the bracket if 32. We are really only looking at a small handful of very bad teams in the bracket if 32.

Bottom line, if your team can’t make the final round of your conference playoffs, you probably shouldn’t be in the final 32 bracket.

Laxattackjack wrote: ↑Thu Apr 13, 2023 1:35 pm Someone put together a “bracketology” on this board. It lists all 28 automatic bid conferences. I only see 7 or 8 that a 4th seed ODAC team would be favored. And the bottom 12 teams are playing on Wednesday on play in day, so 6 won’t even make it to the bracket if 32. We are really only looking at a small handful of very bad teams in the bracket if 32.

FWIW, the old Laxpower ratings would have Roanoke (#33) as a favorite against 18/28 Pool A teams in InsiderRoll's most recent bracketology. They are rated behind only Gettysburg (Centennial), Tufts (NESCAC), RIT (Liberty), York (MAC-C), Stevens (MAC-F), Denison (NCAC), Babson (NEWMAC), Lynchburg (ODAC), Geneseo (SUNYAC), and Cabrini (Cabrini and Friends).

The top 32 teams right now come from mostly the Big 3 conferences:
8 teams - NESCAC
6 teams - Centennial
5 teams - Liberty
2 teams - ODAC, C2C, NEWMAC, SUNYAC, MAC-C
1 team - NCAC, Cabrini, MAC-F

You made the point. Another poll that has them ranked outside of the top 32. They will either win the ODAC, or lose more games and drop further outside of the top 32. The only scenario that has Roanoke cracking the top 32 is winning out, and winning the ODAC. Which would give them an automatic bid. And if they can’t win the ODAC, they are not even a top 32 team. The argument was, the best 32 teams should get in.


Back to the original response. Win your conference, and you get in. Come in 4th place, in an average conference, you can’t be upset if you don’t make the bracket

And no offense, by lax power rankings are flawed. I am a York fan. They are ranked 6 on that poll. Ahead of Amhearst, who beat them a few weeks ago. York isn’t a top 6 team. And I really don’t think Roanoke would beat 18 of the 28 automatic bid teams. Like I said earlier, the bottom 12 teams (many of them will be the automatic bid teams) will play each other in the “play in game”. Those 6 winners will be part of the final 32 teams for the bracket. Those are the 6 teams that Roanoke would probably be favored today. But by the time those 6 teams get that far, they will have won their conference, then won a “bracket” game. Likely be on a several game winning streak.

The system isn’t perfect. It adding a 4th seed team from an average conference, that wasn’t even ranked in the top 32, isn’t going to make the bracket better

Awfully quiet after RMC just beat Lynchburg 13-8 …

Oaklax wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:01 pm Awfully quiet after RMC just beat Lynchburg 13-8 …

That was a big kneecap for chances of at large berth for Lynchburg

That has to be humbling for Lynchburg. 8 in the nation losing to an unranked team. They will fall in the rankings.

The universe is misaligned. Can’t imagine under any scenario that Randy Mac wind this game. Gotta see this on the webcast. Congrats to Randy, players will recall this win for a long time…… Ah there it is , goal play. Does Lynchburg have to win the AQ now ?

Can't believe Lynchburg lost 13-9 to Randolph-Macon of all teams. Quite possibly the most shocking upsets in the last 20 years of ODAC lacrosse. This game had no business even being competitive, to the point where I didn't even look at the ODAC scores because none of the games involving the top four should have been competitive. This is the same Randolph-Macon team that lost 22-7 at W&L and 17-9 at H-SC, a game which frankly was more lopsided than the final score indicates.

Poor Virginia Wesleyan has Lynchburg next, oh man that's going to get especially ugly if Lynchburg bounces back with that focused anger energy...

thescottharris wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 4:45 pm Can't believe Lynchburg lost 13-9 to Randolph-Macon of all teams. Quite possibly the most shocking upsets in the last 20 years of ODAC lacrosse. This game had no business even being competitive, to the point where I didn't even look at the ODAC scores because none of the games involving the top four should have been competitive. This is the same Randolph-Macon team that lost 22-7 at W&L and 17-9 at H-SC, a game which frankly was more lopsided than the final score indicates.

Yes W&L was up 19-2 at one point vs Randolph-Macon then they emptied the bench.

How does Lynchburg only take 20 shots. I will watch the tape on this one. Very good game for Randy Mac goalie. Hadley struggled a bit but still. Didn’t Lynchburg recently play CNU to a one goal game. I’ve seen upsets but can’t think of many of this order

Dehuntshigwa’es wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 5:14 pm How does Lynchburg only take 20 shots. I will watch the tape on this one. Very good game for Randy Mac goalie. Hadley struggled a bit but still. Didn’t Lynchburg recently play CNU to a one goal game. I’ve seen upsets but can’t think of many of this order

Lynchburg had 47 shots with 23 on goal

Dehuntshigwa’es wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 5:14 pm How does Lynchburg only take 20 shots. I will watch the tape on this one. Very good game for Randy Mac goalie. Hadley struggled a bit but still. Didn’t Lynchburg recently play CNU to a one goal game. I’ve seen upsets but can’t think of many of this order

They played both Salisbury and CNU to a one-goal game. And beat Cabrini 11-7, Stevenson 12-8, F&M 13-12, W&L 14-13, and Roanoke 14-11.

Oaklax wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 3:01 pm Awfully quiet after RMC just beat Lynchburg 13-8 …

Must have been snowing at Randolph-Macon…

thescottharris wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 5:30 pm

Dehuntshigwa’es wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 5:14 pm How does Lynchburg only take 20 shots. I will watch the tape on this one. Very good game for Randy Mac goalie. Hadley struggled a bit but still. Didn’t Lynchburg recently play CNU to a one goal game. I’ve seen upsets but can’t think of many of this order

Lynchburg had 47 shots with 23 on goal

The box score incorrectly showed 20 on Lynchburg’s site. They didn’t add up the column correctly . Thought that was crazy

This is Lynchburg's first ODAC loss to a team not named Hampden-Sydney, Roanoke, or Washington & Lee since losing to Virginia Wesleyan 17-6 in 1998. It's their first loss to Randolph-Macon since 1993, 14-10. They also lost to Macon in 1989, 1986, and 1985.

thescottharris wrote: ↑Sat Apr 15, 2023 5:52 pm This is Lynchburg's first ODAC loss to a team not named Hampden-Sydney, Roanoke, or Washington & Lee since losing to Virginia Wesleyan 17-6 in 1998. It's their first loss to Randolph-Macon since 1993, 14-10. They also lost to Macon in 1989, 1986, and 1985.

Great job framing this Scott. This was an epic upset

Solid defense and goalie play by RMC. Well done!
4/29 a big night @ LYN.