ODAC 2023

[Laxattackjack]

What is the best way evaluate a team’s talent / ceiling?

A) Overall record / body of work?
B) How they are playing in April / Early May?

Both are obviously important, but I’m curious on what the different perspectives are when looking at a tournament team.

You have to look at the entire season. Second half of season is more important. Week 15 is more important than week 7, and week 7 is more important than week 1. Who they played. How they played, where they played. a loss to an unranked team is bad, but much worse if that loss comes in April or may.
I like a team with a few close losses to top teams on the road, vs a team with close losses to top teams at home. I really think home field is worth 1-2 goals. A road trip more than 4 hrs is worth 2-3 goals.

[Leonard Washington]

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

Care to elaborate on how big you feel this gap is, especially since the 2-time defending champs are involved in the equation?

[InsiderRoll]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

I think it is safe to say the favorites to reach the finals are the following

Good chance
Tufts
CNU
Salisbury
Amhearst

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

RIT
gettysburgh
Lynchburg
York

For any other team to make the finals, they will need almost everything to bounce their way, and have opponents play one of their worst games

Lynchburg and York have no shot of playing on Memorial Day. They have a combined 1 win vs top 20 caliber teams. And that is an overtime win that W&L gave away in similar fashion as Lynchburg did last night. In fact at the current moment both of them would barely or not at all get an at-large. That’s like saying W&L has a legit shot at Memorial Day, they don’t.

CNU seems to be peaking since the mustang. They aren’t playing at the same level they did before. Shooting percentage is way down. Cabiness is maybe banged up after the 4th qtr of the Lynchburg game.

Gettysburg has a major weakness in the goal unless Morgan gets healthy, FOs are below average for them as well. Best defense in D3, don’t really think it’s close.

[Laxattackjack]

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

Care to elaborate on how big you feel this gap is, especially since the 2-time defending champs are involved in the equation?

Tough to say how big the gap is. There is definitely a difference between the two groups. I also think on any given day, on a neutral site, any of the bottom group, could beat any of the top group.

[Laxattackjack]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

I think it is safe to say the favorites to reach the finals are the following

Good chance
Tufts
CNU
Salisbury
Amhearst

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

RIT
gettysburgh
Lynchburg
York

For any other team to make the finals, they will need almost everything to bounce their way, and have opponents play one of their worst games

Lynchburg and York have no shot of playing on Memorial Day. They have a combined 1 win vs top 20 caliber teams. And that is an overtime win that W&L gave away in similar fashion as Lynchburg did last night. In fact at the current moment both of them would barely or not at all get an at-large. That’s like saying W&L has a legit shot at Memorial Day, they don’t.

CNU seems to be peaking since the mustang. They aren’t playing at the same level they did before. Shooting percentage is way down. Cabiness is maybe banged up after the 4th qtr of the Lynchburg game.

Gettysburg has a major weakness in the goal unless Morgan gets healthy, FOs are below average for them as well. Best defense in D3, don’t really think it’s close.

You lost me at the first sentence. Didn’t even bother reading the rest.

[InsiderRoll]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

I think it is safe to say the favorites to reach the finals are the following

Good chance
Tufts
CNU
Salisbury
Amhearst

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

RIT
gettysburgh
Lynchburg
York

For any other team to make the finals, they will need almost everything to bounce their way, and have opponents play one of their worst games

Lynchburg and York have no shot of playing on Memorial Day. They have a combined 1 win vs top 20 caliber teams. And that is an overtime win that W&L gave away in similar fashion as Lynchburg did last night. In fact at the current moment both of them would barely or not at all get an at-large. That’s like saying W&L has a legit shot at Memorial Day, they don’t.

CNU seems to be peaking since the mustang. They aren’t playing at the same level they did before. Shooting percentage is way down. Cabiness is maybe banged up after the 4th qtr of the Lynchburg game.

Gettysburg has a major weakness in the goal unless Morgan gets healthy, FOs are below average for them as well. Best defense in D3, don’t really think it’s close.

You lost me at the first sentence. Didn’t even bother reading the rest.

Who have they beaten to date?

[Laxattackjack]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

I think it is safe to say the favorites to reach the finals are the following

Good chance
Tufts
CNU
Salisbury
Amhearst

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

RIT
gettysburgh
Lynchburg
York

For any other team to make the finals, they will need almost everything to bounce their way, and have opponents play one of their worst games

Lynchburg and York have no shot of playing on Memorial Day. They have a combined 1 win vs top 20 caliber teams. And that is an overtime win that W&L gave away in similar fashion as Lynchburg did last night. In fact at the current moment both of them would barely or not at all get an at-large. That’s like saying W&L has a legit shot at Memorial Day, they don’t.

CNU seems to be peaking since the mustang. They aren’t playing at the same level they did before. Shooting percentage is way down. Cabiness is maybe banged up after the 4th qtr of the Lynchburg game.

Gettysburg has a major weakness in the goal unless Morgan gets healthy, FOs are below average for them as well. Best defense in D3, don’t really think it’s close.

You lost me at the first sentence. Didn’t even bother reading the rest.

Who have they beaten to date?

That isn’t the point. For you to say a top 10 team doesn’t have a chance to make the finals, is ignorant.

By the way, if you are going to discount teams outside of the top group, then who have any of the top group beaten? Besides tufts beating Amhearst??

[InsiderRoll]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

I think it is safe to say the favorites to reach the finals are the following

Good chance
Tufts
CNU
Salisbury
Amhearst

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

RIT
gettysburgh
Lynchburg
York

For any other team to make the finals, they will need almost everything to bounce their way, and have opponents play one of their worst games

Lynchburg and York have no shot of playing on Memorial Day. They have a combined 1 win vs top 20 caliber teams. And that is an overtime win that W&L gave away in similar fashion as Lynchburg did last night. In fact at the current moment both of them would barely or not at all get an at-large. That’s like saying W&L has a legit shot at Memorial Day, they don’t.

CNU seems to be peaking since the mustang. They aren’t playing at the same level they did before. Shooting percentage is way down. Cabiness is maybe banged up after the 4th qtr of the Lynchburg game.

Gettysburg has a major weakness in the goal unless Morgan gets healthy, FOs are below average for them as well. Best defense in D3, don’t really think it’s close.

You lost me at the first sentence. Didn’t even bother reading the rest.

Who have they beaten to date?

That isn’t the point. For you to say a top 10 team doesn’t have a chance to make the finals, is ignorant.

By the way, if you are going to discount the and outside of the top group, then who have any of the top group beaten?

They don’t. Please Show me 1 year where a non top 5 level team made it to the national championship in D3 lacrosse?

2022 - #1 RIT vs #5 Union
2021 - #1 RIT vs # 2 Salisbury
2020 -
2019 - #4 Amherst vs #3 Cabrini
2018 - #1 Salisbury vs #4 Wesleyan
2017 - #1 Salisbury vs #3 RIT
2016 - #1 Tufts vs #2 Salisbury
2015 - #1 Tufts vs #4 Lynchburg
2014 - #1 Salisbury vs #2 Tufts
2013 - #3 Stevenson vs #4 RIT
2012 - #1 Salisbury vs #2 Cortland

It actually only get worse as you look even further back. In fact a 4 loss team has only made it two memorial weekend 2 times since 1998. Then you have to look at when Hobart was D3.

[Laxattackjack]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

I think it is safe to say the favorites to reach the finals are the following

Good chance
Tufts
CNU
Salisbury
Amhearst

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

RIT
gettysburgh
Lynchburg
York

For any other team to make the finals, they will need almost everything to bounce their way, and have opponents play one of their worst games

Lynchburg and York have no shot of playing on Memorial Day. They have a combined 1 win vs top 20 caliber teams. And that is an overtime win that W&L gave away in similar fashion as Lynchburg did last night. In fact at the current moment both of them would barely or not at all get an at-large. That’s like saying W&L has a legit shot at Memorial Day, they don’t.

CNU seems to be peaking since the mustang. They aren’t playing at the same level they did before. Shooting percentage is way down. Cabiness is maybe banged up after the 4th qtr of the Lynchburg game.

Gettysburg has a major weakness in the goal unless Morgan gets healthy, FOs are below average for them as well. Best defense in D3, don’t really think it’s close.

You lost me at the first sentence. Didn’t even bother reading the rest.

Who have they beaten to date?

That isn’t the point. For you to say a top 10 team doesn’t have a chance to make the finals, is ignorant.

By the way, if you are going to discount the and outside of the top group, then who have any of the top group beaten?

They don’t. Please Show me 1 year where a non top 5 level team made it to the national championship in D3 lacrosse?

2022 - #1 RIT vs #5 Union
2021 - #1 RIT vs # 2 Salisbury
2020 -
2019 - #4 Amherst vs #3 Cabrini
2018 - #1 Salisbury vs #4 Wesleyan
2017 - #1 Salisbury vs #3 RIT
2016 - #1 Tufts vs #2 Salisbury
2015 - #1 Tufts vs #4 Lynchburg
2014 - #1 Salisbury vs #2 Tufts
2013 - #3 Stevenson vs #4 RIT
2012 - #1 Salisbury vs #2 Cortland

It actually only get worse as you look even further back. In fact a 4 loss team has only made it two memorial weekend 2 times since 1998. Then you have to look at when Hobart was D3.

You are right. I will contact ncaa tomorrow and have them cancel the rest of the season , so we can just jump to the final 4. Thank you for clearing things up.

[DeepPocket]

You are right. I will contact ncaa tomorrow and have them cancel the rest of the season , so we can just jump to the final 4. Thank you for clearing things up.

Just don’t engage him. Everyone here has their bias’ and he’s no different (though he seems to think so).

It is silly to say a team has “no shot.” I don’t think too many gave Union a shot at playing in the ‘ship on April 2nd 2022.

[nescac commit]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

@insider where did you get that there would be no north and south regions for this years bracket? I have been looking all over NCAA website and can't find that anywhere

[Laxattackjack]

Everything you need to know about the tourney

https://www.ncaa.org/sports/2013/11/5/d ... rosse.aspx

[Carroll81]

I think this is the link you want:
https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/champi ... manual.pdf

[nescac commit]

I think this is the link you want:
https://ncaaorg.s3.amazonaws.com/champi ... manual.pdf

Correct me if I’m wrong, but this is the (exact?) same setup as last year. Even if it’s not, the wording implies there will still be a generally south and north portion of the bracket.

[2laxers]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

I think it is safe to say the favorites to reach the finals are the following

Good chance
Tufts
CNU
Salisbury
Amhearst

There is a gap to this next group. They all have a shot. All have played close games against the top group

RIT
gettysburgh
Lynchburg
York

For any other team to make the finals, they will need almost everything to bounce their way, and have opponents play one of their worst games

I’ve seen all 4 of the good chance teams and 3 of 4 the next teams in person and Tufts is 1 and there is a gap.

Lynchburg is 5 yards from the restraining line and a 50 yard clearing pass in 20 mph winds from being a top 5 team. Would have liked to see Lynchburg Tufts not play in a blizzard, I think Tufts wins by a few, but much a much better game.

I think all the teams listed have a shot if they put it together come May.

[InsiderRoll]

Ouch..
That clear pass to wide open Grant Voight was just a bit high. Goalie out of cage.. would have iced it.
4.2 second on the end line.. geez just grab Cook and wrap up. 3 seconds restart would be outside box below GLE..
Game ball to goalie who spied that pass with LYN man UP in OT… they were 2-2 UP at that point.. was that a coaches call or instinct? Shellenburger field is a great setting..

Some unbelievable games lately..
CNU is beatable. The south in wide open with 6-8 teams who can make it to Memorial Day
Sal
CNU
Getty
York
LYN - need Dylan Wolfe’s stretch shooting back!
W&L
Denison?
HSC?
Stevens may be in bracket too..

Ok. Let’s be serious. Denison, HSC, and stevens making it to Memorial Day???

Salisbury, Gettysburg, CNU, Tufts, RIT, maybe Amherst are the only teams that can make it to Memorial Day this year. There is no more north and south brackets so everyone is mixed.

@insider where did you get that there would be no north and south regions for this years bracket? I have been looking all over NCAA website and can't find that anywhere

When they moved the pod system they were able to get creative with their pairings.

That why you saw Lynchburg head to Schenectady to play WNE in the first round last year. Tufts and Salisbury met in the quarters. York Vs Union. Etc.

[Dehuntshigwa’es]

The York and Denison wins are diminishing in value to the Generals

How is the York win diminishing in value. York might be a top 10 team after this weekend.

York is 5-4 best win being Ursinus #19 at the time and Denison just lost to Kenyon. Bottom line is there are a lot of teams who aren’t what I thought they’d be; W&L, Lynchburg, York have all played below my expectations were for the season. What do I say about Denison besting Gettysburg and then lose to Kenyon. I agree on this thread with the comment there are only 4-5 teams who can with the National title this year, Tufts, RIT, CNU, Salisbury, maybe Gettysburg due their D

[Laxattackjack]

The York and Denison wins are diminishing in value to the Generals

How is the York win diminishing in value. York might be a top 10 team after this weekend.

York is 5-4 best win being Ursinus #19 at the time and Denison just lost to Kenyon. Bottom line is there are a lot of teams who aren’t what I thought they’d be; W&L, Lynchburg, York have all played below my expectations were for the season. What do I say about Denison besting Gettysburg and then lose to Kenyon. I agree on this thread with the comment there are only 4-5 teams who can with the National title this year, Tufts, RIT, CNU, Salisbury, maybe Gettysburg due their D

York and Lynchburg playing below your expectations? York lost on the road to RIT, Salisbury, Amhearst and W&L. Besides the W&L loss, which of those teams did you think York should have won? Lynchburg lost to CNU, Salisbury, tufts, and St Lawrence. Which of those top 10 teams did you expect Lynchburg should have been favored?

My view is there are 2-3 rock solid teams. And about 10 others that are very good. They are all beating each other up, early in the season.

When CNU plays Salisbury, one of them will lose. Doesn’t mean the loser is playing below expectations. They just played a really good team

[DeepPocket]

The York and Denison wins are diminishing in value to the Generals

How is the York win diminishing in value. York might be a top 10 team after this weekend.

York is 5-4 best win being Ursinus #19 at the time and Denison just lost to Kenyon. Bottom line is there are a lot of teams who aren’t what I thought they’d be; W&L, Lynchburg, York have all played below my expectations were for the season. What do I say about Denison besting Gettysburg and then lose to Kenyon. I agree on this thread with the comment there are only 4-5 teams who can with the National title this year, Tufts, RIT, CNU, Salisbury, maybe Gettysburg due their D

To be fair he’s saying “make it to Memorial Day” as in, even be runner up, not just the winner. We needn’t look further than Union last year to see how ridiculous that is. Tell me who your favorites are, heck tell me who the favorites are. But to list 4-5 teams and say nobody else has a chance is right on par with the arrogance frequently displayed. Just plain silly, but I suppose he will stop watching then, because he called it.

[InsiderRoll]

I agree with this. All of the teams mentioned are good teams. And quite frankly they are good enough to knock off a top ranked team. But not one of the teams being mentioned has truly proven they can win one of those games this year.

Let alone beat one of those teams the day after they face another top 10 level team.

I just don’t see it yet from a York, Lynchburg, W&L that they could win 5 in a row against top level teams. Especially because of their losses they will get a tough draw early.

Their hypothetical road would be something of this caliber.

Cabrini
Lynchburg/York/W&L
Gettysburg
RIT
Tufts

I think those teams could beat anyone of those opponents on the right day (Tufts seems daunting). But I’m not buying yet that they’ve proven they can win 5 straight of that caliber.