Israel and West Bank Settlements

[jhu72]

Logically, what is the more likely impetus to the reported increase in antisemitic attacks in the US ?

(a) Marjorie Taylor Greene's remarks comparing Pelosi's mask mandate to the Holocaust.

(b) Israel's bombing of Gaza.

If you get your news from MSNBC, it's due solely to (a) & unrelated to (b).

Greene's idiotic remarks are terribly insensitive. They trivialize the vilest event in human history. How do they incite antisemitic violence ?

... bullsh*t.

[Peter Brown]

Logically, what is the more likely impetus to the reported increase in antisemitic attacks in the US ?

(a) Marjorie Taylor Greene's remarks comparing Pelosi's mask mandate to the Holocaust.

(b) Israel's bombing of Gaza.

If you get your news from MSNBC, it's due solely to (a) & unrelated to (b).

Greene's idiotic remarks are terribly insensitive. They trivialize the vilest event in human history. How do they incite antisemitic violence ?

Good points above.

The media wants MTG to be the new Trump because libs always need a bugaboo.

[jhu72]

... Greene is just speaking for her people. Trumpnista rubes who think Hitler was just swell, you know what your party calls the good old days.

[MDlaxfan76]

You're certainly welcome to believe as you believe. But you can be confident that few would agree with you that it "proves" anything at all more than a chosen belief set, a singular textual interpretation not held by most Jews.

Bottom line is, just try to prove them wrong. I'd love to watch such a debate.

Again, trying to "prove" an interpretation is "wrong" is fruitless. Not that an alternative interpretation cannot be persuasive to others, based on text and logic, but because it won't convince those who, on faith, and justified by their own reading of text and logic, believe what they believe.

In this specific situation, far more Jewish scholars come to a different conclusion than do those who agree with this sect. Does that make it "proven"? Nope.

Note, I don't think those who claim that text provides Jews with a superior claim to create a Jewish state of Israel than other parties' claims to this land can 'prove' that claim to all. Nope.

[MDlaxfan76]

Logically, what is the more likely impetus to the reported increase in antisemitic attacks in the US ?

(a) Marjorie Taylor Greene's remarks comparing Pelosi's mask mandate to the Holocaust.

(b) Israel's bombing of Gaza.

If you get your news from MSNBC, it's due solely to (a) & unrelated to (b).

Greene's idiotic remarks are terribly insensitive. They trivialize the vilest event in human history. How do they incite antisemitic violence ?

... bullsh*t.

Agreed, he obviously doesn't watch MSNBC...it's quite clear there and on CNN that the conflict has prompted this surge, at this moment. There's no avoidance of the connection...the difference is that it's simply an excuse for anti-semitic hate to come out from under its rock.

And it's also clear that the rhetoric of politicians emboldens the haters.

So, here in this post above, we have yet one more example of blaming Jews for anti-semitic hate. Not the haters. Not those who encourage them. Old story.

[Matnum PI]

How is that? Because Jews can't be anti-Semitic? In large numbers, some of the biggest anti-Semites in world history were Jews. Even religious Jews.

Examples?

This is an old battle. When King David is writing poetry about his enemies, over and over, he writes about Jews. When the Prophets write about the people who are undermining the Jews, it's the Jews. jewish history is wrought with Jews undermining the jews. More recently, the biggest enemies of the Jews has been assimilating/assimilated Jews. The battles between the assimilated Jews and the "shtetl" Jews in Europe were epic. The assimilated Jews felt the reason why there was antisemitism was because the Jews wouldn't assimilate. The holocaust proved them wrong when both groups were treated equally but this battle between the two groups continues to rage on.

[Matnum PI]

Pretty good podcast this AM from The NY Times' The Daily about Hamas. Explains a lot pretty clearly and fairly.

[Peter Brown]

... Greene is just speaking for her people. Trumpnista rubes who think Hitler was just swell, you know what your party calls the good old days.

Hmmmmm.

Why are Democrats so anti-Semitic? When forced to choose between hamas and Israel, we all know who you’ll choose...

[jhu72]

... Greene is just speaking for her people. Trumpnista rubes who think Hitler was just swell, you know what your party calls the good old days.

Hmmmmm.

Why are Democrats so anti-Semitic? When forced to choose between hamas and Israel, we all know who you’ll choose...

^^^ weak sauce.

[Matnum PI]

There are enormous similarities between American Blacks in inner-city projects and Palestinians. Both are stuck in terrible situations and, due to these terrible situations, they are forced to have less-than-optimal partners to survive. For the blacks it's gangs, for the Palestinians it's Hamas. The gangs and Hamas are involved in terrible activities, both create chaos and death, and both the inner-city blacks and the Palestinians are all but forced to turn to them to survive. Initially they both had more of choice but now that the gangs and Hamas have power, it's relatively difficult to separate the one from the other. the inner-city blacks/Palestinians are continually victimized by the gangs/Hamas and, simultaneously, supported and taken care of by them. It's like an abusive husband. he'll love you. but, first, he needs to beat you. just a horrible situation. This doesn't mean the US and Israel have no role in the situation of the inner-city blacks or the Palestinians. they most certainly do. Especially in the creations of these situations. But in terms of solutions today, there are no simple ones.

[Brooklyn]

Again, trying to "prove" an interpretation is "wrong" is fruitless. Not that an alternative interpretation cannot be persuasive to others, based on text and logic, but because it won't convince those who, on faith, and justified by their own reading of text and logic, believe what they believe.

In this specific situation, far more Jewish scholars come to a different conclusion than do those who agree with this sect. Does that make it "proven"? Nope.

Note, I don't think those who claim that text provides Jews with a superior claim to create a Jewish state of Israel than other parties' claims to this land can 'prove' that claim to all. Nope.

Nut fruitless at all. The truth is that the Zionists know they will be embarrassed in a public debate because they are so wrong. Can't honestly say I'd blame them.

[Brooklyn]

... Greene is just speaking for her people. Trumpnista rubes who think Hitler was just swell, you know what your party calls the good old days.

Hmmmmm.

Why are Democrats so anti-Semitic? When forced to choose between hamas and Israel, we all know who you’ll choose...

There he goes, again!

Like Charles Schumer, Bernie Sanders, Jacob Frey, Joe Lieberman, Michael Bloomberg, etc all hate themselves and the others.

[Brooklyn]

How is that? Because Jews can't be anti-Semitic? In large numbers, some of the biggest anti-Semites in world history were Jews. Even religious Jews.

Examples?

This is an old battle. When King David is writing poetry about his enemies, over and over, he writes about Jews. When the Prophets write about the people who are undermining the Jews, it's the Jews. jewish history is wrought with Jews undermining the jews. More recently, the biggest enemies of the Jews has been assimilating/assimilated Jews. The battles between the assimilated Jews and the "shtetl" Jews in Europe were epic. The assimilated Jews felt the reason why there was antisemitism was because the Jews wouldn't assimilate. The holocaust proved them wrong when both groups were treated equally but this battle between the two groups continues to rage on.

King Saul may have been an enemy of David but it was because they were rivals, not because of anti Semitism. Kings deposed other kings all throughout European history again because of rivalry, not self hatred.

Shtetls were under attack from the Tsarist pogroms, not from fellow Jews. History is perfectly clear about that.

[Matnum PI]

King Saul may have been an enemy of David but it was because they were rivals, not because of anti Semitism. Kings deposed other kings all throughout European history again because of rivalry, not self hatred.

Shtetls were under attack from the Tsarist pogroms, not from fellow Jews. History is perfectly clear about that.

David wrote over one hundred poems. A tiny fraction are about Shaul.

The shtetls are one example. Assimilated Jews work with the non-Jewish governments. This is how they ingratiate themselves with the government and prove that they're assimilated. This was and is standard operating procedures.

[Brooklyn]

King Saul may have been an enemy of David but it was because they were rivals, not because of anti Semitism. Kings deposed other kings all throughout European history again because of rivalry, not self hatred.

Shtetls were under attack from the Tsarist pogroms, not from fellow Jews. History is perfectly clear about that.

David wrote over one hundred poems. A tiny fraction are about Shaul.

The shtetls are one example. Assimilated Jews work with the non-Jewish governments. This is how they ingratiate themselves with the government and prove that they're assimilated. This was and is standard operating procedures.

Tiny fraction? Well, there were more about his hatred for Philistines who were his real enemies.

Give us some examples of those assimilated types who hate Jews.




One thing I notice about you defenders of Zionism is how you avoid the matter of Zionism's socialist origin and how so much of Israel's politics are socialist. Socialism is readily found in its kibbutzim, cooperatives and deep government involvement in people's lives. It even has that hated universal health care! All paid for by USA tax dollars, of course. It comes as no surprise that Bolshevik dictator Stalin was a big defender of Israel. In the past conservatives used to say that pouring money into a problem won't solve it. Yet, for some strange reason they never say that about the multiple billions in USA tax financed support poured into Israel every year. Where's all the anti socialist talk now??

[PizzaSnake]

Logically, what is the more likely impetus to the reported increase in antisemitic attacks in the US ?

(a) Marjorie Taylor Greene's remarks comparing Pelosi's mask mandate to the Holocaust.

(b) Israel's bombing of Gaza.

If you get your news from MSNBC, it's due solely to (a) & unrelated to (b).

Greene's idiotic remarks are terribly insensitive. They trivialize the vilest event in human history. How do they incite antisemitic violence ?

Good points above.

The media wants MTG to be the new Trump because libs always need a bugaboo.

Too bad we got a boogaloo instead...

[Brooklyn]

Logically, what is the more likely impetus to the reported increase in antisemitic attacks in the US ?

(a) Marjorie Taylor Greene's remarks comparing Pelosi's mask mandate to the Holocaust.

(b) Israel's bombing of Gaza.

If you get your news from MSNBC, it's due solely to (a) & unrelated to (b).

Greene's idiotic remarks are terribly insensitive. They trivialize the vilest event in human history. How do they incite antisemitic violence ?

Some people have likened Israel's repression of Palestine to the Holocaust. Some delusionals say this is anti Semitic Jew hatred even though Einstein and others have agreed with this assessment.

As for Greene's idiotic comment, imagine if some liberal attempted to trivialize the Holocaust the way she did. What would the far right be saying today?

[Matnum PI]

Some people have likened Israel's repression of Palestine to the Holocaust. Some delusionals say this is anti Semitic Jew hatred even though Einstein and others have agreed with this assessment.

Brooklyn, your belief that a Jew can't be anti-Semitic is as illogical as a black can't be racist or a gay can't be homophobic or etc.

And, in the name of keeping Einstein's name clean, he was a victim of the Holocaust and was very much pro-Israel. i'd be surprised to see a quote from him where he compares Israelis to Nazis. Anything is possible but I don't see it...

[Brooklyn]

Some people have likened Israel's repression of Palestine to the Holocaust. Some delusionals say this is anti Semitic Jew hatred even though Einstein and others have agreed with this assessment.

Brooklyn, your belief that a Jew can't be anti-Semitic is as illogical as a black can't be racist or a gay can't be homophobic or etc.

And, in the name of keeping Einstein's name clean, he was a victim of the Holocaust and was very much pro-Israel. i'd be surprised to see a quote from him where he compares Israelis to Nazis. Anything is possible but I don't see it...

Ask and ye shall receive:


https://www.21cir.com/2019/12/albert-ei ... d%E2%80%9D








TO THE EDITORS OF NEW YORK TIMES:

[letter titled] “New Palestine Party. Visit of Menachen Begin and Aims of Political Movement Discussed”

Among the most disturbing political phenomena of our times is the emergence in the newly created state of Israel of the “Freedom Party” (Tnuat Haherut), a political party closely akin in its organization, methods, political philosophy and social appeal to the Nazi and Fascist parties. It was formed out of the membership and following of the former Irgun Zvai Leumi, a terrorist, right-wing, chauvinist organization in Palestine.

The current visit of Menachem Begin, leader of this party, to the United States is obviously calculated to give the impression of American support for his party in the coming Israeli elections, and to cement political ties with conservative Zionist elements in the United States. Several Americans of national repute have lent their names to welcome his visit. It is inconceivable that those who oppose fascism throughout the world, if correctly informed as to Mr. Begin’s political record and perspectives, could add their names and support to the movement he represents.

Before irreparable damage is done by way of financial contributions, public manifestations in Begin’s behalf, and the creation in Palestine of the impression that a large segment of America supports Fascist elements in Israel, the American public must be informed as to the record and objectives of Mr. Begin and his movement.

The public avowals of Begin’s party are no guide whatever to its actual character. Today they speak of freedom, democracy and anti-imperialism, whereas until recently they openly preached the doctrine of the Fascist state. It is in its actions that the terrorist party betrays its real character; from its past actions we can judge what it may be expected to do in the future.

Attack on Arab Village

A shocking example was their behavior in the Arab village of Deir Yassin. This village, off the main roads and surrounded by Jewish lands, had taken no part in the war, and had even fought off Arab bands who wanted to use the village as their base. On April 9 (THE NEW YORK TIMES), terrorist bands attacked this peaceful village, which was not a military objective in the fighting, killed most of its inhabitants (240 men, women, and children) and kept a few of them alive to parade as captives through the streets of Jerusalem. Most of the Jewish community was horrified at the deed, and the Jewish Agency sent a telegram of apology to King Abdullah of Trans-Jordan. But the terrorists, far from being ashamed of their act, were proud of this massacre, publicized it widely, and invited all the foreign correspondents present in the country to view the heaped corpses and the general havoc at Deir Yassin.

The Deir Yassin incident exemplifies the character and actions of the Freedom Party.

Within the Jewish community they have preached an admixture of ultranationalism, religious mysticism, and racial superiority. Like other Fascist parties they have been used to break strikes, and have themselves pressed for the destruction of free trade unions. In their stead they have proposed corporate unions on the Italian Fascist model.

During the last years of sporadic anti-British violence, the IZL and Stern groups inaugurated a reign of terror in the Palestine Jewish community. Teachers were beaten up for speaking against them, adults were shot for not letting their children join them. By gangster methods, beatings, window-smashing, and wide-spread robberies, the terrorists intimidated the population and exacted a heavy tribute.

The people of the Freedom Party have had no part in the constructive achievements in Palestine. They have reclaimed no land, built no settlements, and only detracted from the Jewish defense activity. Their much-publicized immigration endeavors were minute, and devoted mainly to bringing in Fascist compatriots.

Discrepancies Seen

The discrepancies between the bold claims now being made by Begin and his party, and their record of past performance in Palestine bear the imprint of no ordinary political party. This is the unmistakable stamp of a Fascist party for whom terrorism (against Jews, Arabs, and British alike), and misrepresentation are means, and a “Leader State” is the goal.

In the light of the foregoing considerations, it is imperative that the truth about Mr. Begin and his movement be made known in this country. It is all the more tragic that the top leadership of American Zionism has refused to campaign against Begin’s efforts, or even to expose to its own constituents the dangers to Israel from support to Begin.

The undersigned therefore take this means of publicly presenting a few salient facts concerning Begin and his party; and of urging all concerned not to support this latest manifestation of fascism.

[27 signers]

ISIDORE ABRAMOWITZ,

HANNAH ARENDT,

ABRAHAM BRICK,

RABBI JESSURUN CARDOZO,

ALBERT EINSTEIN,

HERMAN EISEN, M.D.,

HAYIM FINEMAN, M. GALLEN, M.D.,

H.H. HARRIS,

ZELIG S. HARRIS,

SIDNEY HOOK,

FRED KARUSH,

BRURIA KAUFMAN,

IRMA L. LINDHEIM,

NACHMAN MAISEL,

SEYMOUR MELMAN,

MYER D. MENDELSON, M.D.,

HARRY M. OSLINSKY,

SAMUEL PITLICK,

FRITZ ROHRLICH,

LOUIS P. ROCKER,

RUTH SAGIS,

ITZHAK SANKOWSKY,

I.J. SHOENBERG,

SAMUEL SHUMAN,

SINGER,
IRMA WOLFE,

STEFAN WOLFE.

New York, Dec. 2, 1948

Written: Dec. 2, 1948





Contents are public domain.





Not one of those Jewish scholars who signed the letter were anti Semite. On the contrary, they were pro Jew and stood for all the good principles Jews have always affirmed.

[Matnum PI]

And the quote we're discussing is nowhere to be found in the letter to the editor you posted below it. Made up, anti-Israel propaganda. Via Honest Reporting Canada: "There’s no evidence to confirm the veracity that Einstein ever made this statement that was wrongly attributed to him. As we told the Journal Pioneer, unless Mr. Deaton can substantiate with verifiable evidence/sourcing that Einstein made this statement, a retraction should be published. Additionally, Mr. Deaton’s bringing up this alleged quote is tantamount to antisemitism as according to the Ottawa Protocol and U.S. State Department, when you draw comparisons of contemporary Israeli policy to that of the Nazis, you are making an antisemitic statement."

It's a fake, Brooklyn. and horribly inappropriate. (I'm being kind with my language.)