MLL, Who is left?

[hooligan88]

With the formation of the PLL i noticed a lot of MLL players signed up. Who will exactly be left on the MLL rosters? Will they be allowed to play for both leagues? Is this just a ruse to extend Paul Rabils career? This seriously has the future pro lacrosse twisting in the wind.

[Clever Username]

According to Greg Gurenlian, guys we haven't really heard of it yet. He has an interesting take on the whole thing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOB31xZJ1V8

[longboard315]

The PLL is going to bury the MLL in 1-2 years. They have ALL the marquee players, a great business model with prominent financial backers, and with a far better TV package than the MLL has ever had (NBC Sports). And they just announced a partnership with the WPLL (Womens Professional Lacrosse League), creating an inclusive environment and showcasing a sport like no other professional sports organization has ever done. Smart move here IMO.

And it's nice to see these guys finally are able to make some kind of living doing this too, they deserve it with all the hard work they put in on and off the field!

And when a long-standing franchise like the Boston Cannons, who once played in Boston at venues like Boston & Harvard University, now call their new home Veterans Memorial Stadium in Quincy, MA, the writing is on the wall. I personally lived in Quincy for 7 years, and have been to that stadium a few times - its a dump. http://www.bostoncannons.com/veterans-memorial-stadium

And no offense, but why would I go pay and watch 2nd tier pro lacrosse when the very best players are playing in another league. At Best, the MLL is now more like a minor league system (to the PLL!).

The MLL has no one to blame but themselves....The league has been around for nearly 20 years, and has done zero to improve it's place in U.S. professional sports.

[Fanlax999]

Pro lacrosse is going nowhere, frankly. And the MLL was a dying fish and not taking care of its players. And with Warrior basically running it, it wasn't inclusive. They were a monopoly and acted like nobody could touch them and they could do whatever they wanted to the players, etc. and get away with it. Now PLL has come on board, and soon the MLL will start to go under. PLL does not exist to make the MLL stronger or better. They are out to destroy the MLL and take the whole pie for themselves. That's great and all but the bigger picture is that total player participation from the lower grade levels to HS and college are way, way down. And will continue on their downward path. I have been in the game for over 10 year now and seen it rise and fall. Too much greed and shadiness with the sport, especially with the travel teams. And coaches scheming and scamming players and parents of their cash, time and dreams of just playing the game they love. The game is not about playing it anymore for the sport but getting recruited. For what exactly? For that coveted spotlight of announcing your commitment to a lowly D3, D2 or D1 school (and even MCLA club teams!! LOL). Its all about spending a ton of money to fly down to play pick-up games across the country LOL! To spend a weekend watching your kids play with and against kids who don't have the stick skills or lax IQ to be on the team. Watching your kid's team get beat by other teams 15-1 or 20-1 by stacked teams or teams playing down (and the opposing coaches high-fiving themselves on destroying lesser teams, and emotional and physically hurting kids in the process). The only people currently benefiting in today's lacrosse landscape are the travel team and tournament owners. They are lining their pockets up with cash. But that is dying off as players are no longer playing this sport and seeing the light with all the greed and shadiness. Parents are also seeing the light.

[Laxdad1960]

Fanlax999 ...wow...this seems a pretty pessimistic take.

Where are you getting you participation stats....the most recent I see from US Lacrosse (2017) shows almost flat across those age levels.

Yes there is plenty of money grubbing among the club programs but at least as many guys and gals out there just growing the sport.

Personally looking forward to what the PLL puts on the field

[ColumbiaBlueBlack]

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... illionaire

[Fanlax999]

Fanlax999 ...wow...this seems a pretty pessimistic take.

Where are you getting you participation stats....the most recent I see from US Lacrosse (2017) shows almost flat across those age levels.

Yes there is plenty of money grubbing among the club programs but at least as many guys and gals out there just growing the sport.

Personally looking forward to what the PLL puts on the field

I don't have or need to recite any participation stats because all I have to do is look out on the field and see the lower quality of play and number of players at the youth, HS and college levels. I know some teams in our area can't field as many teams as before because they don't have enough players. I know there are less and less teams playing in local tournaments and less and less tournaments being held. I also talk to other parents and players and read emails from parents about how badly teams are run by coaches, who are really in it just to squeeze as many dollars out of the players/parents as they can. You know the coaches-- the ones that direct their hs teams to join their travel teams and play in their tournaments that they own (all under the guise of charity and the 501(c) scam.). The ones that force players to buy gear from them and have a side business for lax training. No conflict of interest there, right? LOL. It's so funny to watch almost everyone drink the kool-aide. Even the school administration. They must be getting a cut in the action because why would they tolerate this shady behavior. I know my company would never tolerate an employee directing clients to personal side businesses that was in direct conflict with the company. It's like sending your kid to college and the college professor directs the students to his outside tutoring business to "better learn" the subject that he is teaching at the college. Nothing wrong with that, right??!?? Any incentive for that teacher to put in any effort to teach his college course??--or should he direct his students to his side business to better learn the subject they already paid the college for??

The total number of players has grown in the last 10 or so years. No doubt. It has spread to other areas not seen before. Sure. -- But over the last several years, at least in my area, the popularity of lacrosse is going down. You can see it on the field. You can see it in the box scores where historically weak teams are now beating historically stronger teams, and that is because the talent level for both teams are BOTH equally low - not equally high(er).

And yes, I do know some very good players who came out of the area, but that number is getting smaller and smaller. And if you asked any of the players and parents how much they spent to get to that level, it would be over $100K to do it with all the forced travel teams and recruiting events that players are pushed into doing. I know you don't have to spend that kind of money to be good and play D1/D2/D3 college level lacrosse but the current landscape practically forces you to do so - or else you won't get that coveted D1/D2/D3 offer! LOL. And this is supposed to grow lacrosse?

[pucksandbones]

So you're using your anecdotal evidence instead of actual evidence to form your opinions, got it.

Also, not sure why you decided to use the professional lacrosse forum to rant about what is coming off as a personal vendetta against club programs, but it isn't super relevant. You seem to have a minority opinion on the direction of lacrosse, as I think most would say the overall talent level is improving. Also, $100k? That would mean they are spending 10k per year from the age of 8-18 on travel lacrosse, this isn't AAA ice hockey.

In conclusion, numbers show lacrosse is growing despite it being "less popular in your town," the talent level is up as evidenced by non-traditional market players making impacts at D1, and historic teams like Syracuse, Hopkins, Maryland, UNC, and Duke losing to teams like Denver, Ohio State, Towson, Penn State, Villanova, High Point despite "the box scores of your local HS games saying otherwise."

[Fanlax999]

Ya, stats published by governing bodies or someone with a stake in it are REALLY accurate. chuckle chuckle....All I am saying is lacrosse is NOT exploding like some people want you to believe. But hey, don't believe me, go and LOOK for yourselves. And then ask why is that the case.

The number of kids and parents that participate in this sport during their youth and club years does have an affect on the sport's professional popularity, I would think.

Does anyone here want to list out how much they pay for travel teams from 8-18? How about Team fees for starters? Then travel costs for those ever popular and required lax tournaments? Does anyone have to pay for individual tournaments in addition to the Team fees? How about recruiting trips and events? Play for any "all-star" teams? -- how much does that cost? Box leagues? Team fees for HS level club teams are $4000-$5000 alone per year, and that doesn't even include any travel costs. And I know many kids who are on MULTIPLE club teams so do the math. $10,000 avg/year and $100,000 for 10 years of lax is just really the starting point. You could always spend $200 to $2000 a year but that is not how the lax landscape is setup for these days. That is why this sport is targeted for the relatively SMALL wealthy class.

[pucksandbones]

Why do you keep valuing direct observation ("go and LOOK") of a small sample size over national trends with real numbers published by third party groups with no interest in lacrosse? This is the sports equivalent of saying I ate today so world hunger isn't real.

[Fanlax999]

man, your really bust me up. you just keep on believing what you're reading. lol. everything all good and rosy in lacrosse land. nothing to be concerned about, numbers are good. it says so. lol......btw, did you want to respond to my club team costs info? you seem so confident before that you knew what you were talking about and implied I didn't....i have been around the game for a while and don't come from a small market...

anyone else want to chime in on this debate? would love to hear what others are reading, seeing and thinking about the growth of lacrosse, which has some affect on the growth and popularity of professional lacrosse (this thread).

[Badlands]

Saw the interview with the MLL Commish during the Duke/Loyola game. He was far from convincing in his enthusiasm for the state of the league (seems to be all about a new logo) and for the upcoming draft. How many of those guys who are picked by both leagues will go to the MLL? Seems most of the best players are going to the PLL. Talked a bunch about his efforts have been to secure the fan base and sell tickets. I'd be really surprised if the MLL has sold a bunch of tickets this off-season unless they dramatically lowered prices, but who knows? He was trying to talk happy, but he seemed to me like a guy who knows he's on a sinking ship.

[LRoggy]

Breaking This Morning:

https://www.floridalacrossenews.com/bre ... Yyi5UdH4XE

[kramerica.inc]

Florida’s statement:

http://www.floridalaunchlacrosse.com/ar ... -statement