All things Chinese CoronaVirus

The odds are excellent that you will leave this forum hating someone.

How many of your friends and family members have died of the Chinese Corona Virus?

0 people
44
64%
1 person.
10
14%
2 people.
3
4%
3 people.
5
7%
More.
7
10%
 
Total votes: 69

jhu72
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by jhu72 »

a fan wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 12:05 pm
tech37 wrote: Mon Oct 25, 2021 8:30 am So instead we should just walk in circles, wringing our hands, hoping for the best?

It's the same issue we face with climate change. As you know, countries like China and India continue to pollute and amplify greenhouse effect. Should we simply throw up our hands and say, what's the point of continued US effort when other countries don't give a sh!t?

Re Covid though, 5 million dead across the globe. I would bet a worldwide ban on research such as GOF will be easy to come by. Of course regulation oversight will be difficult, but again, better to do nothing at all? IMO, any reduction of GOF research is one less disaster waiting to happen. Now someone on here will say something dopey like, you're anti-science! As mentioned before, find a new way to research this stuff without tinkering with live viruses, putting human existence in jeopardy.

Also, there will always be bad actors, independently plotting to destroy by scientific means. You'd be stating the obvious to raise that point... and in that case we can only hope for the best.
Everything above makes perfect sense. I'm all for it. I don't think China will sign on, but what do I know?

And yes, you're right, it's better than nothing.
Not only will China not sign on to it, neither will the US!!

In a world with over 130 countries you can not solve this problem with a worldwide agreement - ban. In a world full of smart people with very inexpensive components you can not solve this problem. In a world where there is so much wealth and so much freedom bought by that wealth you can not solve this problem. Any solution requires worldwide authoritarianism at an incredible level.

You are on the ride and it is too late to get off. Same with nuclear.
Image STAND AGAINST FASCISM
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youthathletics
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by youthathletics »

A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy


“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
SCLaxAttack
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by SCLaxAttack »

youthathletics wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:57 pm Telling it like it is: https://www.instagram.com/p/CVgIKjEFrQt/
Other examples in society of different classes of people:

People who have the right to practice medicine and those who can't.
People who have the right to drive and those who can't.
People who have purchased the right to fish and those who can't.
Ad nauseum.
ggait
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by ggait »

SCLaxAttack wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:18 pm
youthathletics wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:57 pm Telling it like it is: https://www.instagram.com/p/CVgIKjEFrQt/
Other examples in society of different classes of people:

People who have the right to practice medicine and those who can't.
People who have the right to drive and those who can't.
People who have purchased the right to fish and those who can't.
Ad nauseum.
People who comply with the applicable rules get to breeze through airport security using TSA Pre or Clear. If you are worried about the govt mind controlling you or some such nonsense, you are absolutely free to stand in the long line instead.

As with the case of vax refuse-niks, your increased inconvenience is justified by your unwillingness to do certain things which would lower your risk profile to the overall community. Totally free choice.

But choices do have consequences. Which is what we all tell our little kids as parents all the time. Funny how the mouth breathers can't seem to remember that when it is applied to them.
Boycott stupid. If you ignore the gator troll, eventually he'll just go back under his bridge.
CU88
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by CU88 »

ggait wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 6:24 pm
SCLaxAttack wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 3:18 pm
youthathletics wrote: Tue Oct 26, 2021 2:57 pm Telling it like it is: https://www.instagram.com/p/CVgIKjEFrQt/
Other examples in society of different classes of people:

People who have the right to practice medicine and those who can't.
People who have the right to drive and those who can't.
People who have purchased the right to fish and those who can't.
Ad nauseum.
People who comply with the applicable rules get to breeze through airport security using TSA Pre or Clear. If you are worried about the govt mind controlling you or some such nonsense, you are absolutely free to stand in the long line instead.

As with the case of vax refuse-niks, your increased inconvenience is justified by your unwillingness to do certain things which would lower your risk profile to the overall community. Totally free choice.

But choices do have consequences. Which is what we all tell our little kids as parents all the time. Funny how the mouth breathers can't seem to remember that when it is applied to them.
Choices have consequences indeed!


I feel like there's a word for killing 130,000 people.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2 ... -pandemic/
by cradleandshoot » Fri Aug 13, 2021 8:57 am
Mr moderator, deactivate my account.
You have heck this forum up to making it nothing more than a joke. I hope you are happy.
This is cradle and shoot signing out.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
CU88
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by CU88 »

I guess Blue Lives really dont matter?

Five times as many police officers have died from Covid-19 as from gunfire since start of pandemic

https://www.cnn.com/2021/10/16/us/polic ... index.html
by cradleandshoot » Fri Aug 13, 2021 8:57 am
Mr moderator, deactivate my account.
You have heck this forum up to making it nothing more than a joke. I hope you are happy.
This is cradle and shoot signing out.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
CU88
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by CU88 »

One step closer to a full national mandate!

(Link is a better read)

https://yourlocalepidemiologist.substac ... tm_source=


Vaccines for 5-11 year olds: FDA meeting cliff notes

Katelyn Jetelina

Today VRBPAC (an external scientific advisory committee to the FDA) voted in favor of the Pfizer COVID19 vaccine for 5-11 year olds. VRBPAC was the second stop in a long process to get the vaccine authorized for emergency use.


This was a much anticipated meeting for two reasons:

Originally, the FDA hinted they would not consider an EUA for kids <12 years. But, Delta and pandemic resurgence caused the FDA to change perspectives.

The VRBPAC step was not conducted for the adolescent Pfizer vaccine; VRBPAC doesn’t have to be called for an EUA amendment. But they were called for the vaccine for 5-11 year olds.

So, today 18 members of VRBPAC met to discuss hundreds of pages of data. These members are a mix of pediatricians, immunologists, virologists, epidemiologists, and other scientists across the nation. There were also presentations from the sponsor (Pfizer), FDA, and the CDC. Here was the agenda. Here are all the powerpoints. And here are your cliff notes…

Need

Kids aren’t spared from the harm of COVID19. CDC presented the epidemiology of COVID19 outcomes among 5-11 year olds. These are close to real-time numbers:

Infection: More than 1.9 million 5-11 year olds have been infected by COVID19 during the pandemic. During Delta, there was a sharp increase in cases; 5-11 year olds represented 10.6% of cases in the week of Oct 10 (they make up 8.7% of the population).

There are still kids susceptible to COVID19. Only 42% of kids aged 5-11 years have antibodies from natural immunity.

Hospitalization: There’ve been >8300 COVID19 hospitalizations of 5-11 year olds

Over 30% of 5-11 year olds hospitalized did not have an underlying condition.

When compared to other kids, 5-11 year olds had the least number of hospitalizations. But, starting in August, they had the highest rate since the beginning of the pandemic.

Once hospitalized, 1/3 of kids ended up in the ICU.


There were exceedingly low (only 9) hospitalizations for flu during 2020-2021. At the same time, there were significantly higher COVID19 hospitalizations. Had mitigation measures (masks, closed schools) not been in place, these numbers would have been much higher.


MIS-C (multisystem inflammatory syndrome in children) is highest among 5-11 year olds. This is a condition where different body parts can become inflamed, including the heart, lungs, kidneys, brain, skin, eyes, or gastrointestinal organs. There’s been 5,217 MIS-C cases reported as of October 4, 2021. 60-70% of patients are admitted to ICU and 1-2% died.

Death: There have been 94 5-11 year olds that have died from COVID19. For context, this places COVID19 as the 8th leading cause of death for this age group. More recently (during Delta), COVID19 jumped to the 6th leading cause of death in this age group.

Long COVID19: 7-8% of kids experience long COVID19. The following symptoms occur among kids for more than 4 weeks: fatigue, headache, insomnia, trouble concentrating, muscle and joint pain, and cough. There are also impacts on quality of life: Limitations of physical activity, feeling distressed about symptoms, mental health challenges, decreased school attendance/participation.

Secondary outcomes

In-person school: COVID-19 in children leads to lost in-person learning and other adverse outcomes. This has resulted in 2,074 schools closed, 1,069,116 of students and 68,718 teachers affected.

Transmission: Kids also significantly contribute to the spread of the virus. Secondary transmission from young school age children can and does occur in both household and school settings


Timeline of SARS-CoV-2 illness onset* after onset in the index patient among students, siblings, and parents, relative to onset in the index patient, May 2021
Clinical Trial Results

The clinical trial was organized into two cohorts:

2,268 trial participants (including 1,518 vaccine recipients) followed for at least two months past the 2nd dose

A “safety expansion” group of an additional 2,379 participants (1,500 vaccine recipients) followed for a median of 2.4 weeks after the second dose. This was done per the FDAs request “to allow for more robust assessment of serious adverse events and other adverse events of interest”.


First Pfizer presented their results. Then the FDA presented their results. The FDA always analyzes data themselves to ensure there is no conflict of interest. This is normal practice.

Safety

During the clinical trial, the most common adverse events (AEs) was fatigue (39%), followed by headache (28%) and muscle pain (12%).

Most AEs were mild or moderate and resolved 1-2 days after

Interestingly, fever and chills was less frequent compared to older kids/adults

Adverse reactions was higher for dose 2 compared to dose 1


There are two other adverse events linked to the vaccine:

Lymphadenopathy (swelling of lymph nodes): 13 vaccine participants vs. 1 placebo participant. We saw this in adult clinical trials too.

Hypersensitivity: Such as rash and dermatitis after the vaccine compared to the placebo

There were 5 severe adverse events. None were linked to the vaccine:

Ingestion of a penny (1 person in the vaccine group)

Fractures (2 people in the vaccine group and 1 in the placebo)

Infective arthritis (one person in vaccine group)

There were no cases of myocarditis (heart inflammation), anaphylaxis or deaths among ages 5-11 in the clinical trials.

Effectiveness

Does the vaccine work for 5-11 year olds? The FDA required Pfizer to prove immunobridging. Pfizer also included data on two other outcomes:

Immunobridging: This is a process that compares antibodies among 5-11 year olds to another age group (in this case 16-25 year olds) in which the efficacy of a vaccine is already established. The clinical trial found that antibody numbers were comparable to the older age group. In other words, the vaccine works.

Effectiveness against Delta: Pfizer also included data on a subsample of participants’ (34 participants) to assess the effectiveness of the vaccine-induced antibodies on specific variants. The vaccine worked great against Delta.

COVID19 disease: Pfizer also showed efficacy. During the clinical trial there were 19 cases of COVID19: 3 cases in the vaccine group and 16 cases in the placebo group. This equates to a 90.7% efficacy.


Myocarditis

No myocarditis cases were reported in the clinical trial. This is great news but expected. The clinical trials were not nearly large enough to capture such a rare event.

Myocarditis is the principal concern that people have with mRNA vaccines with children. So, CDC presented everything we know about vaccine-induced myocarditis. Key take home points:

Myocarditis is a true safety signal, but rare. There have been 877 cases of vaccine-induced myocarditis among 12-29 year olds (out of more than 100,000,000 vaccinated). Of these, 829 were hospitalized and 77% recovered. At the time of analysis, 5 people were in the ICU. No myocarditis cases reported and investigated by the CDC have resulted in death.

Not all myocarditis should be treated the same. Classic myocarditis (opposed to vaccine-induced myocarditis) has a relatively high mortality rate and can even result in sudden death. Classic myocarditis also impacts on how well the heart pumps blood (called ejection fraction). We don’t see mortality or ejection fraction reduction with vaccine-induced myocarditis. It’s a much more mild form of disease.

Long term effects of vaccine-induced myocarditis. Kids tend to bounce back very well. A key study followed a subset of adolescents with vaccine-induced myocarditis. Adolescents fully recovered from symptoms and arrhythmias ~35 days. Data is limited, but continues to be studied. Unfortunately we are at the mercy of time.

Why is this happening? We don’t know yet. Only 2 of the myocarditis cases among children have been biopsied. We think genetics and hormones may play a role.

The FDA conducted an extensive benefit/risk assessment through a series of six models. Because we can’t see into the future, biostatisticians ran different scenarios based on varying three variables: COVID19 cases (pandemic could get worse or better); real world effectiveness of vaccines (we think this will be high, but could vary depending on waning and variants); and rate of vaccine-induced myocarditis among this age group (we think it will be lower than adolescents but we don’t know). All of these risks are deliberately conservative. In other words, they looked at worse case scenarios for myocarditis risk and vaccine efficacy. This is what they found…

For five scenarios, the benefits of a vaccine clearly outweigh the risks of myocarditis:

Scenario 1: Used number of COVID19 cases on Sept 11, 2021

Scenario 2: Used number of COVID19 cases at the Delta peak (worse case scenario)

Scenario 4: Used a high real-world effectiveness of the vaccine

Scenario 5: Used high COVID-19 death rate

Scenario 6: Used a lower estimate of myocarditis rate than adolescents (this is the likely scenario given the impact of hormones on myocarditis and given classic myocarditis among this group is so low)

There was one scenario (#3) where benefits didn’t outweigh risks. In this model, the FDA used the lowest level of COVID19 cases like we saw in June 2021. Using this, the model predicts more excess hospitalizations due to vaccine-related myocarditis compared to prevented hospitalizations due to COVID-19 in males and in both sexes combined. It’s important to keep in mind that there are benefits to the vaccine beyond hospitalization.


There was quite a bit of discussion around the limitations of the risk/benefit analysis. For 5 to 11 year olds, 18% of COVID19 hospitalizations are not COVID19 related. The FDA risk/benefit ratio didn’t take this into account. The risk/benefit analysis also did not take into account natural immunity protection.

Discussion

As you can imagine, there was a robust discussion among voting members:

Make it available to certain 5-11 year olds? Two members voiced frustration that this was a binary choice: all or nothing vaccine for 5-11 year olds. Some asked whether they could rephrase the question for specific kids, like obese or immunocompromised. Some pointed to the number than 42% of kids have natural protection and that vaccines may not help that much.

On the other hand, others pointed out that 32% of kids hospitalized don’t have a comorbidity, and we have no idea where the pandemic will go. We have a flu vaccine to prevent 100 deaths a year and kids are dying at higher rates from COVID19. And, most importantly, this isn’t a decision for VRBPAC. VRBPAC decides whether the vaccine is safe and effective. Defining the policy (i.e. who gets the vaccine) is ACIP’s job. If VRBPAC doesn’t authorize EUA for kids, then no kid can get the vaccine.

Should 11 year olds wait for the 12 year old dose? This was specifically asked by the members because of the 3 breakthrough cases in the clinical trial: 10, 10 and 11 years old. Pfizer said that the effectiveness of the smaller dose works the same whether you are 5 or 11. They think breakthrough cases were older because they were more exposed to the virus. Pfizer hasn’t tested this dose among 12 year olds. So, ultimately, they don’t know if parents should wait. CDC should weigh into this next week.

Does the vaccine prevent transmission? Pfizer did not assess asymptomatic disease (and thus transmission) in the clinical trials. So, technically, they don’t know. They do know that adult vaccines reduce transmission. But adults had a higher dosage, does this matter? We don’t know, but we hypothesize that pediatric vaccines reduce transmission to some degree.

Vote

So, VRBPAC needed to vote: “Based on the totality of scientific evidence available, do the benefits of the PfizerBioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine when administered as a 2-dose series (10 µg each dose, 3 weeks apart) outweigh its risks for use in children 5-11 years of age?”

Yes: 17 votes

No: 0 votes

Abstain: 1 vote

The ball now goes to the FDA. Then, it goes to the ACIP and CDC next week. If all goes well, vaccines in arms for 5-11 year olds will come at the end of next week.

Love, YLE

I joined the President of the American Academy of Pediatrics last week for a Q&A regarding the vaccine for 5-11 year olds. See the recording here.

Other Q&A questions for parents answered in my newsletter here

Here are common vaccine concerns for parents and how to address them. If you’re a paying subscriber and want the PDF, just reply to this email. The latest draft is for adolescents specifically, but I’m happy to update for 5-11 year olds if helpful.
by cradleandshoot » Fri Aug 13, 2021 8:57 am
Mr moderator, deactivate my account.
You have heck this forum up to making it nothing more than a joke. I hope you are happy.
This is cradle and shoot signing out.
:roll: :roll: :roll:
wgdsr
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by wgdsr »

so... 42% with antibodies forming natural immunity, i assume that means via infection?

and so if they caught 1.9 million via test, that accounts for 16% or less than 1 in 6 of those that have developed antibodies via infection.
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Brooklyn
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by Brooklyn »

Image
https://i.imgur.com/n1UigGj.png


tRump = killer of Americans
It has been proven a hundred times that the surest way to the heart of any man, black or white, honest or dishonest, is through justice and fairness.

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Typical Lax Dad
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by Typical Lax Dad »

More on the old ball coach!

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... 19-vaccine

Maybe he will land at Ole’ Miss or Florida State.
“I wish you would!”
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MDlaxfan76
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by MDlaxfan76 »

Typical Lax Dad wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 12:42 pm More on the old ball coach!

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... 19-vaccine

Maybe he will land at Ole’ Miss or Florida State.
Good article.

Pretty clear that the university was pretty darn open to valid religious exemption requests.
runrussellrun
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DocB ....where R U ?

Post by runrussellrun »

Did we mis learn this misinformation, or, IS it really, really true. All 4 sides. That POTUSA Joe Biden just completely opened our boarders to anyone and all.

What could go wrong?

If I were POTUSA, mandates on hour one. CLOSE the borders. Don't like it..........give back your C.A.R.E.S. act.......(that most haven't even used , but, not a subject for this gang of social media addicts. )

But.....have no desire to "take questions" and sniff hair, that IS Joe Biden's pervUE.

Again, did Biden just KILL even more Americans? Travel, and borders are open, yes?

hypocrites..........if you can't bash Biden for this.
ILM...Independent Lives Matter
Pronouns: "we" and "suck"
runrussellrun
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Biden Kills.......

Post by runrussellrun »

Boy oh boy....it IS true.

NOW, THEREFORE, I, JOSEPH R. BIDEN JR., President of the United States, by the authority vested in me by the Constitution and the laws of the United States of America, including sections 1182(f) and 1185(a) of title 8, United States Code, and section 301 of title 3, United States Code, hereby find that it is in the interests of the United States to advance the resumption of international travel to the United States, provided necessary health and safety protocols are in place to protect against the further introduction, transmission, and spread of COVID-19 into and throughout the United States. I further find that vaccination requirements are essential to advance the safe resumption of international travel to the United States and that the unrestricted entry of persons described in section 2 of this proclamation would, except as provided for in section 3(a) of this proclamation, be detrimental to the interests of the United States, and that their entry should be subject to certain restrictions, limitations, and exceptions. I therefore hereby proclaim the following:

from:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-roo ... -pandemic/



But.....this is the part that will kill us all.......

(iii) provide proof of having arranged for post-arrival testing for COVID-19, as determined by the Director of the CDC; and
(iv) provide proof of having arranged to self-quarantine or self-isolate after arriving in the United States, as determined by the Director of the CDC.


That's IT.....that is all ? When landing at Logan (Boston), that's all a NON-vaccinated person has to do/say........"sure, I have "made" arrangements."

hopefully, their details as to what "proof" is considered legitamate.

This sounds like a good plan ?

un Friggin reel......
ILM...Independent Lives Matter
Pronouns: "we" and "suck"
ardilla secreta
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by ardilla secreta »

Moog workers walk out in protest of vaccine mandate
"We're against government coercion"

Primarily a defense contractor, they are required to get vaccinated by December 8 or be fired. Showing a great sense of humor, they state that they’re not against the vaccine, but stand against the government forcing them. I doubt that in the end they’d be willing to give up a good paying job with benefits, though there are always a few willing to do so.

https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/mo ... ne-mandate
Farfromgeneva
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by Farfromgeneva »

That girl with the my body my choice sign should see how it is to live in Al or Tx these days...
Now I love those cowboys, I love their gold
Love my uncle, God rest his soul
Taught me good, Lord, taught me all I know
Taught me so well, that I grabbed that gold
I left his dead ass there by the side of the road, yeah
runrussellrun
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by runrussellrun »

Brooklyn wrote: Wed Oct 27, 2021 11:34 am Image
https://i.imgur.com/n1UigGj.png


tRump = killer of Americans
dude.....check out the POTUSA Joe BIDEN travel ban plan and who come into this country.

Why no mandates in February, for the vaxx? Why now?

come on brookly, don't be a hypocrite. Biden just opened air travel to UN vaccinated people. Write their ;) in his own executive order.....as long as they "promise" :lol:

yeah.....don't blame the medical community, just some old guy mouth peace......out.

it IS childish, to continue your posts about who is killing whom, don't you think?

(iii) provide proof of having arranged for post-arrival testing for COVID-19, as determined by the Director of the CDC; and
(iv) provide proof of having arranged to self-quarantine or self-isolate after arriving in the United States, as determined by the Director of the CDC.
ILM...Independent Lives Matter
Pronouns: "we" and "suck"
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Brooklyn
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by Brooklyn »

dude.....check out the POTUSA Joe BIDEN travel ban plan and who come into this country

Yup. Blame Biden for what tRump did.

Next ...


:lol:
It has been proven a hundred times that the surest way to the heart of any man, black or white, honest or dishonest, is through justice and fairness.

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Brooklyn
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by Brooklyn »

It has been proven a hundred times that the surest way to the heart of any man, black or white, honest or dishonest, is through justice and fairness.

Charles Francis "Socker" Coe, Esq
kramerica.inc
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by kramerica.inc »

ardilla secreta wrote: Thu Oct 28, 2021 8:10 am Moog workers walk out in protest of vaccine mandate
"We're against government coercion"

Primarily a defense contractor, they are required to get vaccinated by December 8 or be fired. Showing a great sense of humor, they state that they’re not against the vaccine, but stand against the government forcing them. I doubt that in the end they’d be willing to give up a good paying job with benefits, though there are always a few willing to do so.

https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/mo ... ne-mandate
Our company has the same mandate.
We have those with the company who are vaccinated and unvaccinated that are both fighting the reporting of vaccination status.
Companies will incur a large (~$15k) fine per employee, each day past, for non reporting.
Peter Brown
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Re: All things CoronaVirus

Post by Peter Brown »

In no universe would I allow a young child to be jabbed with this vaccine. Not in a trillion years.

The FDA, Pfizer, and the cdc are so untrustworthy and so remarkably inept. Google ‘Chantix’ to see if you should trust these clowns.

Or check this out:

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/justice- ... ts-history

I’d be very careful were I anyone with kids in this age range.
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