Hobart 2021

[Farfromgeneva]

It was clear weeks ago that the best NEC teams would have offensive options 4-6 which I don’t think LIU has but SJU does have depth and Bryant is inconsistent like us.

Losing Knox (not to mention not having Herlihy) thinned the offense out a lot.

Didn’t see Baltzer out there and think he’s a hge difference maker for us as well.

Wait a minute didn't you BEAT Bryant. And it wasn't close

Didn't you give the game away to an inferior St Joes.

Didn't the LIU goalie have 21 saves yet you lost only by 2.

Yep the team sucks. This threads as gloomy as my Hop posters.

Are you saying this based on my post of the string? Because I put up our record last three years as well recently.

You’re context is not the right perspective of very incomplete.

Our best scorer is not playing for non injury reasons and it’s a problem for the offense.

We blew a 6 goals Q3 lead to SJU like 2 weeks ago.

Nearly turned around and did it again to Mack up by 6 then all of the sudden its 10-8 but able to pull away.

Struggled to get to 9 vs a very weak Wagner team (though they played hard for sure and credit to them having 1-2 wins in 2+ years)

EMO is below Mendoza.

Shooting is bad.

TOs are unforced.

It’s not so much bad as making rookie mistakes. Forcing passes in the middle, not enough off ball movement, tightening grip on stick, not putting shots on the cage, kids trying to split double teams on clearing and on other side of field from bench and coughing it up.

Basically with an experienced D and solid goalie along with more offensive talent than 2016 I could see it playing out like that possibly but Holtby has to be on his game then.

[Ketch]

Ketch, I wouldn't categorize Bryant's shot selection as great. I watched the game and a lot of them were ? mark dodges with a leaping shot. Not a lot of great passing (which kills Hobart). O'Rourke took 24 shots!. He did score on 6 of them. To quote a friend and LIU alum, they rely on their offense to win games, not the D to stop their opponents. If their goalie wasn't as good as he is, they would be struggling to win most of their games. We still have to beat SHU, who loves to be physical. A note regarding Ty Yanko. He runs point in box on emo. He isn't a prototypical crease guy.

Bryant started out taking ill-advised shots going one on one, but they quickly corrected that.

[Ketch]

Whatever is happening Knox was probably the best crease scorer we’ve had in D1. 54 goals in first 21 games and 40%+ shooting.

There’s been tremendous crease players like Jake McHenry but the relative loss to the offense without Knox is devastating. Again after losing Herlihy before the season too.

On the crease and for man up at least, i still don’t see why Ty Yanko can’t get some time given what he’s done last couple of summers in box. Maybe have a othe canadian around the cease who plays box?

I disagree with your assessment of Knox. He's not a crease scorer. Most of his shots come from outside, and he ain't no Alex Love. Alex could create his own shots, even when he was heavily covered. Knox doesn't have the same mobility. Alex was a very underrated as a dodger and feeder. Not just an accurate rocket shooter. And Alex didn't spend half of his time in (apparently) the coach's doghouse. Except for a very serious injury he was always out there and always produced.

[Farfromgeneva]

Whatever is happening Knox was probably the best crease scorer we’ve had in D1. 54 goals in first 21 games and 40%+ shooting.

There’s been tremendous crease players like Jake McHenry but the relative loss to the offense without Knox is devastating. Again after losing Herlihy before the season too.

On the crease and for man up at least, i still don’t see why Ty Yanko can’t get some time given what he’s done last couple of summers in box. Maybe have a othe canadian around the cease who plays box?

I disagree with your assessment of Know. He's not a crease scorer. Most of his shots come from outside, and he ain't no Alex Love. Alex could create his own shots, even when he was heavily covered. Knox doesn't have the same mobility. Alex was a very underrated as a dodger and feeder. Not just an accurate rocket shooter. And Alex didn't spend half of his time in (apparently) the coach's doghouse. Except for a very serious injury he was always out there and always produced.

Don’t get me started on Binghamton between Love and Akner...

Love played a lot under TW who didn’t have a doghouse and want a doghouse type of guy. So a little unfair of a comparison. And while he got abused, he ran his mouth a lot and got flagged many times for that. (Not to mention that we don’t have anyone nearly as a good a feeder as Stone and our best is Archer who’s playing up top)

[Ketch]

Whatever is happening Knox was probably the best crease scorer we’ve had in D1. 54 goals in first 21 games and 40%+ shooting.

There’s been tremendous crease players like Jake McHenry but the relative loss to the offense without Knox is devastating. Again after losing Herlihy before the season too.

On the crease and for man up at least, i still don’t see why Ty Yanko can’t get some time given what he’s done last couple of summers in box. Maybe have a othe canadian around the cease who plays box?

I disagree with your assessment of Know. He's not a crease scorer. Most of his shots come from outside, and he ain't no Alex Love. Alex could create his own shots, even when he was heavily covered. Knox doesn't have the same mobility. Alex was a very underrated as a dodger and feeder. Not just an accurate rocket shooter. And Alex didn't spend half of his time in (apparently) the coach's doghouse. Except for a very serious injury he was always out there and always produced.

Don’t get me started on Binghamton between Love and Akner...

Love played a lot under TW who didn’t have a doghouse and want a doghouse type of guy. So a little unfair of a comparison. And while he got abused, he ran his mouth a lot and got flagged many times for that. (Not to mention that we don’t have anyone nearly as a good a feeder as Stone and our best is Archer who’s playing up top)

I'm not comparing Alex to Stone or Archer. Just saying that he had a more complete game than Knox and produced on a consistent basis.

[Farfromgeneva]

I guess, productivity wise knox did put up 54,8,62 on 40%+ shooting and a positive gb/to ratio. This year is off for whatever reasons but that’s pretty stellar stuff.

My point in stone/archer is having a great feeder behind the cage frees other players up a lot to do different things.

Love was great but I also was talking as a “pure scorer” was written earlier with regard to Knox. We don’t know what’s going on w Knox, Raymond made Tanner John live in the doghouse and I know Tanner was a very good kid who worked hard with no attitude.

But if he’s there, defenses focus on him and it frees other kids up. Now we’re mixing Bach, Barthelme, Simas and maybe a few others into that crease role. Like all those kids but our offense just scored single digits in OT and it’s plainly clear you add him and this offense is more dangerous and dynamic. I thought Knox shot pretty well in general on sat in terms of getting his hands free and decent looks, thought he’d hit more eventually but I see kids taking worse shots in volume one of whom has been given every opportunity for a couple of years, still hasn’t demonstrated discipline in shooting or passin/ball handling that is worth focusing on more than Knoxs shooting which is uncharacteristically down in the 4.5 games he’s played in.

Who’s the 4th option on this offense right now? Simas? Dattellas? He’s cooled off on shooting if still playing fairly well overall. Bach? (I really like his game). Barthelme? Baltzer? Grooms?

In 2020 our 4-8 scorers were: Herlihy (2.6pts/gm), Scott (same as John H), Madonna (3pts/gm) & Mott (2/gm) who provided 10.2pts/Gm

2019 4-7 (KoKo was 8th w 17pts in 13gms): Knox (41pts), Scott (38pts), Madonna (32) & Mott (25)

Who after the theee and Knox can we basically count on to give us, on average, 1.5-2pts every game?

[Laxgunea]

Dattillas, Bach and Simas can be counted on for 1-2 each per game.
I would still like to see Yanko out there on EMO more (it isnt like we'll get worse).
I was told not to expect Knox on Saturday. It isnt clear to me that it is the coaches doghouse. Not injured either from what I heard.

[Farfromgeneva]

Dattillas, Bach and Simas can be counted on for 1-2 each per game.
I would still like to see Yanko out there on EMO more (it isnt like we'll get worse).
I was told not to expect Knox on Saturday. It isnt clear to me that it is the coaches doghouse. Not injured either from what I heard.

Perhaps there’s a clearing issue w Knox. Recall Veltman has to sit first three games of his Sr Yr (2008-would’ve beat Bucknell w him and potentially been in running for at large) due to playing in a Canadian league that was a mix of professionals. Sean Robinson never made it to the team for issues- we haven’t demonstrated a ton of competence in managing canadian kids and their eligibility historically.

On the second wave of offense, math suggests you get slightly less than 4pts a game from Simas, Dattellas and Bach who have a combined 27pts (24,3) on average being 3.5g & 0.5a/ game over 7 games. Using points not goals myself before and now, but yeah, we need the 4-6 guys “contributing” to more than 5 goals a game to have an effective offense. The top three might get you 6-8 goals most games and 10-12pts and ideally a well functioning offense is scoring 13-14+ and near 20pts a game. That means we’re on average 2-4 goals and 4-6pts short out of our top 6 to get to a average comfortable level. Leaves a lot of leaning on SSDMs, limited run middies and less proven FR, fogos and longsticks to consistently provide 2-3 goals a game which is risky.

[Laxgunea]

I totally agree. I thought you were asking who we can/should look to in the future. These three are the ones at the moment who I think offer the most immediate promise. I think Bach is going to get better and better (he has played well this season, but I've been most impressed by his trajectory over the season). Datillas is in the same boat, though I think his earlier success drew more attention to him and he's had a slight leveling out (which I suspect is very temporary). Simas is much better than his overall production has been. His weakness, IMHO, is occasionally poor decision-making (both in shot selection and in some passing). I also think that Barthelme is better than he played earlier in the season. I did not see him in there against Wagner and was wondering if he was injured.

Just a question for everyone: what you do about EMO? We seem stale and stuck, and it has gone on all year. If we want another two goals a game, one place to look would be a revised EMO. Also, having no EMO just invites teams to bully us. And, again IMHO, we are team that sometimes lets itself get pushed around.

[Farfromgeneva]

Love all those kids for future was meaning this year specifically and especially In the context of Herlihy and now Knox on field. I like Grooms a lot too, looked great way against Syracuse last year And kind of think Baltzer could become more of the offense. And we haven’t mentioned durkin who plays first three games but not since and I expect to do well (plus Delaney). But for winning two NEC playoff games after SHU, I can’t see w Knox out who is even a consistent 4th kid who might get a pole or occasional double and that seems problematic when it’s going to take at least 13-14 goals to win min one of the two playoff games for whoever the winner is (I.e. Our AQ wont get there winning two games with less than 13 goals in both IMO)

Seems like biggest problem on EMO is too many younger kids forcing interior passes or rushing the ball around the box. That may be a tenure fix but doesn’t help this year.

[Farfromgeneva]

I totally agree. I thought you were asking who we can/should look to in the future. These three are the ones at the moment who I think offer the most immediate promise. I think Bach is going to get better and better (he has played well this season, but I've been most impressed by his trajectory over the season). Datillas is in the same boat, though I think his earlier success drew more attention to him and he's had a slight leveling out (which I suspect is very temporary). Simas is much better than his overall production has been. His weakness, IMHO, is occasionally poor decision-making (both in shot selection and in some passing). I also think that Barthelme is better than he played earlier in the season. I did not see him in there against Wagner and was wondering if he was injured.

Just a question for everyone: what you do about EMO? We seem stale and stuck, and it has gone on all year. If we want another two goals a game, one place to look would be a revised EMO. Also, having no EMO just invites teams to bully us. And, again IMHO, we are team that sometimes lets itself get pushed around.

Great point. Though when we get abused violating game rules and respond in any way we get unsportsmanlike when Knox is knocked down from behind away from play in last minute at Bryant or with our FOGO face first on the ground flagged while we win a clean GB...

[oldbartman]

EMO.... Yanko runs point on his box team. I could see him and Davis working well together as both are good making quick decisions. Barthelme should be be either behind looking to feed, or up top looking to crank. Driving with the ball isn't his forte. FY Nathan Greenberg was on the field against Wagner for a minute. Not sure if he's just getting up to speed or coming off injury. He did have a sold HS career from a good program. My dark horse candidate for making an impact is Tanner Wood. Hope to see some different names in the score box after Saturday's game.

[catchnshoot]

There seems to be a consistent thread with the younger guys like Datallis “leveling off” etc...
The common theme is none of these guys have been as good without Knox.

[Ketch]

There seems to be a consistent thread with the younger guys like Datallis “leveling off” etc...
The common theme is none of these guys have been as good without Knox.

We’ve got to get over the fact that Knox is history though.

[catchnshoot]

Unfortunately true
Go Statesmen!

[Farfromgeneva]

There seems to be a consistent thread with the younger guys like Datallis “leveling off” etc...
The common theme is none of these guys have been as good without Knox.

We’ve got to get over the fact that Knox is history though.

Can that be done 1 reg season game remaining and make it through NEC playoffs? How? Who amongst these kids do you think will step up to do so? Lot to ask but if the answer is Knox is done for 21 then solutions are needed pretty quick and maybe even restructuring the offense.

[catchnshoot]

They could certainly start by restructuring the EMO!
Only two teams Wagner and Cleveland State are worse.
Anything new would be a treat , any 6 new guys
Can’t be much worse.
We were terrible u see Pistol Peet and worse now with Brundage.

[manyhats]

Need to defend home turf today against a 1 and 11 SHU. A cool cloudy day so far in the Finger Lakes

[PDSlax]

What did happen to John Herlihy?

[SMAIN]

Not too much has change with the team.... 6 minutes in and 3 turnovers already.