Is Lacrosse an "Aristocrat Sport?"

[Ivyman]

In today’s Wall Street Journal on page A3 is an article relating action against “legacy admission” to universities, especially Harvard and other “elite” schools. Included in that piece is this:

“Former Harvard President Larry Summers said last week in an opinion piece in the Washington Post that it is time for elite colleges to do away with legacy preferences and “take a hard look at admissions preferences for those who excel in ‘aristocrat sports’ and resist being impressed by those who have benefited from high-priced coaching through the admissions process.”

I think the “high-priced coaching” reference was to SAT and application guidance, but I suppose could include sports camps. But what is an “aristocrat sport?” Cornell, Virginia, and others have polo. Fencing? Sailing? How about gymnastics? Squash? Tennis? Swimming? Skiing (nodding to MDlaxfan76)? If expense is a factor, I think the only non-aristocrats are hoops and soccer.

Is lacrosse "an aristocrat sport?"

[1766]

It is currently. There are entry barriers for people that can't afford equipment, not to mention the biggest challenge for kids in inner cities- field space. I'm indifferent about "sixes" but there is no question that will make the game more accessible when you consider less field space needed.

This all seems to be changing as the game is growing to areas outside of traditional well heeled private schools in Baltimore an affluent areas of Long Island. You could probably say the same thing for a number of sports, such as water polo on the west coast, fencing, or anything equestrian. There is a clear difference though of someone getting into a school based on skin color and someone getting into a school because they excel at a sport. How that relates to legacy admissions is something the schools will have to figure out. I do seem to recall Harvard specifically having this conversation a number of years ago. I guess nothing has changed.

[ohmilax34]

I don't have an answer, but I was listening to a podcast interview with the Taft School boys lacrosse coach and the level of coaching those kids receive is close to the level of a lot of college programs. I can see why players who want to play lacrosse in college are taking PG years or transferring to schools like Brunswick or Taft. They get a lot of resources. However, it also seems like the sport is really differentiating those that want to play in college from those who are playing for fun. It is looking more like the college hockey recruiting landscape where the top prep hockey players are likely playing junior hockey (and not living at home) and are usually older than 18 when they get to college. I guess this is what happens when there are more players available for the same number of D1 spots.

[Typical Lax Dad]

In today’s Wall Street Journal on page A3 is an article relating action against “legacy admission” to universities, especially Harvard and other “elite” schools. Included in that piece is this:

“Former Harvard President Larry Summers said last week in an opinion piece in the Washington Post that it is time for elite colleges to do away with legacy preferences and “take a hard look at admissions preferences for those who excel in ‘aristocrat sports’ and resist being impressed by those who have benefited from high-priced coaching through the admissions process.”

I think the “high-priced coaching” reference was to SAT and application guidance, but I suppose could include sports camps. But what is an “aristocrat sport?” Cornell, Virginia, and others have polo. Fencing? Sailing? How about gymnastics? Squash? Tennis? Swimming? Skiing (nodding to MDlaxfan76)? If expense is a factor, I think the only non-aristocrats are hoops and soccer.

Is lacrosse "an aristocrat sport?"

Baseball and Volleyball may also make the cut…..actually a lot of kids are priced out of high level hoops. The demographic isn’t what it was 25 years ago.

[ohmilax34]

Football seems like one sport that could stay non-aristocratic for awhile, but I'm just basing that on it being a school sponsored sport, so most kids have roughly equal access to football training hours. A quality Football culture can be established at poor High Schools. I don't know the college football camp landscape, but my impression is that college programs want the best players possible at their camps, and those kids paying for the camp is less important than their ability.

It seems like soccer culture is bigger among immigrants to the US than it is among the rich. I don't know the youth soccer system that the best immigrant players are in to say if it's changing like lacrosse is.

[OCanada]

Cannot remember the last time Larry Summers was right

[10stone5]

^——

[FannOLax]

I'd say polo, fencing, squash, skiing and maybe crew / sailing are aristocrat sports. Maybe swimming/diving, maybe golf. Lacrosse started out in limited regions, but has spread; it kinda has an whiff of money about it, like tennis, but these two sports now are accessible in the US and Canada to young people of all socio-economic classes. Pretty silly thing for Summers to say; I guess he sensed too many advantages for the wealthy while at Harvard; maybe he should talk more about raising taxes on the wealthy and improving public education at all levels rather than putting the onus on universities to correct the injustices of society.

[mdk01]

Cannot remember the last time Larry Summers was right

Inflation

[Ivyman]

What bothered me was the divisive word "aristocrat." And the implied idea that some sports in and of themselves can be disdained instead of being looked as as an opportunity to participate even if by a limited clientele. All sports involve some expense unless subsidized (the towns and cities provide basketball courts and sponsors help Little League teams. There are certainly plenty of public schools with lacrosse teams. I would tend to see polo, sailing, gymnastics and maybe golf as separate from lacrosse/hockey/soccer, And these distinct from sports with more infrastructure and public funding than football/basketball/baseball.

[mdk01]

If cost of equipment is a criteria then how is football not an "aristocratic sport"?

At one point lacrosse was, but that began to change in the 70's.

[NoLeft]

Cannot remember the last time Larry Summers was right

Amen. Kind of clueless for Summers to talk about 'aristocratic' anything when he heads one of the most aristocratic institutions in America.....

And, Dr Summers, let me know when and how you figure out how to get more minorities in your most exclusive university. And if you can't then you shouldn't be in that position.

[faircornell]

This choice of words by former Harvard President Summers was troubling. More so in that it was tied to legacy admissions. Lacrosse certainly has an image of being an upper middle class sport, although there is plenty of evidence that this image is a debatable one.

Specifically to Harvard, they reported that 15 percent of their class was legacies. This is about 300 students in a class of approximately 2000. I understand that Cornell is approximately the same as a percentage.

There seem to be a lot of lacrosse athletes in the NCAA who were encouraged by their parents to take up lacrosse, and an attack on legacy admissions (which is already being materially phased out) could impact lacrosse recruiting if a legacy is part of the process.

[sinman6]

Lacrosse is an aristocratic sport, absolutely, and I wouldn’t take anyone seriously who said otherwise. Yes, the game is growing, but its growth is largely confined to wealthy persons in large metropolitan cities. My understanding is that USILA supports the growth of the game through grants, but I have limited insight into that process. Hopefully that process works, and any additional needs are met through private donation. … Hopefully

[faircornell]

Edward Luce in the Financial Times today lists lacrosse as one of three sports only available to people of privilege. There certainly seems to be an image problem. Mr Luce receives much of his oped input from sources in Washington DC.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Football seems like one sport that could stay non-aristocratic for awhile, but I'm just basing that on it being a school sponsored sport, so most kids have roughly equal access to football training hours. A quality Football culture can be established at poor High Schools. I don't know the college football camp landscape, but my impression is that college programs want the best players possible at their camps, and those kids paying for the camp is less important than their ability.

It seems like soccer culture is bigger among immigrants to the US than it is among the rich. I don't know the youth soccer system that the best immigrant players are in to say if it's changing like lacrosse is.

Many of the best youth soccer clubs are in affluent communities. USSF has been making a big push to try to expand its reach without a lot of success. California and Texas may do a good job of attracting players from immigrant families. Immigration status of parents / grandparents may have been one impediment and time/travel commitment is another. Soccer pretty much needs to appeal to stay at home moms as someone has to drive the player to and from practice or watch the siblings while the player is shuttled around. We were knee deep into soccer. Somethings I liked much better than lacrosse….more of a meritocracy and getting better was more important than getting recruited.

[Matnum PI]

Edward Luce in the Financial Times today lists lacrosse as one of three sports only available to people of privilege. There certainly seems to be an image problem. Mr Luce receives much of his oped input from sources in Washington DC.

What were the other two? Seems to be more than 2...

[mdk01]

Football seems like one sport that could stay non-aristocratic for awhile, but I'm just basing that on it being a school sponsored sport, so most kids have roughly equal access to football training hours. A quality Football culture can be established at poor High Schools. I don't know the college football camp landscape, but my impression is that college programs want the best players possible at their camps, and those kids paying for the camp is less important than their ability.

It seems like soccer culture is bigger among immigrants to the US than it is among the rich. I don't know the youth soccer system that the best immigrant players are in to say if it's changing like lacrosse is.

Many of the best youth soccer clubs are in affluent communities. USSF has been making a big push to try to expand its reach without a lot of success. California and Texas may do a good job of attracting players from immigrant families. Immigration status of parents / grandparents may have been one impediment and time/travel commitment is another. Soccer pretty much needs to appeal to stay at home moms as someone has to drive the player to and from practice or watch the siblings while the player is shuttled around. We were knee deep into soccer. Somethings I liked much better than lacrosse….more of a meritocracy and getting better was more important than getting recruited.

Isn't soccer a winter sport in Texas HSs, though I'm sure there are year round travel teams.

[mdk01]

Edward Luce in the Financial Times today lists lacrosse as one of three sports only available to people of privilege. There certainly seems to be an image problem. Mr Luce receives much of his oped input from sources in Washington DC.

A Brit who went to Oxford. Maybe over there.

[DocBarrister]

In today’s Wall Street Journal on page A3 is an article relating action against “legacy admission” to universities, especially Harvard and other “elite” schools. Included in that piece is this:

“Former Harvard President Larry Summers said last week in an opinion piece in the Washington Post that it is time for elite colleges to do away with legacy preferences and “take a hard look at admissions preferences for those who excel in ‘aristocrat sports’ and resist being impressed by those who have benefited from high-priced coaching through the admissions process.”

I think the “high-priced coaching” reference was to SAT and application guidance, but I suppose could include sports camps. But what is an “aristocrat sport?” Cornell, Virginia, and others have polo. Fencing? Sailing? How about gymnastics? Squash? Tennis? Swimming? Skiing (nodding to MDlaxfan76)? If expense is a factor, I think the only non-aristocrats are hoops and soccer.

Is lacrosse "an aristocrat sport?"

Is lacrosse "an aristocrat sport?"

The question is absurd.

Lord DocBarrister, First Earl of Fanlax