"The Deep State" aka the American Intelligence Community

[Typical Lax Dad]

Typical v19 SHAMING.......

........didn't you claim that you gave it to your mother in law?

No. My mother in law us fine. I was afraid my son may have passed it to her...Turned out to be fine. I am keeping my fingers crossed and hope I don’t get it and then pass it on to her. She has been healthy and independent. Would hate to see her go because of Covid-19 but as you say, anyone over 65 or thereabouts has lived enough. Maybe you just got in under the bar?

why can't you pass it on to anyone? Do you never leave the house?

First of all, let me say I hope you are ok. Secondly where did I say that if I have COVID, I can’t pass it on to anyone?

why you thinking it was your son, and not you? Are you like mdlax, and never leave the house?

I am going to let you put your thinking cap on for a while.

[ABV 8.3%]

Typical v19 SHAMING.......

........didn't you claim that you gave it to your mother in law?

No. My mother in law us fine. I was afraid my son may have passed it to her...Turned out to be fine. I am keeping my fingers crossed and hope I don’t get it and then pass it on to her. She has been healthy and independent. Would hate to see her go because of Covid-19 but as you say, anyone over 65 or thereabouts has lived enough. Maybe you just got in under the bar?

watching a show on late nite local cable, great guest from Harvard Med school.......very clear we need to STOP with the v19 shaming as not productive. kind of like you claiming I love tRump.

Guess why I went to the ACLU fundraiser in 2017.......to support Trump

We need to stop making fun of the seriousness of the virus....you know....fear porn and all.... I don’t know what you did in 2017.....I can only go by what I see here....you choose to defend and deflect....I recall you suggesting people are jealous to not be able to live Trump’s lavish lifestyle....your kind of partier...who wouldn’t want to hang around a guy like Trump? You remember? I do.

huh? your conclusions are all wrong about that. Goes along with everyone "tolerating" Trump over the years because he was rich. I could give two birds about that, being rich. (I am not normal ) He was a tolerable buffoon. Like Mikey Milken is loved by the Giving Pledge gang.

Kind of like the gang from that great movie, American Pie, who only were friends with stiffler because of his party house. Or Mom.

Since you don't party, you wouldn't understand. How do you manage when the bond daddies wanna leave Morriseey BLVD and head down to RI's foxy lady or whatever it's called.

[ABV 8.3%]

Typical v19 SHAMING.......

........didn't you claim that you gave it to your mother in law?

No. My mother in law us fine. I was afraid my son may have passed it to her...Turned out to be fine. I am keeping my fingers crossed and hope I don’t get it and then pass it on to her. She has been healthy and independent. Would hate to see her go because of Covid-19 but as you say, anyone over 65 or thereabouts has lived enough. Maybe you just got in under the bar?

why can't you pass it on to anyone? Do you never leave the house?

First of all, let me say I hope you are ok. Secondly where did I say that if I have COVID, I can’t pass it on to anyone?

why you thinking it was your son, and not you? Are you like mdlax, and never leave the house?

I am going to let you put your thinking cap on for a while.

what cap?

[Typical Lax Dad]

Typical v19 SHAMING.......

........didn't you claim that you gave it to your mother in law?

No. My mother in law us fine. I was afraid my son may have passed it to her...Turned out to be fine. I am keeping my fingers crossed and hope I don’t get it and then pass it on to her. She has been healthy and independent. Would hate to see her go because of Covid-19 but as you say, anyone over 65 or thereabouts has lived enough. Maybe you just got in under the bar?

watching a show on late nite local cable, great guest from Harvard Med school.......very clear we need to STOP with the v19 shaming as not productive. kind of like you claiming I love tRump.

Guess why I went to the ACLU fundraiser in 2017.......to support Trump

We need to stop making fun of the seriousness of the virus....you know....fear porn and all.... I don’t know what you did in 2017.....I can only go by what I see here....you choose to defend and deflect....I recall you suggesting people are jealous to not be able to live Trump’s lavish lifestyle....your kind of partier...who wouldn’t want to hang around a guy like Trump? You remember? I do.

huh? your conclusions are all wrong about that. Goes along with everyone "tolerating" Trump over the years because he was rich. I could give two birds about that, being rich. (I am not normal ) He was a tolerable buffoon. Like Mikey Milken is loved by the Giving Pledge gang.

Kind of like the gang from that great movie, American Pie, who only were friends with stiffler because of his party house. Or Mom.

Since you don't party, you wouldn't understand. How do you manage when the bond daddies wanna leave Morriseey BLVD and head down to RI's foxy lady or whatever it's called.

I have a good memory guy...you can’t BS me dude.... maybe you were just being wacky.

[ABV 8.3%]

Typical v19 SHAMING.......

........didn't you claim that you gave it to your mother in law?

No. My mother in law us fine. I was afraid my son may have passed it to her...Turned out to be fine. I am keeping my fingers crossed and hope I don’t get it and then pass it on to her. She has been healthy and independent. Would hate to see her go because of Covid-19 but as you say, anyone over 65 or thereabouts has lived enough. Maybe you just got in under the bar?

watching a show on late nite local cable, great guest from Harvard Med school.......very clear we need to STOP with the v19 shaming as not productive. kind of like you claiming I love tRump.

Guess why I went to the ACLU fundraiser in 2017.......to support Trump

We need to stop making fun of the seriousness of the virus....you know....fear porn and all.... I don’t know what you did in 2017.....I can only go by what I see here....you choose to defend and deflect....I recall you suggesting people are jealous to not be able to live Trump’s lavish lifestyle....your kind of partier...who wouldn’t want to hang around a guy like Trump? You remember? I do.

huh? your conclusions are all wrong about that. Goes along with everyone "tolerating" Trump over the years because he was rich. I could give two birds about that, being rich. (I am not normal ) He was a tolerable buffoon. Like Mikey Milken is loved by the Giving Pledge gang.

Kind of like the gang from that great movie, American Pie, who only were friends with stiffler because of his party house. Or Mom.

Since you don't party, you wouldn't understand. How do you manage when the bond daddies wanna leave Morriseey BLVD and head down to RI's foxy lady or whatever it's called.

I have a good memory guy...you can’t BS me dude.... maybe you were just being wacky. kind of like you, and all your comments. most recently MAGA2024

Nope, you have me confused with someone else. If you are referring too, as I just mentioned, that people loved trump , along with Jeff Epstein, because of that lavish lifestyle...and sure, many are jealous of it.

Nantucket is full of these types, you awtta know, hanging at Bill B's pad. Robert Kraft like Trump and his rubNtug types. Speaking of, can't believe he went after the person who gave him a happy ending. Kraft is such a scumbag.

but, either way, I will never be anything that what you think I am. Stay open minded, cradleNshoot has some hypocrisy water bottles to fill.

[old salt]

All I am saying, is yes, he plead guilty.....but that also does not mean what he plead guilty of doing, is factually accurate.

Flynn thought it was factually accurate. He so testified under oath twice in front of a federal judge. He signed one or more documents under oath so stating.

T**** thought it was factually accurate. That’s why he fired him for lying. Pence thought it was factually accurate.

Mueller thought it was factually accurate. The prosecutors thought it was factually accurate. The judge thought it was factually accurate.

Even Bill Barr in his motion to dismiss did not dispute that it was factually accurate.

We have the tapes of Flynn’s calls with Kislyak. We know what Flynn said to him. We have the notes of the FBI agents who interviewed him. Their account has not been disputed by Flynn or anyone else.

Who thinks it isn’t factually accurate and what is their evidence?

Must be some real bad attorneys and judges out there if they couldn’t lock someone up so guilty. Why, then, IYO was it not such a slam dunk case if everyone believes his plea? You guys are so certain and yet, prior to pardon, it was still be argued. Not to mention, POTUS just pardoned him.

EDIT: the quote from NPR, is where I am coming from in my earlier comments, unfortunately, this small back and forth w/njbill does not cover the premise of the original conversation.

Attorney General William Barr was clear in an interview with CBS News on Thursday evening: "People sometimes plead to things that turn out not to be crimes, and the Department of Justice is not persuaded that this was material to any legitimate counterintelligence investigation. So it was not a crime."

Part of the delay was due to the fact that Flynn elected not to proceed to sentencing when he first came up before Judge Sullivan. Then Sid started filing motion after motion. Then Bill Barr filed his motion to dismiss. Then Sid appealed before Sullivan had even ruled. And now Flynn has been pardoned. So the delays are almost entirely due to Sid and Barr.

Yes, Barr claims there was no crime. Importantly, though, to our discussion, he did not say there was no crime because Flynn did not lie. He says there was no crime because Flynn’s lie was not material (in his view).

Thank you.

In bold of your reply, which means what?

As Flynn said, and Barr alluded, the guilty plea was A calculated decision based on the circumstances he was presented at the time, coupled with the financial ramifications of a drawn out legal battle with the feds, that will certainly impact family.

It is clearly a quagmire.

Have zero empathy for Flynn, or ANY long time officer who wants to play politics. Collect your retirement pay and go coach some youth lacrosse.
Why is it why never hear of Coast Guard guys getting into trouble by pretending to take part in a Model UN project like some skullNbones loser, FRAT guy.

I suspect Flynn agrees with you, ...now. His case illustrates why most retired senior military officers are reluctant to enter the political fray.

The things that made Flynn such a successful intel officer (willingness to challenge the status quo & conventional wisdom), doomed him in politics.

His previous contacts with Russian officials & plan to work with Turkey & Russia in resolving the civil war in Syria played right into the Russophobia excuse for the election result.

He was doomed as soon as he joined in the "lock her up" chants. If he had to play, he was on the wrong side.

[njbill]

It's your assertion that Flynn's contacts with Kislyak were illegal. If that's the case, why didn't Mueller charge him with that "illegality" ? Mueller was looking for every indictment & plea he could get to run up the score. Even he wasn't willing to use the Logan Act to prosecute normal & appropriate communications between an incoming admin official & a foreign diplomat.

If the FBI had grounds to suspect that Flynn was working with the Russians off the books (whatever that means) they should have sought the warrants necessary to conduct a legit counter-intel investigation. We don't know that they had not under Crossfire Razor. If it was a good faith investigation, they would have shown Flynn (& McGahn) the transcript & asked Flynn to account for his actions. Either way, an interview would have alerted Flynn they were on his trail. Once they learned that their suspicions about Flynn & the Russians lead to nothing & he co-operated with Mueller's investigators fully, there was no reason to charge him on their entrapment.

What did all the suspicions about Flynn (& the extraordinary measures they rationalized) yield, after 18 mos of spying & investigation ? Nothing but a fabricated entrapment charge. Partisan lawyers can criminalize anything. They did in Flynn's case.

It’s not just my assertion. A lot of people think he violated the Logan act. I imagine Mueller didn’t charge him because we are told there has never been a successful prosecution under that law. In light of that fact, maybe Mueller didn’t think he could get a conviction. Lots of people commit crimes, but aren’t charged. I exceed the speed limit from time to time, but seldom get a speeding ticket.

To me at least, the suspicion that Flynn might be working for the Russians didn’t arise until he lied to Pence. The interview of Flynn was the logical next step, or at least one of them. Up until the lie to Pence, Flynn’s conversation with Kislyak could be explained as perhaps nothing more than jumping the gun if you don’t want to view it as a Logan act violation.

But once you add in the lie to Pence, reasonable people become suspicious as to whether Flynn is lying to everyone in government and working in secret for the Russians. I forget the exact time frame, but I don’t think much time elapsed between the Pence lie and the White House interview.

Investigators have to be given latitude in how they investigate a crime. Sometimes the criminal is confronted with evidence, sometimes not. The investigators here didn’t show Flynn the transcript, but they quoted his exact words. He knew or should’ve known that they had listened to the tape and likely had a transcript. He probably knew they were quoting his words back to him. The approach they used was perfectly reasonable, certainly within their investigative discretion.

If Flynn had simply told the truth to the FBI, that probably would have been the end of it. They might have asked him why he lied to Pence. Perhaps the truth is that it was because T**** told him not to tell Pence about his conversations with Kislyak. Simple as that.

I wasn’t a Flynn fan, but didn’t have strong feelings about whether he should go to jail. I was willing to leave that up to the judge. But with his recent statements, my views on him have changed. He’s advocating overthrowing the government which is outrageous for any American, let alone a former general.

[old salt]

It's your assertion that Flynn's contacts with Kislyak were illegal. If that's the case, why didn't Mueller charge him with that "illegality" ? Mueller was looking for every indictment & plea he could get to run up the score. Even he wasn't willing to use the Logan Act to prosecute normal & appropriate communications between an incoming admin official & a foreign diplomat.

If the FBI had grounds to suspect that Flynn was working with the Russians off the books (whatever that means) they should have sought the warrants necessary to conduct a legit counter-intel investigation. We don't know that they had not under Crossfire Razor. If it was a good faith investigation, they would have shown Flynn (& McGahn) the transcript & asked Flynn to account for his actions. Either way, an interview would have alerted Flynn they were on his trail. Once they learned that their suspicions about Flynn & the Russians lead to nothing & he co-operated with Mueller's investigators fully, there was no reason to charge him on their entrapment.

What did all the suspicions about Flynn (& the extraordinary measures they rationalized) yield, after 18 mos of spying & investigation ? Nothing but a fabricated entrapment charge. Partisan lawyers can criminalize anything. They did in Flynn's case.

It’s not just my assertion. A lot of people think he violated the Logan act. I imagine Mueller didn’t charge him because we are told there has never been a successful prosecution under that law. In light of that fact, maybe Mueller didn’t think he could get a conviction. Lots of people commit crimes, but aren’t charged. I exceed the speed limit from time to time, but seldom get a speeding ticket.

To me at least, the suspicion that Flynn might be working for the Russians didn’t arise until he lied to Pence. The interview of Flynn was the logical next step, or at least one of them. Up until the lie to Pence, Flynn’s conversation with Kislyak could be explained as perhaps nothing more than jumping the gun if you don’t want to view it as a Logan act violation.

But once you add in the lie to Pence, reasonable people become suspicious as to whether Flynn is lying to everyone in government and working in secret for the Russians. I forget the exact time frame, but I don’t think much time elapsed between the Pence lie and the White House interview.

Investigators have to be given latitude in how they investigate a crime. Sometimes the criminal is confronted with evidence, sometimes not. The investigators here didn’t show Flynn the transcript, but they quoted his exact words. He knew or should’ve known that they had listened to the tape and likely had a transcript. He probably knew they were quoting his words back to him. The approach they used was perfectly reasonable, certainly within their investigative discretion.

If Flynn had simply told the truth to the FBI, that probably would have been the end of it. They might have asked him why he lied to Pence. Perhaps the truth is that it was because T**** told him not to tell Pence about his conversations with Kislyak. Simple as that.

I wasn’t a Flynn fan, but didn’t have strong feelings about whether he should go to jail. I was willing to leave that up to the judge. But with his recent statements, my views on him have changed. He’s advocating overthrowing the government which is outrageous for any American, let alone a former general.

So if Comey, McCabe & Strzok still had doubts about Flynn, why spook him with the interview ? Let him carry on & monitor him. Crossfire Razor was still open, as was Crossfire Hurricane. The transcript & the apparent lie to Pence should have been sufficient grounds to widen the investigation, if needed. If they had a FISA warrant on Carter Page, should we wonder if & how they were surveilling & spying on Flynn already ? Because of the calls, they elected to keep Crossfire Razor open.

Acting AG Yates was reportedly upset that Comey decided to " just send a over couple guys" to question Flynn without her consent or knowledge. Their duty was to notify the WH counsel & Flynn's superiors before they alerted him that they were on his trail. They blew up their own counter intel investigation when they interviewed Flynn, ...if their suspicions were genuine & not just a political hit.

You overstate the content of the tweet that Flynn merely retweeted. He was being provocative on social media. Accusing him of "advocating overthrowing the government" is hyperbole worthy of Judge Sullivan.

[njbill]

You are Monday morning quarterbacking. Again, you are suggesting alternative investigative strategies. Sure, they could’ve done it that way. Or they could’ve done it the way they did it. That was their choice as the investigators.

None of these scenarios explains or excuses why Flynn lied to the FBI.

In terms of why not drop back and surveil Flynn from afar, he was the brand new national security advisor. It would be quite something to wire tap the national security advisor. I see no problems with interviewing him directly.

It was T**** who fired Flynn for lying don’t forget. Nobody forced him to do that.

Calling for (or agreeing with calls for) martial law so that a valid election can be overturned? What do you call that?

[a fan]

Calling for (or agreeing with calls for) martial law so that a valid election can be overturned? What do you call that?

He calls him a fellow Republican, and says nothing about this behavior. And yet he wants "everyone else" to behave ethically.

Been like this for four years. Everyone has to act perfectly, except TeamTrump. Everyone has to act ethically, except team Trump.

[Typical Lax Dad]

You are Monday morning quarterbacking. Again, you are suggesting alternative investigative strategies. Sure, they could’ve done it that way. Or they could’ve done it the way they did it. That was their choice as the investigators.

None of these scenarios explains or excuses why Flynn lied to the FBI.

In terms of why not drop back and surveil Flynn from afar, he was the brand new national security advisor. It would be quite something to wire tap the national security advisor. I see no problems with interviewing him directly.

It was T**** who fired Flynn for lying don’t forget. Nobody forced him to do that.

Calling for (or agreeing with calls for) martial law so that a valid election can be overturned? What do you call that?

His guy punching back?

[old salt]

Calling for (or agreeing with calls for) martial law so that a valid election can be overturned? What do you call that?

I don't call it overthrowing the government.

WTPC Calls for President to Invoke Limited Martial Law to Hold New Election and Protect our Vote, in Full Page Washington Times Ad, if Legislators, Courts and Congress Do Not Follow the Constitution

It's a call for Legialators, Courts & Congress to act.

Not Flynn's words. It's a retweet. Social media trolling.

[old salt]

In terms of why not drop back and surveil Flynn from afar, he was the brand new national security advisor. It would be quite something to wire tap the national security advisor. I see no problems with interviewing him directly.

How do you know they weren't ? They declined to close Crossfire Razor on Jan 4th. Crossfire Hurricane continued into the Trump term in office & was taken over by Mueller. Didn't have to "drop back"too far. Plenty of whistleblowers in holdover NSC staffers. ...aka unnamed sources.

[a fan]

Calling for (or agreeing with calls for) martial law so that a valid election can be overturned? What do you call that?

I don't call it overthrowing the government.

WTPC Calls for President to Invoke Limited Martial Law to Hold New Election and Protect our Vote, in Full Page Washington Times Ad, if Legislators, Courts and Congress Do Not Follow the Constitution

It's a call for Legialators, Courts & Congress to act.

Right. Except that they all HAVE followed the Constitution. And Flynn is telling millions of ignorant Americans that they aren't. This is treasonous stuff that would make Putin proud.

And you just can't muster the energy to condemn it.

[old salt]

Calling for (or agreeing with calls for) martial law so that a valid election can be overturned? What do you call that?

I don't call it overthrowing the government.

WTPC Calls for President to Invoke Limited Martial Law to Hold New Election and Protect our Vote, in Full Page Washington Times Ad, if Legislators, Courts and Congress Do Not Follow the Constitution

It's a call for Legialators, Courts & Congress to act.

Right. Except that they all HAVE followed the Constitution. And Flynn is telling millions of ignorant Americans that they aren't. This is treasonous stuff that would make Putin proud.

And you just can't muster the energy to condemn it.

I said I would not have retweeted that one.
I'm cautious when it comes to accusing anyone of treason.
I don't know what evidence Flynn has seen.

[a fan]

I said I would not have retweeted that one.

Sigh. That's all you can do, huh? Okay.

I'm cautious when it comes to accusing anyone of treason.

Fine. How about: he's literally undermining the sanctity of our elections in a manner that would make Putin proud.

This is stuff Antifa is supposed to do. Not retired freaking Generals.

I don't know what evidence Flynn has seen.

Oh, yes you have. What the do you think those court cases are? Do you think those weren't real Judges, or something?

[njbill]

Calling for (or agreeing with calls for) martial law so that a valid election can be overturned? What do you call that?

I don't call it overthrowing the government.

WTPC Calls for President to Invoke Limited Martial Law to Hold New Election and Protect our Vote, in Full Page Washington Times Ad, if Legislators, Courts and Congress Do Not Follow the Constitution

It's a call for Legialators, Courts & Congress to act.

Not Flynn's words. It's a retweet. Social media trolling.

Holding a new election when there is absolutely no basis for doing so, including in the constitution, is advocating the overthrow of the government.

There isn’t much difference between a retweet and a tweet. By retweeting, he indicates his agreement with the tweet.

[njbill]

In terms of why not drop back and surveil Flynn from afar, he was the brand new national security advisor. It would be quite something to wire tap the national security advisor. I see no problems with interviewing him directly.

How do you know they weren't ? They declined to close Crossfire Razor on Jan 4th. Crossfire Hurricane continued into the Trump term in office & was taken over by Mueller. Didn't have to "drop back"too far. Plenty of whistleblowers in holdover NSC staffers. ...aka unnamed sources.

Because T**** has controlled DOJ and the FBI for almost 4 years now. This was part of Barr’s investigation into the Flynn prosecution. Durham also has been looking into this.

Nothing has been disclosed. Given Barr’s proclivity for leaking, surely he would have leaked something like this if it had occurred.

[dislaxxic]

Mueller/Durham Side-By-Side "Results" Comparison

Was wondering where all those waiting for the Major Durham News Dump to happen and rescue Don The Con's fatazz...whatever happened to all that??

Speaking of Durham, haven't heard from Techie lately...locked safely in his bunker perhaps?

..

[njbill]

Aha!! Note the yellow sticky on the copy of the hotel receipt.