Navy 2022

[gymman1031]

People have talked about Navy's expectations. Here is what I think Navy can do with the right coach:

1. often make the Patriot League Title game
2. make several postseason appearances, either with the automatic bid or as an at-large
3. have multiple Top 100 players in each of their recruiting classes
4. considering the region they are in and their awesome stadium, lead the NCAA in regular season attendance several times
5. make the Patriot League Tournament Semifinals most years
6. get to the NCAA Tournament Quarterfinals multiple times
7. if all goes right, at least one trip to the Final Four, and maybe beyond

Wait, never mind, thought I stumbled on the Loyola thread by mistake

Haha! The truth is, those ARE very realistic expectations for Loyola. The truth is, Coach Toomey and Co. having exceed them is tremendous!

[Seahawk]

I don’t expect Navy to meet these expectations anytime soon but at least they are the path to follow. And it starts with the new coach and recruiting those Top 100 players to the Yard before they get sidetracked into the BIG, ACC, or the Ivies. Once the recruits are there, then the steps on the path are more realistic.

[youthathletics]

agree to disagree...a high paying and high profile/pressure job(unlike almost all D3 jobs) is not the place for on-the-job training. Can't think of any "big time" program that hires a first time HC--let me know if I've forgotten someone...

Andy Shay - Yale
Matt Madalon - Princeton
Charlie Toomey - Loyola ( he was HC at NAPS and a MD HS, but no college HC exp.)
Nick Meyers - Ohio State

Cornell hired Petro who returned the program to competitiveness on the national scene who hired Tambdo I as his asst.

In addition to the ones listed above, there are several other examples of D-I programs that hired a first-time HC. Not sure what defines big time, but there are some familiar names.
Joe Alberici - Army
Joe Amplo - Marquette
Joe Breschi - Ohio State
Ben DeLuca - Cornell
Chris Fiefs - UVM
Peter Milliman - Cornell
Shawn Nadelen - Towson
Lars Tiffany - Stony Brook
John Tillman - Harvard
Jon Torpey - High Point
Kevin Warne - Georgetown

Anthony Gilardi - Stony Brook
Andrew Baxter - Fairfield

[oldjayfan]

agree to disagree...a high paying and high profile/pressure job(unlike almost all D3 jobs) is not the place for on-the-job training. Can't think of any "big time" program that hires a first time HC--let me know if I've forgotten someone...

Andy Shay - Yale
Matt Madalon - Princeton
Charlie Toomey - Loyola ( he was HC at NAPS and a MD HS, but no college HC exp.)
Nick Meyers - Ohio State

Cornell hired Petro who returned the program to competitiveness on the national scene who hired Tambdo I as his asst.

In addition to the ones listed above, there are several other examples of D-I programs that hired a first-time HC. Not sure what defines big time, but there are some familiar names.
Joe Alberici - Army
Joe Amplo - Marquette
Joe Breschi - Ohio State
Ben DeLuca - Cornell
Chris Fiefs - UVM
Peter Milliman - Cornell
Shawn Nadelen - Towson
Lars Tiffany - Stony Brook
John Tillman - Harvard
Jon Torpey - High Point
Kevin Warne - Georgetown

Anthony Gilardi - Stony Brook
Andrew Baxter - Fairfield

At the time of those hires, I would say only Cornell was in the National debate each year.. Granted Towson , OSU and maybe G'town have upped their standing. SBU and Fairfield, ah, no... And, Cornell was in a major budget crunch during both of the aforementioned hires...

For example, look where these guys went after their first gigs: Tills - UMD; Lars --UVA; Breschi --UNC; Amplo--Navy(sort of big time ); Torpey--will get a big time job soon if his star stays on the same trajectory. I suppose I feel a "big time" job is a destination job, not a stepping stone. Army is like Navy in that regard--right person makes it a lifetime gig.

[laxpere]

As always, it will be tough to find scorers,

The scorers are there and have been. You can't score when you only shoot with just the starters week in and week out. Look no further than a player like Foster who barely, if ever, saw the field in 2018, then was a bright star in 2019. Another like Spilker can shoot from outside and on the run very well, was on EMO in 2018, then gets bumped to nowhere in 2019.
Many of the players just need the reps and did not get them, which is why I have suggested for the past few years that the practice needed to change.

Case in point would be the Holy Cross game. Navy lost by only two ignoring the junk goal near the end. That game should have been a cake walk for Navy even with the former NAPS coach on the enemy sideline. That was a non factor, and Navy sealed their fate in that game by making way too many mistakes. Have no idea what was going on up there in Mass, but the first line didn't deliver and no one else was offered a chance.
Plenty of other examples where players, like 7 for one, didn't have enough touches/reps over the course of the season. Total lack of consistency in every phase of the game doomed Navy's season starting with the Princeton game.
Maybe next year will be different? Looking forward to seeing if there is a transformation but it's really time to worry about winning on the field. Not the year to worry about about attendance incentives, like company tailgates/BBQs, because it's a year stacked with away games.
Go Navy Lacrosse v.2020!

[laxpere]

At the time of those hires, I would say only Cornell was in the National debate each year.. Granted Towson , OSU and maybe G'town have upped their standing. SBU and Fairfield, ah, no... And, Cornell was in a major budget crunch during both of the aforementioned hires...

For example, look where these guys went after their first gigs: Tills - UMD; Lars --UVA; Breschi --UNC; Amplo--Navy(sort of big time ); Torpey--will get a big time job soon if his star stays on the same trajectory. I suppose I feel a "big time" job is a destination job, not a stepping stone. Army is like Navy in that regard--right person makes it a lifetime gig.

So how many proven experienced head coaches have been hired by "big time" DI programs?
Tillman's tenure at Harvard was too short so maybe Breschi and Tiffany on your list fit?
Tambroni was proven at Cornell but Penn State isn't "big time".
Any ones that fit?

[Dip&Dunk]

As always, it will be tough to find scorers,

The scorers are there and have been. You can't score when you only shoot with just the starters week in and week out. Look no further than a player like Foster who barely, if ever, saw the field in 2018, then was a bright star in 2019. Another like Spilker can shoot from outside and on the run very well, was on EMO in 2018, then gets bumped to nowhere in 2019.
Many of the players just need the reps and did not get them, which is why I have suggested for the past few years that the practice needed to change.

Case in point would be the Holy Cross game. Navy lost by only two ignoring the junk goal near the end. That game should have been a cake walk for Navy even with with the former NAPS coach on the enemy sideline. He was a non factor and Navy sealed their fate in that game by making way too many mistakes. Have no idea what was going on up there in Mass but the first line didn't deliver and no one else was offered a chance.
Plenty of other examples where players, like 7 for one, didn't have enough touches/reps over the course of the season. Total lack of consistency in every phase of the game doomed Navy starting with the Princeton game.
Maybe next year will be different? Looking forward to seeing if there is a transformation but it's really time to worry about winning on the field. Not the year to worry about about attendance incentives, like company tailgates/BBQs, because it's a year stacked with away games.
Go Navy Lacrosse v.2020!

Gotta have some reason to go.

[oldjayfan]

At the time of those hires, I would say only Cornell was in the National debate each year.. Granted Towson , OSU and maybe G'town have upped their standing. SBU and Fairfield, ah, no... And, Cornell was in a major budget crunch during both of the aforementioned hires...

For example, look where these guys went after their first gigs: Tills - UMD; Lars --UVA; Breschi --UNC; Amplo--Navy(sort of big time ); Torpey--will get a big time job soon if his star stays on the same trajectory. I suppose I feel a "big time" job is a destination job, not a stepping stone. Army is like Navy in that regard--right person makes it a lifetime gig.

So how many proven experienced head coaches have been hired by "big time" DI programs?
Tillman's tenure at Harvard was too short so maybe Breschi and Tiffany on your list fit?
Tambroni was proven at Cornell but Penn State isn't "big time".
Any ones that fit?

Don't know where "proven" came into the conversation...it's my opinion that most "destination" jobs hire coaches that are not first timers..And, PSU had the goal to go "big time"...like OSU, not sure about G'town. Towson has been back and forth...

[Homer]

At the time of those hires, I would say only Cornell was in the National debate each year.. Granted Towson , OSU and maybe G'town have upped their standing. SBU and Fairfield, ah, no... And, Cornell was in a major budget crunch during both of the aforementioned hires...

For example, look where these guys went after their first gigs: Tills - UMD; Lars --UVA; Breschi --UNC; Amplo--Navy(sort of big time ); Torpey--will get a big time job soon if his star stays on the same trajectory. I suppose I feel a "big time" job is a destination job, not a stepping stone. Army is like Navy in that regard--right person makes it a lifetime gig.

So how many proven experienced head coaches have been hired by "big time" DI programs?
Tillman's tenure at Harvard was too short so maybe Breschi and Tiffany on your list fit?
Tambroni was proven at Cornell but Penn State isn't "big time".
Any ones that fit?

Don't know where "proven" came into the conversation...it's my opinion that most "destination" jobs hire coaches that are not first timers..And, PSU had the goal to go "big time"...like OSU, not sure about G'town. Towson has been back and forth...

When you're talking about "big time" programs it's inherently a very small sample size, insofar as programs that consistently do well over a long period are least likely to make changes... Maryland has hired just two coaches since 1984. Syracuse has only been coached by three men since the Hoover administration. Notre Dame has had one coaching change in its entire existence as a program.

Within that small sample, you'll find a few "proven experienced head coaches" even beyond the Breschi/Tiffany level. Cottle to Maryland. Danowski to Duke.

As for the flip side, "big time" programs hiring coaches with no previous HC experience, there's a long history of internally promoting assistants who've never run a program -- in some cases who've never coached anywhere else at all. E.g., I don't believe Desko ever left Syracuse as a player or assistant between graduating West Genny and taking over as head. Historically that was the tradition at places like Cuse and Hopkins, and a number of the current top coaches like Toomey and Nadelen were also internally promoted into their first jobs as HC.

If the question's whether "big time" programs ever hire assistants without HC experience from outside, that's more interesting. The obvious example, as noted above, is Petro at Cornell. But who would be next on that list? Highest program in terms of perceived stature at the time to bring in a first-timer? Let's say within the last 25 years, just to keep it somewhat relevant to the present. I dunno. Hofstra was at least hanging around the fringes of the elite at the time they hired Seth Tierney... I'm sure there's probably somebody else I'm forgetting?

[OCanada]

There was doubt Danowski was going to be at Hofstra much longer before Duke opened up. He was having the same kind of problems Seth has.

Bob Scott was HC st Hopkins from the 50s to 1974. Scottie was not a HC prior. He became AD and was replaced by Chic who had not been a HC. 7 title games in a row but developed heart/health issues that forced his retirement. Followed by Zim who resigned a few years later but had not been a HC. Followed by Tony Seaman who had been HC at Penn. then Petro who was HC at Cornell and went a long way towards rebuilding the program.

Desko is a fixture at Cuse. RM was not a head coach before Navy as I recall. Dom was HC at Brown before UVA? Tierney was an assistant before Princeton.

Willie Scroggs was not a HC before UNC

[FactChecker]

RM was not a head coach before Navy as I recall.

Not immediately before he took the Navy job, however he was HC at University of Baltimore from 1980-83.

[OCanada]

Thanks

[10stone5]

There was doubt Danowski was going to be at Hofstra much longer before Duke opened up. He was having the same kind of problems Seth has.

Bob Scott was HC st Hopkins from the 50s to 1974. Scottie was not a HC prior. He became AD and was replaced by Chic who had not been a HC. 7 title games in a row but developed heart/health issues that forced his retirement. Followed by Zim who resigned a few years later but had not been a HC. Followed by Tony Seaman who had been HC at Penn. then Petro who was HC at Cornell and went a long way towards rebuilding the program.

Desko is a fixture at Cuse. RM was not a head coach before Navy as I recall. Dom was HC at Brown before UVA? Tierney was an assistant before Princeton.

Willie Scroggs was not a HC before UNC.

And, 1 year at C.W. Post for Seaman prior to Penn.
Danowski coached at C.W. Post, also, prior to Hofstra.

[10stone5]

There was doubt Danowski was going to be at Hofstra much longer before Duke opened up. He was having the same kind of problems Seth has.

Bob Scott was HC st Hopkins from the 50s to 1974. Scottie was not a HC prior. He became AD and was replaced by Chic who had not been a HC. 7 title games in a row but developed heart/health issues that forced his retirement. Followed by Zim who resigned a few years later but had not been a HC. Followed by Tony Seaman who had been HC at Penn. then Petro who was HC at Cornell and went a long way towards rebuilding the program.

Desko is a fixture at Cuse. RM was not a head coach before Navy as I recall. Dom was HC at Brown before UVA? Tierney was an assistant before Princeton.

Willie Scroggs was not a HC before UNC

Blame the alumni, re: Danowski at Hofstra.
He had several quarterfinal teams, averaged almost 10 wins a season, but when that excellent 2006 team got upset by UMass, all h377 broke loose.

[OCanada]

It sure did. I agree

[old salt]

Marquette has finalized their coaching staff. New offensive coordinator, not a holdover.
https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/ ... vard/54913

[laxxygilmore]

As always, it will be tough to find scorers,

The scorers are there and have been. You can't score when you only shoot with just the starters week in and week out. Look no further than a player like Foster who barely, if ever, saw the field in 2018, then was a bright star in 2019. Another like Spilker can shoot from outside and on the run very well, was on EMO in 2018, then gets bumped to nowhere in 2019.

Many of the players just need the reps and did not get them, which is why I have suggested for the past few years that the practice needed to change.

+1 youthathletics. Well stated and exactly correct -- as usual.

[WOMBAT, Mod Emeritus]

There was doubt Danowski was going to be at Hofstra much longer before Duke opened up. He was having the same kind of problems Seth has.

Bob Scott was HC st Hopkins from the 50s to 1974. Scottie was not a HC prior. He became AD and was replaced by Chic who had not been a HC. 7 title games in a row but developed heart/health issues that forced his retirement. Followed by Zim who resigned a few years later but had not been a HC. Followed by Tony Seaman who had been HC at Penn. then Petro who was HC at Cornell and went a long way towards rebuilding the program.

Desko is a fixture at Cuse. RM was not a head coach before Navy as I recall. Dom was HC at Brown before UVA? Tierney was an assistant before Princeton.

Willie Scroggs was not a HC before UNC

You forgot the forgettable Haus.

[laxxygilmore]

Does anyone have any intel on who Amplo might hire? You figure he has to hire at least 1 guy soon since recruiting is in full swing. His top assistant has to be an O guy and good recruiter I would think.

Some awesome names have been mentioned. Maybe he can convince Phipps to come back?

I also want to reiterate how great of a man Coach Wellner was and respected by all.

Interesting read:

https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/ ... gage/54828

Fore
"T"

Agreed, "T". Refreshing to know and be encouraged about on so many levels for the MLax Mids. Especially these key comments from Coach Amplo...

https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/ ... gage/54828

“My biggest thing is the relationships. I can’t let my first 30 days here go by without being engaged with as many people as possible. I want to be involved from a relationship standpoint with anyone who can touch this program,” Amplo said.

“The opportunity to work at the world’s best leadership institution, that personally and professionally is an unbelievable honor and a privilege. The personal and professional growth — what an opportunity."

“From a lacrosse standpoint, it has one of the most long-standing traditions in our sport, and a rich alumni network that is supportive, excited, and the institution supports it at the highest level. You’re given every resource necessary to compete. You’ve got the support of a fanbase. You’ve got the support of alums. The potential for the team to compete at the highest level of our sport is there,” he said. “And oh by the way. Everyone that you coach is going to go on to do great things in the world. To me, it’s the complete package.”

“Listen about their experience and learn what I need to learn. Talk to the players on my team and hear about their day. Understand the challenges, but accept them. Every institution’s got challenges… I can’t make it a deterrent to who we are as a team. I have to make it part of who we are. The biggest thing is learning about it and understanding how I’m going to fit a process into play where that’s part of it,” he said.

“This is a unique challenge, and there are young men that don’t want this opportunity, and they’re right off the board. There are young men who are off the board right away at every institution, whether it's an academic, geographical or competitive reason. There are kids that most institutions can’t recruit,” he said. “For ours, the military is the clearinghouse. To the extent that students may be interested even a little bit, the sooner they learn the opportunities with the military and then beyond the service are as good or better than most institutions in our sport, kids are going to become even more excited.”

…yup, additional indications that Coach Amplo gets it already. Refreshing and encouraging indeed.

Man, looks like he’s been reading Reef Points already.

Or did he find an unused copy in his new desk?

Is Reef Points the definitive guide to all the best fishing spots along the Severn & Chesapeake?

Truly encouraging for the MLax Mids and their families to experience Coach Amplo's authenticity, confidence and competence in establishing open lines of communication with the full Navy MLax Family that spans the past decades to the present...Coach Amplo is walking the walk of Navy Lacrosse. Fall ball 2019 will be here before we know it - a lot to look forward to with Coach Amplo, his staff and their Mids.

[AreaLax]

LSN has an interview with Amplo