Regulation - Too Much or Too Little?

[PizzaSnake]

You and I have danced this dance before. What you call pure socialism I call federal spending. Once Uncle Sam takes our tax dollars from us they spend it however they see fit. IMO the UV has enough Alum out there that they can create their own endowment for their university.

Yeah---but they didn't do that.

If UVa---where the government owns and operates the entity in question isn't socialism?

Then that would mean that you could open up a Federal or State owned and operated shoe factory, and that wouldn't be socialism, either.


Socialism is simply where the government owns and operates the entity in question.

Can America function without Government owned and operated schools? Can we have only private toll roads? Or privately owned parks?

Of course. But we elected representatives who CHOSE to install socialist institutions.

Can function? Poorly, maybe.

‘By the morning of Tuesday last week, Texas was plunged into an unprecedented energy crisis, with Ercot unable to restore most of the grid. As markets reopened, some traders liquidated their positions, unable to post the additional margin.

“If you want to play, you’ve got to pay,” said John Kilduff, trader and founding partner at Again Capital. “It’s a mechanism to wring out excessive speculation.”‘

Play? Is this a forking game ?!?!

Move to Tejas and Texit if that’s your plan. I’m pretty sure most people will pass.

[PizzaSnake]

Of course, given nonsense like the truly munificent offer of a $10 minimum wage, I guess we shouldn’t look for any realism from certain parties.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles ... nd=premium

Really, work full-time and end up with a princely 20K a year?

So, if we can mandate minimums, how about some maximums? Hmm? I’m pretty sure no one, and I’m very confident in this, is worth more than 100 times the lowest paid. 100 times more. Think about it.

One hundred times. Two orders of magnitude.

Really?

[Farfromgeneva]

We would probably disagree on min wage generally (I tend to think something lower than $15 and perhaps chain linked is better, or perhaps a regional adjustment, fannie/freddie and HUD all do this in their guarantees on multifamily property loan guarantees, NYC for example gets a multiplier over the base census tract nationally) as there are a number of reasons that implementing it nationally would have some nasty consequences in cities under around 75,000 and smaller areas below that threshold, particularly areas with negative net migration going on (NE, Midwest for example).

But more importantly, the fiscal and monetary houses have to synchronize their activities. Gov't/Congress/WH has been enacting policies and legislation for more than a decade now that has often run counter to each other's expected outcomes from their actions. So ramping fast on min wage with zero interest rate policy and fed still buying assets is a recipe for disaster. Wouldn't happen overnight so naturally some clown would show up 6mo-1yr later declaring victory or failure, but over a 18-36mo period you'd see it I'm fairly certain (depending on other controllable and exogenous events we can't necessarily anticipate).

So honestly you can't have a Powell or Yellen running the Fed while making moves that will push prices upward. We're benefitting a ton from the secular decline of fossil fuels as a price component in our lives (offset for most of the millenium by rising healthcare and education costs) which is deflationary but believe that inflation is not a risk at your own peril. Want to jump straight to $15 min wage and take other actions? Tighten up the Fed, put a hawk in the chair seat. Let them pull some liquidity out of the system and push up the cost of money a little and over time that will actually increase operating margins for business overall which will allow them to absorb the higher wage costs without as much damage to the "small business community" that everyone loves to talk about in the abstract but many folks don't really understand on the street level.

[RedFromMI]

We would probably disagree on min wage generally (I tend to think something lower than $15 and perhaps chain linked is better, or perhaps a regional adjustment, fannie/freddie and HUD all do this in their guarantees on multifamily property loan guarantees, NYC for example gets a multiplier over the base census tract nationally) as there are a number of reasons that implementing it nationally would have some nasty consequences in cities under around 75,000 and smaller areas below that threshold, particularly areas with negative net migration going on (NE, Midwest for example).

But more importantly, the fiscal and monetary houses have to synchronize their activities. Gov't/Congress/WH has been enacting policies and legislation for more than a decade now that has often run counter to each other's expected outcomes from their actions. So ramping fast on min wage with zero interest rate policy and fed still buying assets is a recipe for disaster. Wouldn't happen overnight so naturally some clown would show up 6mo-1yr later declaring victory or failure, but over a 18-36mo period you'd see it I'm fairly certain (depending on other controllable and exogenous events we can't necessarily anticipate).

So honestly you can't have a Powell or Yellen running the Fed while making moves that will push prices upward. We're benefitting a ton from the secular decline of fossil fuels as a price component in our lives (offset for most of the millenium by rising healthcare and education costs) which is deflationary but believe that inflation is not a risk at your own peril. Want to jump straight to $15 min wage and take other actions? Tighten up the Fed, put a hawk in the chair seat. Let them pull some liquidity out of the system and push up the cost of money a little and over time that will actually increase operating margins for business overall which will allow them to absorb the higher wage costs without as much damage to the "small business community" that everyone loves to talk about in the abstract but many folks don't really understand on the street level.

This is the current proposal:

Under the proposal, the minimum wage would almost immediately increase to $9.50 per hour, then would increase annually by $1.50 per hour until reaching $15 in 2025. Each year thereafter, any further increase would be based on the median hourly wage of all employees for the prior year.

[Farfromgeneva]

I guess that's ok. I could even see a little higher starting place and smaller steps, which decline in percentage terms, but is north of 15% and 10% in the first two years which I would manage on a smoother level, mabye 10-11 start and then 5% increases until you get to $15 given inflation is below 2% these days that's still a net 3%+ real wage increase for 4-7yrs without doing the compounding math. The point is to "stick the tip in and see how it feels before getting all the way in" and not "shocking" the system with immediate substantial step ups. (did back of the napkin but starting at $10.00 and growing 5% for 8yrs would get you to $14.77, so maybe something like that, perhaps slightly higher than 10.00 or 6%)

[PizzaSnake]

I guess that's ok. I could even see a little higher starting place and smaller steps, which decline in percentage terms, but is north of 15% and 10% in the first two years which I would manage on a smoother level, mabye 10-11 start and then 5% increases until you get to $15 given inflation is below 2% these days that's still a net 3%+ real wage increase for 4-7yrs without doing the compounding math. The point is to "stick the tip in and see how it feels before getting all the way in" and not "shocking" the system with immediate substantial step ups. (did back of the napkin but starting at $10.00 and growing 5% for 8yrs would get you to $14.77, so maybe something like that, perhaps slightly higher than 10.00 or 6%)

So, a minimum but no max? What person is worth more than a hundred times the minimum?

[Farfromgeneva]

We will have to part ways in this part my friend. As I was writing what I thought would be more manageable for the economy I felt a little queasy even suggesting that. Still believe in limited govt, purer libertarian than a lot of republicans and folks here, frankly most folks who claim o be libertarians don’t even know what that means.

Best you’ll get out of me on addressing disparity is whatever reasonable, ideally already on the books but not enforced, rules around holding board of directors of public companies accountable for agency (C suite) problems on behalf of shareholders rather than being asleep rubber stamps. Enforce monopolistic situations, based on readily available and comparable competition as to limit size (frankly no one in the world can manage companies as large as WalMart, Wells Fargo, Amazon, etc, their size alone creates tons of hidden risk embedded). Find ways to utilize law and regulation to push back closer to the definition of free market capitalism as defined as many competitors with easily substitutable products and services. That would help you get there.

Frankly though is rather have a lighter touch and create a UBI like my boy Andrew Yang was pimping last two years. Oversee and manage an open architecture which allows unlimited upside for value creation but also have a robust safety net for those permanently or long term damaged in terms of their availing to support themselves.

Looking forward, I’m not some “let’s have a Wild West free markets” so please don’t read and respond that way and understand I think there’s a way to open it up and support those citizens of ours in true need successfully. (Also have to address long term fixed commitments). I don’t think this is likely to happen as it would require leadership and compromise beyond Bowles Simpson which couldn’t get through.

[Farfromgeneva]

I guess that's ok. I could even see a little higher starting place and smaller steps, which decline in percentage terms, but is north of 15% and 10% in the first two years which I would manage on a smoother level, mabye 10-11 start and then 5% increases until you get to $15 given inflation is below 2% these days that's still a net 3%+ real wage increase for 4-7yrs without doing the compounding math. The point is to "stick the tip in and see how it feels before getting all the way in" and not "shocking" the system with immediate substantial step ups. (did back of the napkin but starting at $10.00 and growing 5% for 8yrs would get you to $14.77, so maybe something like that, perhaps slightly higher than 10.00 or 6%)

So, a minimum but no max? What person is worth more than a hundred times the minimum?

BTW, I bill myself out at $200-$500/hr, sometimes translated in engagements to unit pricing or fixed contract based on our estimate of time, assuming we aren’t using our one employee or outside contractors from our pool. I have some, light as a new business, overhead but I will gladly defend what I get which is 20-30x what we’re talking about. Not 100x but big multiple.

[Brooklyn]

I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism.

Because what happened there has NOTHING to do with socialism. That's a kleptocracy.

Want socialism? Look to any EU country. They're all doing fine. They all have varying degrees of socialism.....and all have more socialism than the US.


Or, if you prefer, look to America, where we have plenty of examples of pure socialism. The University of Virginia-----pure socialism-----is doing just fine. So fine, in fact, they should put a serious beatdown on privately owned and operated Syracuse University next week!

You and I have danced this dance before. What you call pure socialism I call federal spending. Once Uncle Sam takes our tax dollars from us they spend it however they see fit. IMO the UV has enough Alum out there that they can create their own endowment for their university. The problem is a Fan, we have no control over our tax dollars once they are in the possession of the government. By your definition every single penny our government spends is pure socialism. It is a unique attempt to change the verbiage but it does not really matter what you choose to call it. The money is spent and will never be seen again. I will still call it federal spending and you will continue to call it pure socialism. Does it really matter? At the end of the day the money is gone. That defense budget of ours is 700 plus billion of pure socialist spending. The billions we spent on welfare and social services is pure socialism. The federal money we spend on infrastructure is pure socialism. Every dime our government begs, borrows or steals is all simply used to pay for all that socialism we all want and love. How do you think we ran up a 30 trillion dollar debt? That didn't happen by being fiscally responsible did it? Every politician wants what they want and they want it right now.

Silly rabbit - you forgot that Republicans Reagan, Bush I, Bush II, and your hero tRUMP had more to do with it than anyone else.

[cradleandshoot]

You and I have danced this dance before. What you call pure socialism I call federal spending. Once Uncle Sam takes our tax dollars from us they spend it however they see fit. IMO the UV has enough Alum out there that they can create their own endowment for their university.

Yeah---but they didn't do that.

If UVa---where the government owns and operates the entity in question isn't socialism?

Then that would mean that you could open up a Federal or State owned and operated shoe factory, and that wouldn't be socialism, either.


Socialism is simply where the government owns and operates the entity in question.

Can America function without Government owned and operated schools? Can we have only private toll roads? Or privately owned parks?

Of course. But we elected representatives who CHOSE to install socialist institutions.

Can function? Poorly, maybe.

‘By the morning of Tuesday last week, Texas was plunged into an unprecedented energy crisis, with Ercot unable to restore most of the grid. As markets reopened, some traders liquidated their positions, unable to post the additional margin.

“If you want to play, you’ve got to pay,” said John Kilduff, trader and founding partner at Again Capital. “It’s a mechanism to wring out excessive speculation.”‘

Play? Is this a forking game ?!?!

Move to Tejas and Texit if that’s your plan. I’m pretty sure most people will pass.

Here in upstate NY we have had repeated failures do to weather related issues. 4 years ago we had 70 mph winds that pretty much devastated the electric grid and took down hundreds of trees. Our local utility company was as unprepared that day as would be today. None of these utilities have the resources to be pro active in preparing for these types of disasters. When this country decides to spend the money on the nation's infrastructure, then these weather related events won't be as catostrophic as they are today.

[youthathletics]

You and I have danced this dance before. What you call pure socialism I call federal spending. Once Uncle Sam takes our tax dollars from us they spend it however they see fit. IMO the UV has enough Alum out there that they can create their own endowment for their university.

Yeah---but they didn't do that.

If UVa---where the government owns and operates the entity in question isn't socialism?

Then that would mean that you could open up a Federal or State owned and operated shoe factory, and that wouldn't be socialism, either.


Socialism is simply where the government owns and operates the entity in question.

Can America function without Government owned and operated schools? Can we have only private toll roads? Or privately owned parks?

Of course. But we elected representatives who CHOSE to install socialist institutions.

Can function? Poorly, maybe.

‘By the morning of Tuesday last week, Texas was plunged into an unprecedented energy crisis, with Ercot unable to restore most of the grid. As markets reopened, some traders liquidated their positions, unable to post the additional margin.

“If you want to play, you’ve got to pay,” said John Kilduff, trader and founding partner at Again Capital. “It’s a mechanism to wring out excessive speculation.”‘

Play? Is this a forking game ?!?!

Move to Tejas and Texit if that’s your plan. I’m pretty sure most people will pass.

Here in upstate NY we have had repeated failures do to weather related issues. 4 years ago we had 70 mph winds that pretty much devastated the electric grid and took down hundreds of trees. Our local utility company was as unprepared that day as would be today. None of these utilities have the resources to be pro active in preparing for these types of disasters. When this country decides to spend the money on the nation's infrastructure, then these weather related events won't be as catostrophic as they are today.

They are not allowed to cut down trees...its like an act of congress. Same thing happened in DC. Gotta save the planet #AllTreesMatter

[holmes435]

You guys should move to Virginia. The power company comes through our neighborhood every year and practically shreds all the trees around the power lines.

It's fun reading Nextdoor. Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

[a fan]

From a friend:

Texans: we want a free, unregulated Capitalist Government!!

ERCOT: Ok, here's a $17,000 electrical bill

Texans: wait.....not like that. Also: where's my Federal bailout?

[PizzaSnake]

You guys should move to Virginia. The power company comes through our neighborhood every year and practically shreds all the trees around the power lines.

It's fun reading Nextdoor. Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

Yeah, who needs those trees anyway?!

[a fan]

Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

Yep. It's why I always laugh at the idea that Right Wingers don't like regulation.....or that Left Wingers are welcoming....

NIMBY. This attitude is also where 99% of regulations that choke small businesses with endless red tape and fees originates.

[cradleandshoot]

You guys should move to Virginia. The power company comes through our neighborhood every year and practically shreds all the trees around the power lines.

It's fun reading Nextdoor. Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

Actually our power company last year hired sub contractors to cut back branches in back yards that could take down power lines. They really hacked up our wimp willow tree that had grown all around the power lines. The thing is they need the homeowners permission to do the work. I was happy they were pro active enough to do what they could do. My next door neighbor has 4 big oak trees that still have branches that could take out power lines. She would not let them come in to her yard and trim the branches. It might have had something to do with the pot plants back there. That would be speculation on my part.

[ardilla secreta]

You guys should move to Virginia. The power company comes through our neighborhood every year and practically shreds all the trees around the power lines.

It's fun reading Nextdoor. Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

Actually our power company last year hired sub contractors to cut back branches in back yards that could take down power lines. They really hacked up our wimp willow tree that had grown all around the power lines. The thing is they need the homeowners permission to do the work. I was happy they were pro active enough to do what they could do. My next door neighbor has 4 big oak trees that still have branches that could take out power lines. She would not let them come in to her yard and trim the branches. It might have had something to do with the pot plants back there. That would be speculation on my part.

You earlier stated no proactive measures were taken and now your dissatisfied with proactive measures taken.

I’ve been in Buffalo eight years now. National Grid has a proactive trimming of trees by power lines about every four years. During this time I’ve only had a couple very brief power outages, never due to down power lines. I have no complaints. Have to add that I love having hydro-power. Niagara Falls (slowly I turn).

[SCLaxAttack]

You guys should move to Virginia. The power company comes through our neighborhood every year and practically shreds all the trees around the power lines.

It's fun reading Nextdoor. Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

Actually our power company last year hired sub contractors to cut back branches in back yards that could take down power lines. They really hacked up our wimp willow tree that had grown all around the power lines. The thing is they need the homeowners permission to do the work. I was happy they were pro active enough to do what they could do. My next door neighbor has 4 big oak trees that still have branches that could take out power lines. She would not let them come in to her yard and trim the branches. It might have had something to do with the pot plants back there. That would be speculation on my part.

A weeping willow. Unless your back yard is a swamp you should have asked them to cut it to the ground.

[cradleandshoot]

You guys should move to Virginia. The power company comes through our neighborhood every year and practically shreds all the trees around the power lines.

It's fun reading Nextdoor. Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

Actually our power company last year hired sub contractors to cut back branches in back yards that could take down power lines. They really hacked up our wimp willow tree that had grown all around the power lines. The thing is they need the homeowners permission to do the work. I was happy they were pro active enough to do what they could do. My next door neighbor has 4 big oak trees that still have branches that could take out power lines. She would not let them come in to her yard and trim the branches. It might have had something to do with the pot plants back there. That would be speculation on my part.

A weeping willow. Unless your back yard is a swamp you should have asked them to cut it to the ground.

I could not get that past the censor... it is a p***y willow tree. weeping willows are the messiest trees in the world. They look nice from far away in someone elses yard

[SCLaxAttack]

You guys should move to Virginia. The power company comes through our neighborhood every year and practically shreds all the trees around the power lines.

It's fun reading Nextdoor. Both the hippie-dippie types and the right-wingers who live next to the line get upset about how much gets cuts back in their yards and on the right-of-ways.

Actually our power company last year hired sub contractors to cut back branches in back yards that could take down power lines. They really hacked up our wimp willow tree that had grown all around the power lines. The thing is they need the homeowners permission to do the work. I was happy they were pro active enough to do what they could do. My next door neighbor has 4 big oak trees that still have branches that could take out power lines. She would not let them come in to her yard and trim the branches. It might have had something to do with the pot plants back there. That would be speculation on my part.

A weeping willow. Unless your back yard is a swamp you should have asked them to cut it to the ground.

I could not get that past the censor... it is a p***y willow tree. weeping willows are the messiest trees in the world. They look nice from far away in someone elses yard

Ah, female genitalia. I assumed wimp=weeping, not the other type. didn’t know that type of willow grew that tall.