LaxPower Back-Up Stick

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:27 am

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:30 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:52 pm

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:37 pm So offending is quite alright....well, depending on who is doing the offending, of course.
You sound like a perfect human being. Welcome to club, I am too.

Nobody on this planet is perfect. I can admit to being wrong. There is nothing wrong with being wrong. No shame in it. Also, nothing wrong with a difference in OPINION. You ever see me claim my comments aren’t offensive? Legitimate question.

No one has said there's anything wrong with being wrong, no one has said there's any shame in being wrong either, nor has anyone said there's anything wrong with a difference of OPINION.
Your question, no. Why would there be a need to claim the clearly obvious intent?

And that’s my issue in OS, it’s been historically so often unclear but skewing heavily, massively, in one direction only to hear “that’s not what I was saying or those aren’t my words I only posted them while quoting someone else’s in response while providing no context” as to make confidence in anything he’s putting out very low. Hence I used the term bad faith discourse wayyyy back on this and continue to pound for transparency. Otherwise he’s just Fatty with some service time.

You do know that if you read Fatty's posts that he is also former military. His opinions about Reagan and the suicide bombings of the Marine barracks in Beirut if memory serves me correctly is that his allegiance is as a marine who served in some capacity. I guess you didn't know that though did you?? That is the mistake people make when they don't pay attention to detail. FTR, OS has much more going for him than your derogatory comment about him having "some service time" His record as a decorated naval aviator is beyond reproach.

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 9:15 am

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 9:02 am

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 8:47 am

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:29 am

old salt wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 9:29 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:59 pm

old salt wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:43 pm

MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:27 pm So, when one uses Soros (or other Jews) and "globalist" to make a claim about "control", this is indeed well understood as a slur...indeed, it is actively used as such by white supremacist, White Nationalist groups that make their ideologies and bigotries quite clear. That's been a longstanding usage.

When one repeats these tropes, it may or may not be the intention of the user to be making an anti-semitic slur. But it feeds into that narrative. Which is why I asked and tried to provide a path for you to back off the trope and apologize. I assumed, as I try to do with most anyone, that you didn't intend it as the slur, but rather it was part of the literature you consume...and others intend to manipulate this way.

Do you deny that Soros is a globalist, notwithstanding his religion ?
Do you deny that he has exerted great influence in the US & in E Europe ?
Yet stating the obvious is somehow an antisemitic trope.

https://www.ajc.org/translatehate/globalist

https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/20 ... -globalist

The use of the word is not an accident…..and often it isn’t “innocent”.

https://www.azmirror.com/2022/09/28/cal ... -rejected/

But ain’t nobody going to shame you into not using it!

https://academic.oup.com/book/43056/cha ... m=fulltext

Soros has an agenda. He very effectively uses his wealth to achieve it, globally & in the US.
It is not antisemitic to point that out.
The fact that he is Jewish does not exempt him from critique.
Likewise for Bloomberg, only to a lesser extent re. his influence.
The Koch bros or Peter Thiel don't get a categorical pass.
https://www.politico.com/story/2016/08/ ... orm-227519

Want do you call Rebekah mercer and Pete Thiel?

BTW, who said Soros gets a pass? The issue is the use of what can be considered a “slur”:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/ar ... ur/555479/

When it’s constantly pointed out and yet constantly used anyway, what conclusion can one draw? This isn’t trying to change someone’s opinion. It’s the use of a slur. But like I said, everyone loves watermelon….ain’t nothing wrong with saying black folk love watermelon….or fried Chicken for that matter. Fuzzy was canceled!

I crush Soros all the time for his trade on the Pound Sterling (93 or 94?). MD hit me for that way back then and we discussed offline. You’ve seen me make the case in bold above numerous times so you know it’s just a matter of awareness and respect for ones surroundings vs arrogance and dismissiveness or being obtuse and stupid. Either one ain’t great but I’m offering a choice.

https://funnyjunk.com/funny_pictures/437536/Black/

Yes. I was referring to what was in bold. As if someone was suggesting that Soros gets a categorical pass. It’s the use of a trope/slur….not the criticism of Soros. Easy for an honorable person to say, my mistake….Didn’t mean it that way….and then stop using it….I am not going to be cowed into not using globalists because it’s considered a slur seems like it would be kind of hard to support.

We're saying the same thing I believe.

cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 11:07 am

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:27 am

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:30 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:52 pm

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:37 pm So offending is quite alright....well, depending on who is doing the offending, of course.
You sound like a perfect human being. Welcome to club, I am too.

Nobody on this planet is perfect. I can admit to being wrong. There is nothing wrong with being wrong. No shame in it. Also, nothing wrong with a difference in OPINION. You ever see me claim my comments aren’t offensive? Legitimate question.

No one has said there's anything wrong with being wrong, no one has said there's any shame in being wrong either, nor has anyone said there's anything wrong with a difference of OPINION.
Your question, no. Why would there be a need to claim the clearly obvious intent?

And that’s my issue in OS, it’s been historically so often unclear but skewing heavily, massively, in one direction only to hear “that’s not what I was saying or those aren’t my words I only posted them while quoting someone else’s in response while providing no context” as to make confidence in anything he’s putting out very low. Hence I used the term bad faith discourse wayyyy back on this and continue to pound for transparency. Otherwise he’s just Fatty with some service time.

You do know that if you read Fatty's posts that he is also former military. His opinions about Reagan and the suicide bombings of the Marine barracks in Beirut if memory serves me correctly is that his allegiance is as a marine who served in some capacity. I guess you didn't know that though did you?? That is the mistake people make when they don't pay attention to detail. FTR, OS has much more going for him than your derogatory comment about him having "some service time" His record as a decorated naval aviator is beyond reproach.

decorated?
I'm going to assume that's true, though I'm not sure what you mean by that or how you would know...but ok.

Flynn certainly was "decorated"...doesn't mean he ain't a fascist, bigoted nut job....dangerously so because of the credibility given to him and claimed by him because of his "decorated" service.

For the record, I'm not saying Salty is Flynn.

An interesting perspective from India. Too bad things aren't going better with getting India to provide military support to Ukraine.
India has massive quantities of Soviet legacy weapons systems which could really help the Ukrainians.
We've been trying, with some success, to convince India to switch to US weapons, as we've increased joint military exercises with them.
imho -- this is not helpful.

https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/opin ... ions-india

Opinion
Victoria Nuland’s Stealth Sanctions against India
by M.D. Nalapat, Updated : October 1, 2022

The visa denial to Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Victoria Nuland way on S-400 or Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s.

...it has become next to impossible for a citizen of India to get a visa to travel to the US, although such a situation remains not at all reciprocal.
A Communist Chinese citizen can get a visa for travel to the US in two or three days, but a citizen of India has to wait two or three years for the privilege... Those in the know of activities in Foggy Bottom claim that the policy of visa denial to citizens of India was put on steroids by Under-Secretary of State Victoria Nuland after her Delhi visit that took place early in the year. Not used to having countries outside the Atlanticist group turn down her commands, Nuland inwardly fumed when South Block refused to scrap the S-400 deal and join the crusade against Russia that she has long been a champion of. If Blinken were to look into the mail and voice trail of the origins of his department’s Visa Denial to Indians policy, he would easily be able to track the individuals who are succeeding in punishing several in this country who are empathetic to the US. Just as China was delighted by Biden’s 2022 pivot from China to Russia and from Asia to Europe, Beijing must be gloating over the fact that business to business linkages between India and the US are going for a toss simply because travel from India to that country is practically becoming impossible for citizens of the world’s most populous democracy. But for the chokehold suggested, according to insiders, by Under-Secretary Nuland on the giving of US visas to Indian citizens, trade and investment between the two countries would have expanded by much more than they nevertheless have. The Visa Denial for Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Nuland way on S-400 or on Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s. Friends and relatives seeking to participate in the marriage of their friends are unable to do so, tourists wanting to see the US are blocked in that desire. In multiple ways, people to people contact between the two largest democracies on the globe is being nuked, even while US visas are available as easily as buying an ice cream cone in Beijing or Shanghai.

Seeking to fool the people of India through lavish dollops of “utterly butterly” praise has long been a diplomatic staple in the global circuit. That same technique was used days ago by Antony Blinken to mask the reality of his department’s vicious visa policy towards India, a policy designed to punish the people of India for the refusal of their government to join Japan and South Korea in reflexively obeying Nuland’s diktat in the manner expected of non-Atlanticist countries. As a consequence, loved ones have fallen ill and died in the US without being able to meet for the last time friends and family from India... What is being implemented by Secretary of State Blinken appears to be a deliberate policy of Sanctions by Stealth. Those in the US Congress and elsewhere who are genuinely seeking a US-India security and defense partnership that would keep the Indo-Pacific free of attempted hegemony need to make themselves heard, before the closet foes of the India-US partnership still being indulged in the Biden White House do further damage to India-US relations. Of course, it must be admitted that such a course by Washington delights not just Beijing but Moscow as well.

DMac wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 7:53 am

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:12 am

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 6:55 pm

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 6:28 pm Some of you boys need to pat yourselves on your backs.

old salt has clearly stated this more than once but that doesn't matter to you boys, it's pile on salty time again.

What "tropes" ? As I've stated --
-- I made no implication or reference to any religion.
-- I was not aware that 2 of the 3 "influencers" I referenced were Jewish. How would I know that ?
-- I am not familiar with the "dinner party trope" which MDLF76 so enthusiastically & tastelessly embellished.

This kind of thing has happened to me more than once on this board, you read it one way when it was meant another
but that doesn't matter your minds are made up and that's not going to change. The stones are going to be thrown,
careful not to break any of the windows in those glass houses, fellas. Not one of you is the least bit hesitant to say
some mighty offensive stuff to salty...not one.

I’m not.

I don’t understand the glass house comment unless it means we’re all pussies. I can take it. But come correct because I’m a 10:1 guy. Irrational.

It's pretty easy. People jumping all over salty and piling on, which of course is the norm and tolerable behavior here, for what they perceive as offensive comments he's made while there are no boundaries to the level of offense that can be directed at him (I've seen some mighty vile stuff thrown at him over the years, no complaining about offensive from anyone). Glass houses with broken windows, has nothing to do with puszies.
I've been in this boat with MDlax who is perhaps the most sanctimonious of all posters. If I say there's a chink in the Yankees armor, he's going to tell me that's a racist comment and I should apologize for such. Guess who is going to say no it's not and no I won't? Because you perceive it as such doesn't make it so. TLD puffs his chest and proudly admits to being intentionally offensive (not restricted to salty) and that's perfectly acceptable here....more broken windows in the house. DocB is in a class all by himself, the entire white race is made up of bigots and racists whose time has come to an end. If you aint brown you're nothing but an ignorant clown who can't see the light in the Dr's book (that includes you if you haven't already figured that out).
Will say again, we'll see what an anachronism salty is the next time schidt goes down in the world. Nobody calling him out of touch and stupid when that goes down, quite the opposite actually.
I miss The Chairman Of The Board a lot. A real voice of reason who came out with some real thought provoking stuff, he's needed here. That's a non troll who longer participates, and there are a whole lot of them. Wonder why?

Again, I think the emergence of really awful trolling was what pushed people to not participate. We used to have vigorous discussions and quite strident disagreements, but the active trolling behaviors were minimal.

It got very, very ugly in the permission structure that happened well beyond our forum and that bled into this as well.

I'll accept that I'm "sanctimonious", or at least that when I take a position that I think is indeed "morally superior" it sure can come across that way. Valid criticism.

That said, I don't think I look at your posts in the knee jerk way you suggest, DMac. It wouldn't really occur to me that you are racist based on your history of posting, at least in my memory, though I think we all have some bigotry, at a minimum unconsciously so...surely you and I are not immune from such. If anything, I think you tend to exaggerate for effect.

When I point something out, as I did with Salty's use of a very common anti-semitic trope, I try to give them the opportunity to unwind it, say "oops" etc, under the starting assumption that it was likely an unconscious act. Some on here might not want to give salty the benefit of that doubt, but I just think it's a better starting point.

I'd hope others would do the same for me.

geneva cited an example of such when I'd objected to his use of Soros in what seemed like a potential antisemitic attack, or at least such that fit the narrative that is generally pushed by anti-semites...we had a very civil and constructive discussion and it was pretty darn clear that wasn't remotely his intention. He hadn't conflated Soros with a global world order, nor conflated Soros' action with other Jews in an international cabal, etc, etc...just a straightforward, sharp critique.

That's what should happen.

old salt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 1:08 pm An interesting perspective from India. Too bad things aren't going better with getting India to provide military support to Ukraine.
India has massive quantities of Soviet legacy weapons systems which could really help the Ukrainians.
We've been trying, with some success, to convince India to switch to US weapons, as we've increased joint military exercises with them.
imho -- this is not helpful.

https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/opin ... ions-india

Opinion
Victoria Nuland’s Stealth Sanctions against India
by M.D. Nalapat, Updated : October 1, 2022

The visa denial to Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Victoria Nuland way on S-400 or Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s.

...it has become next to impossible for a citizen of India to get a visa to travel to the US, although such a situation remains not at all reciprocal.
A Communist Chinese citizen can get a visa for travel to the US in two or three days, but a citizen of India has to wait two or three years for the privilege... Those in the know of activities in Foggy Bottom claim that the policy of visa denial to citizens of India was put on steroids by Under-Secretary of State Victoria Nuland after her Delhi visit that took place early in the year. Not used to having countries outside the Atlanticist group turn down her commands, Nuland inwardly fumed when South Block refused to scrap the S-400 deal and join the crusade against Russia that she has long been a champion of. If Blinken were to look into the mail and voice trail of the origins of his department’s Visa Denial to Indians policy, he would easily be able to track the individuals who are succeeding in punishing several in this country who are empathetic to the US. Just as China was delighted by Biden’s 2022 pivot from China to Russia and from Asia to Europe, Beijing must be gloating over the fact that business to business linkages between India and the US are going for a toss simply because travel from India to that country is practically becoming impossible for citizens of the world’s most populous democracy. But for the chokehold suggested, according to insiders, by Under-Secretary Nuland on the giving of US visas to Indian citizens, trade and investment between the two countries would have expanded by much more than they nevertheless have. The Visa Denial for Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Nuland way on S-400 or on Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s. Friends and relatives seeking to participate in the marriage of their friends are unable to do so, tourists wanting to see the US are blocked in that desire. In multiple ways, people to people contact between the two largest democracies on the globe is being nuked, even while US visas are available as easily as buying an ice cream cone in Beijing or Shanghai.

Seeking to fool the people of India through lavish dollops of “utterly butterly” praise has long been a diplomatic staple in the global circuit. That same technique was used days ago by Antony Blinken to mask the reality of his department’s vicious visa policy towards India, a policy designed to punish the people of India for the refusal of their government to join Japan and South Korea in reflexively obeying Nuland’s diktat in the manner expected of non-Atlanticist countries. As a consequence, loved ones have fallen ill and died in the US without being able to meet for the last time friends and family from India... What is being implemented by Secretary of State Blinken appears to be a deliberate policy of Sanctions by Stealth. Those in the US Congress and elsewhere who are genuinely seeking a US-India security and defense partnership that would keep the Indo-Pacific free of attempted hegemony need to make themselves heard, before the closet foes of the India-US partnership still being indulged in the Biden White House do further damage to India-US relations. Of course, it must be admitted that such a course by Washington delights not just Beijing but Moscow as well.

India's in a tough spot re. Ukraine.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/09/29/indias- ... alyst.html

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/03/india/in ... i-intl-hnk

old salt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 1:19 pm

old salt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 1:08 pm An interesting perspective from India. Too bad things aren't going better with getting India to provide military support to Ukraine.
India has massive quantities of Soviet legacy weapons systems which could really help the Ukrainians.
We've been trying, with some success, to convince India to switch to US weapons, as we've increased joint military exercises with them.
imho -- this is not helpful.

https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/opin ... ions-india

Opinion
Victoria Nuland’s Stealth Sanctions against India
by M.D. Nalapat, Updated : October 1, 2022

The visa denial to Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Victoria Nuland way on S-400 or Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s.

...it has become next to impossible for a citizen of India to get a visa to travel to the US, although such a situation remains not at all reciprocal.
A Communist Chinese citizen can get a visa for travel to the US in two or three days, but a citizen of India has to wait two or three years for the privilege... Those in the know of activities in Foggy Bottom claim that the policy of visa denial to citizens of India was put on steroids by Under-Secretary of State Victoria Nuland after her Delhi visit that took place early in the year. Not used to having countries outside the Atlanticist group turn down her commands, Nuland inwardly fumed when South Block refused to scrap the S-400 deal and join the crusade against Russia that she has long been a champion of. If Blinken were to look into the mail and voice trail of the origins of his department’s Visa Denial to Indians policy, he would easily be able to track the individuals who are succeeding in punishing several in this country who are empathetic to the US. Just as China was delighted by Biden’s 2022 pivot from China to Russia and from Asia to Europe, Beijing must be gloating over the fact that business to business linkages between India and the US are going for a toss simply because travel from India to that country is practically becoming impossible for citizens of the world’s most populous democracy. But for the chokehold suggested, according to insiders, by Under-Secretary Nuland on the giving of US visas to Indian citizens, trade and investment between the two countries would have expanded by much more than they nevertheless have. The Visa Denial for Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Nuland way on S-400 or on Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s. Friends and relatives seeking to participate in the marriage of their friends are unable to do so, tourists wanting to see the US are blocked in that desire. In multiple ways, people to people contact between the two largest democracies on the globe is being nuked, even while US visas are available as easily as buying an ice cream cone in Beijing or Shanghai.

Seeking to fool the people of India through lavish dollops of “utterly butterly” praise has long been a diplomatic staple in the global circuit. That same technique was used days ago by Antony Blinken to mask the reality of his department’s vicious visa policy towards India, a policy designed to punish the people of India for the refusal of their government to join Japan and South Korea in reflexively obeying Nuland’s diktat in the manner expected of non-Atlanticist countries. As a consequence, loved ones have fallen ill and died in the US without being able to meet for the last time friends and family from India... What is being implemented by Secretary of State Blinken appears to be a deliberate policy of Sanctions by Stealth. Those in the US Congress and elsewhere who are genuinely seeking a US-India security and defense partnership that would keep the Indo-Pacific free of attempted hegemony need to make themselves heard, before the closet foes of the India-US partnership still being indulged in the Biden White House do further damage to India-US relations. Of course, it must be admitted that such a course by Washington delights not just Beijing but Moscow as well.

India's in a tough spot re. Ukraine.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/09/29/indias- ... alyst.html

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/03/india/in ... i-intl-hnk

The real prize in Ukraine is food. India might want to get on the right side of that equation. As the river flow from the Third Pole grows inconsistent, their rudimentary agricultural practices will fail to meet internal demand.

Looks like even McTurtle can see the long term truth: better to be seen an ally of food exporters than an antagonist or “fence-sitter.”

Perhaps to get this trainwreck of a thread back on topic - this piece on the Baltic States is rather sobering

Europe Should Have Listened to the Baltic States on Russia

https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/eu- ... Zi2IK9Ovdg

old salt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 1:19 pm

old salt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 1:08 pm An interesting perspective from India. Too bad things aren't going better with getting India to provide military support to Ukraine.
India has massive quantities of Soviet legacy weapons systems which could really help the Ukrainians.
We've been trying, with some success, to convince India to switch to US weapons, as we've increased joint military exercises with them.
imho -- this is not helpful.

https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/opin ... ions-india

Opinion
Victoria Nuland’s Stealth Sanctions against India
by M.D. Nalapat, Updated : October 1, 2022

The visa denial to Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Victoria Nuland way on S-400 or Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s.

...it has become next to impossible for a citizen of India to get a visa to travel to the US, although such a situation remains not at all reciprocal.
A Communist Chinese citizen can get a visa for travel to the US in two or three days, but a citizen of India has to wait two or three years for the privilege... Those in the know of activities in Foggy Bottom claim that the policy of visa denial to citizens of India was put on steroids by Under-Secretary of State Victoria Nuland after her Delhi visit that took place early in the year. Not used to having countries outside the Atlanticist group turn down her commands, Nuland inwardly fumed when South Block refused to scrap the S-400 deal and join the crusade against Russia that she has long been a champion of. If Blinken were to look into the mail and voice trail of the origins of his department’s Visa Denial to Indians policy, he would easily be able to track the individuals who are succeeding in punishing several in this country who are empathetic to the US. Just as China was delighted by Biden’s 2022 pivot from China to Russia and from Asia to Europe, Beijing must be gloating over the fact that business to business linkages between India and the US are going for a toss simply because travel from India to that country is practically becoming impossible for citizens of the world’s most populous democracy. But for the chokehold suggested, according to insiders, by Under-Secretary Nuland on the giving of US visas to Indian citizens, trade and investment between the two countries would have expanded by much more than they nevertheless have. The Visa Denial for Indians policy has become a form of collective punishment imposed in retaliation for India not following the Nuland way on S-400 or on Ukraine, a path that is leading to trade disruptions, famine, unrest and a looming repeat of the Great Depression of the 1930s. Friends and relatives seeking to participate in the marriage of their friends are unable to do so, tourists wanting to see the US are blocked in that desire. In multiple ways, people to people contact between the two largest democracies on the globe is being nuked, even while US visas are available as easily as buying an ice cream cone in Beijing or Shanghai.

Seeking to fool the people of India through lavish dollops of “utterly butterly” praise has long been a diplomatic staple in the global circuit. That same technique was used days ago by Antony Blinken to mask the reality of his department’s vicious visa policy towards India, a policy designed to punish the people of India for the refusal of their government to join Japan and South Korea in reflexively obeying Nuland’s diktat in the manner expected of non-Atlanticist countries. As a consequence, loved ones have fallen ill and died in the US without being able to meet for the last time friends and family from India... What is being implemented by Secretary of State Blinken appears to be a deliberate policy of Sanctions by Stealth. Those in the US Congress and elsewhere who are genuinely seeking a US-India security and defense partnership that would keep the Indo-Pacific free of attempted hegemony need to make themselves heard, before the closet foes of the India-US partnership still being indulged in the Biden White House do further damage to India-US relations. Of course, it must be admitted that such a course by Washington delights not just Beijing but Moscow as well.

India's in a tough spot re. Ukraine.

https://www.cnbc.com/2022/09/29/indias- ... alyst.html

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/03/india/in ... i-intl-hnk

Yes they are, albeit a position of their own making.

And it remains of their own making...they could pivot to a pro-Western position, but haven't made that decision.

But it's a rock and hard place they find themselves in for sure, and it makes sense for us to understand that reality.

The propaganda screed above is a lot of BS, though.

There is no such policy and the visa process post pandemic opened up this fall.

That said, pre-Biden (Nuland) visa denials for Indians were indeed high and one would assume that continued during the rest of the pandemic.
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/nr ... s?from=mdr

But it's entirely nonsense that most visas for Indians take two to three years...because of Nuland...

But this is consistent with this author (pretty distinguished guy) and his various screeds against Biden and his Admin.

Kismet wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 2:03 pm Perhaps to get this trainwreck of a thread back on topic - this piece on the Baltic States is rather sobering

Europe Should Have Listened to the Baltic States on Russia

https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/eu- ... Zi2IK9Ovdg

Very interesting. Thanks.

Kismet wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 2:03 pm Perhaps to get this trainwreck of a thread back on topic - this piece on the Baltic States is rather sobering

Europe Should Have Listened to the Baltic States on Russia

https://www.worldpoliticsreview.com/eu- ... Zi2IK9Ovdg

Methinks the Lady doth protest too much, or at least Mr Lucas does so on her behalf.
NATO got the message in 2014 & turned the Baltic States into a NATO garrison, mainly with US forces.
The author minimizes the assignment of US rapid reaction forces to fall in on the Baltics in short order,
Rubbing fellow EU members nose in it does not engender ongoing cooperation & serves no useful purpose.
The author should be grateful that the Baltic States were welcomed into NATO after they opted out of the CIS.

It is not polite, as Estonian Prime Minister Kaja Kallas put it in June, to say, “I told you so.”

Russia’s seizure of Crimea in 2014 prompted a belated Western rethink about the Kremlin’s intentions and capabilities. The Baltic states finally saw NATO tripwire forces, known as the alliance’s “enhanced Forward Presence,” deployed to deter Russian aggression. Contingency plans for the defense of the Baltics were further elaborated. But the NATO presence in the region remained slender, relying largely on U.S. reinforcements being deployed in the event of any trouble.

Russia’s renewed onslaught on Ukraine in February has brought some grudging vindication. In an interview with Finland’s national broadcaster, Prime Minister Sanna Marin said, “I want to openly admit that we could have listened more to our friends in the Baltics when talking about Russia in recent decades.” That was some recompense for the 30 years during which Finnish decision-makers patronized and ignored their southern neighbors, dismissing their hawkishness toward Russia as the result of “post-Soviet traumatic stress,” as then-Finnish President Tarja Halonen put it with regard to Estonia in 2008.

But most countries have yet to acknowledge their past complacency and arrogance. Germany has had particular difficulty doing so, despite the many years in which German leaders focused on trade and investment opportunities in Russia, clothing their self-interest with sanctimonious words about “dialogue” and “rapprochement.” German decision-makers openly mocked those who warned them about the dangers of dependence on Russian natural gas or the Kremlin’s ability to use the large Russian-speaking diaspora as a fifth column in its conduct of information warfare.

This question of acknowledging these errors in judgment is not just a matter of abstract historical justice. Western naïveté and greed have paved the way for the greatest humanitarian catastrophe in Europe in eight decades. Tens of thousands of people are dead. Millions are displaced and traumatized. The financial cost is already in the trillions. And all of it was avoidable, had the “old West” used even a fraction of its diplomatic, economic and military might to support Ukraine in the months before February.

This was not a random catastrophe, akin to a natural disaster. It was the logical result of Russia’s trajectory since the 1990s. The Baltic states warned Europe and the West about it. And no one listened. They may be too polite to point this out. But that should not dilute the shame, rage and grief that the West’s willful ignorance merits.

Dunno why so many continue to believe that the US needs to finance or maintain Ukraine's forces against the Russians. It's their war, not ours. A conflict has been going on between Kyiv and Moscow since the 8th or 9th century and it will not be ended any time soon. Furthermore, because of its origin there is nothing we can do to solve it when they cannot solve it themselves. Billions have been given to the Zelenskyy regime and billions more are slated to go into his coffers. For those who believe federal assistance of any kind such as subsidies or food stamps or to relieve student loans constitutes "socialism" these billions in Ukrainian relief should be a source of outrage.

Nothing in the Constitution dictates that we need to engage in nation building or maintenance overseas. "Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness" is something intended by our Founders for ourselves, not for some nation that employs a dictator like Zelenskyy. For those of you who complain that we pay too many taxes for social programs you should be complaining about this largesse. Those of you who say we need to prioritize government help for the poor by providing health insurance and other programs, you should be equally outraged.

Everyone needs to understand that we as a nation will not solve our problems unless and until we prioritize them. Continually intervening in foreign wars creates massive profits for wealthy elites, increases the burden of taxation, and deflects attention from our domestic needs which remain unsolved. Then there's the impending election.

Polls quoted by the news media give inconsistent reports about the popularity ratings and the anticipated results that are to come. While some elections are projected as being close, we now hear that certain intolerant right wingers are stealing ballot boxes or intimidating potential voters who seek to deposit their early votes. This is a crime against humanity. Its solution and termination must be prioritized. Yet, I do not see anyone calling for immediate and corrective action. Instead, Biden (who should be campaigning for Democrats) and others view the Russian-Ukraine conflict, an on going matter that is of no consequence to us, as their top priority. Small wonder why we never solve our problems.

Brooklyn,

We disagree re Ukraine.

On your last para, there's a lawsuit requesting an immediate injunction against the vigilante stuff in Arizona. And DOJ is on it as well.

cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 11:07 am

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:27 am

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:30 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:52 pm

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:37 pm So offending is quite alright....well, depending on who is doing the offending, of course.
You sound like a perfect human being. Welcome to club, I am too.

Nobody on this planet is perfect. I can admit to being wrong. There is nothing wrong with being wrong. No shame in it. Also, nothing wrong with a difference in OPINION. You ever see me claim my comments aren’t offensive? Legitimate question.

No one has said there's anything wrong with being wrong, no one has said there's any shame in being wrong either, nor has anyone said there's anything wrong with a difference of OPINION.
Your question, no. Why would there be a need to claim the clearly obvious intent?

And that’s my issue in OS, it’s been historically so often unclear but skewing heavily, massively, in one direction only to hear “that’s not what I was saying or those aren’t my words I only posted them while quoting someone else’s in response while providing no context” as to make confidence in anything he’s putting out very low. Hence I used the term bad faith discourse wayyyy back on this and continue to pound for transparency. Otherwise he’s just Fatty with some service time.

You do know that if you read Fatty's posts that he is also former military. His opinions about Reagan and the suicide bombings of the Marine barracks in Beirut if memory serves me correctly is that his allegiance is as a marine who served in some capacity. I guess you didn't know that though did you?? That is the mistake people make when they don't pay attention to detail. FTR, OS has much more going for him than your derogatory comment about him having "some service time" His record as a decorated naval aviator is beyond reproach.

If you're not going to critically read then you're just adding to the arthritis in your fingers.

MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 12:54 pm

cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 11:07 am

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:27 am

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:30 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:52 pm

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:37 pm So offending is quite alright....well, depending on who is doing the offending, of course.
You sound like a perfect human being. Welcome to club, I am too.

Nobody on this planet is perfect. I can admit to being wrong. There is nothing wrong with being wrong. No shame in it. Also, nothing wrong with a difference in OPINION. You ever see me claim my comments aren’t offensive? Legitimate question.

No one has said there's anything wrong with being wrong, no one has said there's any shame in being wrong either, nor has anyone said there's anything wrong with a difference of OPINION.
Your question, no. Why would there be a need to claim the clearly obvious intent?

And that’s my issue in OS, it’s been historically so often unclear but skewing heavily, massively, in one direction only to hear “that’s not what I was saying or those aren’t my words I only posted them while quoting someone else’s in response while providing no context” as to make confidence in anything he’s putting out very low. Hence I used the term bad faith discourse wayyyy back on this and continue to pound for transparency. Otherwise he’s just Fatty with some service time.

You do know that if you read Fatty's posts that he is also former military. His opinions about Reagan and the suicide bombings of the Marine barracks in Beirut if memory serves me correctly is that his allegiance is as a marine who served in some capacity. I guess you didn't know that though did you?? That is the mistake people make when they don't pay attention to detail. FTR, OS has much more going for him than your derogatory comment about him having "some service time" His record as a decorated naval aviator is beyond reproach.

decorated?
I'm going to assume that's true, though I'm not sure what you mean by that or how you would know...but ok.

Flynn certainly was "decorated"...doesn't mean he ain't a fascist, bigoted nut job....dangerously so because of the credibility given to him and claimed by him because of his "decorated" service.

For the record, I'm not saying Salty is Flynn.

Its just conflating words and nothing more. A mashed incest baby of fibonacci and mc escher would draw a straighter line of logic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2BMsHppIKM

MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 2:06 pm
There is no such policy and the visa process post pandemic opened up this fall.

That said, pre-Biden (Nuland) visa denials for Indians were indeed high and one would assume that continued during the rest of the pandemic.
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/nr ... s?from=mdr

But it's entirely nonsense that most visas for Indians take two to three years...because of Nuland...

But this is consistent with this author (pretty distinguished guy) and his various screeds against Biden and his Admin.

We want India as an ally. China is a major adversary. This makes no sense.

https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/opin ... umps-india

US visa wars: Where China trumps India

by Maura Moynihan, May 21, 2022

The US State Department has for years prioritized visas for Communist China over democratic India.

...why does the Biden administration condemn India at every turn whilst showing favour to Communist China, after it spread its Wuhan virus across the globe, costing the United States $50 trillion in damages and destroying civilization as we knew it?

We don’t read about Indian immigrants stealing US military or industrial secrets or murdering citizens in their hour of pray. But the US State Department has for years prioritized visas for Communist China over democratic India. Every visitor to the US must fill out a questionnaire, upon arrival, which includes: “Have you ever been or are you now affiliated with the Communist Party?” The US State Department selectively ignores this question for Chinese nationals, allowing the CCP to plant its agents at every level of the US government and institutions of finance, technology and higher education. A Senate aide in Washington told me: “Basically that’s how China stole all of its high-tech weapons and industrial programs from the US. And now they’ve got cyber spies hacking into our banks and intelligence and we don’t know how this is going to end.”

Most Chinese spies prosecuted by the US Department of Justice entered the US on student or work visas and obtained citizenship. CCP entities today own millions of acres of US farmland and real estate and operate Confucius Institutes at universities nationwide. The CCP’s propaganda department, Xinhua, established in 1931 as the Red China News Agency, has a huge media tower in New York’s Times Square and a multimillion-dollar complex in Washington, DC. Every US city is peppered with China Daily newsboxes, every cable service broadcasts CCP propaganda channels, in English and Mandarin. CCP cash dominates US foundations and think tanks, which churn out books and programs proclaiming that the 21st century belongs to the CCP, a totalitarian dictatorship that openly states in Xinhua editorials its goal of “destroying America from within.”

The Donald Trump administration sought to reverse this trend by refusing visas to CCP members and labelled the CCP’s Confucius Institutes as “entities advancing Beijing’s global propaganda and malign influence.” But Biden stripped away these sanctions, returning to the pro-CCP policies of Clinton, Bush, and Obama, who cut visas to India while increasing visas for China. On 19 January 2012, US ambassador to China, Gary Locke, said, “President Obama signed an executive order to significantly increase legitimate travel and tourism to the US, with the goal of increasing visa-processing capacity in China by up to 40 per cent in 2012. In 2011, we processed more than 1 million visa applications in China, an increase of 34 per cent over the previous year, and already we have processed 48 per cent more visas in China compared to 2011.”

Obama continued the Bush administration’s War on Terror, targeted Indian visa applicants with Muslim surnames. I know of many children and relatives of Indian officials who were accepted into US universities but had their student visas rejected due to “terror alerts.” Shahrukh Khan, India’s beloved Bollywood superstar, was interrogated at Los Angeles international airport in 2016 when his name appeared on a computer “alert” list. In 2012, Shahrukh flew to New York on a private plane with the Ambani family to receive a prestigious fellowship at Yale, but was held for 2 hours for a “terror flag.” In 2009, Shahrukh was detained in New Jersey when he arrived for a South Asian cultural festival. Shahrukh later said in an interview: “I became so sick of being mistaken for some crazed terrorist who coincidentally carries the same last name as mine that I made a film, subtly titled My Name is Khan (and I am not a terrorist) to prove a point. Ironically, I was interrogated at the airport for hours when I was going to present the film in America for the first time.”

The US State Department apologised to Shahrukh for the inconvenience—US Ambassador to India, Richard Verma posted a lame tweet stating: “Your work inspires millions, including in the US”—but if you are from India your name is Khan, you will be met with suspicion, even if you are one of the most famous people on the planet. India, a vital ally and strategic partner of the US, should not be pushed to the back of the visa queue while CCP agents are allowed free reign to “destroy America from within.” I hope India raises this matter at the next Quad Summit.

Maura Moynihan is a New York based journalist and author, specialising in the Chinese Communist occupation of Tibet. Her website is: mauramoynihan.net

old salt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 3:02 pm

MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 2:06 pm
There is no such policy and the visa process post pandemic opened up this fall.

That said, pre-Biden (Nuland) visa denials for Indians were indeed high and one would assume that continued during the rest of the pandemic.
https://economictimes.indiatimes.com/nr ... s?from=mdr

But it's entirely nonsense that most visas for Indians take two to three years...because of Nuland...

But this is consistent with this author (pretty distinguished guy) and his various screeds against Biden and his Admin.

We want India as an ally. China is a major adversary. This makes no sense.

https://www.sundayguardianlive.com/opin ... umps-india

US visa wars: Where China trumps India

by Maura Moynihan, May 21, 2022

The US State Department has for years prioritized visas for Communist China over democratic India.

...why does the Biden administration condemn India at every turn whilst showing favour to Communist China, after it spread its Wuhan virus across the globe, costing the United States $50 trillion in damages and destroying civilization as we knew it?

We don’t read about Indian immigrants stealing US military or industrial secrets or murdering citizens in their hour of pray. But the US State Department has for years prioritized visas for Communist China over democratic India. Every visitor to the US must fill out a questionnaire, upon arrival, which includes: “Have you ever been or are you now affiliated with the Communist Party?” The US State Department selectively ignores this question for Chinese nationals, allowing the CCP to plant its agents at every level of the US government and institutions of finance, technology and higher education. A Senate aide in Washington told me: “Basically that’s how China stole all of its high-tech weapons and industrial programs from the US. And now they’ve got cyber spies hacking into our banks and intelligence and we don’t know how this is going to end.”

Most Chinese spies prosecuted by the US Department of Justice entered the US on student or work visas and obtained citizenship. CCP entities today own millions of acres of US farmland and real estate and operate Confucius Institutes at universities nationwide. The CCP’s propaganda department, Xinhua, established in 1931 as the Red China News Agency, has a huge media tower in New York’s Times Square and a multimillion-dollar complex in Washington, DC. Every US city is peppered with China Daily newsboxes, every cable service broadcasts CCP propaganda channels, in English and Mandarin. CCP cash dominates US foundations and think tanks, which churn out books and programs proclaiming that the 21st century belongs to the CCP, a totalitarian dictatorship that openly states in Xinhua editorials its goal of “destroying America from within.”

The Donald Trump administration sought to reverse this trend by refusing visas to CCP members and labelled the CCP’s Confucius Institutes as “entities advancing Beijing’s global propaganda and malign influence.” But Biden stripped away these sanctions, returning to the pro-CCP policies of Clinton, Bush, and Obama, who cut visas to India while increasing visas for China. On 19 January 2012, US ambassador to China, Gary Locke, said, “President Obama signed an executive order to significantly increase legitimate travel and tourism to the US, with the goal of increasing visa-processing capacity in China by up to 40 per cent in 2012. In 2011, we processed more than 1 million visa applications in China, an increase of 34 per cent over the previous year, and already we have processed 48 per cent more visas in China compared to 2011.”

Obama continued the Bush administration’s War on Terror, targeted Indian visa applicants with Muslim surnames. I know of many children and relatives of Indian officials who were accepted into US universities but had their student visas rejected due to “terror alerts.” Shahrukh Khan, India’s beloved Bollywood superstar, was interrogated at Los Angeles international airport in 2016 when his name appeared on a computer “alert” list. In 2012, Shahrukh flew to New York on a private plane with the Ambani family to receive a prestigious fellowship at Yale, but was held for 2 hours for a “terror flag.” In 2009, Shahrukh was detained in New Jersey when he arrived for a South Asian cultural festival. Shahrukh later said in an interview: “I became so sick of being mistaken for some crazed terrorist who coincidentally carries the same last name as mine that I made a film, subtly titled My Name is Khan (and I am not a terrorist) to prove a point. Ironically, I was interrogated at the airport for hours when I was going to present the film in America for the first time.”

The US State Department apologised to Shahrukh for the inconvenience—US Ambassador to India, Richard Verma posted a lame tweet stating: “Your work inspires millions, including in the US”—but if you are from India your name is Khan, you will be met with suspicion, even if you are one of the most famous people on the planet. India, a vital ally and strategic partner of the US, should not be pushed to the back of the visa queue while CCP agents are allowed free reign to “destroy America from within.” I hope India raises this matter at the next Quad Summit.

Maura Moynihan is a New York based journalist and author, specialising in the Chinese Communist occupation of Tibet. Her website is: mauramoynihan.net

We want India as an ally, and given their "issues" with China, one would think they would make common cause with the US. Yet they don't.

Now, why they don't is a very,very interesting question the US should be asking itself.

old salt wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 3:02 pm We want India as an ally. China is a major adversary. This makes no sense.

Makes perfect sense and you know it, and Biden's no different than Trump before Covid messed up the numbers.

Told you this during Trump's Fake Trade War.....if China is an adversary, why did Trump accelerate trade with them pre-Covid? Why do we import more goods from China than any other country....with no one close in 2nd place....if they are our enemies?

Why did Trump allow 373,000+ Chinese students into our school in 2019, OS, if they are our adversaries? That was an all time high.

Funny way of treating someone that you and your party considers to be an adversary.

It's almost as if our leaders are lying to us about who they consider to be an adversary....naaah, not possible. Republicans don't lie. Only Dems do, right?

Well played Progressives.

https://www.cnn.com/2022/10/25/politics ... index.html

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 2:49 pm

cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 11:07 am

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Tue Oct 25, 2022 6:27 am

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 8:30 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:52 pm

DMac wrote: ↑Mon Oct 24, 2022 7:37 pm So offending is quite alright....well, depending on who is doing the offending, of course.
You sound like a perfect human being. Welcome to club, I am too.

Nobody on this planet is perfect. I can admit to being wrong. There is nothing wrong with being wrong. No shame in it. Also, nothing wrong with a difference in OPINION. You ever see me claim my comments aren’t offensive? Legitimate question.

No one has said there's anything wrong with being wrong, no one has said there's any shame in being wrong either, nor has anyone said there's anything wrong with a difference of OPINION.
Your question, no. Why would there be a need to claim the clearly obvious intent?

And that’s my issue in OS, it’s been historically so often unclear but skewing heavily, massively, in one direction only to hear “that’s not what I was saying or those aren’t my words I only posted them while quoting someone else’s in response while providing no context” as to make confidence in anything he’s putting out very low. Hence I used the term bad faith discourse wayyyy back on this and continue to pound for transparency. Otherwise he’s just Fatty with some service time.

You do know that if you read Fatty's posts that he is also former military. His opinions about Reagan and the suicide bombings of the Marine barracks in Beirut if memory serves me correctly is that his allegiance is as a marine who served in some capacity. I guess you didn't know that though did you?? That is the mistake people make when they don't pay attention to detail. FTR, OS has much more going for him than your derogatory comment about him having "some service time" His record as a decorated naval aviator is beyond reproach.

If you're not going to critically read then you're just adding to the arthritis in your fingers.

It is possible maybe with the exception of this forum to read critically and not have a bizarre need to nitpick every word and disparage everything he says. So are you telling me that OS is not a decorated naval aviator?? FTR how did you know about the arthritis in my fingers. I have not been able to play my accoustic guitar in many years. Once you lose those callouses on your finger tips getting them back is not easy.