Orange Duce

[Brooklyn]

Yeah right ...

[old salt]

Also consider these facts - one of Gallagher's lawyers is Marc Mukasy who is also a Trump Organization legal counsel. Also on the legal team is convicted felon Bernard Kerik - both are connected directly to Rudy Colludy and his security firm as well as to Fox News.

Mere coincidence???? Think again. Giuliani and his various associates and henchmen are involved in many, many things both in and out of government as well as both domestically and internationally. Hilarious Twitter description of Rudy Colludy today - "As one longtime Giuliani associate phrased it, "This is a little bit like a baby with a hammer, or a monkey with a typewriter.""

IMHO, it all stinks to high heaven. Corruption and criminality extends now to the military as well as all of the other locations these slimeballs are operating.

Have to wonder what political office Gallagher is going to run for next. He'll fit right in.

UPDATE Monday AM: Defense Secretary Mark Esper confirms to reporters that President Trump ordered him to allow Eddie Gallagher to keep his Trident pin.

So what ? Did they bribe Gallagher's teammate to change his testimony & admit that he killed the prisoner (med tech -- mercy killing).
The case fell apart during Court Martial. The prosecution witnesses were not credible. A panel of 7 combat experienced SEALs & Marines acquitted Gallagher of all charges except posing for a group photo with a dead IS prisoner. JAG overcharged & got out lawyered before the Court.

[old salt]

MDLF76:
He's a 'folk hero' now, Salty?
Convicted of posing with a dead opponent?
The heck with what he was accused of doing, do you really think he deserves acclaim for what he did?

Guess the Tailhook guys were heroes too?

Yes. Because of the way this was mishandled by the Chain of Command, Gallagher emerges a folk hero.
He answered for his actions before a Court Martial & was acquitted, IAW the UCMJ.
He was in a group photo with his platoonmates.
Should the entire platoon now be subjected to a Court Martial.
Should NCIS search social media & emails for other SEALs & Marines who have done the same ?

As usual, you're making a McCarthyite overstatement.
I didn't say he deserves to be a folk hero.
I'm acknowledging the reality of the situation.

...& you apparently didn't read the entire Jim Webb interview.
He repeatedly criticized senior Naval officers for not defending the Navy's culture & he listed, by name, several officers whose promotions were unjustly withheld by Congressional meddling. There were indeed several "heroes" who were professionally punished for Tailhook who had nothing to do with what happened there. I was working for one at the time.

[old salt]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

[Typical Lax Dad]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

Thanks for posting that.

[MDlaxfan76]

As to the the generals and admirals, far as I can tell, we're talking about pretty much everyone in top command disagreeing with Trump.
So, again, really not a difficult question re Trump's involvement.

Seems to me only a Trumpist or Trump apologist would see it otherwise.

So now you have polling data from the hundreds of Flag officers currently serving ?
...or just the retired ones you see on MSNBC, who can't get the SEAL Admiral's name right or tell us that Chief Gallagher is retiring with just 14 years of service ?

CNO restored Gallagher from E-1 to E-6 during his review (Trump restored it to E-7)

CNO dismissed charges against Gallagher's platoon commander, the medic who claimed the mercy killing, & came down hard on Navy JAG.
https://www.dailyrepublic.com/all-dr-ne ... imes-case/

Nah, just the serving admirals and generals...you know, the guys who are so ticked...at the top.

So now you're in touch with serving Flag officers ?
You say they're ticked. Who ? How many ? How 'bout some facts.

Admin Boards are conducted to determine a members suitability for continued duty.
You don't delay their retirement in order to pull a pilot's wings or a submariner's dolphins.

Big Navy has bigger problems to address than humiliating a SEAL folk hero on his way out the door to retirement.
https://news.usni.org/2019/11/24/secnav ... ing-secnav

He's a 'folk hero' now, Salty?
Not speaking for salty here, but yeah, folk hero.

Gallagher served eight deployments and was awarded two bronze stars. He also was up for a Silver Star — the Armed Force’s third-highest personal decoration for valor in combat —

Convicted of posing with a dead opponent?
BFD (and this is all he was convicted of). Can you even begin to imagine, from your cushy couch, that this amounts to no more than a hunter posing with a bear after a kill to this guy given the type of training he's had, what he's been asked to do, and the situations he's been in (how many of his comrades has he seen killed?)?
The heck with what he was accused of doing, do you really think he deserves acclaim for what he did?
Given 20 years of service, much of which is beyond what 99 percent of the population could, or would be willing to do, along with a couple of Bronze Stars, I'd say he deserves some acclaim.
Guess the Tailhook guys were heroes too?
You are, again, compltely out of line here.

As a side, I'm surprised to see that since 2011 150+ SEALs have been stripped of their Tridents (many, I think, for medical/injuries...drug abuse too).

I have no doubt that he was a warrior deserving of every bit of recognition he had received. And our appreciation for such service, including from my "cushy couch". And yours.
I can assure you that the a*s*s on this cushy couch has been in an environment where an enemy was dehumanized and around people whose mission it was to kill people. Perhaps I better understand the mentality that leads to posing with a kill.

But really, BFD? Yes, BFD.
And, with that perspective, you're "surprised" by the number of SEALs to have been stripped of their Tridents??? I'm unable to find the reason they were stripped but from what I have found, I think it's mostly due to injuries and drug abuse. In that respect I'm not surprised. I suspect your question insinuates they lost their Tridents due to out of control behavior on the battlefield and that doesn't appear to be the case.

What I am 'surprised' by is that folks like you, DMac, are actually excusing a trophy photo. (again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner). Yes, let's. I won't define this guy for one indiscretion particularly given the state of mind one is in in the heat of the moment....you have to give that a lot of consideration.
Let's ask this question, if not there, where do you draw the line? I'll leave that up to those who live this...not the Prez.

No, not out of line. Yes it is, salty never said anything about anyone involved being a folk hero. He only mentioned how politicians getting involved has a negative affect on the military judicial system. I highly doubt salty views any of those involved as folk heros. You just wanted to get your dig in there.
Salty brought up Tailhook as another example of the Navy being 'too political'...and the argument was that there was a Marine 'culture' that needed to be defended...guys are 'warriors' and we just need to understand that...

no, Salty called Gallagher a "folk hero"...why are you now denying it?

Gallagher was tried and found guilty by a jury of SEALs, not civilians. They decided not to find him guilty of the greater charges, given the medic's surprise story.

How about we let those guys actually decide where to draw the line?
Let the military justice system work...
It sure as heck shouldn't be Trump.

I have no idea why you think I'm 'insinuating' anything, there may well be a mix of reasons why Tridents are pulled, including behaviors tied to drug abuse. I'd hope, though, it's not for the abuse of the drugs, but rather for very egregious conduct in specific, whether on the battlefield or off.

The reporting does suggest that the Navy has been having discipline issues with these units...which really isn't a surprise given the # of deployments, the stress of what they've been through, the likely concussions and CTE effects, the injuries and pains sustained and the ease with which opioids used to get prescribed...

Listen, if Gallagher was to say, hey, I was way, way out of line, I deeply regret the photograph, it was not excusable, I and a whole lot of others would say, yup, bad mistake, but 8 tours of duty in intense combat situations is simply too much. Retire with honor, sir.

But as far as I've seen, he's unrepentant and guys like you are saying BFD..which is exactly why it really is a BFD.

[MDlaxfan76]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

Thanks for posting that.

So, this guy says he didn't see Gallagher stab him.

But from same article:
Kirylo statements contradict those of other SEALs who testified that Gallagher, a 19-year veteran on his eighth deployment, stabbed the prisoner with his hunting knife.

Two of the SEALs testified that they witnessed the stabbing, but one — Corey Scott — said he was the one who ultimately killed the militant by plugging his breathing tube with his thumb as an act of mercy.

Two SEALs, (not namby pamby civilians), testified under oath they actually witnessed Gallagher stab the prisoner.

[MDlaxfan76]

MDLF76:
He's a 'folk hero' now, Salty?
Convicted of posing with a dead opponent?
The heck with what he was accused of doing, do you really think he deserves acclaim for what he did?

Guess the Tailhook guys were heroes too?

Yes. Because of the way this was mishandled by the Chain of Command, Gallagher emerges a folk hero.
He answered for his actions before a Court Martial & was acquitted, IAW the UCMJ.
He was in a group photo with his platoonmates.
Should the entire platoon now be subjected to a Court Martial.
Should NCIS search social media & emails for other SEALs & Marines who have done the same ?

As usual, you're making a McCarthyite overstatement.
I didn't say he deserves to be a folk hero.
I'm acknowledging the reality of the situation.

...& you apparently didn't read the entire Jim Webb interview.
He repeatedly criticized senior Naval officers for not defending the Navy's culture & he listed, by name, several officers whose promotions were unjustly withheld by Congressional meddling. There were indeed several "heroes" who were professionally punished for Tailhook who had nothing to do with what happened there. I was working for one at the time.

I see, you are simply observing that others, not you, consider him to be a 'folk hero'.
Yet, you say he was 'acquitted'.
You do recognize that he was found guilty by a jury of SEALs, and that other SEALS testified against him, right?
I don't know whether Webb or you are correct that these other officers who got punished truly "had nothing to do with what happened there", but I'll take your word for it.

That said, Webb also appears to be suggesting that women don't belong in these units and 'whaddya expect, boys will be boys'...he says as much, though more carefully.

Were these other officers taking the position that the Tailhook matter was, in another poster's parlance, BFD?

[Typical Lax Dad]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

Thanks for posting that.

So, this guy says he didn't see Gallagher stab him.

But from same article:
Kirylo statements contradict those of other SEALs who testified that Gallagher, a 19-year veteran on his eighth deployment, stabbed the prisoner with his hunting knife.

Two of the SEALs testified that they witnessed the stabbing, but one — Corey Scott — said he was the one who ultimately killed the militant by plugging his breathing tube with his thumb as an act of mercy.

Two SEALs, (not namby pamby civilians), testified under oath they actually witnessed Gallagher stab the prisoner.

I noticed the same thing.

[DMac]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

Thanks for posting that.

So, this guy says he didn't see Gallagher stab him.

But from same article:
Kirylo statements contradict those of other SEALs who testified that Gallagher, a 19-year veteran on his eighth deployment, stabbed the prisoner with his hunting knife.

Two of the SEALs testified that they witnessed the stabbing, but one — Corey Scott — said he was the one who ultimately killed the militant by plugging his breathing tube with his thumb as an act of mercy.

Two SEALs, (not namby pamby civilians), testified under oath they actually witnessed Gallagher stab the prisoner.

Don't forget this part of the article too:

SAN DIEGO — A Marine who worked jointly in Iraq with a decorated Navy SEAL accused of murder testified Thursday that the platoon chief did not stab a wounded teenage Islamic State prisoner as alleged by other platoon members.

Marine Staff Sgt. Giorgio Kirylo said he watched as Special Warfare Operator Chief Edward “Eddie” Gallagher tried to save the 17-year-old captive and never saw him use his hunting knife on him.

Gallagher is accused of fatally stabbing the adolescent captive while he was under his care in Iraq in 2017 and to shooting civilians. He has pleaded not guilty to murder and attempted murder.

After the boy died, Kirylo said he moved the corpse to pose for a "cool guy trophy" photo because it was the platoon's first Islamic State prisoner captured from their battlefield.

He said he lifted up the teen's body to put the corpse's head on his foot when a bandage on his neck popped up.


Kirylo testified that he saw no stab wounds under the dressing.

By: Carl Prine
He said each member of the platoon took turns posing with the body, and no one was upset.


He said the platoon members took turns taking photos with the body because they were excited that they had coordinated an air strike with Iraqi troops that had killed Islamic State fighters including the captive's commander.

"This was our unofficial war trophy," the Marine Raider said."[/i]

Posing with their unofficial war trophy, the BFD IS posing with their kill...just like a bear hunter. You can't take the element of where they are and what their mission is out of this picture. You won't accept that so we'll agree to disagree.
I'll be good with how the military judicial system sorts it all out, but I'm pulling for him to retire with his Trident however dispicable you might find that.

As for the namby pamby part, you've expressed these sentiments as to how you feel military people view civilians before. You're the one who would be apt to say something in your past must have happened to you to develop that complex.

[Typical Lax Dad]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

Thanks for posting that.

So, this guy says he didn't see Gallagher stab him.

But from same article:
Kirylo statements contradict those of other SEALs who testified that Gallagher, a 19-year veteran on his eighth deployment, stabbed the prisoner with his hunting knife.

Two of the SEALs testified that they witnessed the stabbing, but one — Corey Scott — said he was the one who ultimately killed the militant by plugging his breathing tube with his thumb as an act of mercy.

Two SEALs, (not namby pamby civilians), testified under oath they actually witnessed Gallagher stab the prisoner.

Don't forget this part of the article too:

SAN DIEGO — A Marine who worked jointly in Iraq with a decorated Navy SEAL accused of murder testified Thursday that the platoon chief did not stab a wounded teenage Islamic State prisoner as alleged by other platoon members.

Marine Staff Sgt. Giorgio Kirylo said he watched as Special Warfare Operator Chief Edward “Eddie” Gallagher tried to save the 17-year-old captive and never saw him use his hunting knife on him.

Gallagher is accused of fatally stabbing the adolescent captive while he was under his care in Iraq in 2017 and to shooting civilians. He has pleaded not guilty to murder and attempted murder.

After the boy died, Kirylo said he moved the corpse to pose for a "cool guy trophy" photo because it was the platoon's first Islamic State prisoner captured from their battlefield.

He said he lifted up the teen's body to put the corpse's head on his foot when a bandage on his neck popped up.


Kirylo testified that he saw no stab wounds under the dressing.

By: Carl Prine
He said each member of the platoon took turns posing with the body, and no one was upset.


He said the platoon members took turns taking photos with the body because they were excited that they had coordinated an air strike with Iraqi troops that had killed Islamic State fighters including the captive's commander.

"This was our unofficial war trophy," the Marine Raider said."[/i]

Posing with their unofficial war trophy, the BFD IS posing with their kill...just like a bear hunter. You can't take the element of where they are and what their mission is out of this picture. You won't accept that so we'll agree to disagree.
I'll be good with how the military judicial system sorts it all out, but I'm pulling for him to retire with his Trident however dispicable you might find that.

As for the namby pamby part, you've expressed these sentiments as to how you feel military people view civilians before. You're the one who would be apt to say something in your past must have happened to you to develop that complex.

I don't know the answer but I was wondering if there have been other incidences in the past where a POTUS stepped in to protect a soldier from military punishment?

[DMac]

Nixon jumped into the Lt. Calley My Lai incident.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Calley

[Typical Lax Dad]

Nixon jumped into the Lt. Calley My Lai incident.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Calley

Thanks. Nothing I have ever experienced. Best for military people with perspective to decide, in my opinion.

[foreverlax]

Everyone gets an opinion on whether it was the right call, but that's really not the issue.

Seems to me, it's the who makes that call...the SEAL HMFIC should have the "final" say or some other SEAL process to arrive at a "final" say. It's their team, they make and follow the rules.

It's like a ref ejecting a player and the head of the NCAA says "no he isn't."

Folklore has more of a positive connotation....this any positive from any angle.

[ABV 8.3%]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

Thanks for posting that.

So, this guy says he didn't see Gallagher stab him.

But from same article:
Kirylo statements contradict those of other SEALs who testified that Gallagher, a 19-year veteran on his eighth deployment, stabbed the prisoner with his hunting knife.

Two of the SEALs testified that they witnessed the stabbing, but one — Corey Scott — said he was the one who ultimately killed the militant by plugging his breathing tube with his thumb as an act of mercy.

Two SEALs, (not namby pamby civilians), testified under oath they actually witnessed Gallagher stab the prisoner.

Don't forget this part of the article too:

SAN DIEGO — A Marine who worked jointly in Iraq with a decorated Navy SEAL accused of murder testified Thursday that the platoon chief did not stab a wounded teenage Islamic State prisoner as alleged by other platoon members.

Marine Staff Sgt. Giorgio Kirylo said he watched as Special Warfare Operator Chief Edward “Eddie” Gallagher tried to save the 17-year-old captive and never saw him use his hunting knife on him.

Gallagher is accused of fatally stabbing the adolescent captive while he was under his care in Iraq in 2017 and to shooting civilians. He has pleaded not guilty to murder and attempted murder.

After the boy died, Kirylo said he moved the corpse to pose for a "cool guy trophy" photo because it was the platoon's first Islamic State prisoner captured from their battlefield.

He said he lifted up the teen's body to put the corpse's head on his foot when a bandage on his neck popped up.


Kirylo testified that he saw no stab wounds under the dressing.

By: Carl Prine
He said each member of the platoon took turns posing with the body, and no one was upset.


He said the platoon members took turns taking photos with the body because they were excited that they had coordinated an air strike with Iraqi troops that had killed Islamic State fighters including the captive's commander.

"This was our unofficial war trophy," the Marine Raider said."[/i]

Posing with their unofficial war trophy, the BFD IS posing with their kill...just like a bear hunter. You can't take the element of where they are and what their mission is out of this picture. You won't accept that so we'll agree to disagree.
I'll be good with how the military judicial system sorts it all out, but I'm pulling for him to retire with his Trident however dispicable you might find that.

As for the namby pamby part, you've expressed these sentiments as to how you feel military people view civilians before. You're the one who would be apt to say something in your past must have happened to you to develop that complex.

Neato, but the bad guy is STILL DEAD, CORRECT?? Don't care how it happened. Killing is part of war. Even killing dying prisoners. To bad, so sad. Don't like it, bring em home.

And the "make your bed" guy, a former Navy officer, I think a seal, wrote in his book that they took pictures of Bin Laden, just to verify. Or, I could just be making it up.

"......charging for murder in this place is like handing out speeding tickets at the Indianapolis 500..."

Drones don't take pictures with the dead, that's why Obama loved them so much.

[Bandito]

Nasdaq and S&P close at record highs!!! Thanks President Trump!!! Cue all the butthurt liberals on here who will credit Obama the Brown Kenyan ( you all make fun of Trumps skin color... just uses your insult!) even though this is Trumps economy!

[old salt]

MDLH76:
(again, let's ignore for a moment that he stabbed a bound prisoner).

Marine witness testifies that Gallagher did not stab detainee

Thanks for posting that.

So, this guy says he didn't see Gallagher stab him.

But from same article:
Kirylo statements contradict those of other SEALs who testified that Gallagher, a 19-year veteran on his eighth deployment, stabbed the prisoner with his hunting knife.

Two of the SEALs testified that they witnessed the stabbing, but one — Corey Scott — said he was the one who ultimately killed the militant by plugging his breathing tube with his thumb as an act of mercy.

Two SEALs, (not namby pamby civilians), testified under oath they actually witnessed Gallagher stab the prisoner.

Gallagher was a Navy medical corpsman before he became a SEAL. He was assisting the combat medic in treating the detainee. That included cutting a "trac" to open an airway & other penetrations to insert a chest tube. Scott was the combat medic. His testimony, along with the Marine I cited, exonerated Gallagher. The accusers did not observe the two medics efforts closely. Their testimony was obviously not convincing or Gallagher would have been found guilty on additional counts.

[runrussellrun]

Nasdaq and S&P close at record highs!!! Thanks President Trump!!! Cue all the butthurt liberals on here who will credit Obama the Brown Kenyan ( you all make fun of Trumps skin color... just uses your insult!) even though this is Trumps economy!

Does Obama get sprayed, like Donald S?

Trump is a RINO.....spend spend spend. The GOP still has a platform, don't they ? Something about deficits, reducing government jobs, etc.

[runrussellrun]

Nasdaq and S&P close at record highs!!! Thanks President Trump!!! Cue all the butthurt liberals on here who will credit Obama the Brown Kenyan ( you all make fun of Trumps skin color... just uses your insult!) even though this is Trumps economy!

What stocks do you currently own? And, don't be lame and say " I don't know, it's in a mutual fund". If that's the case, they LOVE you and your "investments". "oh...that's the management fee. I know you didn't realize its prorated, in my favor (the bankster), but, you made money LAST quarter "

[old salt]

MDLF76:
He's a 'folk hero' now, Salty?
Convicted of posing with a dead opponent?
The heck with what he was accused of doing, do you really think he deserves acclaim for what he did?

Guess the Tailhook guys were heroes too?

Yes. Because of the way this was mishandled by the Chain of Command, Gallagher emerges a folk hero.
He answered for his actions before a Court Martial & was acquitted, IAW the UCMJ.
He was in a group photo with his platoonmates.
Should the entire platoon now be subjected to a Court Martial.
Should NCIS search social media & emails for other SEALs & Marines who have done the same ?

As usual, you're making a McCarthyite overstatement.
I didn't say he deserves to be a folk hero.
I'm acknowledging the reality of the situation.

...& you apparently didn't read the entire Jim Webb interview.
He repeatedly criticized senior Naval officers for not defending the Navy's culture & he listed, by name, several officers whose promotions were unjustly withheld by Congressional meddling. There were indeed several "heroes" who were professionally punished for Tailhook who had nothing to do with what happened there. I was working for one at the time.

I see, you are simply observing that others, not you, consider him to be a 'folk hero'.
Yet, you say he was 'acquitted'.
You do recognize that he was found guilty by a jury of SEALs, and that other SEALS testified against him, right?
SEALs & Marines, All with combat experience. Members of a Court Martial, not a jury. He was acquitted on 6 of 7 charges. He did not contest the photo. It was a lesser included charge, which (in isolation) is normally handled via Non Judicial Punishment by the unit Commanding Office.
I don't know whether Webb or you are correct that these other officers who got punished truly "had nothing to do with what happened there", but I'll take your word for it. Look up the cases of the Blue Angel's skipper, or other pilots, relieved of command or denied promotion, who weren't on the 3rd floor, or even in Vegas.
https://www.cmrlink.org/issues/full/cmr ... ngels-comm
https://www.cmrlink.org/data/Sites/85/C ... ls1994.pdf

That said, Webb also appears to be suggesting that women don't belong in these units and 'whaddya expect, boys will be boys'...he says as much, though more carefully.
Why am I not surprised that you would infer that ?

Were these other officers taking the position that the Tailhook matter was, in another poster's parlance, BFD?
.. ...you're unbelievable.