Re: 2020 Elections - Off and Running
Posted: Sat Jun 01, 2019 10:03 pm
6ftstick wrote: ↑Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:57 pm“Used to” is right: https://www.modernhealthcare.com/articl ... of-closure
https://www.centerforhealthjournalism.o ... ecline?amp
Same Party, Different House
https://fanlax.com/forum/
6ftstick wrote: ↑Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:57 pm“Used to” is right: https://www.modernhealthcare.com/articl ... of-closure
https://www.centerforhealthjournalism.o ... ecline?amp
Is this a serious question? History. Simple history. We already did the minimal government thing. All you have to do is look at America before the Great Depression FDR programs were started.
Yes.
Yes! I've told you this many times. We started our biz with a Small Business Administration loan. Our parents aren't rich. So, like so many entrepreneurs without rich friends and family, we got a Federally subsidized loan. Paid it back years ago, including all fees and interest. So thank you for that!
Steve Jobs started his business at the Nexus of government spending on computers.
Ah, so we must decide who is worthy of help and who is clueless and lazy, is that it?
Yep. And let's take a look at google founders Larry Page and Sergei Brin. Quotes from wikipedia, with my comments in brackets:
OK, I'm too lazy to copy Brin's page. He emigrated from Russia at age 6. Another professor-at-a-public-school (UMd) dad. Brin went to public high school and a public college (UMd). Same deal at Stanford.Page was born on March 26, 1973, in East Lansing, Michigan. .. His father, Carl Victor Page, Sr., earned a PhD in computer science from the University of Michigan [a public, taxpayer supported, university], when the field was being established. ... He was a computer science professor at Michigan State University [salary paid by the taxpayers]. Page graduated from East Lansing High School [a public, taxpayer supported, school] in 1991. Page holds a Bachelor of Science in computer engineering from the University of Michigan [a public, taxpayer supported, school], with honors. … After enrolling in a computer science PhD program at Stanford University …[Stanford is private, but almost certainly Page's tuition and expenses were paid by gubmint grants from one or more of the federal research agencies. Nobody pays to go to grad school in STEM fields, the gubmint pays.]
Yep.CU77 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2019 5:29 pmYep. And let's take a look at google founders Larry Page and Sergei Brin. Quotes from wikipedia, with my comments in brackets:OK, I'm too lazy to copy Brin's page. He emigrated from Russia at age 6. Another professor-at-a-public-school (UMd) dad. Brin went to public high school and a public college (UMd). Same deal at Stanford.Page was born on March 26, 1973, in East Lansing, Michigan. .. His father, Carl Victor Page, Sr., earned a PhD in computer science from the University of Michigan [a public, taxpayer supported, university], when the field was being established. ... He was a computer science professor at Michigan State University [salary paid by the taxpayers]. Page graduated from East Lansing High School [a public, taxpayer supported, school] in 1991. Page holds a Bachelor of Science in computer engineering from the University of Michigan [a public, taxpayer supported, school], with honors. … After enrolling in a computer science PhD program at Stanford University …[Stanford is private, but almost certainly Page's tuition and expenses were paid by gubmint grants from one or more of the federal research agencies. Nobody pays to go to grad school in STEM fields, the gubmint pays.]
Without these VAST amounts of public investment, the tech industry would not be in the US, no matter how smart our kids are. Kids are smart everywhere, what they need is a society that gives ALL of them every opportunity to excel. And not be called shiftless and lazy.
a fan wrote: ↑Sat Jun 01, 2019 11:05 pmIs this a serious question? History. Simple history. We already did the minimal government thing. All you have to do is look at America before the Great Depression FDR programs were started.
What did that look like? We had no middle class. We had rich, and we had poor. Factory workers barely scraped by. Middle class arrived post WWII with the GI Bill and all that socialized college. And, of course, Unions.
Who were all those unemployed people standing in line for apples and soup? The rich? How were there MILLIONS of people in New York, Chicago, Detroit. What were they doing? How did they live before FDR? There were no government handouts. Maybe they had jobs. Middle Class jobs.
Why were there MILLIONS of immigrants coming here. Just to be poor? My ancestors settled in western Pa. They helped make Carnegie a rich man. But within two generations they're grandchildren were in college becoming lawyers, engineers, doctors, anything they wanted to be. With NO government handouts.
Yes.
Where do you think the roads came from that enabled Fords cars and Rockeller's oil?
[b]Keep pushing this notion. Infrastructure is what government does. Its why civilizations form. And security for its citizens. Defending the constitution. Not free housing, free food, free healthcare, free tuition—which is now nearly a trillion in annual federal spending. All governments—federal to local— spend 7 Trillion combined annually. [/b]
Just the beginning: Federal Aid Road Act of 1916
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal_A ... ct_of_1916
Yes! I've told you this many times. We started our biz with a Small Business Administration loan. Our parents aren't rich. So, like so many entrepreneurs without rich friends and family, we got a Federally subsidized loan. Paid it back years ago, including all fees and interest. So thank you for that!
Ahh borrowed and paid it back. I think banks do that, too. Far different from sucking and sucking and sucking for multiple generations.With no payback. Just the next generation illiterate and unemployable.
Steve Jobs started his business at the Nexus of government spending on computers.
Neither government nor the business sector used MAC's. Jobs had had 2% of the market—mostly designers, advertising agencies, architects. etc. organizations needing a graphic platform not word or spreadsheets. PC's were the rage. Jobs changed the world with the cellphone.
Know where the Nexus of private investment in computing was? Upstate New York. IBM. So why wasn't that area Silicon Valley? Simple. The US Government was throwing money at Stanford for computing. And yep, the Federal government invented the internet.
No internet, and no Federal funding: no Silicon Valley. And Steve Jobs would be selling shoes at your local FootLocker.
So only government aperatchecks can make those decisions. Adults can't figure it out? You should be watching Chernobyl on HBO.CU77 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2019 5:14 pmAh, so we must decide who is worthy of help and who is clueless and lazy, is that it?
And can you please tell me who decides? Who will appoint the death panels that will tell me whether I am worthy of help, or clueless and lazy?
I really want to know how you think this should work.
Slight correction. NO ONE WILL PAY FOR R(esarch). Every once in a while D(evelopment) will find someone willing to pay for it, if the potential market is huge or the risk really really small. You have not even touched on the most significant roll the government plays in the development of advance technology is that of early adopter customer! The world's largest most successful venture fund, bar none. All other venture funds are jokes compared to the US Federal Government in terms of success rate. It is an imperfect socialist operation, the socialization of risk and the privatization of profit. The socialization of the profit is the natural basis for the universal minimum income.a fan wrote: ↑Sat Jun 01, 2019 9:33 pmI don't understand these sentences. Can you rewrite them?
Who's going to pay for it? The free market say: nope, no money for that.
Example that I gave you before? Every single drug approved for use by the FDA in a 10 year period ending in (I think) 2017 took Federal funding. All of them.
What does that tell you?
Exactly. Free market, my *ss. No one is going to pay for that R&D. Too much risk, too little reward. So what does American pharma do? It uses taxpayer money that it gets for free, and then keeps every penny of the profits when their taxpayer funded R&D pays off. Sweet deal, right?
Another one I gave you last month: over 60% of all new home loans given last year were paid for by the Federal government---Fannie, Freddie, Dept. of Ag, etc.
Because folks like you and the MSM are telling them Trump will be gone by 2020. Keep rooting for everyone but the US.
Wish that were true, but it isn't. Trump is not about, never has been, the economy (to first order). Trump supporters, the hardcore base does not care about the economy as you, I and Wall Street understand the economy. IT IS THE SOCIAL ISSUES. It is racism, it is homophobia, it is Xenophobia, it is ("cry baby conservatism" - thanks George Will) evangelism. The complaint about Obama being a socialist - laughable as we both know - was an excuse to make the racism palatable. You more than anyone have made this point over and over - the economy to these people is now great even though the "real economy" has not really changed.a fan wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2019 10:51 pm All one of the Dems need to do is say: "vote for me, and I'll end the trade wars. All of them". That's it. Game over.
Because when they do that, now the World is holding all the cards-----China, EU, Mexico, and now India....will simply wait Trump out.
We'll see how swell Americans think these tariffs are when it finally hits THEIR bottom line, and it's not just farmers and automakers feeling the pain from Trump's stupidity.
And if those countries are smart, they'll offer Trump: nothing. Not even the fee for the gaming license. Because Trump is too much of a small-handed, over compensating moron to back down without getting some pointless chit in return for backing down.
If all those countries wise up and tell Trump to get bent? Bye, bye Trumpy.
.. although with the most recent Trump moves on trade that may be changing for the worse - significantly, but that is yet to be seen.jhu72 wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2019 10:25 amWish that were true, but it isn't. Trump is not about, never has been, the economy (to first order). Trump supporters, the hardcore base does not care about the economy as you, I and Wall Street understand the economy. IT IS THE SOCIAL ISSUES. It is racism, it is homophobia, it is Xenophobia, it is ("cry baby conservatism" - thanks George Will) evangelism. The complaint about Obama being a socialist - laughable as we both know - was an excuse to make the racism palatable. You more than anyone have made this point over and over - the economy to these people is now great even though the "real economy" has not really changed.a fan wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2019 10:51 pm All one of the Dems need to do is say: "vote for me, and I'll end the trade wars. All of them". That's it. Game over.
Because when they do that, now the World is holding all the cards-----China, EU, Mexico, and now India....will simply wait Trump out.
We'll see how swell Americans think these tariffs are when it finally hits THEIR bottom line, and it's not just farmers and automakers feeling the pain from Trump's stupidity.
And if those countries are smart, they'll offer Trump: nothing. Not even the fee for the gaming license. Because Trump is too much of a small-handed, over compensating moron to back down without getting some pointless chit in return for backing down.
If all those countries wise up and tell Trump to get bent? Bye, bye Trumpy.
Oh yeah. I'm rooting to lose.
Oh, I agree. The Dems won't get these voters. They'll get those that normally don't vote, but are getting screwed by another year and a half of tariffs. And what I'm really talking about is Mexico. All Mexico has to do is tell Trump to buzz off...call his bluff...and Trump is stupid enough to enact those Draconian tariffs.