Re: Regulation - Too Much or Too Little?
Posted: Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am
Same Party, Different House
https://fanlax.com/forum/
But still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism. We are all just in deep doo doo because nothing is ever going to make the huddled masses happy. We need to try Bernie's Americanized version of socialism light. What the hell, it is only taxpayer money being flushed down the toilet.RedFromMI wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:11 amBut still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
That is why Enron was such a Charlie Foxtrot. You make the ONLY incentive for a company to make money, you distort the practices of business to do just that.
“I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana?”cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 amI wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism. We are all just in deep doo doo because nothing is ever going to make the huddled masses happy. We need to try Bernie's Americanized version of socialism light. What the hell, it is only taxpayer money being flushed down the toilet.RedFromMI wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:11 amBut still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
That is why Enron was such a Charlie Foxtrot. You make the ONLY incentive for a company to make money, you distort the practices of business to do just that.
"Because humans suck."PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:52 pm“I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana?”cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 amI wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism. We are all just in deep doo doo because nothing is ever going to make the huddled masses happy. We need to try Bernie's Americanized version of socialism light. What the hell, it is only taxpayer money being flushed down the toilet.RedFromMI wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:11 amBut still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
That is why Enron was such a Charlie Foxtrot. You make the ONLY incentive for a company to make money, you distort the practices of business to do just that.
Because humans suck. Most are inherently selfish.
All systems need to acknowledge that truth and provide mechanisms to temper basic human weaknesses. Speaking of wisdom one should acquire at some point...
Because what happened there has NOTHING to do with socialism. That's a kleptocracy.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 am I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism.
Careful there, I agree, but it puts a huge dent in this “free market capitalism failed” argument for exactly the same point (that George Will has been making for 20+ yrs). In fact kleptocracy might be extreme but isn’t outrageous as a explanation for why our version of capitalism has been failing as well....a fan wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:13 pmBecause what happened there has NOTHING to do with socialism. That's a kleptocracy.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 am I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism.
Want socialism? Look to any EU country. They're all doing fine. They all have varying degrees of socialism.....and all have more socialism than the US.
Or, if you prefer, look to America, where we have plenty of examples of pure socialism. The University of Virginia-----pure socialism-----is doing just fine. So fine, in fact, they should put a serious beatdown on privately owned and operated Syracuse University next week!
Yes, it does, doesn't it?Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:40 pm Careful there, I agree, but it puts a huge dent in this “free market capitalism failed” argument for exactly the same point (that George Will has been making for 20+ yrs).
For modern republicans sure. Part of it, I suspect is that things worked out for the prior generation (say up to the 90s or early 2000s) when executing these plans so they got away with bastardizing the "purity" of some of these fiscal and regulatory moves and subsequently made the mistake of thinking success meant they could get away with porking and side deal cutting through the capitalist implementation and over time its become this.a fan wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:09 pmYes, it does, doesn't it?Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:40 pm Careful there, I agree, but it puts a huge dent in this “free market capitalism failed” argument for exactly the same point (that George Will has been making for 20+ yrs).
It's why I'm a moderate. A little of capitalism. A little of socialism, and we'll be fine.
My issue, as I'm sure you've figure out, is that modern Republicans are dishonest brokers. They're selling their voters a line of dump.
And that line of dump is: trickle down works, and if we get the .gov out of the way? Oh, your GED will lead to six figure jobs with fat pensions and full health care.
Nope.
Case in point:cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:12 pm"Because humans suck."PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:52 pm“I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana?”cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 amI wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism. We are all just in deep doo doo because nothing is ever going to make the huddled masses happy. We need to try Bernie's Americanized version of socialism light. What the hell, it is only taxpayer money being flushed down the toilet.RedFromMI wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:11 amBut still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
That is why Enron was such a Charlie Foxtrot. You make the ONLY incentive for a company to make money, you distort the practices of business to do just that.
Because humans suck. Most are inherently selfish.
All systems need to acknowledge that truth and provide mechanisms to temper basic human weaknesses. Speaking of wisdom one should acquire at some point...
That may be the most brilliant thing you have said on this forum. I agree 100%.
PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:29 pmCase in point:cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:12 pm"Because humans suck."PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:52 pm“I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana?”cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 amI wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism. We are all just in deep doo doo because nothing is ever going to make the huddled masses happy. We need to try Bernie's Americanized version of socialism light. What the hell, it is only taxpayer money being flushed down the toilet.RedFromMI wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:11 amBut still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
That is why Enron was such a Charlie Foxtrot. You make the ONLY incentive for a company to make money, you distort the practices of business to do just that.
Because humans suck. Most are inherently selfish.
All systems need to acknowledge that truth and provide mechanisms to temper basic human weaknesses. Speaking of wisdom one should acquire at some point...
That may be the most brilliant thing you have said on this forum. I agree 100%.
"In the US, 85% of meat production is controlled by four companies, one of which is Tyson, heavily criticised recently after it emerged that management at one facility had been taking bets to see how many workers would contract Covid-19. “That betting pool might be the most disgusting thing ever created in a Tyson factory which is saying something given that Tyson also created ranch flavour chicken chips,” Oliver said."
Salisbury MD relies on poultry production as a top employer in that area (per a local bank exec when getting to know them) so I’m guessing you’re a LI or Upstate NY lacrosse guy.PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:29 pmCase in point:cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:12 pm"Because humans suck."PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:52 pm“I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana?”cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 amI wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism. We are all just in deep doo doo because nothing is ever going to make the huddled masses happy. We need to try Bernie's Americanized version of socialism light. What the hell, it is only taxpayer money being flushed down the toilet.RedFromMI wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:11 amBut still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
That is why Enron was such a Charlie Foxtrot. You make the ONLY incentive for a company to make money, you distort the practices of business to do just that.
Because humans suck. Most are inherently selfish.
All systems need to acknowledge that truth and provide mechanisms to temper basic human weaknesses. Speaking of wisdom one should acquire at some point...
That may be the most brilliant thing you have said on this forum. I agree 100%.
"In the US, 85% of meat production is controlled by four companies, one of which is Tyson, heavily criticised recently after it emerged that management at one facility had been taking bets to see how many workers would contract Covid-19. “That betting pool might be the most disgusting thing ever created in a Tyson factory which is saying something given that Tyson also created ranch flavour chicken chips,” Oliver said."
When you go to a concert, James Taylor or Kenny G or Tiny Tim - whoever you are into, do you want to hear the tracks off the new album of the greatest hits?
Perdue country.Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:54 pmSalisbury MD relies on poultry production as a top employer in that area (per a local bank exec when getting to know them) so I’m guessing you’re a LI or Upstate NY lacrosse guy.PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:29 pmCase in point:cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:12 pm"Because humans suck."PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:52 pm“I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana?”cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 amI wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism. We are all just in deep doo doo because nothing is ever going to make the huddled masses happy. We need to try Bernie's Americanized version of socialism light. What the hell, it is only taxpayer money being flushed down the toilet.RedFromMI wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:11 amBut still related to the original problem foreseen by Adam Smith when he wrote about capitalism - completely unfettered/unregulated practices will lead to the wrong thing being the goal - profit over functionality to society.seacoaster wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 9:21 am Kind of a screed, but pretty interesting:
https://www.gregpalast.com/texas-gets-l ... he-lights/
That is why Enron was such a Charlie Foxtrot. You make the ONLY incentive for a company to make money, you distort the practices of business to do just that.
Because humans suck. Most are inherently selfish.
All systems need to acknowledge that truth and provide mechanisms to temper basic human weaknesses. Speaking of wisdom one should acquire at some point...
That may be the most brilliant thing you have said on this forum. I agree 100%.
"In the US, 85% of meat production is controlled by four companies, one of which is Tyson, heavily criticised recently after it emerged that management at one facility had been taking bets to see how many workers would contract Covid-19. “That betting pool might be the most disgusting thing ever created in a Tyson factory which is saying something given that Tyson also created ranch flavour chicken chips,” Oliver said."
Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:55 pmWhen you go to a concert, James Taylor or Kenny G or Tiny Tim - whoever you are into, do you want to hear the tracks off the new album of the greatest hits?
Not saying it’s right or cool, but you can understand why folks will play the string out on something they perceive to be a winner.
You and I have danced this dance before. What you call pure socialism I call federal spending. Once Uncle Sam takes our tax dollars from us they spend it however they see fit. IMO the UV has enough Alum out there that they can create their own endowment for their university. The problem is a Fan, we have no control over our tax dollars once they are in the possession of the government. By your definition every single penny our government spends is pure socialism. It is a unique attempt to change the verbiage but it does not really matter what you choose to call it. The money is spent and will never be seen again. I will still call it federal spending and you will continue to call it pure socialism. Does it really matter? At the end of the day the money is gone. That defense budget of ours is 700 plus billion of pure socialist spending. The billions we spent on welfare and social services is pure socialism. The federal money we spend on infrastructure is pure socialism. Every dime our government begs, borrows or steals is all simply used to pay for all that socialism we all want and love. How do you think we ran up a 30 trillion dollar debt? That didn't happen by being fiscally responsible did it? Every politician wants what they want and they want it right now.a fan wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:13 pmBecause what happened there has NOTHING to do with socialism. That's a kleptocracy.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:20 am I wonder why Venezuela has been such an abysmal failure at becoming a socialist Nirvana? Unfettered capitalism sucks and so does unfettered socialism.
Want socialism? Look to any EU country. They're all doing fine. They all have varying degrees of socialism.....and all have more socialism than the US.
Or, if you prefer, look to America, where we have plenty of examples of pure socialism. The University of Virginia-----pure socialism-----is doing just fine. So fine, in fact, they should put a serious beatdown on privately owned and operated Syracuse University next week!
Yeah---but they didn't do that.cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:21 am You and I have danced this dance before. What you call pure socialism I call federal spending. Once Uncle Sam takes our tax dollars from us they spend it however they see fit. IMO the UV has enough Alum out there that they can create their own endowment for their university.