How many schools will drop lacrosse?

[steel_hop]

If the fall football season is cancelled, then further sport deletions are inevitable..

If football is cancelled then schools aren't going to have campus's opened. Dorms are just as much a petri dish as stadiums. But, let's all hold off before we make these proclomations. It is April 23rd. Let's see where we are on June 1st. Lots of things have happened in less than 6 weeks let's see what the next 6 weeks hold.

[SpiritInTheStick]

With schools starting to close or shut down athletic programs, I was interested in what laxpert and Homer posted in this thread earlier on page 1 and I did a little research and comparison using that Forbes list that graded each school on their financial health. For those who didn't go through it, they graded almost every private school with a gpa, highest rating being a 4.5. After reading this IL article (https://www.insidelacrosse.com/article/ ... orts/56338) about conferences opening up the door to cut non-revenue sports, I was interested to see how lacrosse programs looked going forward and how the conferences stacked up. I'm not saying that a low score will result in a program being removed, I just thought it was interesting to look at. I'm going to post each conference for D1 here, and in case anyone is interested, I'll do a similar post in both the D2 and D3 threads.

For starters, D1 has 51 private schools that got a ranking, with an average GPA of 2.81.
D2 has 65 private schools on the list with an average of 1.79.
D3 has 209 schools rated with a GPA average of 2.23.

Here are the conferences ranked:

Ivy - 4.47 (Cornell, Yale, Princeton, Dartmouth, Penn all got perfect scores of 4.5 with Brown receiving a 4.46 and Harvard coming in with a 4.31)

ACC - 3.88 (3 private schools: Notre Dame - 4.5, Duke - 4.45, Syracuse - 2.69)

Patriot - 3.37 (Highs: Lafayette - 3.74, Lehigh - 3.72 Lows: Boston - 3.17, Loyola - 2.14)

Big East - 2.59 (Highs: Villanova - 3.28, Georgetown - 2.88 Lows: Providence - 2.26, Marquette - 2.13)

CAA - 2.42 (3 private schools: Fairfield - 2.94, Hofstra - 2.70, Drexel - 1.63)

SoCon - 2.39 (Highs: Richmond - 4.19, Furman - 3.55 Lows: Bellarmine - 1.47, Jacksonville - 0.82)

MAAC - 1.94 (Highs: Marist - 2.6, Quinnipiac - 2.33 Lows: Canisius - 1.49, Detroit Mercy - 1.48)

NEC - 1.93 (Highs: St. Joe's - 2.37, Hobart - 2.29 Lows: Robert Morris - 1.37, Mt. St. Mary's - 1.35)

The conferences with 1 private school: Johns Hopkins (Big Ten) - 4.21, Hartford (American East) - 1.59, and Hampton (Independent) - 2.55

Again, I'm not sure that this really means anything, just something to do while sitting at home. But it is interesting to see what schools could be in danger in each conference and also the range of financial health between some schools in the same conferences. Loyola looks to be way off from many of the Patriot schools and there is a big discrepancy in the SoCon between Richmond and Jacksonville.

[laxfan22]

Here’s where things could get really ugly for many schools. If colleges announce soon that they will be online only this fall, how many families will take that term off? Does anyone think they will receive $30,000 of value online? I would rather have our kids take a semester or a year off to work, read and maybe do The Great Courses or Stanford MOOCs. ..No good answer.

Or as my daughter (a HS junior) and I were discussing last night, attend some local community college or state school, and not shell out the private school tuitions.

I think CO's comment about there being no good answer on point. You are going to have two competing forces going against each other. I see the reason why many parents/students will want to take a gap year because of the cost in attending an on-line school when you are paying for the full school tuition.* But, this is going to make it difficult for the HS juniors admission to schools for the 2021 school year. If my kid is an incoming freshman taking a gap year but still wants to attend School X, I'm going to assume School X is going to want some form of deposit to hold that spot. That spot taken by my kid for the 2021 school year means that there is likely one less spot for a current HS junior to fill. This means the competition for the freshman class of 2021 is going to be absurd as you have spots filled by gap kids that would have been going to school this fall that normally would have been open.

There is the opposite effect. More than likely if kids take gap years, schools are going to want to fill those spots and will take kids on the waiting list. If your kid is on the waiting list at a top school and gets accepted late because of an increase in gap kids at a school, there will be an interesting discussion to be had. At the end of the day, the top schools will be fine, it is those lower tiers ones, ones that were already in trouble, will be feeling it.

*American University discounted there summer classes because they would be on line from approximately 1500 a credit/hour to 1400 a credit hour. A whopping $100. I doubt that type of discount moves the needle if one wants a discount because classes are taught on line.

Schools are not letting kids take gap years from what i hear. You don't want to start this fall, re-apply next year. And, i assume for schools that give out financial awards, they'll be forcing kids to attend or lose that aid.

[FMUBart]

If the fall football season is cancelled, then further sport deletions are inevitable..

If football is cancelled then schools aren't going to have campus's opened. Dorms are just as much a petri dish as stadiums. But, let's all hold off before we make these proclomations. It is April 23rd. Let's see where we are on June 1st. Lots of things have happened in less than 6 weeks let's see what the next 6 weeks hold.

https://www.espn.com/college-football/s ... ers-needed

Arizona president is speculating that students WILL return to campus but he doubts football season will happen in the fall...we'll see..

[Farfromgeneva]

Higher ed in general is going to get what it's got coming to it, so to speak. This behavior and financial mismanagement could never go on in perpetuity like all these college boards and administration believed. Too many people in "paycheck" jobs in this sector.

[steel_hop]

Here’s where things could get really ugly for many schools. If colleges announce soon that they will be online only this fall, how many families will take that term off? Does anyone think they will receive $30,000 of value online? I would rather have our kids take a semester or a year off to work, read and maybe do The Great Courses or Stanford MOOCs. ..No good answer.

Or as my daughter (a HS junior) and I were discussing last night, attend some local community college or state school, and not shell out the private school tuitions.

I think CO's comment about there being no good answer on point. You are going to have two competing forces going against each other. I see the reason why many parents/students will want to take a gap year because of the cost in attending an on-line school when you are paying for the full school tuition.* But, this is going to make it difficult for the HS juniors admission to schools for the 2021 school year. If my kid is an incoming freshman taking a gap year but still wants to attend School X, I'm going to assume School X is going to want some form of deposit to hold that spot. That spot taken by my kid for the 2021 school year means that there is likely one less spot for a current HS junior to fill. This means the competition for the freshman class of 2021 is going to be absurd as you have spots filled by gap kids that would have been going to school this fall that normally would have been open.

There is the opposite effect. More than likely if kids take gap years, schools are going to want to fill those spots and will take kids on the waiting list. If your kid is on the waiting list at a top school and gets accepted late because of an increase in gap kids at a school, there will be an interesting discussion to be had. At the end of the day, the top schools will be fine, it is those lower tiers ones, ones that were already in trouble, will be feeling it.

*American University discounted there summer classes because they would be on line from approximately 1500 a credit/hour to 1400 a credit hour. A whopping $100. I doubt that type of discount moves the needle if one wants a discount because classes are taught on line.

Schools are not letting kids take gap years from what i hear. You don't want to start this fall, re-apply next year. And, i assume for schools that give out financial awards, they'll be forcing kids to attend or lose that aid.

I guess we will see because I just did a quick google search and it says schools are worried about it. I seriously doubt they are going to force kids into paying for school and not being able to attend the school. They would get raked over the coals and they know it.

[smoova]

Here’s where things could get really ugly for many schools. If colleges announce soon that they will be online only this fall, how many families will take that term off? Does anyone think they will receive $30,000 of value online? I would rather have our kids take a semester or a year off to work, read and maybe do The Great Courses or Stanford MOOCs. ..No good answer.

Or as my daughter (a HS junior) and I were discussing last night, attend some local community college or state school, and not shell out the private school tuitions.

I think CO's comment about there being no good answer on point. You are going to have two competing forces going against each other. I see the reason why many parents/students will want to take a gap year because of the cost in attending an on-line school when you are paying for the full school tuition.* But, this is going to make it difficult for the HS juniors admission to schools for the 2021 school year. If my kid is an incoming freshman taking a gap year but still wants to attend School X, I'm going to assume School X is going to want some form of deposit to hold that spot. That spot taken by my kid for the 2021 school year means that there is likely one less spot for a current HS junior to fill. This means the competition for the freshman class of 2021 is going to be absurd as you have spots filled by gap kids that would have been going to school this fall that normally would have been open.

There is the opposite effect. More than likely if kids take gap years, schools are going to want to fill those spots and will take kids on the waiting list. If your kid is on the waiting list at a top school and gets accepted late because of an increase in gap kids at a school, there will be an interesting discussion to be had. At the end of the day, the top schools will be fine, it is those lower tiers ones, ones that were already in trouble, will be feeling it.

*American University discounted there summer classes because they would be on line from approximately 1500 a credit/hour to 1400 a credit hour. A whopping $100. I doubt that type of discount moves the needle if one wants a discount because classes are taught on line.

Schools are not letting kids take gap years from what i hear. You don't want to start this fall, re-apply next year. And, i assume for schools that give out financial awards, they'll be forcing kids to attend or lose that aid.

I guess we will see because I just did a quick google search and it says schools are worried about it. I seriously doubt they are going to force kids into paying for school and not being able to attend the school. They would get raked over the coals and they know it.

It is an interesting situation. IMO, asking students to either matriculate or apply again next year is very reasonable.

[Can Opener]

Here’s where things could get really ugly for many schools. If colleges announce soon that they will be online only this fall, how many families will take that term off? Does anyone think they will receive $30,000 of value online? I would rather have our kids take a semester or a year off to work, read and maybe do The Great Courses or Stanford MOOCs. ..No good answer.

Or as my daughter (a HS junior) and I were discussing last night, attend some local community college or state school, and not shell out the private school tuitions.

I think CO's comment about there being no good answer on point. You are going to have two competing forces going against each other. I see the reason why many parents/students will want to take a gap year because of the cost in attending an on-line school when you are paying for the full school tuition.* But, this is going to make it difficult for the HS juniors admission to schools for the 2021 school year. If my kid is an incoming freshman taking a gap year but still wants to attend School X, I'm going to assume School X is going to want some form of deposit to hold that spot. That spot taken by my kid for the 2021 school year means that there is likely one less spot for a current HS junior to fill. This means the competition for the freshman class of 2021 is going to be absurd as you have spots filled by gap kids that would have been going to school this fall that normally would have been open.

There is the opposite effect. More than likely if kids take gap years, schools are going to want to fill those spots and will take kids on the waiting list. If your kid is on the waiting list at a top school and gets accepted late because of an increase in gap kids at a school, there will be an interesting discussion to be had. At the end of the day, the top schools will be fine, it is those lower tiers ones, ones that were already in trouble, will be feeling it.

*American University discounted there summer classes because they would be on line from approximately 1500 a credit/hour to 1400 a credit hour. A whopping $100. I doubt that type of discount moves the needle if one wants a discount because classes are taught on line.

Schools are not letting kids take gap years from what i hear. You don't want to start this fall, re-apply next year. And, i assume for schools that give out financial awards, they'll be forcing kids to attend or lose that aid.

I guess we will see because I just did a quick google search and it says schools are worried about it. I seriously doubt they are going to force kids into paying for school and not being able to attend the school. They would get raked over the coals and they know it.

If I were an incoming freshman, I would take the deferral option right now. The window is open for a few more weeks under the “normal” deferral rules at most schools. Hit that button now before the window shuts. If you try to do it after the deadline, I still think you have a shot because it is hard for schools to demand payment for a less than 100% product. I don’t envy coaches trying to advise their athletes right now. Good chance no fall ball and online classes only. They want the freshmen on the field in the spring of 2021, but having a kid you love arrive a year later ain’t a bad outcome. Same as what hockey is doing these days. 20 year old freshmen.

[NoLeft]

Apparently the NCAA has a proposal out there that would cut the number of sports a school is required to support to maintain their Division I status.
This link concerns that...
https://www.savecollegesports.com/

[laxfan22]

Apparently the NCAA has a proposal out there that would cut the number of sports a school is required to support to maintain their Division I status.
This link concerns that...
https://www.savecollegesports.com/

NCAA refused to hear it but apparently will allow individual colleges to petition for relief, if i understood the release correctly.

[laxjuris]

Wesleyan sent an email to admitted students yesterday stating that if they cannot host students next fall, they will grant an automatic deferral to the spring semester, and a deferral to fall 2021 upon request. Our son is considering Wesleyan along with a couple other schools, and we sure don’t want to have to pay full tuition if classes will be online. And we would much prefer our son have a full residential experience all four years. The tricky part is if kids defer, what will they be able to do with the down time?

[CT Transplant]

Work??

[shaadb-man]

Zig when others zag... Instead of deferring start school now and join what could be one of the smallest graduating classes in quite some time giving you a better shot at post grad/job opportunities rather than joining what could one of the biggest a year later

[44WeWantMore]

Assuming it is tough to get a job of any sort, something like updating http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/2044 (virtually, of course).

[Wheels]

Wesleyan sent an email to admitted students yesterday stating that if they cannot host students next fall, they will grant an automatic deferral to the spring semester, and a deferral to fall 2021 upon request. Our son is considering Wesleyan along with a couple other schools, and we sure don’t want to have to pay full tuition if classes will be online. And we would much prefer our son have a full residential experience all four years. The tricky part is if kids defer, what will they be able to do with the down time?

Anecdotally, heard from a friend a big State U in New England about their transition to online for the remainder of the semester. He had to call students who hadn't logged into the system for over 2 weeks. Almost all of them gave a variant of the same response: they don't know how to manage so much free time. We forget how much structure school provides everyone between ages 5-18 or 5-22. Then works takes over until you retire...and then you hear the same thing: How do I manage so much free time.

Sure, HS and college kids could go to work. Given the current state of the economy, finding work without experience will be tough.

[laxjuris]

Work??

Well of course that's the likeliest thing if it's safe to do so. My comment was based on an assumption that meaningful work may not be an option

[socalref]

Work??

"Work" is a cute response, but the reality is that with the record unemployment we're seeing now college kids are competing with a very large adult population desperate to earn income. 2020 seniors leaving school to no graduation ceremony and to unemployment numbers we haven't seen in decades. The job market sucked in the early 90's when I graduated. A brutal 7% and finding a job was though. Now it's almost double that.

[Young Warrior]

Things will start to get back to normal starting May 1

Which year? I have multiple work conferences in the 4th quarter of 2020 that were cancelled this week.

[Farfromgeneva]

“Conference” as in party in nice location where business related terms are thrown around a little? Cancelling legit work functions that far out seems extreme unless it’s an industry that’s on its back like cruise lines.

For the other comment, work can be found. I’ve been in white collar gigs since graduating but have worked as paperboy, long John silvers, ground round, ruby Tuesdays, cleaned city parks, city run summer camp counselor, “floater” mailman, mail distribution center, parts plus distribution center, midnight shift at a Hess station (the stories I could tell from that customer base...), construction & landscaping and a few other things I’m forgetting and that included the early 90s as I graduated from college in May 01, deferred my FICC analyst gig w Citi a year when you could do that and lost it after 9/11. Jobs can be found in a recession, just ones like the ones listed above.

[Young Warrior]

“Conference” as in party in nice location where business related terms are thrown around a little? Cancelling legit work functions that far out seems extreme unless it’s an industry that’s on its back like cruise lines.

For the other comment, work can be found. I’ve been in white collar gigs since graduating but have worked as paperboy, long John silvers, ground round, ruby Tuesdays, cleaned city parks, city run summer camp counselor, “floater” mailman, mail distribution center, parts plus distribution center, midnight shift at a Hess station (the stories I could tell from that customer base...), construction & landscaping and a few other things I’m forgetting and that included the early 90s as I graduated from college in May 01, deferred my FICC analyst gig w Citi a year when you could do that and lost it after 9/11. Jobs can be found in a recession, just ones like the ones listed above.

I get that there is always work. My point is that if you think things are just going to snap back to the way they were in January you too are "extreme". I am thinking many of the seniors who announced they are coming back may not have had their job situation settled yet - and it doesnt seem like many businesses are in a hurry to do much of anything right now. Companies are planning for things to be altered for much longer than the next few months. Not shut down forever, but they will be cautious when we resume.
Schools are in a no win situation - everyone wants class / sports as normal in the fall - but I am sure the schools are terrified of a "full open" followed by the liability of kids subsequently getting round 2 of this virus. Conversely, parents dont want to pay full boat for online classes and the kids dont want to graduate from Zoom University.