Trump's Russian Collusion

[RedFromMI]

Times up.

Barr is just another scum bag piece of beans republican. Obstruct, delay and lie, its what they do. 12 days and not one page of the Mueller report has been released to congress.

That seems a bit over the top.
Time will tell if you are correct about Barr, 72.
My hunch is that, disappointingly but not unpredictably, your description will prove more accurate than not, as to obstruct and delay, but we'll know in due course.

6ft, the chances of the actual report supporting the wild characterizations of DJT and his minions, based upon their mis-reading of Barr's letter, is near zero.

It's yet to be known for sure whether Barr's actual words (rather than the BS out of the White House, Fox et al) fairly represents the full contents and reasonable conclusions from what Mueller's report actually includes, but we'll see.

I think it's most likely that Barr cherry-picked a couple of aspects that would fit into the narrative that got him the gig in the first place. That the President cannot "obstruct" by virtue of being President. That's a scary POV, at least for anyone concerned about authoritarianism, whether left or right, but that's what Barr was selling to get the gig.

But note the "cherry-picked". There's going to be a lot more. Some good for DJT, some not so good.

Why do Trumpists no longer want to know the actual details learned?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Maybe because they relish "winning" so much that they are unwilling to face the truth about their fav president. That he is a con man, a grifter, a compulsive liar, etc., whose only real skills are selling himself as their savior, "sticking it to the libs," and winking at racism/white supremacy.

But from my viewpoint as a definitely non-Trumpist I have always seen that.

The game now is to delay as much of the release of information for as long as possible to get Trump a second term. And Barr is uniquely suited for that effort - he has enough experience with prior administrations to know just how to muck up the works, and will do so willingly...

[jhu72]

Seems the description of a scum bag piece of beans to me. This guy is supposed to answer to the people - release the entire report to congress.

Just more poisoning of the well of justice. Its clear 40% of the people don't care or believe in the American justice system. Barr and his criminal friends are determined to convince the other 60% that the system doesn't work.

[MDlaxfan76]

Times up.

Barr is just another scum bag piece of beans republican. Obstruct, delay and lie, its what they do. 12 days and not one page of the Mueller report has been released to congress.

That seems a bit over the top.
Time will tell if you are correct about Barr, 72.
My hunch is that, disappointingly but not unpredictably, your description will prove more accurate than not, as to obstruct and delay, but we'll know in due course.

6ft, the chances of the actual report supporting the wild characterizations of DJT and his minions, based upon their mis-reading of Barr's letter, is near zero.

It's yet to be known for sure whether Barr's actual words (rather than the BS out of the White House, Fox et al) fairly represents the full contents and reasonable conclusions from what Mueller's report actually includes, but we'll see.

I think it's most likely that Barr cherry-picked a couple of aspects that would fit into the narrative that got him the gig in the first place. That the President cannot "obstruct" by virtue of being President. That's a scary POV, at least for anyone concerned about authoritarianism, whether left or right, but that's what Barr was selling to get the gig.

But note the "cherry-picked". There's going to be a lot more. Some good for DJT, some not so good.

Why do Trumpists no longer want to know the actual details learned?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Maybe because they relish "winning" so much that they are unwilling to face the truth about their fav president. That he is a con man, a grifter, a compulsive liar, etc., whose only real skills are selling himself as their savior, "sticking it to the libs," and winking at racism/white supremacy.

But from my viewpoint as a definitely non-Trumpist I have always seen that.

The game now is to delay as much of the release of information for as long as possible to get Trump a second term. And Barr is uniquely suited for that effort - he has enough experience with prior administrations to know just how to muck up the works, and will do so willingly...

We're in agreement on your first two paras.

And I'm certainly suspicious of Barr, but I just think that "will do so willingly" part remains to be seen.

72, again, your view of Barr may prove accurate.
I hope not, but certainly think it's possible.
But we'll know a lot more over the next few weeks about how he's going to play this out. One way or the other, it won't take 90 days whether he's going to extend the cover-up efforts.

To me, the clock's tickling pretty fast at this point.
It's entirely in his purview to ask the court to allow the grand jury testimony to be made public.
If he doesn't take that step within the next couple of weeks, that'll be a very negative signal.

[RedFromMI]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

[Typical Lax Dad]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

[runrussellrun]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

Before reading the article....let me guess

" ....anonymous.....on the condition of......or....not authorized to speak on behalf of..".
"

[RedFromMI]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

Before reading the article....let me guess

" ....anonymous.....on the condition of......or....not authorized to speak on behalf of..".
"

No - team members spoke to others who talked to NYT. Not anonymous (at least to NYT). Hearsay as far as "could you use it for court testimony" but enough doubt now to put further pressure on Barr to more quickly release to Congress, as well as perhaps release more, to avoid getting tarred as a partisan hack.

There is always the strategy to get out damaging information out quickly and completely to avoid the drip, drip, drip of extended revelations, but this is the Trump administration, and I am not sure they think that far ahead...

[runrussellrun]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

Before reading the article....let me guess

" ....anonymous.....on the condition of......or....not authorized to speak on behalf of..".
"

wrong......the article didn't even bother, and why would the nytimes at this point. nytimes just went with SOME.

SOME ......on the Mueller team. What a crock.

THis outtake is just pathetic on the nytimes part. they should be ashamed for publishing this trash.

The officials and others interviewed declined to flesh out why some of the special counsel’s investigators viewed their findings as potentially more damaging for the president than Mr. Barr explained, although the report is believed to examine Mr. Trump’s efforts to thwart the investigation.

No names. No atributions. Just lies, at this point, innuendos and contradicktory conclusions. So sad that someone posted this link.

[runrussellrun]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

Before reading the article....let me guess

" ....anonymous.....on the condition of......or....not authorized to speak on behalf of..".
"

No - team members spoke to others who talked to NYT. Not anonymous (at least to NYT). Hearsay as far as "could you use it for court testimony" but enough doubt now to put further pressure on Barr to more quickly release to Congress, as well as perhaps release more, to avoid getting tarred as a partisan hack.

There is always the strategy to get out damaging information out quickly and completely to avoid the drip, drip, drip of extended revelations, but this is the Trump administration, and I am not sure they think that far ahead...

Not one name attributed to the claims. But enough for the lemmings to make stone soup with. Only the villagers have no ingrediants to add. Just pathetic. You should know and do better at this point.

[a fan]

No names. No atributions. Just lies, at this point, innuendos and contradicktory conclusions. So sad that someone posted this link.

Easy fix. Release the document that American citizens paid for...that's OUR document. These people work for us, not the other way around.

This is exactly where the tin foil hat wearers get their tin foil from.....hiding information that would clear up the whole mess.

The fact that that document hasn't been handed off to Pelosi...who has every clearance she needs.....stokes the fire.

[RedFromMI]

There were some attributions - apparently the leakers were close to Barr. From Josh Marshall at TalkingPointsMemo:

And this new article seems based largely on sources around Barr.

And a direct quote from the NYT article:

The special counsel’s investigators had already written multiple summaries of the report, and some team members believe that Mr. Barr should have included more of their material in the four-page letter he wrote on March 24 laying out their main conclusions.

[runrussellrun]

No names. No atributions. Just lies, at this point, innuendos and contradicktory conclusions. So sad that someone posted this link.

Easy fix. Release the document that American citizens paid for...that's OUR document. These people work for us, not the other way around.

This is exactly where the tin foil hat wearers get their tin foil from.....hiding information that would clear up the whole mess.

The fact that that document hasn't been handed off to Pelosi...who has every clearance she needs.....stokes the fire.

I don't comment much on this topic b/c it's a wait and see. The poorly attributed (none) NY Times article is pointless. It's speculation. You say it's an easy fix. I say it never should have been published until NAMES were included. They continue to lose what little respect they have left.

SO, I will wait for the report to come out. But, do you really think the speculation will stop?
Now the Dems are after his tax returns. No legal claim to seeing them. None. oh, wait. They could pass a law stating that the President has to reveal their tax return. Pass a law. But, what about the next in line? And the next? And the next? Why stop there, why not all elected lawmakers at the Federal level? How about the Joint chief of staffs? Or Ambassadors? How about CEO's for companies getting tax dollar contracts above 100 million?

[a fan]

TAATS. This is the same JV stuff they pulled on Obama and Hillary. Only difference is, the Dems are plainly willing to vote yes on Trump bills.

[RedFromMI]

No names. No atributions. Just lies, at this point, innuendos and contradicktory conclusions. So sad that someone posted this link.

Easy fix. Release the document that American citizens paid for...that's OUR document. These people work for us, not the other way around.

This is exactly where the tin foil hat wearers get their tin foil from.....hiding information that would clear up the whole mess.

The fact that that document hasn't been handed off to Pelosi...who has every clearance she needs.....stokes the fire.

I don't comment much on this topic b/c it's a wait and see. The poorly attributed (none) NY Times article is pointless. It's speculation. You say it's an easy fix. I say it never should have been published until NAMES were included. They continue to lose what little respect they have left.

SO, I will wait for the report to come out. But, do you really think the speculation will stop?
Now the Dems are after his tax returns. No legal claim to seeing them. None. oh, wait. They could pass a law stating that the President has to reveal their tax return. Pass a law. But, what about the next in line? And the next? And the next? Why stop there, why not all elected lawmakers at the Federal level? How about the Joint chief of staffs? Or Ambassadors? How about CEO's for companies getting tax dollar contracts above 100 million?

The tax return issue is already part of federal law (the tax code).

Section 6103(f)(1) of the Internal Revenue Code (IRC) reads:

Upon written request from the chairman of the Committee on Ways and Means of the House of Representatives, the chairman of the Committee on Finance of the Senate, or the chairman of the Joint Committee on Taxation, the Secretary [of the Treasury] shall furnish such committee with any return or return information specified in such request, except that any return or return information which can be associated with, or otherwise identify, directly or indirectly, a particular taxpayer shall be furnished to such committee only when sitting in closed executive session unless such taxpayer otherwise consents in writing to such disclosure.

In the past other presidents returns have been examined, but it is not clear that any of those examinations involved this particular part of the code...

[njbill]

Now the Dems are after his tax returns. No legal claim to seeing them. None.

Except for this provision of federal law, enacted in 1924:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/6103

For more info, see this article:

https://taxprof.typepad.com/files/154tn1013-yin.pdf

Edit: Red, you beat me to it.

[runrussellrun]

Now the Dems are after his tax returns. No legal claim to seeing them. None.

Except for this provision of federal law, enacted in 1924:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/6103

For more info, see this article:

https://taxprof.typepad.com/files/154tn1013-yin.pdf

Edit: Red, you beat me to it.

Thank you for providing the information, I had NO idea this law existed. None.

In short, what are the TAATS waiting for. exactly

[jhu72]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

Not even a little surprising. The more Barr screws around, the more the investigation will leak. There are people inside who aren't going to let Barr subvert Mueller's work. If there is nothing to see, show the American people's representatives. Too difficult a principle for scum bags to understand I guess. Generally the rank and file civil servants have a better moral compass than the clowns they work for.

[RedFromMI]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

Not even a little surprising. The more Barr screws around, the more the investigation will leak. There are people inside who aren't going to let Barr subvert Mueller's work. If there is nothing to see, show the American people's representatives. Too difficult a principle for scum bags to understand I guess. The rank and file civil servants always have a better moral compass than the clowns they work for.

Washington Post has an article up as well on the same subject. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/n ... story.html

But members of Mueller’s team have complained to close associates that the evidence they gathered on obstruction was alarming and significant.

“It was much more acute than Barr suggested,” said one person, who, like others, spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the subject’s sensitivity.

Some members of the office were particularly disappointed that Barr did not release summary information the special counsel team had prepared, according to two people familiar with their reactions.

“There was immediate displeasure from the team when they saw how the attorney general had characterized their work instead,” according one U.S. official briefed on the matter.

Summaries were prepared for different sections of the report, with a view that they could made public, the official said.

The report was prepared “so that the front matter from each section could have been released immediately — or very quickly,” the official said. “It was done in a way that minimum redactions, if any, would have been necessary, and the work would have spoken for itself.”

Mueller’s team assumed the information was going to be made available to the public, the official said, “and so they prepared their summaries to be shared in their own words — and not in the attorney general’s summary of their work, as turned out to be the case.”

A spokeswoman for the Justice Department declined to comment. A spokesman for the special counsel did not immediately respond to a request for comment. Attorneys for the president did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

[jhu72]

So apparently some of Mueller's team, frustrated with the results of the Barr "summary" letter to Congress have spoken to some of their Justice associates. And apparently not happy:

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/03/us/p ... -ios-share

Title of article pretty much says it all: Some on Mueller’s Team See Their Findings as More Damaging for Trump Than Barr Revealed

Vindicated.....

Not even a little surprising. The more Barr screws around, the more the investigation will leak. There are people inside who aren't going to let Barr subvert Mueller's work. If there is nothing to see, show the American people's representatives. Too difficult a principle for scum bags to understand I guess. The rank and file civil servants always have a better moral compass than the clowns they work for.

Washington Post has an article up as well on the same subject. https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/n ... story.html

But members of Mueller’s team have complained to close associates that the evidence they gathered on obstruction was alarming and significant.

“It was much more acute than Barr suggested,” said one person, who, like others, spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the subject’s sensitivity.

Some members of the office were particularly disappointed that Barr did not release summary information the special counsel team had prepared, according to two people familiar with their reactions.

“There was immediate displeasure from the team when they saw how the attorney general had characterized their work instead,” according one U.S. official briefed on the matter.

Summaries were prepared for different sections of the report, with a view that they could made public, the official said.

The report was prepared “so that the front matter from each section could have been released immediately — or very quickly,” the official said. “It was done in a way that minimum redactions, if any, would have been necessary, and the work would have spoken for itself.”

Mueller’s team assumed the information was going to be made available to the public, the official said, “and so they prepared their summaries to be shared in their own words — and not in the attorney general’s summary of their work, as turned out to be the case.”

A spokeswoman for the Justice Department declined to comment. A spokesman for the special counsel did not immediately respond to a request for comment. Attorneys for the president did not immediately respond to a request for comment.

None of this is surprising. As I said when it was released - Mueller is extraordinarily competent. He knows the law, the process and all the ins and outs. Barr knows nothing that Mueller doesn't! I would have been very surprised if he had not prepared various appendices that could be pulled out that stood alone as summaries, as confidential information, for eyes only, etc. Barr's excuse as to why it is taking all this time is total bull. Mueller did the work for him.

[old salt]

The Wash Post headline is misleading. They're complaining only about the obstruction investigation, not the Russia investigation.

Obstruction = runaway prosecutors whining about the ultimate process crime trap they generated.

Self licking ice cream cone. Boo Hoo Weissman.

They don't know what else Barr is going to release.

They can always peddle their pull out appendices to Fusion GPS.