LaxPower Back-Up Stick

RedIvy wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:38 am Watching many games this year I would agree that ND is a top team and I would have put them in over Harvard and TOSU. But if I look only at data (which I think is the more fair view) I do understand the logic. But even with that I would have likely put ND in over Harvard. I think the seedlings and 5 ivy teams make sense based on 2022 resumes. The vast majority of those polling on fanlax would have left Duke out so I don’t think this is controversial at all.

This is a wake up call for the ACC, the luxury of requiring teams to come to them is over. Get on a bus and travel north in February and March and play in something other than the climate controlled Carrier Dome (or live with the consequences).

This is it right here,

I would add,
ND at least acted desperate to get into the NCAAs,
they were in it to the bitter end.

Just a thought - how about a minimum RPI or other metric be put in place for a conference to get an AQ. You then get a much stronger field without expanding the total number of teams by growing the AL bids. Not sure why lacrosse has to follow the hoops model.

The ACC had the advantage of nicer weather and making everyone come to them. They would go 18-2 stack the early wins and have a huge RPI advantage the entire year….Then with the media cheerleaders saying things like Quints “ Yale has almost ACC type athletes” when they had caught up 2-3 years prior , and the dye was cast annually, even when teams like Army beat both ACC opponents one year and was left out… I feel for the athletes that were left out this year, but I have been watching it happen to Army, Bucknell, Rutgers in the past……live by RPI. Die by RPI

I think it's a valid idea that ND got screwed. I think the Ivy League deserved 5 for sure, anyone saying otherwise hasn't been paying attention this season. I have a hard time feeling bad for ACC, a conf that for so long has benefitted from the very same criteria that worked against them this year.

RedIvy wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:38 am Watching many games this year I would agree that ND is a top team and I would have put them in over Harvard and TOSU. But if I look only at data (which I think is the more fair view) I do understand the logic. But even with that I would have likely put ND in over Harvard. I think the seedlings and 5 ivy teams make sense based on 2022 resumes. The vast majority of those polling on fanlax would have left Duke out so I don’t think this is controversial at all.

This is a wake up call for the ACC, the luxury of requiring teams to come to them is over. Get on a bus and travel north in February and March and play in something other than the climate controlled Carrier Dome (or live with the consequences).

Wow, can you imagine those warm weather teams like Duke, NC , UVA coming to Schoellkopf in late Feb. Early March when the windchills are in the Teens, it's snowing ,and your sweat is forming icecles on your nose (and that's just us crazy fans)?
Love to see it.
By the way, the last time UVA came to the Kopf as #1 or 2, Cornell waxed them I believe about 14-11, and the weather was great that day.
GOBIGRED
Joewillie78

having read the committee's rationale for the last 6 teams considered, i say welcome back to crazy. i'd say it was the most inane illogical rationale i've seen, but it's really just a re-up from past years going back a while. nd and duke just got caught up in it this year.

the consequences are that there'll be great anticipation for those final selections. and also that teams will have absolutely no idea what's important to get in year to year. don't live on the bubble.

HGK wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:48 am Just a thought - how about a minimum RPI or other metric be put in place for a conference to get an AQ. You then get a much stronger field without expanding the total number of teams by growing the AL bids. Not sure why lacrosse has to follow the hoops model.

Just not the point of the AQ. It’s about broader participation and equal access, actually never ever been about putting only the very best teams in.

A discussion to change the AQ system comes with a much larger and broader conversation about how the sport should grow in the future without being a closed loop system an keep schools engaged and participating. It’s fine if you only want 35 schools participating but drop the AQ and you’d lose 10-15 schools within 5-7 years.

wgdsr wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:58 am don't live on the bubble.

Best advice EVER...

HGK wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:48 am Just a thought - how about a minimum RPI or other metric be put in place for a conference to get an AQ. You then get a much stronger field without expanding the total number of teams by growing the AL bids. Not sure why lacrosse has to follow the hoops model.

We have this discussion every year over in the d3 forum as well.

AQs help to grow the game. They allow teams from lesser conferences to participate in the tournament, get exposure (for potential recruits), etc.

I don't see this happening. 8 at-larges in a tourney field of, what...18? And every year the vast majority of those at-larges go to 2 or 3 conferences, with the lowest of the low (conference RPI-wise) have to go the play-in game route, so it's not like they're really shouldering better teams out of the tourney.

(I guess you could make the argument that really there are only 7 at-larges, with the ACC not having an AQ, but the general argument still holds).

Most years the issue isn't AQ teams taking up spots; it's legacy teams who've learned to play game the RPI system snagging invites from more deserving teams. This year, thankfully, that wasn't a problem.

ND and Duke being left out has folks hopping mad! Quint, Anish and the crew are hysterical. We should let the ESPN and PLL guys make the selections.

b1w7o9y7h wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:04 am

wgdsr wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:58 am don't live on the bubble.

Best advice EVER...

Basic advice I used to give to my son when he was playing basketball, soccer and lacrosse growing up. It won’t be the coaches fault, it will be yours. Go get better.

If Duke, UNC, UVA had scheduled and beat teams in the North this would have helped them as well as ND. When things like this happen it’s easy to blame, but you’ll find better answers reflecting on your own actions and what you can control. I believe this is what made the Ivies adjust their scheduling practices and add top teams very early on in spite of the limited practice time (due to ivy rules) and weather challenges in the NE.

wgdsr wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:58 am having read the committee's rationale for the last 6 teams considered, i say welcome back to crazy. i'd say it was the most inane illogical rationale i've seen, but it's really just a re-up from past years going back a while. nd and duke just got caught up in it this year.

the consequences are that there'll be great anticipation for those final selections. and also that teams will have absolutely no idea what's important to get in year to year. don't live on the bubble.

Sometimes you have to blow up the algorithm when all participants are modeling their systems to the algo. I don’t mind it. This is a college sport. An expenditure and still extracurricular no matter what the “it’s all business now” crowd seems to think so it’s more disappointing that institutions of higher learning would try to game scheduling to work a system rather than let kids just go compete and win the games out in front of them without all these other considerations. Maybe it won’t matter if the OSU AD gets his way and FBS takes over CFB freeing up the NCAA in some ways.

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:10 am

b1w7o9y7h wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:04 am

wgdsr wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:58 am don't live on the bubble.

Best advice EVER...

Basic advice I used to give to my son when he was playing basketball, soccer and lacrosse growing up. It won’t be the coaches fault, it will be yours. Go get better.

Blinders on just go to friggin goal. Was telling my son in his first lacrosse season, get upfield, keep your head up and remember what your doing playing this game. (Having fun but of course competing to try and win)

1766 wrote: ↑Sun May 08, 2022 11:33 pm

RopeUnit wrote: ↑Sun May 08, 2022 11:14 pm 2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

THIS! Quality OCC foes will want home-and-home agreements. The sport will benefit if one clan no longer treats itself as royalty and everyone else as peasants.

Farfromgeneva wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:16 am

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:10 am

b1w7o9y7h wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:04 am

wgdsr wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 8:58 am don't live on the bubble.

Best advice EVER...

Basic advice I used to give to my son when he was playing basketball, soccer and lacrosse growing up. It won’t be the coaches fault, it will be yours. Go get better.

Blinders on just go to friggin goal.

It was always “make it hard not to be picked and not to start”

Ezra White wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:18 am

1766 wrote: ↑Sun May 08, 2022 11:33 pm

RopeUnit wrote: ↑Sun May 08, 2022 11:14 pm 2 things can be true:
1. Notre Dame could likely beat anyone in the field this weekend
2. Notre Dame didn’t do enough to earn a tournament invite—they are 0-4 against teams that made the cut. One win against those and they’re in.

ND, and Duke, have no one to blame but themselves. In ND's case, sure they finished well. But they started terribly for almost half the season.

It will be interesting to see how some of the Acc teams schedule moving forward. Not all, but some beating up on regional mid majors, for the most part, and counting on the Acc portion of their schedules to put them in tournament doesn't seem like a great strategy moving forward. They are going to have to travel to places perhaps they traditionally haven't.

THIS! Quality OCC foes will want home-and-home agreements. The sport will benefit if one clan no longer treats itself as royalty and everyone else as peasants.

I will admit that I am surprised Harvard is in and ND is out. Wasn’t sure the committee had the nads to do that.

Everyone talking about how we need to completely overhaul the selection process. I’m not going to say it’s without its flaws, but how about we need to seriously reevaluate how polling is done. People taking 10 mins to fill out a survey about teams they haven’t actually watched creates major disconnect for your average fan. The bigger question isn’t “why isn’t Notre Dame in the tournament”. It’s “why were they ranked as high as #4 in the polls”?

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon May 09, 2022 9:07 am ND and Duke being left out has folks hopping mad! Quint, Anish and the crew are hysterical. We should let the ESPN and PLL guys make the selections.

Anish's histrionics on Twitter are something else. Now we're going to have to hear about this all the way through Memorial Day. That this tournament is illegitimate. That the winner of the whole thing benefitted from not having ND in the field. Those dudes can't help themselves. They're going to slip it into every broadcast they're on.

Harvard lost 3 of the last 4 games. Gave up 61 goals (15 a game) in the last four. And, did not make the conference tournament.