ggait wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:48 am
Lots of wind power in chilly places like Canada, Greenland, Scandinavia, Germany, Wyoming, South Dakota, North Dakota, Minnesota, Colorado etc.
Seems like this is a Texas biff. Not a wind power problem.
JFTR what makes those propellers spin when the wind is not blowing? I believe that would be those fossil fuel mother effing back up turbine engines. Wind power is awesome, when the wind actually blows. Is the lack of wind also something you fruit loops can try and blame on CC.
They don't spin when there's no wind. So you throw in solar, geothermal, nuclear, smart hydroelectric, other renewable options, add in a variety of energy storage methods, and have fossil fuels still available to use if we want/need.
People aren't advocating that we only use wind power.
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
A friend of mine put one in about 10 years ago. I visited him a couple of times during various phases of the project. It was fairly easy and he is pleased with the results. I had not really heard much about it for home a home system. I hadn’t considered it personally.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
What Is Going On With China’s Crazy Clean Energy Installation Figures?
Analysts have been left dumbfounded after China last month released official 2020 wind and solar installation figures that were seemingly too big to be true.
The truly stunning aspect is that some folks on this forum actually believe anything the Chicoms say. The Chicoms don't give a flying fig about saving the planet. The day some of our esteemed environmental advocates on this forum journey to Chicom land and tell the Chicom leadership of the errors of their ways I will be very impressed. We will never see them or hear from them again, but i will still be very impressed at the effort. I only hope that Mr MD Lax has the bold enough leadership initiative to lead the environmental advocacy group into Communist China. I'm sure his leadership skills will change the hearts and minds of the leaders of Communist China to understand the errors of their ways.
I added the following above, apparently as you were trolling me...
Wouldn't be surprised if some heads will roll if this was indeed an f-up in the accounting, though that won't likely get much attention beyond in China itself.
The Chinese gov't is an enormous bureaucracy, with a predilection of middle managers trying to get ahead by pleasing their superiors (or not displeasing them), and superiors pushing the system to perform to objectives, resulting all too often in embracing mistakes or worse (wuhan). Our system has similar dysfunctions of course, but the repercussions in China tend to be far more severe. A screw up there can lead to thousands losing their jobs, and being relegated thereafter to menial work in comparison. And at the senior levels, Xi keeps purging anyone he deems insufficiently loyal to him or who screw up in some way, all in the name of "corruption reform" which has two meanings: yes, the first deals with corruption and incompetence, but the second is all about unifying power behind Xi.
On the substance of your comment, I agree that we shouldn't mistake China's commitment to leadership in clean energy to be one driven by "caring about the planet". Xi cares about power and everything he does is coldly calculated to achieve objectives that enable that continuation.
Clean energy is essential to that objective.
Damn it MD, i have no trolling gear. I told you before i am a hook, worm and bobber kind of fisherman. If you want believe the horsechit the chi coms put forward then maybe you should look at their government the same way you looked at trump and disbelieved what he had to say. The Chi coms don't give a chit about saving the planet. That is why I recommended you to go over there and use your negotiating skills to change some hearts and minds over there. What is up? Your not feeling up to the challenge? IMO you would make a gorgeous lampshade.
And again you don't bother to even read what I write.
The only thing you care about is insulting others.
But at least read and comprehend what others say...otherwise you just look like another loudmouth idiot popping off wildly.
I will respond and be more mellow, heaven knows I don't want to upset your extremely sensitive nature. My reading comprehension is fine. i read and understood every single bit of horsechit you wrote. That is why I volunteered you to go over to China and meet with Xi so you can use you powers of persuasion to change his ways. Is it INSULTING to you that i want you to represent the USA and talk face to face with Xi? You are the person who believes what he says and looks the other way as to he actually does. I'm not insulting you, that would be bullying. I'm just calling you out on your own words. You trust the chicoms as to what they say publicly regarding CCBS. I must rephrase my doubts in a more respectful and non bullying manner... why do you trust what Xi says? You did not trust anything trump said. Why would you trust anything the leader of the Chicoms has to say? The only thing I can think of is that Xi is saying what you want to hear. Why you would believe anything Xi has to say about clean energy is beyond me. I guess you are just trusting soul at heart.
So you build em in other countries... GOT IT. I guess the family living in a mud hut in Indonesia is probably happy to have electric lights powering their hut. I bet most of them don't know what the flip CC is. I bet they do understand what it means to have lights in their house. So I am guessing they should sacrifice the luxuries most of us have had in America for a hundred plus years.. to save the planet of course.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
Posted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 11:12 am
by holmes435
cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:58 am
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
This might be something worth looking into for upstate NY - geothermal greenhouse. Guy runs pipes 8' below ground in Nebraska, and blows air through them with a fan to keep the place 50°+ in the winter. $1 a day in energy costs to grow citrus and other stuff year round.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
ggait wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:48 am
Lots of wind power in chilly places like Canada, Greenland, Scandinavia, Germany, Wyoming, South Dakota, North Dakota, Minnesota, Colorado etc.
Seems like this is a Texas biff. Not a wind power problem.
JFTR what makes those propellers spin when the wind is not blowing? I believe that would be those fossil fuel mother effing back up turbine engines. Wind power is awesome, when the wind actually blows. Is the lack of wind also something you fruit loops can try and blame on CC.
They don't spin when there's no wind. So you throw in solar, geothermal, nuclear, smart hydroelectric, other renewable options, add in a variety of energy storage methods, and have fossil fuels still available to use if we want/need.
People aren't advocating that we only use wind power.
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
A friend of mine put one in about 10 years ago. I visited him a couple of times during various phases of the project. It was fairly easy and he is pleased with the results. I had not really heard much about it for home a home system. I hadn’t considered it personally.
I first saw them do it on a project episode of This Old House. It is amazing and efficient technology. The biggest expense is where your house is located and how difficult it is to dig down to the depth needed. If you have a yard full of beautiful old maple trees like i do, the problem with tree roots make it almost impossible to do, unless you wanna cut down your trees.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:58 am
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
This might be something worth looking into for upstate NY - geothermal greenhouse. Guy runs pipes 8' below ground in Nebraska, and blows air through them with a fan to keep the place 50°+ in the winter. $1 a day in energy costs to grow citrus and other stuff year round.
If I let my wife see this I would be in big trouble. If she knew we could have citrus trees in our backyard, especially lemons she would want it done ASAP.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
What Is Going On With China’s Crazy Clean Energy Installation Figures?
Analysts have been left dumbfounded after China last month released official 2020 wind and solar installation figures that were seemingly too big to be true.
The truly stunning aspect is that some folks on this forum actually believe anything the Chicoms say. The Chicoms don't give a flying fig about saving the planet. The day some of our esteemed environmental advocates on this forum journey to Chicom land and tell the Chicom leadership of the errors of their ways I will be very impressed. We will never see them or hear from them again, but i will still be very impressed at the effort. I only hope that Mr MD Lax has the bold enough leadership initiative to lead the environmental advocacy group into Communist China. I'm sure his leadership skills will change the hearts and minds of the leaders of Communist China to understand the errors of their ways.
I added the following above, apparently as you were trolling me...
Wouldn't be surprised if some heads will roll if this was indeed an f-up in the accounting, though that won't likely get much attention beyond in China itself.
The Chinese gov't is an enormous bureaucracy, with a predilection of middle managers trying to get ahead by pleasing their superiors (or not displeasing them), and superiors pushing the system to perform to objectives, resulting all too often in embracing mistakes or worse (wuhan). Our system has similar dysfunctions of course, but the repercussions in China tend to be far more severe. A screw up there can lead to thousands losing their jobs, and being relegated thereafter to menial work in comparison. And at the senior levels, Xi keeps purging anyone he deems insufficiently loyal to him or who screw up in some way, all in the name of "corruption reform" which has two meanings: yes, the first deals with corruption and incompetence, but the second is all about unifying power behind Xi.
On the substance of your comment, I agree that we shouldn't mistake China's commitment to leadership in clean energy to be one driven by "caring about the planet". Xi cares about power and everything he does is coldly calculated to achieve objectives that enable that continuation.
Clean energy is essential to that objective.
Damn it MD, i have no trolling gear. I told you before i am a hook, worm and bobber kind of fisherman. If you want believe the horsechit the chi coms put forward then maybe you should look at their government the same way you looked at trump and disbelieved what he had to say. The Chi coms don't give a chit about saving the planet. That is why I recommended you to go over there and use your negotiating skills to change some hearts and minds over there. What is up? Your not feeling up to the challenge? IMO you would make a gorgeous lampshade.
And again you don't bother to even read what I write.
The only thing you care about is insulting others.
But at least read and comprehend what others say...otherwise you just look like another loudmouth idiot popping off wildly.
I will respond and be more mellow, heaven knows I don't want to upset your extremely sensitive nature. My reading comprehension is fine. i read and understood every single bit of horsechit you wrote. That is why I volunteered you to go over to China and meet with Xi so you can use you powers of persuasion to change his ways. Is it INSULTING to you that i want you to represent the USA and talk face to face with Xi? You are the person who believes what he says and looks the other way as to he actually does. I'm not insulting you, that would be bullying. I'm just calling you out on your own words. You trust the chicoms as to what they say publicly regarding CCBS. I must rephrase my doubts in a more respectful and non bullying manner... why do you trust what Xi says? You did not trust anything trump said. Why would you trust anything the leader of the Chicoms has to say? The only thing I can think of is that Xi is saying what you want to hear. Why you would believe anything Xi has to say about clean energy is beyond me. I guess you are just trusting soul at heart.
So you build em in other countries... GOT IT. I guess the family living in a mud hut in Indonesia is probably happy to have electric lights powering their hut. I bet most of them don't know what the flip CC is. I bet they do understand what it means to have lights in their house. So I am guessing they should sacrifice the luxuries most of us have had in America for a hundred plus years.. to save the planet of course.
Buddy, I am not defending China. I am just pointing out some of the articles that have been written on what they are doing. Your link is another example. Thanks for the information. The better informed a person is, the less stupid they sound.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
Posted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 11:30 am
by CU88
February 17, 2021
Heather Cox Richardson
Feb 18
Comment
Share
The crisis in Texas continues, with almost 2 million people still without power in frigid temperatures. Pipes are bursting in homes, pulling down ceilings and flooding living spaces, while 7 million Texans are under a water boil advisory.
Tim Boyd, the mayor of Colorado City, Texas, put on Facebook: “The City and County, along with power providers or any other service owes you NOTHING! I’m sick and tired of people looking for a damn handout!... If you are sitting at home in the cold because you have no power and are sitting there waiting for someone to come rescue you because your lazy is direct result of your raising! [sic]…. This is sadly a product of a socialist government where they feed people to believe that the FEW will work and others will become dependent for handouts…. I’ll be damned if I’m going to provide for anyone that is capable of doing it themselves!... Bottom line quit crying and looking for a handout! Get off your ass and take care of your own family!” “Only the strong will survive and the weak will parish [sic],” he said.
After an outcry, Boyd resigned.
Boyd’s post was a fitting tribute to talk radio host Rush Limbaugh, who passed today from lung cancer at age 70. It was Limbaugh who popularized the idea that hardworking white men were under attack in America. According to him, minorities and feminists were too lazy to work, and instead expected a handout from the government, paid for by tax dollars levied from hardworking white men. This, he explained, was “socialism,” and it was destroying America.
Limbaugh didn’t invent this theory; it was the driving principle behind Movement Conservatism, which rose in the 1950s to combat the New Deal government that regulated business, provided a basic social safety net, and promoted infrastructure. But Movement Conservatives' efforts to get voters to reject the system that they credited for creating widespread prosperity had little success.
In 1971, Lewis Powell, an attorney for the tobacco industry, wrote a confidential memo for the U.S. Chamber of Commerce outlining how business interests could overturn the New Deal and retake control of America. Powell focused on putting like-minded scholars and speakers on college campuses, rewriting textbooks, stacking the courts, and pressuring politicians. He also called for “reaching the public generally” through television, newspapers, and radio. “[E]very available means should be employed to challenge and refute unfair attacks,” he wrote, “as well as to present the affirmative case through this media.”
Pressing the Movement Conservative case faced headwinds, however, since the Federal Communications Commission (FCC) enforced a policy that, in the interests of serving the community, required any outlet that held a federal broadcast license to present issues honestly, equitably, and with balance. This “Fairness Doctrine” meant that Movement Conservatives had trouble gaining traction, since voters rejected their ideas when they were stacked up against the ideas of Democrats and traditional Republicans, who agreed that the government had a role to play in the economy (even though they squabbled about the extent of that role).
In 1985, under a chair appointed by President Ronald Reagan, the FCC stated that the Fairness Doctrine hurt the public interest. Two years later, under another Reagan-appointed chair, the FCC abolished the rule.
With the Fairness Doctrine gone, Rush Limbaugh stepped into the role of promoting the Movement Conservative narrative. He gave it the concrete examples, color, and passion it needed to jump from think tanks and businessmen to ordinary voters who could help make it the driving force behind national policy. While politicians talked with veiled language about “welfare queens” and same-sex bathrooms, and “makers” and “takers,” Limbaugh played “Barack the Magic Negro,” talked of “femiNazis,” and said “Liberals” were “socialists,” redistributing tax dollars from hardworking white men to the undeserving.
Constantly, he hammered on the idea that the federal government threatened the freedom of white men, and he did so in a style that his listeners found entertaining and liberating.
By the end of the 1980s, Limbaugh’s show was carried on more than 650 radio stations, and in 1992, he briefly branched out into television with a show produced by Roger Ailes, who had packaged Richard Nixon in 1968 and would go on to become the head of the Fox News Channel. Before the 1994 midterm elections, Limbaugh was so effective in pushing the Republicans’ “Contract With America” that when the party won control of the House of Representatives for the first time since 1952, the Republican revolutionaries made him an honorary member of their group.
Limbaugh told them that, under House Speaker Newt Gingrich, the Republicans must “begin an emergency dismantling of the welfare system, which is shredding the social fabric,” bankrupting the country, and “gutting the work ethic, educational performance, and moral discipline of the poor.” Next, Congress should cut capital gains taxes, which would drive economic growth, create hundreds of thousands of jobs, and generate billions in federal revenue.
Limbaugh kept staff in Washington to make sure Republican positions got through to voters. At the same time, every congressman knew that taking a stand against Limbaugh would earn instant condemnation on radio channels across the country, and they acted accordingly.
Limbaugh saw politics as entertainment that pays well for the people who can rile up their base with compelling stories—Limbaugh’s net worth when he died was estimated at $600 million—but he sold the Movement Conservative narrative well. He laid the groundwork for the political career of Donald Trump, who awarded Limbaugh the Presidential Medal of Freedom in a made-for-tv moment at Trump’s 2020 State of the Union address. His influence runs deep in the current party: former Mayor Boyd, an elected official, began his diatribe with: “Let me hurt some feelings while I have a minute!!”
Like Boyd, other Texas politicians are also falling back on the Movement Conservative narrative to explain the disaster in their state. The crisis was caused by a lack of maintenance on Texas’s unregulated energy grid, which meant that instruments at coal, natural gas, and nuclear plants froze, at the same time that supplies of natural gas fell short. Nonetheless, Governor Greg Abbott and his allies in the fossil fuel industry went after “liberal” ideas. They blamed the crisis on the frozen wind turbines and solar plants which account for about 13% of Texas’s winter power. Abbott told Fox News Channel personality Sean Hannity that “this shows how the Green New Deal would be a deadly deal for the United States of America.” Tucker Carlson told his viewers that Texas was “totally reliant on windmills.”
The former Texas governor and former Secretary of Energy under Trump, Rick Perry, wrote on House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy’s website to warn against regulation of Texas’s energy system: “Texans would be without electricity for longer than three days to keep the federal government out of their business,” he said. The website warned that “Those watching on the left may see the situation in Texas as an opportunity to expand their top-down, radical proposals. Two phrases come to mind: don’t mess with Texas, and don’t let a crisis go to waste.”
At Abbott’s request, President Biden has declared that Texas is in a state of emergency, freeing up federal money and supplies for the state. The Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) has sent 60 generators to state hospitals, water plants, and other critical facilities, along with blankets, food, and bottled water. It is also delivering diesel fuel for backup power.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
What Is Going On With China’s Crazy Clean Energy Installation Figures?
Analysts have been left dumbfounded after China last month released official 2020 wind and solar installation figures that were seemingly too big to be true.
The truly stunning aspect is that some folks on this forum actually believe anything the Chicoms say. The Chicoms don't give a flying fig about saving the planet. The day some of our esteemed environmental advocates on this forum journey to Chicom land and tell the Chicom leadership of the errors of their ways I will be very impressed. We will never see them or hear from them again, but i will still be very impressed at the effort. I only hope that Mr MD Lax has the bold enough leadership initiative to lead the environmental advocacy group into Communist China. I'm sure his leadership skills will change the hearts and minds of the leaders of Communist China to understand the errors of their ways.
I added the following above, apparently as you were trolling me...
Wouldn't be surprised if some heads will roll if this was indeed an f-up in the accounting, though that won't likely get much attention beyond in China itself.
The Chinese gov't is an enormous bureaucracy, with a predilection of middle managers trying to get ahead by pleasing their superiors (or not displeasing them), and superiors pushing the system to perform to objectives, resulting all too often in embracing mistakes or worse (wuhan). Our system has similar dysfunctions of course, but the repercussions in China tend to be far more severe. A screw up there can lead to thousands losing their jobs, and being relegated thereafter to menial work in comparison. And at the senior levels, Xi keeps purging anyone he deems insufficiently loyal to him or who screw up in some way, all in the name of "corruption reform" which has two meanings: yes, the first deals with corruption and incompetence, but the second is all about unifying power behind Xi.
On the substance of your comment, I agree that we shouldn't mistake China's commitment to leadership in clean energy to be one driven by "caring about the planet". Xi cares about power and everything he does is coldly calculated to achieve objectives that enable that continuation.
Clean energy is essential to that objective.
Damn it MD, i have no trolling gear. I told you before i am a hook, worm and bobber kind of fisherman. If you want believe the horsechit the chi coms put forward then maybe you should look at their government the same way you looked at trump and disbelieved what he had to say. The Chi coms don't give a chit about saving the planet. That is why I recommended you to go over there and use your negotiating skills to change some hearts and minds over there. What is up? Your not feeling up to the challenge? IMO you would make a gorgeous lampshade.
And again you don't bother to even read what I write.
The only thing you care about is insulting others.
But at least read and comprehend what others say...otherwise you just look like another loudmouth idiot popping off wildly.
I will respond and be more mellow, heaven knows I don't want to upset your extremely sensitive nature. My reading comprehension is fine. i read and understood every single bit of horsechit you wrote. That is why I volunteered you to go over to China and meet with Xi so you can use you powers of persuasion to change his ways. Is it INSULTING to you that i want you to represent the USA and talk face to face with Xi? You are the person who believes what he says and looks the other way as to he actually does. I'm not insulting you, that would be bullying. I'm just calling you out on your own words. You trust the chicoms as to what they say publicly regarding CCBS. I must rephrase my doubts in a more respectful and non bullying manner... why do you trust what Xi says? You did not trust anything trump said. Why would you trust anything the leader of the Chicoms has to say? The only thing I can think of is that Xi is saying what you want to hear. Why you would believe anything Xi has to say about clean energy is beyond me. I guess you are just trusting soul at heart.
So you build em in other countries... GOT IT. I guess the family living in a mud hut in Indonesia is probably happy to have electric lights powering their hut. I bet most of them don't know what the flip CC is. I bet they do understand what it means to have lights in their house. So I am guessing they should sacrifice the luxuries most of us have had in America for a hundred plus years.. to save the planet of course.
Buddy, I am not defending China. I am just pointing out some of the articles that have been written on what they are doing. Your link is another example. Thanks for the information. The better informed a person is, the less stupid they sound.
My apologies TLD. I know this may surprise you but sometimes I jump to conclusions.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
What Is Going On With China’s Crazy Clean Energy Installation Figures?
Analysts have been left dumbfounded after China last month released official 2020 wind and solar installation figures that were seemingly too big to be true.
The truly stunning aspect is that some folks on this forum actually believe anything the Chicoms say. The Chicoms don't give a flying fig about saving the planet. The day some of our esteemed environmental advocates on this forum journey to Chicom land and tell the Chicom leadership of the errors of their ways I will be very impressed. We will never see them or hear from them again, but i will still be very impressed at the effort. I only hope that Mr MD Lax has the bold enough leadership initiative to lead the environmental advocacy group into Communist China. I'm sure his leadership skills will change the hearts and minds of the leaders of Communist China to understand the errors of their ways.
I added the following above, apparently as you were trolling me...
Wouldn't be surprised if some heads will roll if this was indeed an f-up in the accounting, though that won't likely get much attention beyond in China itself.
The Chinese gov't is an enormous bureaucracy, with a predilection of middle managers trying to get ahead by pleasing their superiors (or not displeasing them), and superiors pushing the system to perform to objectives, resulting all too often in embracing mistakes or worse (wuhan). Our system has similar dysfunctions of course, but the repercussions in China tend to be far more severe. A screw up there can lead to thousands losing their jobs, and being relegated thereafter to menial work in comparison. And at the senior levels, Xi keeps purging anyone he deems insufficiently loyal to him or who screw up in some way, all in the name of "corruption reform" which has two meanings: yes, the first deals with corruption and incompetence, but the second is all about unifying power behind Xi.
On the substance of your comment, I agree that we shouldn't mistake China's commitment to leadership in clean energy to be one driven by "caring about the planet". Xi cares about power and everything he does is coldly calculated to achieve objectives that enable that continuation.
Clean energy is essential to that objective.
Damn it MD, i have no trolling gear. I told you before i am a hook, worm and bobber kind of fisherman. If you want believe the horsechit the chi coms put forward then maybe you should look at their government the same way you looked at trump and disbelieved what he had to say. The Chi coms don't give a chit about saving the planet. That is why I recommended you to go over there and use your negotiating skills to change some hearts and minds over there. What is up? Your not feeling up to the challenge? IMO you would make a gorgeous lampshade.
And again you don't bother to even read what I write.
The only thing you care about is insulting others.
But at least read and comprehend what others say...otherwise you just look like another loudmouth idiot popping off wildly.
I will respond and be more mellow, heaven knows I don't want to upset your extremely sensitive nature. My reading comprehension is fine. i read and understood every single bit of horsechit you wrote. That is why I volunteered you to go over to China and meet with Xi so you can use you powers of persuasion to change his ways. Is it INSULTING to you that i want you to represent the USA and talk face to face with Xi? You are the person who believes what he says and looks the other way as to he actually does. I'm not insulting you, that would be bullying. I'm just calling you out on your own words. You trust the chicoms as to what they say publicly regarding CCBS. I must rephrase my doubts in a more respectful and non bullying manner... why do you trust what Xi says? You did not trust anything trump said. Why would you trust anything the leader of the Chicoms has to say? The only thing I can think of is that Xi is saying what you want to hear. Why you would believe anything Xi has to say about clean energy is beyond me. I guess you are just trusting soul at heart.
You call that "reading comprehension"???
Read the bolded...sound like I "trust" Xi ???
To the extent that you mean "trust" that I believe he will act in his self interest to preserve and unify power, sure. But "trust" their #'s ??
As long as he sees driving China to be the world leader in clean energy production and usage in his personal interest for unitary power, we can "trust" that ongoing approach. By "trust" I mean we can predict continued efforts.
But let's be clear, if he saw a different path as being better for his own unitary power, he'd take it in a heart beat.
And let's also be clear that he and Chinese bureaucracy and economists see this as a strategic opportunity to dominate another crucial industry of the future. It's not benign interest in 'saving the planet'.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
Posted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 11:49 am
by ardilla secreta
CU88 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 10:57 am
We all know that the cure is for Biden to go and throw paper towel rolls at Texans...
Biden should ship electric water kettles to Texas so they can boil their unsafe water.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
ggait wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:48 am
Lots of wind power in chilly places like Canada, Greenland, Scandinavia, Germany, Wyoming, South Dakota, North Dakota, Minnesota, Colorado etc.
Seems like this is a Texas biff. Not a wind power problem.
JFTR what makes those propellers spin when the wind is not blowing? I believe that would be those fossil fuel mother effing back up turbine engines. Wind power is awesome, when the wind actually blows. Is the lack of wind also something you fruit loops can try and blame on CC.
They don't spin when there's no wind. So you throw in solar, geothermal, nuclear, smart hydroelectric, other renewable options, add in a variety of energy storage methods, and have fossil fuels still available to use if we want/need.
People aren't advocating that we only use wind power.
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
A friend of mine put one in about 10 years ago. I visited him a couple of times during various phases of the project. It was fairly easy and he is pleased with the results. I had not really heard much about it for home a home system. I hadn’t considered it personally.
I first saw them do it on a project episode of This Old House. It is amazing and efficient technology. The biggest expense is where your house is located and how difficult it is to dig down to the depth needed. If you have a yard full of beautiful old maple trees like i do, the problem with tree roots make it almost impossible to do, unless you wanna cut down your trees.
You can keep your maple trees and have the geothermal if you really choose. They can run the lines vertical instead of horizontal. They use the same casings they would in drilling a water well. That is expensive and you would probably need more than one to get the total amount of piping needed. (I looked quickly into it and by quickly I mean $$$$$) In a horizontal placement they use a weblike design for piping. I helped a friend put his in and I forget how deep we dug the trench but if I remember correctly it was 4 feet wide. Something sticks in my head 6 feet deep by 4 feet wide but I may be wrong. His heating bill is ridiculously low.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
ggait wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:48 am
Lots of wind power in chilly places like Canada, Greenland, Scandinavia, Germany, Wyoming, South Dakota, North Dakota, Minnesota, Colorado etc.
Seems like this is a Texas biff. Not a wind power problem.
JFTR what makes those propellers spin when the wind is not blowing? I believe that would be those fossil fuel mother effing back up turbine engines. Wind power is awesome, when the wind actually blows. Is the lack of wind also something you fruit loops can try and blame on CC.
They don't spin when there's no wind. So you throw in solar, geothermal, nuclear, smart hydroelectric, other renewable options, add in a variety of energy storage methods, and have fossil fuels still available to use if we want/need.
People aren't advocating that we only use wind power.
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
A friend of mine put one in about 10 years ago. I visited him a couple of times during various phases of the project. It was fairly easy and he is pleased with the results. I had not really heard much about it for home a home system. I hadn’t considered it personally.
I first saw them do it on a project episode of This Old House. It is amazing and efficient technology. The biggest expense is where your house is located and how difficult it is to dig down to the depth needed. If you have a yard full of beautiful old maple trees like i do, the problem with tree roots make it almost impossible to do, unless you wanna cut down your trees.
You can keep your maple trees and have the geothermal if you really choose. They can run the lines vertical instead of horizontal. They use the same casings they would in drilling a water well. That is expensive and you would probably need more than one to get the total amount of piping needed. (I looked quickly into it and by quickly I mean $$$$$) In a horizontal placement they use a weblike design for piping. I helped a friend put his in and I forget how deep we dug the trench but if I remember correctly it was 4 feet wide. Something sticks in my head 6 feet deep by 4 feet wide but I may be wrong. His heating bill is ridiculously low.
I have a bigger problem in my back yard that extends beyond the roots of my maple trees. There is an underground aquifer that runs almost in the middle of my back yard. You dig 2 feet down and you hit water. The solutions to bypass that issue become very complicated and very expensive. They involve trying to reroute the aguifer in a different direction. That only scratches the surface of getting the permits to make that happen. Sometimes you just have to know when you are beaten.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
Posted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 1:54 pm
by holmes435
Heartbreaking: One Texas family had to travel 1700 miles to find heat, water and electricity
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
ggait wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:48 am
Lots of wind power in chilly places like Canada, Greenland, Scandinavia, Germany, Wyoming, South Dakota, North Dakota, Minnesota, Colorado etc.
Seems like this is a Texas biff. Not a wind power problem.
JFTR what makes those propellers spin when the wind is not blowing? I believe that would be those fossil fuel mother effing back up turbine engines. Wind power is awesome, when the wind actually blows. Is the lack of wind also something you fruit loops can try and blame on CC.
They don't spin when there's no wind. So you throw in solar, geothermal, nuclear, smart hydroelectric, other renewable options, add in a variety of energy storage methods, and have fossil fuels still available to use if we want/need.
People aren't advocating that we only use wind power.
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
A friend of mine put one in about 10 years ago. I visited him a couple of times during various phases of the project. It was fairly easy and he is pleased with the results. I had not really heard much about it for home a home system. I hadn’t considered it personally.
I first saw them do it on a project episode of This Old House. It is amazing and efficient technology. The biggest expense is where your house is located and how difficult it is to dig down to the depth needed. If you have a yard full of beautiful old maple trees like i do, the problem with tree roots make it almost impossible to do, unless you wanna cut down your trees.
You can keep your maple trees and have the geothermal if you really choose. They can run the lines vertical instead of horizontal. They use the same casings they would in drilling a water well. That is expensive and you would probably need more than one to get the total amount of piping needed. (I looked quickly into it and by quickly I mean $$$$$) In a horizontal placement they use a weblike design for piping. I helped a friend put his in and I forget how deep we dug the trench but if I remember correctly it was 4 feet wide. Something sticks in my head 6 feet deep by 4 feet wide but I may be wrong. His heating bill is ridiculously low.
I have a bigger problem in my back yard that extends beyond the roots of my maple trees. There is an underground aquifer that runs almost in the middle of my back yard. You dig 2 feet down and you hit water. The solutions to bypass that issue become very complicated and very expensive. They involve trying to reroute the aguifer in a different direction. That only scratches the surface of getting the permits to make that happen. Sometimes you just have to know when you are beaten.
You are sitting on a gold mine. two options....drill a well well to heat and cool the home...then send the return water back into the aquifer. Or don't tell anyone, and pull the aquifer water out, use it for HVAC, then send it right back. shhhh...i won't tell anyone.
Re: Climate Change & The Environment: A Green New Deal
Posted: Thu Feb 18, 2021 1:58 pm
by youthathletics
holmes435 wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 1:54 pm
Heartbreaking: One Texas family had to travel 1700 miles to find heat, water and electricity
ggait wrote: ↑Thu Feb 18, 2021 12:48 am
Lots of wind power in chilly places like Canada, Greenland, Scandinavia, Germany, Wyoming, South Dakota, North Dakota, Minnesota, Colorado etc.
Seems like this is a Texas biff. Not a wind power problem.
JFTR what makes those propellers spin when the wind is not blowing? I believe that would be those fossil fuel mother effing back up turbine engines. Wind power is awesome, when the wind actually blows. Is the lack of wind also something you fruit loops can try and blame on CC.
They don't spin when there's no wind. So you throw in solar, geothermal, nuclear, smart hydroelectric, other renewable options, add in a variety of energy storage methods, and have fossil fuels still available to use if we want/need.
People aren't advocating that we only use wind power.
You are a man after my own heart. Nuclear and geothermal are awesome additions to the clean energy conversation. Three years ago we bought a new furnace and central air unit for our house. I talked with our HVAC guy about putting in a geothermal system. If i was as rich as most of you folks on this forum i would have done so. The estimate, with no possible rebates from the state included was around 30 thousand dollars. The compromise is we spent about 5 thousand for a new furnace and AC unit. With pencil and paper it would have taken us about 30 years to the point where the geothermal system would have paid off. I also this fall had an estimate from the folks at a very reputable company that makes their own composite replacement windows. i want to put a new window in the bathroom to replace the window we have had issues with. That window is 12 years old and cost about 250 dollars when we purchased the whole lot of new windows. The estimate for one window 32" x 36" was almost 2400 dollars. After I picked myself up off the floor and thanked the man for his time i remembered something our guy told me when we purchased the original windows. He told us you can buy the best window out there. When you put that window in a 60 year old house you simply can't get the ROI to justify spending twice as much per window. It just will not work. If you are building a brand new house, and money is not the object, put in a geothermal system and install those state of the art composite windows and do the spray foam insulation in all of your walls. That makes perfect sense, if your rich like the folks who post on here. If your not, then sadly life is a compromise when you live in the real world. I ordered the new window for my bathroom that I will install myself. 286 dollars with a 10 year warranty. I hope I am not endangering the planet by living within my means. Unless any one out there wants to pony up 2 grand so i can buy the green energy saving composite window.
A friend of mine put one in about 10 years ago. I visited him a couple of times during various phases of the project. It was fairly easy and he is pleased with the results. I had not really heard much about it for home a home system. I hadn’t considered it personally.
I first saw them do it on a project episode of This Old House. It is amazing and efficient technology. The biggest expense is where your house is located and how difficult it is to dig down to the depth needed. If you have a yard full of beautiful old maple trees like i do, the problem with tree roots make it almost impossible to do, unless you wanna cut down your trees.
You can keep your maple trees and have the geothermal if you really choose. They can run the lines vertical instead of horizontal. They use the same casings they would in drilling a water well. That is expensive and you would probably need more than one to get the total amount of piping needed. (I looked quickly into it and by quickly I mean $$$$$) In a horizontal placement they use a weblike design for piping. I helped a friend put his in and I forget how deep we dug the trench but if I remember correctly it was 4 feet wide. Something sticks in my head 6 feet deep by 4 feet wide but I may be wrong. His heating bill is ridiculously low.
I have a bigger problem in my back yard that extends beyond the roots of my maple trees. There is an underground aquifer that runs almost in the middle of my back yard. You dig 2 feet down and you hit water. The solutions to bypass that issue become very complicated and very expensive. They involve trying to reroute the aguifer in a different direction. That only scratches the surface of getting the permits to make that happen. Sometimes you just have to know when you are beaten.
You are sitting on a gold mine. two options....drill a well well to heat and cool the home...then send the return water back into the aquifer. Or don't tell anyone, and pull the aquifer water out, use it for HVAC, then send it right back. shhhh...i won't tell anyone.
