old salt wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:15 pm
That knot was a way to create a pull loop at the proper height without the excess rope tail being in the way.
"A way"?
Not the way a normal human being would do it, which would be to measure and cut the rope to proper length first, or cut off the excess length after the loop had been fashioned, or wind any excess in any manner other than in a noose, which any person on the planet knows is a racist trope.
Yea...b/c tying a noose is always a racist thing.
Unless you want to use it yourself to commit suicide, what's the purpose other than some form of intimidation? I agree that it needn't be racist in 100% of instances, but it sure as heck isn't benign.
I've not been following this story closely enough...I understand that the rope was there earlier, with some sort of pull knot...but do they have proof that the knot was exactly the same last fall as the one we see now in pictures? Do they have a picture of it proving that to be the case? If so, we should wonder whether someone else was being intimidated. If it's not the exact same knot, then we're back to who re-did it and why.
This is so silly. The knot in the Oct 19 pic is a noose. It's in this thread. Find it & see for yourself.
A noose is a functional knot used for things other than hanging people.
Those are transient garages used by rotating teams which change every race. The teams don't own the garage. It's not their property to cut & shorten the rope. The race crews fashion a loop to fit their needs. Look at the video in this thread showing multiple garages, multiple loops at multiple heights. Nooses were also used to suspend ham hocks being cured in a smoke house. I leave it to TLD to find a race baiting video for that.
You are the guy that mentioned you are witnessing this
old salt wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:15 pm
That knot was a way to create a pull loop at the proper height without the excess rope tail being in the way.
"A way"?
Not the way a normal human being would do it, which would be to measure and cut the rope to proper length first, or cut off the excess length after the loop had been fashioned, or wind any excess in any manner other than in a noose, which any person on the planet knows is a racist trope.
Yea...b/c tying a noose is always a racist thing.
Unless you want to use it yourself to commit suicide, what's the purpose other than some form of intimidation? I agree that it needn't be racist in 100% of instances, but it sure as heck isn't benign.
I've not been following this story closely enough...I understand that the rope was there earlier, with some sort of pull knot...but do they have proof that the knot was exactly the same last fall as the one we see now in pictures? Do they have a picture of it proving that to be the case? If so, we should wonder whether someone else was being intimidated. If it's not the exact same knot, then we're back to who re-did it and why.
This is so silly. The knot in the Oct 19 pic is a noose. It's in this thread. Find it & see for yourself.
A noose is a functional knot used for things other than hanging people.
Those are transient garages used by rotating teams which change every race. The teams don't own the garage. It's not their property to cut & shorten the rope. The race crews fashion a loop to fit their needs. Look at the video in this thread showing multiple garages, multiple loops at multiple heights. Nooses were also used to suspend ham hocks being cured in a smoke house. I leave it to TLD to find a race baiting video for that.
You are the guy that mentioned you are witnessing this
old salt wrote: ↑Thu Jun 25, 2020 5:15 pm
That knot was a way to create a pull loop at the proper height without the excess rope tail being in the way.
"A way"?
Not the way a normal human being would do it, which would be to measure and cut the rope to proper length first, or cut off the excess length after the loop had been fashioned, or wind any excess in any manner other than in a noose, which any person on the planet knows is a racist trope.
Yea...b/c tying a noose is always a racist thing.
Unless you want to use it yourself to commit suicide, what's the purpose other than some form of intimidation? I agree that it needn't be racist in 100% of instances, but it sure as heck isn't benign.
I've not been following this story closely enough...I understand that the rope was there earlier, with some sort of pull knot...but do they have proof that the knot was exactly the same last fall as the one we see now in pictures? Do they have a picture of it proving that to be the case? If so, we should wonder whether someone else was being intimidated. If it's not the exact same knot, then we're back to who re-did it and why.
This is so silly. The knot in the Oct 19 pic is a noose. It's in this thread. Find it & see for yourself.
A noose is a functional knot used for things other than hanging people.
Those are transient garages used by rotating teams which change every race. The teams don't own the garage. It's not their property to cut & shorten the rope. The race crews fashion a loop to fit their needs. Look at the video in this thread showing multiple garages, multiple loops at multiple heights.
Haven't seen any pics from the fall, just the current one which is definitely a noose, not a slip knot or a loop, a bowline, whatever. Very different purpose.
You'd have never used a noose in any naval activities would you, Salty?
It's a very specific purpose knot, I've never seen one tied for any other purpose than in a hanging situation.
Apparently no else has at NASCAR either, no surprise there.
As I said, if there are pics proving the exact same knot was in place back last fall, then great it had nothing to do with Bubba...do wonder what/who it was intended for back then, but Watson wouldn't have been the target.
That's why I asked.
It was in the link in my first post, in the TMZ article. It's been in several articles & posts, above the Menards team race car in the garage door.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:20 pm
by DMac
Woody Guthrie sings of the hangman using thirteen coils:
Did you ever see a hangman tie a hangknot?
I've seen it many a time and he winds, he winds,
After thirteen times he's got a hangknot.
That's not a hangknot in the picture.
Think it's got eight coils.
How many garage door pulls have you seen that look like this? A simple loop would have accomplished the purpose of raising the door - that's what 99% of the people in this country would have done to deal with the problem
IMHO they were correct to call the authorities - at that time they had no way of knowing how long it had been there and whether it was directed at them or not.
Why didn't NASCAR call the FBI in Oct 19 when that "noose" was hanging over the Menard team's car ?
Was that the only garage with a knot like that on the garage door pull rope ?
That knot was a way to create a pull loop at the proper height without the excess rope tail being in the way.
Consult a Boy Scout or Bosun's Mate about how to tie a knot for the task at hand.
Would not have expected anything less from you Old Friend. How is the race war progressing today?
It's becoming increasingly laughable, thanks to the race baiters clinging to stories like this.
Salty, that's a current picture of the knot, not from October; it's a noose whether that was its intent or not...was there another picture showing the same knot back in October?
Re: Racism in America- Week 4 of Unrest
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:33 pm
by old salt
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:25 pm
Salty, that's a current picture of the knot, not from October; it's a noose whether that was its intent or not...was there another picture showing the same knot back in October?
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:42 pm
by ggait
njbill wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:34 pm
Piece of trivia.
Do you know why Smith had a glove on his right hand and Carlos on his left? Because they only had one pair of gloves. I imagine Smith got the right hand glove because he won the gold.
Not quite.
John Carlos just flat out forgot to bring his pair of gloves, leaving them in the Olympic Village.
It was Peter Norman (second place finisher from Australia) who then suggested Carlos wear Smith's left-handed glove. For this reason, Carlos raised his left hand as opposed to his right, differing from the traditional Black Power salute. So that iconic photo is actually a partial biff.
All three athletes wore Olympic Project for Human Rights (OPHR) badges after Norman, a critic of Australia's former White Australia Policy, expressed empathy with their ideals.
An undertold story.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
njbill wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:34 pm
Piece of trivia.
Do you know why Smith had a glove on his right hand and Carlos on his left? Because they only had one pair of gloves. I imagine Smith got the right hand glove because he won the gold.
Not quite.
John Carlos just flat out forgot to bring his pair of gloves, leaving them in the Olympic Village.
It was Peter Norman (second place finisher from Australia) who then suggested Carlos wear Smith's left-handed glove. For this reason, Carlos raised his left hand as opposed to his right, differing from the traditional Black Power salute. So that iconic photo is actually a partial biff.
All three athletes wore Olympic Project for Human Rights (OPHR) badges after Norman, a critic of Australia's former White Australia Policy, expressed empathy with their ideals.
An undertold story.
Thanks. I spoke with my friend today. He said his dad ran against Tommie in HS and college. He said Tommie’s sub 50 440 time in combat boots was faster than his personal best. He also said despite Usain Bolt’s time, we wasn’t as fast as Smith. He said Smiths uniform was catching air, the shoes were bad and the running surface was not as good! I love the 400. My high school teammate ran at Tennessee and Texas. He was a sub 45 second guy. His wife was an a great Olympic Gold medalist. There kid wasn’t that fast...shoulder
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:59 pm
by youthathletics
Time out for a for the Friday Evening Truce, and something we can all appreciate:
njbill wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:34 pm
Piece of trivia.
Do you know why Smith had a glove on his right hand and Carlos on his left? Because they only had one pair of gloves. I imagine Smith got the right hand glove because he won the gold.
Not quite.
John Carlos just flat out forgot to bring his pair of gloves, leaving them in the Olympic Village.
It was Peter Norman (second place finisher from Australia) who then suggested Carlos wear Smith's left-handed glove. For this reason, Carlos raised his left hand as opposed to his right, differing from the traditional Black Power salute. So that iconic photo is actually a partial biff.
All three athletes wore Olympic Project for Human Rights (OPHR) badges after Norman, a critic of Australia's former White Australia Policy, expressed empathy with their ideals.
An undertold story.
Not sure how your account differs from mine, except to add a couple of details (not inconsistent with what I said). I have never heard the "it was Norman's idea" version, which I presume you got from wiki. I note the source to that entry was published 40 years after the event.
As you might imagine, this was huge news at the time. I remember watching live, or at least the first time it was televised in the States, as events back then often were on tape delay. The story that came out back then was that Smith and Carlos told Norman what they were planning on doing before they got to the podium. They did this out of courtesy to a fellow runner. Norman was sympathetic to their protest, which took a lot of courage at the time and for which he received a lot of abuse. Smith and Carlos were pallbearers at Norman's funeral which was in Australia.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 7:17 pm
by njbill
Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:56 pm
He also said despite Usain Bolt’s time, we wasn’t as fast as Smith.
Unlike in most other sports, it is tough to debate the stop watch. Smith was a tremendous runner in his day and his record stood for almost ten years. He was later surpassed by Michael Johnson who, himself, was surpassed by Bolt.
How would Smith have done using modern training and nutrition regimens? We'll never know, but that's a pretty decent gap he'd have to make up (19.83 vs. 19.19). And Tommie's 19.83, BTW, was at altitude in Mexico City. Not sure how much that helps, but some.
I love the old-timers as much as the next old guy. (Don't ever try to tell me Michael Jordan was better than Wilt.) But in track and swimming, the stop watch don't lie.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 5:56 pm
He also said despite Usain Bolt’s time, we wasn’t as fast as Smith.
Unlike in most other sports, it is tough to debate the stop watch. Smith was a tremendous runner in his day and his record stood for almost ten years. He was later surpassed by Michael Johnson who, himself, was surpassed by Bolt.
How would Smith have done using modern training and nutrition regimens? We'll never know, but that's a pretty decent gap he'd have to make up (19.83 vs. 19.19). And Tommie's 19.83, BTW, was at altitude in Mexico City. Not sure how much that helps, but some.
I love the old-timers as much as the next old guy. (Don't ever try to tell me Michael Jordan was better than Wilt.) But in track and swimming, the stop watch don't lie.
I know what you mean. His father loves Tommie Smith that much.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
njbill wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:34 pm
Piece of trivia.
Do you know why Smith had a glove on his right hand and Carlos on his left? Because they only had one pair of gloves. I imagine Smith got the right hand glove because he won the gold.
Not quite.
John Carlos just flat out forgot to bring his pair of gloves, leaving them in the Olympic Village.
It was Peter Norman (second place finisher from Australia) who then suggested Carlos wear Smith's left-handed glove. For this reason, Carlos raised his left hand as opposed to his right, differing from the traditional Black Power salute. So that iconic photo is actually a partial biff.
All three athletes wore Olympic Project for Human Rights (OPHR) badges after Norman, a critic of Australia's former White Australia Policy, expressed empathy with their ideals.
An undertold story.
Not sure how your account differs from mine, except to add a couple of details (not inconsistent with what I said). I have never heard the "it was Norman's idea" version, which I presume you got from wiki. I note the source to that entry was published 40 years after the event.
As you might imagine, this was huge news at the time. I remember watching live, or at least the first time it was televised in the States, as events back then often were on tape delay. The story that came out back then was that Smith and Carlos told Norman what they were planning on doing before they got to the podium. They did this out of courtesy to a fellow runner. Norman was sympathetic to their protest, which took a lot of courage at the time and for which he received a lot of abuse. Smith and Carlos were pallbearers at Norman's funeral which was in Australia.
a number of supposedly credible outlets have reported on norman's suggestion.
maybe where "wiki" picked it up originally.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:26 pm
by njbill
wgdsr wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 7:45 pm
a number of supposedly credible outlets have reported on norman's suggestion.
maybe where "wiki" picked it up originally.
Maybe it is true. wiki cites a source from 2008, 40 years after the event. That was two years after Norman's death. Maybe that's when the account surfaced.
I commented because I've just never heard that version. And I have followed that story since 1968.
You have to be careful of wiki. It is largely a self-policing site. The entry for a good friend of mine says he was born 1959/60. He wasn't. He was born in 1953, like me. He and I graduated from college the same year. Earlier versions of his wiki page incorrectly listed his place of birth.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:18 pm
I remember playing hangman in school to kill time when we were bored. Is hangman going the way of dodgeball? Too filled with anger to be played in any school at any time. If you get caught we will take your #2 pencils away from you and make you go to ballroom dancing classes.
Leave one Anonymously in a black co-workers workspace and let us know how that works out.
cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:18 pm
I remember playing hangman in school to kill time when we were bored. Is hangman going the way of dodgeball? Too filled with anger to be played in any school at any time. If you get caught we will take your #2 pencils away from you and make you go to ballroom dancing classes.
Leave one Anonymously in a black co-workers workspace and let us know how that works out.
guess YOU'RE the guy that is happy Amherst lacrosse is gone......
Amherst dropped lacrosse? Drive through Mattapan with a noose hanging out your window and then stop at Flames for Jerk. Tell them that it is a fishing knot.
PS as for Amherst, I have no feeling one way or the other. A buddy’s kid played there. He didn’t like it so he went to Bucknell and gave up the sport.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 3:18 pm
I remember playing hangman in school to kill time when we were bored. Is hangman going the way of dodgeball? Too filled with anger to be played in any school at any time. If you get caught we will take your #2 pencils away from you and make you go to ballroom dancing classes.
Leave one Anonymously in a black co-workers workspace and let us know how that works out.
guess YOU'RE the guy that is happy Amherst lacrosse is gone......
Amherst dropped lacrosse? Drive through Mattapan with a noose hanging out your window and then stop at Flames for Jerk. Tell them that it is a fishing knot.
PS as for Amherst, I have no feeling one way or the other. A buddy’s kid played there. He didn’t like it so he went to Bucknell and gave up the sport.
Do you even read these threads? Seriously, do you
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
njbill wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:34 pm
Piece of trivia.
Do you know why Smith had a glove on his right hand and Carlos on his left? Because they only had one pair of gloves. I imagine Smith got the right hand glove because he won the gold.
Not quite.
John Carlos just flat out forgot to bring his pair of gloves, leaving them in the Olympic Village.
It was Peter Norman (second place finisher from Australia) who then suggested Carlos wear Smith's left-handed glove. For this reason, Carlos raised his left hand as opposed to his right, differing from the traditional Black Power salute. So that iconic photo is actually a partial biff.
All three athletes wore Olympic Project for Human Rights (OPHR) badges after Norman, a critic of Australia's former White Australia Policy, expressed empathy with their ideals.
An undertold story.
Thanks. I spoke with my friend today. He said his dad ran against Tommie in HS and college. He said Tommie’s sub 50 440 time in combat boots was faster than his personal best. He also said despite Usain Bolt’s time, we wasn’t as fast as Smith. He said Smiths uniform was catching air, the shoes were bad and the running surface was not as good! I love the 400. My high school teammate ran at Tennessee and Texas. He was a sub 45 second guy. His wife was an a great Olympic Gold medalist. There kid wasn’t that fast...shoulder
I ran a 48 second session, wearing a pair of Renaldo Nehemia's spikes in Byrd stadium. Came in third. sounds sexy, but when you see the elites yards and yards ahead, visually, you realize just how "slow" you are.
Re: Race in America - Riots Explode in Minneapolis
njbill wrote: ↑Fri Jun 26, 2020 12:34 pm
Piece of trivia.
Do you know why Smith had a glove on his right hand and Carlos on his left? Because they only had one pair of gloves. I imagine Smith got the right hand glove because he won the gold.
Not quite.
John Carlos just flat out forgot to bring his pair of gloves, leaving them in the Olympic Village.
It was Peter Norman (second place finisher from Australia) who then suggested Carlos wear Smith's left-handed glove. For this reason, Carlos raised his left hand as opposed to his right, differing from the traditional Black Power salute. So that iconic photo is actually a partial biff.
All three athletes wore Olympic Project for Human Rights (OPHR) badges after Norman, a critic of Australia's former White Australia Policy, expressed empathy with their ideals.
An undertold story.
Thanks. I spoke with my friend today. He said his dad ran against Tommie in HS and college. He said Tommie’s sub 50 440 time in combat boots was faster than his personal best. He also said despite Usain Bolt’s time, we wasn’t as fast as Smith. He said Smiths uniform was catching air, the shoes were bad and the running surface was not as good! I love the 400. My high school teammate ran at Tennessee and Texas. He was a sub 45 second guy. His wife was an a great Olympic Gold medalist. There kid wasn’t that fast...shoulder
I ran a 48 second session, wearing a pair of Renaldo Nehemia's spikes in Byrd stadium. Came in third. sounds sexy, but when you see the elites yards and yards ahead, visually, you realize just how "slow" you are.
.
