Who is supporting the immigrant caravan?

[Brooklyn]

the caravan moves on ...










no luggage, no bottled water, no food ~ a 2,000 mile trek with no provisions of any kind - whoever had this planned sure did a good job of coordinating all these people and setting up way stations for them across several borders

and how nice of those providers to do so just before the election

[old salt]

11:20 AM 1/11/18

Lead caravan made it to Juchitan de Zaragoza yesterday. The leaders of the caravan have been petitioning the Mexican government for buses to carry them the rest of the way. Caravan leaders now say the government has made it clear that will not happen. The caravan is now very demoralized. Large numbers of caravan members are talking about turning around and going home or taking the government up on their offer of refuge. Nonetheless, the caravan started out this morning moving on to Jalapa del Marques, some 30 miles away.

Fox News is reporting: "The leading caravan is still about 900 miles from the closest entry point into the U.S. – but their intended route remains a mystery. However, choosing Jalapa del Marques as the next stop appeared to indicate they are opting to travel via Oaxaca state's eponymous capital instead of turning north toward the Gulf coast state of Veracruz, which is a common transit route toward McAllen, Texas."

The caravan can still turn towards the Gulf once they make it to Oaxaca. This however leaves options open for moving towards McAllen, or the longer trek to San Diego. This choice of route seems a strange choice as the route passes through desert or semi-desert the last 50 miles to Oaxaca and then more desert / semi-desert leaving Oaxaca traveling north.

If they choose east, they can ride the Beast to the TX border in less than a week.
It'll be interesting to see if the Mexican authorities try to keep them off the freight trains.
Those who can afford it can buy passage on a smuggler's bus or other vehicle.
Trump may use the military to erect the tent city refugee centers, regardless of what these caravans do, to detain future asylum seekers until adjudicated, whether they arrive individually or in a caravan, to deter economic migrants from exploiting the catch & release loophole.

[youthathletics]

Depending on your news source, there are Americans who actually believe we are going to be under "attack" from this "hoard"....what happens when some kook decides to help with the War Against Brown from his front porch, Trump going to cover his legal fees or give him a pardon.

Remember, some people think chocolate milk comes from brown cows.

[jhu72]

Depending on your news source, there are Americans who actually believe we are going to be under "attack" from this "hoard"....what happens when some kook decides to help with the War Against Brown from his front porch, Trump going to cover his legal fees or give him a pardon.

Remember, some people think chocolate milk comes from brown cows.

The various militia groups are already heading for the border.

[Trinity]

The can help build Camp Ivanka.

[jhu72]

11:20 AM 1/11/18

Lead caravan made it to Juchitan de Zaragoza yesterday. The leaders of the caravan have been petitioning the Mexican government for buses to carry them the rest of the way. Caravan leaders now say the government has made it clear that will not happen. The caravan is now very demoralized. Large numbers of caravan members are talking about turning around and going home or taking the government up on their offer of refuge. Nonetheless, the caravan started out this morning moving on to Jalapa del Marques, some 30 miles away.

Fox News is reporting: "The leading caravan is still about 900 miles from the closest entry point into the U.S. – but their intended route remains a mystery. However, choosing Jalapa del Marques as the next stop appeared to indicate they are opting to travel via Oaxaca state's eponymous capital instead of turning north toward the Gulf coast state of Veracruz, which is a common transit route toward McAllen, Texas."

The caravan can still turn towards the Gulf once they make it to Oaxaca. This however leaves options open for moving towards McAllen, or the longer trek to San Diego. This choice of route seems a strange choice as the route passes through desert or semi-desert the last 50 miles to Oaxaca and then more desert / semi-desert leaving Oaxaca traveling north.

If they choose east, they can ride the Beast to the TX border in less than a week.
It'll be interesting to see if the Mexican authorities try to keep them off the freight trains.
Those who can afford it can buy passage on a smuggler's bus or other vehicle.
Trump may use the military to erect the tent city refugee centers, regardless of what these caravans do, to detain future asylum seekers until adjudicated, whether they arrive individually or in a caravan, to deter economic migrants from exploiting the catch & release loophole.

From my understanding (map I have seen) "The Beast" route does not pass through Oaxaca. It runs on the east side of the central mountains (Oaxaca is on the west). Their chance to pick it up should have had them turning nearly due north and moving to Ixtepec only 8 miles of so from Juchitan (where they stayed last night), which is the last Beast station west of the mountains. Perhaps they are trying to fake everyone out, and lied about today's intended destination. Then again, there are an awful lot of women and children in the caravan.

[jhu72]

8:30 PM 1/1/18

AP is reporting (Fox and ABC picked it up) as of about 2 hours ago, the caravan was traveling to Matias Romero, turning north and traveling over the central mountains, rather that heading towards Oaxca. This makes more sense if they are trying to avoid the more arid climate and has them traveling over the same mountain pass as the Beast. AP is playing up the exhaustion and demoralized state of the caravan. They are expecting a large portion of the caravan to turn around and go home. The government is providing free bus rides home.

US Today is reporting pretty much the same thing from a different reporter.

[old salt]

Oct 30 @ Juchitan de Zaragoza, Oaxaca
Informative policy discussion starting at 09:32.

Interesting factoids :
@ 13:15 : survey of Honduran migrants = only 11.3% are escaping specific threats of violence ; the remainder are seeking better economic conditions & more safety/less general disorder. (...doing the math, apparently 87.7% haven't been coached up yet on how to articulate a claim of credible fear}
@ 13:55 : Mexican govt study = the Honduran murder capital, San Pedro de Sula = 26th most deadly city in the Americas.
St Louis = #13, Baltimore = #21

https://www.businessinsider.com/most-vi ... sidents-49
Several more deadly cities in Mexico, Brazil, USA, Venezuela, & Colombia, than in Central America.

[jhu72]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/army- ... spartandhp

[old salt]

To get a link to work, it needs to be on a line of it's own, with no [ ]'s on either end.
That's why a link doesn't work in a quote, unless it's dropped down a line.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/army- ... spartandhp

Here's the complete link which uses msn to get you around the WP paywall
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/army- ... ar-BBPhoPf
Stupid Newsweek math. The Army isn't positioning soldiers on the border. They'll deploy from FOB's to do CBP support missions.

[Trinity]

And deploy stroller scouts south of the border?

[Typical Lax Dad]

And deploy stroller scouts south of the border?

[youthathletics]

That is bad@$$

[Trinity]

Admiral John Kirby says it’s hard to see how Operation Faithful Patriot is not a campaign stunt. And he’s being nice. Leaked Pentagon docs show no reason for the mission.

[holmes435]

Operation Faithful Patriot

For everyone, Just re-read that a few times and let that name sink in.

We're used to jingoistic names for operations and laws, but this is stupefying.

[Trinity]

SNL reports the caravan includes the Menendez Brothers and the 1990 Detroit Pistons.

[cradleandshoot]

Admiral John Kirby says it’s hard to see how Operation Faithful Patriot is not a campaign stunt. And he’s being nice. Leaked Pentagon docs show no reason for the mission.

I agree that I see no reason for the mission either. My only comment is that I would not want to be the person/persons at the Pentagon leaking such information. There probably is no military operation ever that before being put into operation does not have its detractors. Rule # 1 for any military person... You follow freaking orders. If it is a lawful order you do your job. IMO the vast majority of soldiers don't agree with or understand what their mission is. From what it looks like to me they are spreading miles and miles of concertina wire and then will build tent cities where the people that get across will be held until someone figures out what to do with them. IMO that is not a job for our military. That is the mission they have been given. Huge overkill and sending the wrong people to do the wrong job. This is a border patrol and law enforcement mission. I don't see how it is a job for the US Army. If the politicians had done their job as they should have a long time ago, it would not have come down to this. I don't agree with what Trump is doing but he is doing exactly what he said he would do. Knowing Trump as we do, why does that surprise anyone?

[old salt]

Should have named it Operation Impenetrable Nationalist.

The migrants are noticing. If it helps cause these caravans to fizzle out & deter others, it's worth it.
The images are aimed at the migrants as much as they are at Trump's base.

Otherwise, the concertina wire, vehicle barriers, refugee tent cities, & air mobile MP's teamed with CBP will help reduce incursions & drug smuggling, while signalling that Trump's doing everything in his power to block illegal entries, which will be further deterrence.
Army troops manning HQ consoles frees up CBP agents for the field & border check points.
Mattis doesn't do stunts.

A barrier & border security are working in Hungary.

[Trinity]

Ya got your basic unregulated militia on the way in case the job is too big.
Some of the Texas Minutemen are decorated veterans of Jade Helm.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/na ... story.html

[MDlaxfan76]

Should have named it Operation Impenetrable Nationalist.

The migrants are noticing. If it helps cause these caravans to fizzle out & deter others, it's worth it.
The images are aimed at the migrants as much as they are at Trump's base.

Otherwise, the concertina wire, vehicle barriers, refugee tent cities, & air mobile MP's teamed with CBP will help reduce incursions & drug smuggling, while signalling that Trump's doing everything in his power to block illegal entries, which will be further deterrence.
Army troops manning HQ consoles frees up CBP agents for the field & border check points.
Mattis doesn't do stunts.

A barrier & border security are working in Hungary.

"The migrants are noticing"...sure, they got TV's and cell phone data connections?
But yeah, I bet Trump's threat to shoot anyone who picks up a rock did get spread through the caravan.
"worth it"??

"Mattis doesn't do stunts"...yup, he reportedly strenuously objected, but is following orders. Those who are criticizing are all agreeing that, while stupid, costly overkill with no actual military mission, the orders, so far, are lawful. (The shooting of unarmed people would not be...Mattis I believe would refuse that order. But some meathead might hear Trump and believe that he has license to do so anyway.)

youth, good to see that you and I agree on this one.
I also agree that it is no surprise that Trump's doing this, unnecessary or not.
He's got 2 days left to ratchet the fear up another notch.