NCAC 2024

[Prepschoolkid]

@TopperLax82 can you please tell me where you are getting your info from? If this is true really interested to see who they are bringing in....

Hopefully not another coach from the international ranks

[TopperLax82]

@TopperLax82 can you please tell me where you are getting your info from? If this is true really interested to see who they are bringing in....

Hopefully not another coach from the international ranks

I'm told the hire is TJ Toivonen, the Transy DCOORD.

[Quill]

Big Red put up 22 against Transy D. Looks like 17 of those were unassisted. Is this the change BR seeks?

[laxrules]

Koch will put together a strong staff. He had a unique staff this year, but the change will be good for Denison. Doesn’t matter what the score was vs tranny or whatever, the new coach will come into a spot that is funded well and cares about lacrosse.

[Prepschoolkid]

If this is true it is really sad to see that Koch struggles to get high level coaches to support him. I bet TJ Toivonen is a great guy and probably a good coach but it makes absolutely zero sense to go out and hire the D coordinator of a team you hung 22 goals on the season before. It would be like RIT hiring one of the bartletts after they absolutely pumped Denison this year. I am starting to get vibe that Koch thinks he can win by himself and doesnt need a support staff. Hope I am wrong

[twohandsonestick]

If this is true it is really sad to see that Koch struggles to get high level coaches to support him. I bet TJ Toivonen is a great guy and probably a good coach but it makes absolutely zero sense to go out and hire the D coordinator of a team you hung 22 goals on the season before. It would be like RIT hiring one of the bartletts after they absolutely pumped Denison this year. I am starting to get vibe that Koch thinks he can win by himself and doesnt need a support staff. Hope I am wrong

Happy to chime in here as I’ve seen a lot of discussion about Denison’s new hires. Assuming these rumors are true, there’s a few points I’d like to make. First, it’s obviously hard to hire a young assistant coach to move to Granville, or honestly any D3 college town given most are located in rural, desolate towns. Ideally the guys Koch is bringing in are young, hungry coaches who are committed to building the program for the future years. That said, I tend to agree with PrepSchoolKid that a young ~26 year old coach who grew up in Kentucky (not a hotbed), attended a very below average lacrosse program and now has ~2 years of experience at this said school would be the coach of choice to help lead a nationally recognized program. Just look at Denison’s history and their most successful years – Zimmerman was a 4yr starter and captain at UNC who also came from Gilman arguably one the nations hottest HS for lacrosse. Zalesky was an AA at Seton Hill and played several years in the MLL and was an offensive maestro.

To play devils advocate here, Caravana had the chops and resume to recruit these assistants to Granville knowing they’d have 3-4 yrs of experience to propel them to say head coaching roles or D1 assistant roles. Koch is new to the head coaching game and it takes time to develop the respect to do the same as what Caravana did. While I don’t expect Koch to bring in an assistant with the resume of a Zimmerman, I think its fair to expect an assistant OC/DC to be hired such as one from a D3/D2 equivalent, recent standout grad from top D1 school looking to begin his coaching career, rising star head coach from a lower level echelon D3 program or even at the minimum a tenured/well-respected Ohio HS coach from the Columbus area.

Hoping the Denison fans have an announcement soon.

[Quill]

TJ has Denison DC on his IG account. Self reported, for sure, but no reason to doubt it.

And, looks like Sal Iaria is headed to Bates:

https://gobatesbobcats.com/news/2024/7/ ... staff.aspx

Any other OC contenders?

[SKUD]

I have a Dennison question. They have a remarkable winning tradition. But when were they last good outside of the Midwest other than 1 win vs Lynchburg in 2016? They have a solid history of making the NCAA tournament.

[TopperLax82]

If this is true it is really sad to see that Koch struggles to get high level coaches to support him. I bet TJ Toivonen is a great guy and probably a good coach but it makes absolutely zero sense to go out and hire the D coordinator of a team you hung 22 goals on the season before. It would be like RIT hiring one of the bartletts after they absolutely pumped Denison this year. I am starting to get vibe that Koch thinks he can win by himself and doesnt need a support staff. Hope I am wrong

Happy to chime in here as I’ve seen a lot of discussion about Denison’s new hires. Assuming these rumors are true, there’s a few points I’d like to make. First, it’s obviously hard to hire a young assistant coach to move to Granville, or honestly any D3 college town given most are located in rural, desolate towns. Ideally the guys Koch is bringing in are young, hungry coaches who are committed to building the program for the future years. That said, I tend to agree with PrepSchoolKid that a young ~26 year old coach who grew up in Kentucky (not a hotbed), attended a very below average lacrosse program and now has ~2 years of experience at this said school would be the coach of choice to help lead a nationally recognized program. Just look at Denison’s history and their most successful years – Zimmerman was a 4yr starter and captain at UNC who also came from Gilman arguably one the nations hottest HS for lacrosse. Zalesky was an AA at Seton Hill and played several years in the MLL and was an offensive maestro.

To play devils advocate here, Caravana had the chops and resume to recruit these assistants to Granville knowing they’d have 3-4 yrs of experience to propel them to say head coaching roles or D1 assistant roles. Koch is new to the head coaching game and it takes time to develop the respect to do the same as what Caravana did. While I don’t expect Koch to bring in an assistant with the resume of a Zimmerman, I think its fair to expect an assistant OC/DC to be hired such as one from a D3/D2 equivalent, recent standout grad from top D1 school looking to begin his coaching career, rising star head coach from a lower level echelon D3 program or even at the minimum a tenured/well-respected Ohio HS coach from the Columbus area.

Hoping the Denison fans have an announcement soon.

The reality is these guys aren't getting paid much. They're getting what amounts to minimum wage to be a second assistant - maybe $30 grand. I'm sure the OC will be the 1st assistant so he'll get the hire paying of the two jobs. Hopefully Denison will throw TJ a bone by having him teach a PE class so he can make some extra money, or make him an RA or something.

[TopperLax82]

TJ has Denison DC on his IG account. Self reported, for sure, but no reason to doubt it.

And, looks like Sal Iaria is headed to Bates:

https://gobatesbobcats.com/news/2024/7/ ... staff.aspx

Any other OC contenders?

I know Iaria interviewed for the Denison job but my guess is once they hired TJ they were going for a more experienced OC who is closer to being an HC, or possibly has already been one.

[twohandsonestick]

I have a Dennison question. They have a remarkable winning tradition. But when were they last good outside of the Midwest other than 1 win vs Lynchburg in 2016? They have a solid history of making the NCAA tournament.

You surely cant be serious but I’ll entertain this since im here sitting at work bored out of my mind. For the sake of this conversation, lets just take 2016-present and leave behind all the significant wins Denison had prior to 2016.

- 2016: One goal loss to Salisbury who was the eventual national champion
- 2017: Dominated #11 Dickinson 11-3
- 2017: Ran #16 Lynchburg off the field 18-9
- 2017: One goal loss to Salisbury who was the eventual national champion again after stomping RIT in the final
- 2018: Win over ranked Stevenson
- 2018: Middlebury came in and it wasnt even a game 12-7 Denison win
- 2018: Spanked #9 OWU
- 2019: Wasn’t even a game against #12 Roanoke 20-6 win for Big Red
- 2019: Win over #14 F&M
- 2020: Wins over #13 St. John Fisher and W&L

I graciously left out just about every year’s wins over top 15 ranked W&L and OWU as Denison has historically dominated those matchups. Denison has competed on the national level for national championships for years – albeit a few down seasons since Coach C’s departure this is a top 10 recognized program in D3 lacrosse without a doubt. Lastly, learn to spell the name correctly before having any sort of opinion on the matter

[Can Opener]

2023 - Denison defeated then #2 in the country Gettysburg. That Gettysburg team produced five USILA All Americans that season.

[d3maxlax]

I know this is a shift from the Denison discussion, but as followers of the NCAC, what are your thoughts on Depauw, Oberlin, and Wittenberg? How might the addition of John Carroll affect their future performance?

[Prepschoolkid]

I know this is a shift from the Denison discussion, but as followers of the NCAC, what are your thoughts on Depauw, Oberlin, and Wittenberg? How might the addition of John Carroll affect their future performance?

This is a good question. I think that the addition of John Carroll to the conference is huge. They are a solid program that will make some noise right away and in my opinion be in the conference playoffs in their first year It will hopefully elevate the play of the conference and force a programs to step up their game. In my opinion Hiram, Wittenberg, Wabash, Oberlin, Depauw, and wooster are all in the same boat. They 100% produce some competitive teams every few years that give the top dogs some problems but would love to see their athletic programs put some more resources towards lacrosse. I imagine John Carroll will come in and be a top 4 program in the NCAC right off the bat.

[oldtimelax]

I know this is a shift from the Denison discussion, but as followers of the NCAC, what are your thoughts on Depauw, Oberlin, and Wittenberg? How might the addition of John Carroll affect their future performance?

Of those three schools, Oberlin is the up-and-comer. Oberlin is flush with cash (their endowment is over $1 billion) and enrollment is nearly 3,000. The school was historically terrible in sports (the lacrosse program hasn't beaten either OWU or Denison in over 50 years), but the administration has recently come to to the realization that sports can enhance their national brand and attract a more balanced student body. They have a good young coach in Ryan Polack,who has had four large recruiting large classes (20+ players) and has a 30-19 record in three full seasons since COVID ended. They almost made the NCAC playoffs last year, but lost to Wooster.

Wittenberg was traditionally one of the better teams after Denison, OWU and Kenyon, but they haven't made the playoffs since 2017. Coach Jay Owen came from Salisbury where he was a player and coach, but has a 73-77 record in 11 seasons. Recently, Wittenberg doesn't seem to have kept pace recruiting and in 2024 went 3-5 in the conference, only beating Hiram, DePauw and Wabash.

DePauw seemed to be on the right track before COVID, but has been pretty stagnant since. They only had two conference wins vs. Hiram and Wabash.

John Carroll should be in the top 4 when they join the NCAC -- Denison, Kenyon, OWU and JCU. The next tier will be competitive between Wooster, Oberlin and Wittenberg, with DePauw and Wabash at the bottom (Hiram is leaving the conference to join the PAC).

[Prepschoolkid]

Kenyon has been posting their incoming freshmen class. Looks like they got some legit talent from a lot of east coast schools (Delbarton, Trinity Pawling, Millbrook, Langley, STAB, St George School). Mix that in with some midwest grit thats a solid class... excited to see what the Lordes can do in the spring. Whoops sorry meant Owls

[Quill]

https://goheels.com/news/2024/7/24/wome ... hing-staff

Perhaps she and Sal Iaria decided it was best to seek other opportunities.


Is it possible Sal was offered the OC role and decided to head up to Maine instead? Lexington, VA to Maine makes it more difficult to argue that the Granville location was the issue.

[Prepschoolkid]

https://goheels.com/news/2024/7/24/wome ... hing-staff

Perhaps she and Sal Iaria decided it was best to seek other opportunities.


Is it possible Sal was offered the OC role and decided to head up to Maine instead? Lexington, VA to Maine makes it more difficult to argue that the Granville location was the issue.

Couple of questions/comments

1). Location is not a problem. I have been to Granville a couple of times to watch some NCAC action and it is an amazing little town. For older coaches with a family it is a great place to raise the children because of its amazing school system. For younger coaches you can live in Columbus and make the 30 minute drive to Denison.

2). In regard to Bartlett.... As everyone here knows I have voiced my anger with her has a full time assistant eating up salary. I would imagine she was pushed out and forced to find a new role. Good for her landing at UNC.. I am relieved she is gone.

3). Where did we get the Sal rumor from? In my opinion that would have been a great hire for any team in the NCAC... hes young and has a great resume. Playing at Vermont and then helping W&L get back on the winning path after a slow couple of years.

[d3maxlax]

Thanks Prepschool and oldtime! Had not thought about Oberlin's renewed focus and overall endowment. Looking at endowments (https://www.collegeraptor.com/college-r ... onference/) and endowment per student (https://www.collegeraptor.com/college-r ... onference/), OWU seems to be more successful and DePauw less successful given their resources. Of course, how you use these resources is important.

[TopperLax82]

https://goheels.com/news/2024/7/24/wome ... hing-staff

Perhaps she and Sal Iaria decided it was best to seek other opportunities.


Is it possible Sal was offered the OC role and decided to head up to Maine instead? Lexington, VA to Maine makes it more difficult to argue that the Granville location was the issue.

Couple of questions/comments

1). Location is not a problem. I have been to Granville a couple of times to watch some NCAC action and it is an amazing little town. For older coaches with a family it is a great place to raise the children because of its amazing school system. For younger coaches you can live in Columbus and make the 30 minute drive to Denison.

2). In regard to Bartlett.... As everyone here knows I have voiced my anger with her has a full time assistant eating up salary. I would imagine she was pushed out and forced to find a new role. Good for her landing at UNC.. I am relieved she is gone.

3). Where did we get the Sal rumor from? In my opinion that would have been a great hire for any team in the NCAC... hes young and has a great resume. Playing at Vermont and then helping W&L get back on the winning path after a slow couple of years.

Granville's awesome - there has been an effort to deemphasize lacrosse at Denison once Caravana and staff was cut loose. They even went so far to move the men's program out of its offices (they were nicer) and put the women's coaches in there. The salaries for the assistant coaches aren't great, unless they can give them additional benefits like teaching a PE class to increase their salary. My guess is Koch doesn't have the ability to offer that like Caravana did due to the de-emphasis. Granville is 10x nicer than Lewiston, ME, and Denison is a lot better than Bates. If Sal was offered the job and turned it down the situation at Denison doesn't look good. Bates is in a huge rebuild. I know they are emphasizing lacrosse and rebuilding the program. The lure of NESCAC is real.