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Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:06 pm
by a fan
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:53 pm
My observation is that in the US we tend to be more comfortable with socialist enterprises that are locally administered.
Except for rural and most flyover States where they need the money from other States to keep the lights on....... then they "get religion", fleece their fellow taxpayers, and then (the best part) rail against socialism.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:09 pm
by 6ftstick
Trinity wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:04 pm
Russian strategy—divide Americans by race
Trump’s strategy-divide Americans by race
Democrat strategy—call everyone a racist
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:11 pm
by a fan
6ftstick wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:09 pm
Trinity wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:04 pm
Russian strategy—divide Americans by race
Trump’s strategy-divide Americans by race
Democrat strategy—call everyone a racist
Holy cow! We have a consensus as to what our government leaders (well, and Putin) are doing!
Nice job, gentlemen. Take a bow.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:35 pm
by HooDat
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:41 pm
a fan wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:26 pm
HooDat wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:21 pm
My observation is that in the US we tend to be more comfortable with socialist enterprises that are locally administered. I think that is part of the idiot-savant nature of your average US citizen. Joe Sixpack tends to intuitively understand that power like that is more easily controlled when it is localized. In the US we have the best of both worlds, because when locally administered socialist enterprises go astray (think public schools in the 60's) the local citizens can go to the feds for protection (BrownvBoard of Education).
When the Federal Government has that power - who do we go to when it is abused?
The ballot box. Same as we do for the local government.
boy, that's too logical.
I don't think you understand what authoritarian means??...? Once someone at the Fed level has achieved authoritarian control of the government, there won't be elections - certainly not fair ones.
When the black community wanted open access to schools - why didn't they just vote the suckers out at the "local" ballot box?.... I will wait..... the answer is they
couldn't because they were either outnumbered or there weren't fair elections. SO, they had to go to the Feds.
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:53 pm
But quick question: what do you mean by "modern age" and "successful"?
Are you including fascism?
Are you including right wing dictatorships in South America, Asia, Africa, ME?
so, you call these right wing? Then let me get this straight - if the military takes over it is somehow by definition "right wing" in your mind? The Nazi's (I assume those are the fascists to whom you refer) were socialists. Many (though not all) of the Asian and South American dictatorships were put in place under the name of some form of socialist or communist type of guiding principal.
Modern age is 20th century. I purposely put successful in quotes. But what I meant by that was that someone actually took and held power for multiple decades. Or, in what appears to be the best barometer of success for a "socialist" government - their success in murdering a significant percentage of their own citizens in their rises to power.....
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:04 pm
by Typical Lax Dad
HooDat wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:35 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:41 pm
a fan wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:26 pm
HooDat wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:21 pm
My observation is that in the US we tend to be more comfortable with socialist enterprises that are locally administered. I think that is part of the idiot-savant nature of your average US citizen. Joe Sixpack tends to intuitively understand that power like that is more easily controlled when it is localized. In the US we have the best of both worlds, because when locally administered socialist enterprises go astray (think public schools in the 60's) the local citizens can go to the feds for protection (BrownvBoard of Education).
When the Federal Government has that power - who do we go to when it is abused?
The ballot box. Same as we do for the local government.
boy, that's too logical.
I don't think you understand what authoritarian means??...? Once someone at the Fed level has achieved authoritarian control of the government, there won't be elections - certainly not fair ones.
When the black community wanted open access to schools - why didn't they just vote the suckers out at the "local" ballot box?.... I will wait..... the answer is they
couldn't because they were either outnumbered or there weren't fair elections. SO, they had to go to the Feds.
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:53 pm
But quick question: what do you mean by "modern age" and "successful"?
Are you including fascism?
Are you including right wing dictatorships in South America, Asia, Africa, ME?
so, you call these right wing? Then let me get this straight - if the military takes over it is somehow by definition "right wing" in your mind? The Nazi's (I assume those are the fascists to whom you refer) were socialists. Many (though not all) of the Asian and South American dictatorships were put in place under the name of some form of socialist or communist type of guiding principal.
Modern age is 20th century. I purposely put successful in quotes. But what I meant by that was that someone actually took and held power for multiple decades. Or, in what appears to be the best barometer of success for a "socialist" government - their success in murdering a significant percentage of their own citizens in their rises to power.....
This is why Trump’s thumbing his nose at American institutions and “his” political party cowering is dangerous. Wait until a true left wing nut gets in and justifies actions in the name of good. It won’t be so funny.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:49 pm
by HooDat
I don't think its funny now.
But I also don't think we are anywhere close to authoritarian rule, all the anti-Trump fantasies aside. He is crass, he is crude, but he has not governed with any less respect for the Constitution or the authority of law than Obama did. He just blusters a lot more beforehand. His twitter account is like having the radio frequency to a five-year old's inner thoughts....
He also had a GOP controlled congress for two years. If he was going institute "authoritarian rule" he would have done so then.
Our institutions are fine. Which is why we can weather Trump. And which is also why people should continue to keep any eye on him along with every other person in our government - because that is what our institutions allow and frankly depend upon.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:54 pm
by a fan
The Courts have done just fine with Trump. Approved lawful EO's. Struck down unlawful EO's.
Old Salt is quite correct when he says that our Institutions are holding up well.
Where Trump is killing us is all the behind the scenes stuff at the Dept. of Agriculture, Dept. of Energy, EPA, where he's systematically dismantling
their ability to govern.
We'll be reading about that stuff when he has left office, and it's too late to fix the damage....
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 7:21 pm
by runrussellrun
AOC just voted with the chickenhawk war mongers in funding the illegal surveillance of US citizens
H R 3494: To authorize appropriations for fiscal year 2020 for intelligence and intelligence-related activities of the United States Government, the Community Management Account, and the Central Intelligence Agency Retirement and Disability System, and for other purposes
AOC, She voted AYE, along with 396 other members of the US Congress. 226 Dem/171 Rep.
Could have gone on the TAATS thread, but AOC sure knows when to support the donor bloodline. Nancy taught her to roll over. And only months old
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 7:25 pm
by runrussellrun
a fan wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:54 pm
The Courts have done just fine with Trump. Approved lawful EO's. Struck down unlawful EO's.
Old Salt is quite correct when he says that our Institutions are holding up well.
Where Trump is killing us is all the behind the scenes stuff at the Dept. of Agriculture, Dept. of Energy, EPA, where he's systematically dismantling
their ability to govern.
We'll be reading about that stuff when he has left office, and it's too late to fix the damage....
Why will we be reading this stuff once he is out in 2021? Did it happen to Bush? Obama? Timmy Geithner still need help with his taxes? Monsanto hitting the WH on a daily basis. Monsanto cabinet members today?
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 7:59 pm
by Typical Lax Dad
HooDat wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:49 pm
I don't think its funny now.
But I also don't think we are anywhere close to authoritarian rule, all the anti-Trump fantasies aside. He is crass, he is crude, but he has not governed with any less respect for the Constitution or the authority of law than Obama did. He just blusters a lot more beforehand. His twitter account is like having the radio frequency to a five-year old's inner thoughts....
He also had a GOP controlled congress for two years. If he was going institute "authoritarian rule" he would have done so then.
Our institutions are fine. Which is why we can weather Trump. And which is also why people should continue to keep any eye on him along with every other person in our government - because that is what our institutions allow and frankly depend upon.
"I see far".... I am not concerned with Trump being an authoritarian.. you look at the quality of his judicial appointments? (Not the Supreme Court justices).. "I see far"
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:37 pm
by youthathletics
I have not read the book
I see far....are you referring to it in your quotes?
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:44 pm
by Typical Lax Dad
youthathletics wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:37 pm
I have not read the book
I see far....are you referring to it in your quotes?
Line from an old Anne Rice book. Can’t remember which book.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:29 pm
by 6ftstick
a fan wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:06 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:53 pm
My observation is that in the US we tend to be more comfortable with socialist enterprises that are locally administered.
Except for rural and most flyover States where they need the money from other States to keep the lights on....... then they "get religion", fleece their fellow taxpayers, and then (the best part) rail against socialism.
Never knew how much you hate 50% of your customers.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:39 pm
by a fan
Who said anything about hate?. I live in flyover country, remember? I'm happy to pay taxes to help keep their lights on....my question to you is: are you?
You keep saying no. Have our discussions changed your tune?
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:47 pm
by 6ftstick
a fan wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:39 pm
Who said anything about hate?. I live in flyover country, remember? I'm happy to pay taxes to help keep their lights on....my question to you is: are you?
You keep saying no. Have our discussions changed your tune?
then they "get religion", fleece their fellow taxpayers, and then (the best part) rail against socialism. Sounds so benevolent!
Nah you don't hate them much.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:59 pm
by Brooklyn
6ftstick wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:09 pm
Democrat strategy—call everyone a racist
Lately, it's the Republicans and other delusional righties who have been doing that a lot more often than anyone else.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 10:31 pm
by a fan
6ftstick wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:47 pmthen they "get religion", fleece their fellow taxpayers, and then (the best part) rail against socialism. Sounds so benevolent!
Nah you don't hate them much.
Dodged my question, like always. Have you changed your mind? Are you happy that your tax dollars are taken out of your State, and into mine?
If so, we're all set, my work is done here, and you can stop complaining. You're a moderate or a liberal.
Re: AOC
Posted: Wed Jul 17, 2019 11:03 pm
by 6ftstick
a fan wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 10:31 pm
6ftstick wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 9:47 pmthen they "get religion", fleece their fellow taxpayers, and then (the best part) rail against socialism. Sounds so benevolent!
Nah you don't hate them much.
Dodged my question, like always. Have you changed your mind? Are you happy that your tax dollars are taken out of your State, and into mine?
If so, we're all set, my work is done here, and you can stop complaining. You're a moderate or a liberal.
Your question has nothing to do with the obvious contempt you have for your fellow Americans.
Re: AOC
Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 12:13 am
by a fan
6ftstick wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 11:03 pm
Your question has nothing to do with the obvious contempt you have for your fellow Americans.
Pot meet kettle. Can't think of another poster who despises millions of people....anyone with the letter D is the devil with you.
I am 100% guilty of despising those who complain about government handouts, and then turn around and take more money from taxpayers than anyone else in America. Either don't complain about handouts, or don't take them. Pick one, and we're right as rain.....
Re: AOC
Posted: Thu Jul 18, 2019 8:06 am
by MDlaxfan76
a fan wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 5:06 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 4:53 pm
My observation is that in the US we tend to be more comfortable with socialist enterprises that are locally administered.
Except for rural and most flyover States where they need the money from other States to keep the lights on....... then they "get religion", fleece their fellow taxpayers, and then (the best part) rail against socialism.
Actually, that was quoting Hoodat, not me.