Johns Hopkins 2021

[viper]

I don't believe any sensible person believes that the program is going DIII. Far off the deep end speculation that the Daniels administration doesn't like the program and wants to bring in in line with his view of the university.

As a I dislike Daniels and his identity politics BS (as an alum married to an alum, it there another university I ask for legacy status for my kids, since you guys decided to disenfranchise us?), this going DIII thing is from deep in the fever swamps.

First, the discussion about lax being grandfathered in to DI or moving all sports up to DI took place at least a decade ago. Lots of things have changed. At the time, the President was very active in the sports program and attended many games not just lacrosse. This was also at a time that Hopkins lax under DP was in its prime. You also had a very supportive AD in Tom Calder. He was the assistant AD when Bob Scott (who was alive at the time this decision was going on) was the AD so had a natural affinity to the program staying in DI. A number of big time supporters - guys like Larry Goldfarb, RIP, are long passed away. Sadly, many of the people that knew LG and others like him no longer work at Hopkins. He is just a name on a sign now.

Second, saying that. I doubt Hopkins would move to D3 but to think it wouldn't be discussed is misplaced. I'm sure there are discussions on this whenever long term planning about the Athletic Department take place. There is also likely a great deal of pressure from the faculty to reduce the emphasis on sports - see a school like Swathmore dropping football 20 years ago or Hofstra, St. Johns, or Boston U dropping football. Reducing the commitment (i.e. the cost) of high level sports is not unheard of.

Third, I am alum married to an alum who comes from an alum family. And the decision to discount legacy has meant the entire family has stopped giving. Some of them helped fund scholarships. So it isn't Bloomberg money but some years it was significant. If my kid isn't smart enough to get into Hopkins that is fine. But, if my kid was in the gray area that many decisions are made or equal to someone else who isn't a legacy, I see no reason why being a legacy shouldn't provide some small bonus. Note, Hopkins took a very broad view of legacy such that it was almost to the point that the school's janitor's cousin's kid would be considered a legacy but tightening that up would have made more sense than just dropping it all together.

Having been personally impacted by this as well (my eldest was rejected despite having scores/grades in the top quartile of the class that was admitted his freshman year) I can personally tell you that despite my small donations over the years - they have been redirected to the schools that were/are kind enough to pay for all or most of my eldest two kids educations, despite me having no other ties to them.

I suspect that as legacy families disappear over the years, Hopkins will be losing a great deal of financial support and rely on the hope that there are a few Mike Bloombergs that pop up over the years.

I do agree with steel_hop in that if a legacy is underserving of admission by standards, then so be it. However, IMHO it almost seems that being a legacy has become a detriment, even when you have the gravitas to get in.

[viper]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Well, I this has become a topic of debate over recent years. When DP arrived and through the early years, it seemed this was indisputable. However, off the field events that are not necessarily fully understood here (only seen through suspensions and players leaving, etc) over recent years have raised questions about the "role model" part. We here can't say what is going on behind the scenes (though many here may claim to know or just speculate) but there definitely have been noticeable changes in team chemistry, etc in his recent tenure as compared to his early years as HC.

Justified or not, the HC is the face of the program and when sh*t happens on/off the field they are ultimately the responsible party. On the field results have diminished over time while off the field "things" (Rolling suspensions, Tinney suspension, Foley, Rapine, etc, etc) seem to be taking over the conversations. None of this is good for a coaches resume if you know what I mean. Fair or not, coaches will be measured by their players behavior and their wins/losses. Just ask guys like Pressler, Starsia and most recently Jon Thompson (Amherst).

[WOMBAT, Mod Emeritus]

Bingo.

[HopFan16]

Justified or not, the HC is the face of the program and when sh*t happens on/off the field they are ultimately the responsible party. On the field results have diminished over time while off the field "things" (Rolling suspensions, Tinney suspension, Foley, Rapine, etc, etc) seem to be taking over the conversations. None of this is good for a coaches resume if you know what I mean. Fair or not, coaches will be measured by their players behavior and their wins/losses. Just ask guys like Pressler, Starsia and most recently Jon Thompson (Amherst).

Yes, because the rolling suspension debacle and a few players over the course of several years having some issues is exactly the same as what happened under Starsia's watch at Virginia, and more recently, under Thompson at Amherst. The off-the-field stuff at Homewood that's happened while Petro has been there is not remotely in the same category as those other things. Not even close. If you haven't noticed, most major programs have had some kind of off field issue (or many) in the last few years alone.

You only need to go 15 minutes up the street to Towson, under a head coach a lot of people wish was coaching the Jays, for more recent off-the-field trouble involving multiple players.

Wasn't Matt Rambo arrested and charged with assault while at Maryland?

I mean, did you even see what happened at St. Johns earlier this season? One of their captains nearly disemboweled (literally) his roommate!

Garnsey at Notre Dame last year, all the Tehoka/Albany/Ierlan stuff under Marr at Albany the last few years, Scanlan pretty much saying he hated his teammates and transferring after one year at Loyola—most people don't really know the full stories here. Point is, lots and lots of stuff goes on at most programs.

All things considered, Petro's 20-year tenure at Homewood has been relatively free of major incidents compared to some peer institutions. And what has gone on is not uncommon for a men's lacrosse program. It's a sport-wide issue. We all know that.

The Rapine thing only seems like an outlier to you because every aspect of the program is picked apart on here by a very passionate and interested fan base. But players leave programs under mysterious circumstances every year. The difference with Hopkins is that people actually notice and care when that happens.

[stupefied]

Maybe shouldn't comment because I'm not informed of JHU affairs but almost every d1 program has suspensions for breaking team rules as well as defections. JHU is not unique in that regard . Gonna be some issues amongst 50 young men but it's not more pervasive or on a scale greater than the norms. Problably less . Coach can set the rules, standards and general expectations to adhere to but individuals have to be accountable to themselves. If they lack discipline or have sense of entitlement etc then that is on them. I wouldn't be deflecting blame on Petro for their actions and decisions.

[Sagittarius A*]

Every team has problems of various kinds, and I don't think it's fair to hold a coach accountable for all of them. Some problems are apparent and can be dealt with by a coach, others are more problematic and hard to anticipate. I don't think it's fair at all what happened to Mike Pressler at Duke, for instance. You can't stop people from making their choices and you can't often anticipate those choices and head them off. You can make an argument that obvious issues weren't addressed, but beyond that it's hard for one person to be totally accountable for the behavior of 50 college students.

My issues are that the team just isn't competitive anymore and appears to be in decline. Fundamentals like ground balls and clearing are lacking. Players aren't developing over their tenure. Watching the team get blown out week after week is painful. The downward spiral needs to be reversed. It's time for a change.

[stupefied]

Every team has problems of various kinds, and I don't think it's fair to hold a coach accountable for all of them. Some problems are apparent and can be dealt with by a coach, others are more problematic and hard to anticipate. I don't think it's fair at all what happened to Mike Pressler at Duke, for instance. You can't stop people from making their choices and you can't often anticipate those choices and head them off. You can make an argument that obvious issues weren't addressed, but beyond that it's hard for one person to be totally accountable for the behavior of 50 college students.

My issues are that the team just isn't competitive anymore and appears to be in decline. Fundamentals like ground balls and clearing are lacking. Players aren't developing over their tenure. Watching the team get blown out week after week is painful. The downward spiral needs to be reversed. It's time for a change.

Agree that play and development are what should be judged since there is no Wild West atmosphere to be faulted. Just look at body of work than one poor season that was an outlier.

My take. Many top tier teams have downcyles that can be reversed without coaching change. Cuse fans had been calling for Desko's head saying he was antiquated and that team had fallen from the ranks of contenders . Several good players from 16 and 17 classes have put them back on winning track and now most is fine.

JHU team that I watched playing Maryland and PSU last year was very good . Had some graduations of some unappreciated talents while some highly rated players who jhu fans clamored for all last year were disappointments. To make the fairest assessment, one has to heavily factor in Epstein's injury this year because it clearly hindered him and the entire JHU offense . On the d side, lost two leads and didn't have the backstop that made up for that drop-off.

Looking forward, Epstein be healthy and Murphy and Degnon emerged. Petro's recruiting classes are supposedly good. Some goalie and d talent may be available in transfer portal . Maybe Petro does a Tillman haul.

Reasons to expect a fairly good bounce regardless of who coaches.

[jhu06]

Legacy thing was woke bs. There are 50 private schools in the northeast which are about 1/2 the undergrad population and are aggressively recruited by all the schools because thats whose parents can pay and donate-look up the jared kushner got into harvard story. When I asked Hopkins about it they said other schools were following their lead and if you read the stories most said they absolutely would not especially places like harvard as they understand what alumni mean. The other part of this is that all these international students aren't there by accident. The school doesn't go to random neighborhoods of Cairo or Beijing or Tokyo, they pay companies big big $ to generate lists of uber wealthy foreign families.

Gamewatch on youtube was a big hit. I think Bob or Bobby when I was there Benson said they're going to do more.

For all the issues we have with the school I'm incredibly proud that one of the biggest stories in our lives and our school and its alumni are at the forefront.

[Big Dog]

Legacy thing was woke bs.

It really is. In the first place there are plenty of alums that don't want their kid to go to Hopkins, so the demand has to be much less than legacy demand at say, HYP. (Bawlamer was not for my two.) Secondly, they could have easily limited the legacy tip just to those Parents who attended Hopkins undergrad (much like HYP). That would have shrunk the pool of eligibles. And then see if legacy was even 15% of admissions.

[runrussellrun]

Justified or not, the HC is the face of the program and when sh*t happens on/off the field they are ultimately the responsible party. On the field results have diminished over time while off the field "things" (Rolling suspensions, Tinney suspension, Foley, Rapine, etc, etc) seem to be taking over the conversations. None of this is good for a coaches resume if you know what I mean. Fair or not, coaches will be measured by their players behavior and their wins/losses. Just ask guys like Pressler, Starsia and most recently Jon Thompson (Amherst).

Yes, because the rolling suspension debacle and a few players over the course of several years having some issues is exactly the same as what happened under Starsia's watch at Virginia, and more recently, under Thompson at Amherst. The off-the-field stuff at Homewood that's happened while Petro has been there is not remotely in the same category as those other things. Not even close. If you haven't noticed, most major programs have had some kind of off field issue (or many) in the last few years alone.

You only need to go 15 minutes up the street to Towson, under a head coach a lot of people wish was coaching the Jays, for more recent off-the-field trouble involving multiple players.

Wasn't Matt Rambo arrested and charged with assault while at Maryland?

aTTA boy

.......getting into a fight at the Vous.....so unnormal. (Bigger story is the coach that was with him....but....)

Hopkins ALSO had a player arrested, for a very serious crime. Names don't matter, but its public information. Why bring up "other" schools and kids?

Baltimore sucks. Hopkins pulled the arrogant "we don't care about our neighbors- or the hood "..........look in the mirror Johns and Bloomie. The money the "hero" bloomie spent on his worthless POTUSA campaign ads......how many homes in Baltimore could HE have owned, improved, and provided for the poor folks of Baltirmoer

[HopFan16]

Gamewatch on youtube was a big hit. I think Bob or Bobby when I was there Benson said they're going to do more.

This was the best thing they've done in awhile. The replay is still on the Hopkins Sports YouTube channel for those interested and apparently they are doing another one next week for the 2011 OT comeback win at Byrd. The live comments were a who's who of Hopkins alums, everyone was having fun and being extremely civil. It was a reminder that there is another side to the Hopkins alumni community that is very different from what you see here.

[44WeWantMore]

Legacy thing was woke bs.

It really is. In the first place there are plenty of alums that don't want their kid to go to Hopkins, so the demand has to be much less than legacy demand at say, HYP. (Bawlamer was not for my two.) Secondly, they could have easily limited the legacy tip just to those Parents who attended Hopkins undergrad (much like HYP). That would have shrunk the pool of eligibles. And then see if legacy was even 15% of admissions.

Let us all remember this with some humility the next time we contrast Duke's reputation with the fact that their Gang of 88 faced no opposition, let alone consequences.

I venture to guess that the days when we had that one kooky DOGEE professor and a Chaplain who must have entertained one too many Maryknollers have long passed at JHU.

[WOMBAT, Mod Emeritus]

Simulated Hopkins lost to Michigan at Homewood Field last night, 15-13.

That’s now 0-3 simulated. 2-7 overall. The howling if that were real would be intensifying for sure.

Next up, the game I had circled on my calendar a month ago: at Rutgers.

[51percentcorn]

Who cares about simulated games - some fairly well respected hoops outfit that simulates the tournament came up with a scenario of a final four of BYU/Wisconsin/Maryland and Virginia with Wisconsin cutting down the nets. Now that was their 2020th scenario but still - zero chance of that happening.

On perhaps a more relevant note - DP has been active on twitter lately - sorry there's no links - I only have twitter on my phone and well don't even bother... BUT he first tweeted out a screen shot of a team wide video call and then he filmed a brief message. The message is terrific - no BS - it has a big focus on Drs/Nurses/First responders taking care of all of us and there are better times ahead etc. Great stuff. If you want to take those tweets anywhere but its nice face value - it would certainly be a very gracious gesture to put that message out if you knew or suspected you were not going to be asked to remain in your current position.

[Drcthru]

https://twitter.com/i/status/1243313052994416640

[jhu06]

what is the official top 10 list of candidates who should be considered for the next HC of JHUML followed by what is the betting odds on the next coach-including petro?

[stupefied]

Odds on Petro returning 53 %

Top 8 candidates to replace
jhu06
steel_hop
wes craven
Ocanada
nadelen
Mightyjoe
Peter Brown
viper

[HopFan16]

To answer the question seriously, I think the chances Petro returns is well over 50%. IF he is sent packing, either in the next few months or in the very near future, my guess would be something like:

35% Nadelen
15% Marr
10% Raymond
5% Holman
5% Alberici
5% Wray
5% Chemotti
5% Murphy
5% Torpey
5% A current D1 assistant
1% Seth Tierney
1% Bill Tierney
1% Voelker
0.5% Shay
0.5% Warne
0.25% Tillman
0.25% Toomey
0.25% Myers
0.24% A current high school coach
0.01% DocBarrister

[laxpert]

Are these replacement coaches for real or simulated games

[Laxsmitty]

I would hope the school would make a decision quickly for everyone's sake including Coach P. I am sure he would like some certainty on his own future. Plus if he is talking to kids in the portal I am sure they want some certainty as well. I expect them to bring him back since the season was cut short but not sure that is the right decision as I think he has lost the kids with his style of coaching.

The NCAA also needs to hurry up and decide (sorry if I missed it) whether the athletes get a year back or not. You can't just give it to senior and not the rest of the players it is either all players or none get an extra year of eligibility. I am sure teams want to know if their kids are coming back as well or need to tell the kids if they want them back.