Orange Duce

[OCanada]

Struggling with my memory a but how many Judges, election officials and law enforcement personnel and tgeir families have been attacked by the right wing and threatened with death. I am unaware of and large group that has attacked and threatened people on a scale being utilized by Trump supporters

[Seacoaster(1)]

“Almost any criticism of Trump is already being spun by MAGA as an incitement to assassinate him. This is an Orwellian attempt to silence what remains of the effort to stop him from regaining power.”

Edward Luce, editor in chief of the Financial Times.

[a fan]

Because you still have not acknowledged that they own some responsibility.

This is fantastic. You and your fellow posters (we all know who they are), have refused to take any responsibility for anything your party does for the last decade plus, to the point where you all post-------multiple times--------OpEds that claim that the reason Trump is the Republican nominee is the (hahha) Dems fault.

Coming up with the term Trump Derangement Sydrome and apply it to anyone who EVER dares to hold a sitting President accountable. You cats have been gaslighting the forum for 12 years with this Trump guy, (and Republicans in general) either ignoring everything he does, or mocking folks for making a big deal out of nothing....

.......and you're on here DEMANDING that the Dems hold themselves and their party accountable?

YA....what's a polite way to say go Fu*k yourselves?

[youthathletics]

….tripe like our current POTUS and his sidekicks calling him Hitler, to put a bullet in him, get a bullseye on him, take him out at all costs. That tripe is kinda hard to avoid when it’s on nightly newa from elected officials…then spread to social media. The media owns some, and I’d argue much of the culpability. I suppose it’s justifiable since Hitler deserved a bullet….I might as well save the country and be the hero…..thinks the gunman.

It’s the new game and to not think and admit both sides are equally guilty is disingenuous.

come on, the dangerous rhetoric has been far, far worse from the right.

Did you see the polling on the % of Republicans who agree with political violence? Compared to the much lower % of independents and Dems?

Of course, that doesn't in any way excuse this nutcase 20 year old 'outsider' nor does it justify inflammatory rhetoric that sounds like encouragement of violence from the left. But let's not pretend that the prominent right media and pols haven't been far worse in their rhetoric.

Go pick a fight with Biden…. https://x.com/ighaworth/status/18125663 ... a82I2GssRg

Nah, I agree with that rhetoric.
Trump and MAGA really are a danger to democracy as we've known it in my lifetime.
Project 2025 is a clear roadmap.

I don't think this is even exaggeration for effect.
I think the BS that comes from Trump/MAGA is actually misinformation much of the time, flat out lying, but it's only really problematic when coupled by incitements to violence, references to violence.

Rhetoric which suggests that violence is an acceptable solution should be condemned and avoided.

suggesting "2nd Amendment" as a solution, even in a wink wink supposed 'jest' is not ok.
"I have the tough guys" is not ok.
This is 1776, not ok. Calling for "revolution" not ok.
ETC

I think there's been some over the top rhetoric from Dem politicians re "bullseye" etc that wasn't necessary to make the point that focusing attention on the danger and perfidies of Trump and MAGA needs to be the Campaign priority. Avoid it.

Again, did you see the polling?

Of course you agree with that rhetoric, 'at all costs', right? And as Gretchen Whitmer posted her 86/45 front and center staged message in 2020....my guess is you'll have to google that and seek the softer more consoling definition. The fact you can not come out say they BOTH own and have culpability speaks volumes.

Again, I have been clear that rhetoric that uses terms of violence, that calls for violence, is not ok.
Posing with AR-15's, not ok.

Stating clearly the stakes of an election is entirely appropriate in a democracy. Violence and incitements and encouragements of violence are not.

That you can't admit that the rhetoric from the right, meaning high ranking politicians and media, has been much worse than comparable people on the left "speaks volumes".

That you refuse to even address the polling showing repeatedly that MAGA Republicans have been persuaded by their leaders (or were naturally so predisposed) to think that violence is acceptable at much great % than Independents or Democrats... "speaks volumes".

So, why do YOU that is?

Because you still have not acknowledged that they own some responsibility. You chose your words and sentence structure rather carefully to avoid admitting any culpability, then go hard in the paint against the other side. Polls are turd and you know it. Remember we were supposed to have a red wave in the midterms....howd all those polls pan out. You are hanging on by a chad, my man....and should just liberate yourself from the scoreboard. Until you can do that, you playing into their game.

So, a huge gap between Republicans' opinions and those of Independents and Dems...is "turd"?
Repeatedly these results have come in.

Is it your hypothesis, maybe, that MAGA is just more willing to tell posters they believe in political violence...because they want to f with the pollsters?

You want to ignore as well the 80+% of Republicans who think the 2020 election was stolen? That "polling" is "turd" too?

as to red wave, that's not actually what most of the polls showed, it was what the pundits said was possible based on prior midterms. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/ho ... performed/

Why do you ignore what I bolded in red? Of course, there's been over the top rhetoric from Dems...and that should be reduced...but "culpability" for exactly what? The assassination attempt???

How come you won't admit that the violent rhetoric has been far, far worse from the right, specifically from Trump, Bannon, Flynn and other MAGA acolytes and wannabes? To raucous cheers from their adoring crowds...fund raising with violent rhetoric drives donations...

Because I view it as binary, you do not, Meaning, both sides do it, it needs to stop, and they need to be called out for it; Full Stop. Your argument sounds like this "well, I'm kind of pregnant" ....either you are or you are not.

[MDlaxfan76]

Struggling with my memory a but how many Judges, election officials and law enforcement personnel and tgeir families have been attacked by the right wing and threatened with death. I am unaware of and large group that has attacked and threatened people on a scale being utilized by Trump supporters

I think you meant left wing in your first sentence?

Of course, there are death threats that come from the left at prominent right wing figures, but far lower scale is correct.

Our MAGA friends may remember the alarm bells that have been going off at the FBI and DOJ and Homeland Security, which escalated during the Trump years first and have continued since his ascendancy, about domestic terrorism. Not exclusively, but largely right wing extremists.

Our MAGA friends pooh poohed this, IMO, because it implicated the Trumpian MAGA messaging.

[MDlaxfan76]

….tripe like our current POTUS and his sidekicks calling him Hitler, to put a bullet in him, get a bullseye on him, take him out at all costs. That tripe is kinda hard to avoid when it’s on nightly newa from elected officials…then spread to social media. The media owns some, and I’d argue much of the culpability. I suppose it’s justifiable since Hitler deserved a bullet….I might as well save the country and be the hero…..thinks the gunman.

It’s the new game and to not think and admit both sides are equally guilty is disingenuous.

come on, the dangerous rhetoric has been far, far worse from the right.

Did you see the polling on the % of Republicans who agree with political violence? Compared to the much lower % of independents and Dems?

Of course, that doesn't in any way excuse this nutcase 20 year old 'outsider' nor does it justify inflammatory rhetoric that sounds like encouragement of violence from the left. But let's not pretend that the prominent right media and pols haven't been far worse in their rhetoric.

Go pick a fight with Biden…. https://x.com/ighaworth/status/18125663 ... a82I2GssRg

Nah, I agree with that rhetoric.
Trump and MAGA really are a danger to democracy as we've known it in my lifetime.
Project 2025 is a clear roadmap.

I don't think this is even exaggeration for effect.
I think the BS that comes from Trump/MAGA is actually misinformation much of the time, flat out lying, but it's only really problematic when coupled by incitements to violence, references to violence.

Rhetoric which suggests that violence is an acceptable solution should be condemned and avoided.

suggesting "2nd Amendment" as a solution, even in a wink wink supposed 'jest' is not ok.
"I have the tough guys" is not ok.
This is 1776, not ok. Calling for "revolution" not ok.
ETC

I think there's been some over the top rhetoric from Dem politicians re "bullseye" etc that wasn't necessary to make the point that focusing attention on the danger and perfidies of Trump and MAGA needs to be the Campaign priority. Avoid it.

Again, did you see the polling?

Of course you agree with that rhetoric, 'at all costs', right? And as Gretchen Whitmer posted her 86/45 front and center staged message in 2020....my guess is you'll have to google that and seek the softer more consoling definition. The fact you can not come out say they BOTH own and have culpability speaks volumes.

Again, I have been clear that rhetoric that uses terms of violence, that calls for violence, is not ok.
Posing with AR-15's, not ok.

Stating clearly the stakes of an election is entirely appropriate in a democracy. Violence and incitements and encouragements of violence are not.

That you can't admit that the rhetoric from the right, meaning high ranking politicians and media, has been much worse than comparable people on the left "speaks volumes".

That you refuse to even address the polling showing repeatedly that MAGA Republicans have been persuaded by their leaders (or were naturally so predisposed) to think that violence is acceptable at much great % than Independents or Democrats... "speaks volumes".

So, why do YOU that is?

Because you still have not acknowledged that they own some responsibility. You chose your words and sentence structure rather carefully to avoid admitting any culpability, then go hard in the paint against the other side. Polls are turd and you know it. Remember we were supposed to have a red wave in the midterms....howd all those polls pan out. You are hanging on by a chad, my man....and should just liberate yourself from the scoreboard. Until you can do that, you playing into their game.

So, a huge gap between Republicans' opinions and those of Independents and Dems...is "turd"?
Repeatedly these results have come in.

Is it your hypothesis, maybe, that MAGA is just more willing to tell posters they believe in political violence...because they want to f with the pollsters?

You want to ignore as well the 80+% of Republicans who think the 2020 election was stolen? That "polling" is "turd" too?

as to red wave, that's not actually what most of the polls showed, it was what the pundits said was possible based on prior midterms. https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/ho ... performed/

Why do you ignore what I bolded in red? Of course, there's been over the top rhetoric from Dems...and that should be reduced...but "culpability" for exactly what? The assassination attempt???

How come you won't admit that the violent rhetoric has been far, far worse from the right, specifically from Trump, Bannon, Flynn and other MAGA acolytes and wannabes? To raucous cheers from their adoring crowds...fund raising with violent rhetoric drives donations...

Because I view it as binary, you do not, Meaning, both sides do it, it needs to stop, and they need to be called out for it; Full Stop. Your argument sounds like this "well, I'm kind of pregnant" ....either you are or you are not.

ok, but in order to squeeze a "binary" out of this you are creating a false equivalency. And it ain't remotely equivalent.

Admit that wholeheartedly and you'll find we're in full agreement that the rhetoric that suggests violence as a solution "needs to stop, and they (anyone, both sides) need to be called out for it; Full Stop." etc.

Just don't suggest that the Biden posts that you linked are such rhetoric. None of that called for violence. You even misquoted him, using language he didn't actually use in those posts. That's straight out misinformation.

Focus on just the language that actually suggests violence. Be "binary".

[youthathletics]

Because you still have not acknowledged that they own some responsibility.

This is fantastic. You and your fellow posters (we all know who they are), have refused to take any responsibility for anything your party does for the last decade plus, to the point where you all post-------multiple times--------OpEds that claim that the reason Trump is the Republican nominee is the (hahha) Dems fault.

Coming up with the term Trump Derangement Sydrome and apply it to anyone who EVER dares to hold a sitting President accountable. You cats have been gaslighting the forum for 12 years with this Trump guy, (and Republicans in general) either ignoring everything he does, or mocking folks for making a big deal out of nothing....

.......and you're on here DEMANDING that the Dems hold themselves and their party accountable?

YA....what's a polite way to say go Fu*k yourselves?

You are proving my point, by laying blame solely on the R's. What you are failing to acknowledge, maybe intentionally for the sake of debate, is that the majority of our all our banter around here has almost always been 'scoreboarding' just like what you did; I am just as guilty. What I am arguing, since Saturday, is that not owning both sides share the burden is disingenuous.

Your last comment, is not the intent AT ALL, it is a call to to say, ' how about we each acknowledge that both sides share in the responsibility".

[MDlaxfan76]

“Almost any criticism of Trump is already being spun by MAGA as an incitement to assassinate him. This is an Orwellian attempt to silence what remains of the effort to stop him from regaining power.”

Edward Luce, editor in chief of the Financial Times.

Yup; and you see that impulse right in this thread from posters like youth...whether consciously or not, the objection is to rhetoric that starkly criticizes Trump/MAGA not simply any rhetoric that calls for violence as a solution.

[a fan]

Because you still have not acknowledged that they own some responsibility.

This is fantastic. You and your fellow posters (we all know who they are), have refused to take any responsibility for anything your party does for the last decade plus, to the point where you all post-------multiple times--------OpEds that claim that the reason Trump is the Republican nominee is the (hahha) Dems fault.

Coming up with the term Trump Derangement Sydrome and apply it to anyone who EVER dares to hold a sitting President accountable. You cats have been gaslighting the forum for 12 years with this Trump guy, (and Republicans in general) either ignoring everything he does, or mocking folks for making a big deal out of nothing....

.......and you're on here DEMANDING that the Dems hold themselves and their party accountable?

YA....what's a polite way to say go Fu*k yourselves?

You are proving my point, by laying blame solely on the R's.

I. don't. care.

12 years of you not taking responsibility for anything your party does. Blaming the Dems for why we have Trump.

To say you have ZERO standing here is offensive to the number zero, Youth.

Your last comment, is not the intent AT ALL, it is a call to to say, ' how about we each acknowledge that both sides share in the responsibility".

Except you have NEVER taken responibility for stuff your crew said/did.

Tell you what----how about you, Kram, OS, and now Wregget do NOTHING but criticize your party for one month.

THEN you can rip on the Dems. How's that sound?

[MDlaxfan76]

Because you still have not acknowledged that they own some responsibility.

This is fantastic. You and your fellow posters (we all know who they are), have refused to take any responsibility for anything your party does for the last decade plus, to the point where you all post-------multiple times--------OpEds that claim that the reason Trump is the Republican nominee is the (hahha) Dems fault.

Coming up with the term Trump Derangement Sydrome and apply it to anyone who EVER dares to hold a sitting President accountable. You cats have been gaslighting the forum for 12 years with this Trump guy, (and Republicans in general) either ignoring everything he does, or mocking folks for making a big deal out of nothing....

.......and you're on here DEMANDING that the Dems hold themselves and their party accountable?

YA....what's a polite way to say go Fu*k yourselves?

You are proving my point, by laying blame solely on the R's. What you are failing to acknowledge, maybe intentionally for the sake of debate, is that the majority of our all our banter around here has almost always been 'scoreboarding' just like what you did; I am just as guilty. What I am arguing, since Saturday, is that not owning both sides share the burden is disingenuous.

Your last comment, is not the intent AT ALL, it is a call to to say, ' how about we each acknowledge that both sides share in the responsibility".

Nope, you have still refused to acknowledge the gross imbalance of rhetoric and opinions condoning violence from MAGA. Until you do, asking Dems to "share in the responsibility" falls very flat.

I haven't heard any prominent Dem, nor any moderate or left leaning poster on here, suggest that rhetoric condoning violence from the left is A-ok with them. Quite the opposite.

If you will recall, the over the top rhetoric some far lefties used during the BLM period was condemned on here, in contrast to the underlying just cause.

[Seacoaster(1)]

“Almost any criticism of Trump is already being spun by MAGA as an incitement to assassinate him. This is an Orwellian attempt to silence what remains of the effort to stop him from regaining power.”

Edward Luce, editor in chief of the Financial Times.

Yup; and you see that impulse right in this thread from posters like youth...whether consciously or not, the objection is to rhetoric that starkly criticizes Trump/MAGA not simply any rhetoric that calls for violence as a solution.

What Luce is saying is that MAGA and its intentional and inadvertent supporters in social media are trying to cancel the confirmed, obvious reality that Trump and his movement have totally mainstreamed the language of political violence and vengeance, and would likely act in accordance with those narratives in any next Trump administration. This is filling the zone with sh*t, a la the criminal Steve Bannon, and YA and others here are willing participants or dupes. Pretty sad stuff.

[youthathletics]

Because you still have not acknowledged that they own some responsibility.

This is fantastic. You and your fellow posters (we all know who they are), have refused to take any responsibility for anything your party does for the last decade plus, to the point where you all post-------multiple times--------OpEds that claim that the reason Trump is the Republican nominee is the (hahha) Dems fault.

Coming up with the term Trump Derangement Sydrome and apply it to anyone who EVER dares to hold a sitting President accountable. You cats have been gaslighting the forum for 12 years with this Trump guy, (and Republicans in general) either ignoring everything he does, or mocking folks for making a big deal out of nothing....

.......and you're on here DEMANDING that the Dems hold themselves and their party accountable?

YA....what's a polite way to say go Fu*k yourselves?

You are proving my point, by laying blame solely on the R's.

I. don't. care.

12 years of you not taking responsibility for anything your party does. Blaming the Dems for why we have Trump.

To say you have ZERO standing here is offensive to the number zero, Youth.

Your last comment, is not the intent AT ALL, it is a call to to say, ' how about we each acknowledge that both sides share in the responsibility".

Except you have NEVER taken responibility for stuff your crew said/did.

Tell you what----how about you, Kram, OS, and now Wregget do NOTHING but criticize your party for one month.

THEN you can rip on the Dems. How's that sound?

Could it not be any more clear....

[a fan]

Could it not be any more clear....

Oh, it's clear alright.

After 12 years of you letting it all slide from your party and criticizing NOTHING....you're on here telling the Dems to take responsibility, too.

Here's how you do what you're CLAIMING you want to do, YA:

Spend the next few months hammering your party, and not saying one word about the Dems.

Oh, and Old Salt, kram, and the rest of the posters who refuse to EVER criticize Republicans need to follow suit, and so the same. ONLY hit the Republicans.

That's what it would look like to "take equal responsibility". Your fellow posters wouldn't have to do a thing....and you wouldn't ASK them to do a thing.

Get it? And I'd wager any amount you'd like that you would NEVER do this.

[youthathletics]

Could it not be any more clear....

Oh, it's clear alright.

After 12 years of you letting it all slide from your party and criticizing NOTHING....you're on here telling the Dems to take responsibility, too.

Here's how you do what you're CLAIMING you want to do, YA:

Spend the next few months hammering your party, and not saying one word about the Dems.

Oh, and Old Salt, kram, and the rest of the posters who refuse to EVER criticize Republicans need to follow suit, and so the same. ONLY hit the Republicans.

That's what it would look like to "take equal responsibility". Your fellow posters wouldn't have to do a thing....and you wouldn't ASK them to do a thing.

Get it? And I'd wager any amount you'd like that you would NEVER do this.

And you letting it slide as well; which is my point. Take the opposite of what you just said, look in the mirror and walk the walk. Or are you just trying to stay in control of the scoreboard.

[OCanada]

There was a news report that violence began a sharp upturn in guess what year?? 2016. Surprised?

[a fan]

And you letting it slide as well; which is my point. Take the opposite of what you just said, look in the mirror and walk the walk. Or are you just trying to stay in control of the scoreboard.

I HAVE criticized the libs/dems, my man. You are the one who has said NOTHING about your team.

-remember the libs crashing dinners in DC? I was ALL OVER that dangerous as F nonsense.
-remember antifa wanker, using fire? in Portland I said that was WORSE than Jan 6th, because of how dangerous fire is.
-remember the lawyer marching w/BLM who was prosecuted for a molotov cocktail? Flipped out over that, too.

You can find every word of this whenever you want to use the search function. It's all there, my man.


On the flip side, YA? You have said NOTHING about the stuff our team has said and done. Actually that's not true....you've been worse. You've ignored it AND made excuses for it. For years. Oh, and blamed the Dems for Trump. Remember THAT one?

Yet you want to tell me about taking responsibility?

[Seacoaster(1)]

There was a news report that violence began a sharp upturn in guess what year?? 2016. Surprised?

Weird, I don't get it. Obama?

[youthathletics]

And you letting it slide as well; which is my point. Take the opposite of what you just said, look in the mirror and walk the walk. Or are you just trying to stay in control of the scoreboard.

I HAVE criticized the libs/dems, my man. You are the one who has said NOTHING about your team.

-remember the libs crashing dinners in DC? I was ALL OVER that dangerous as F nonsense.
-remember antifa wanker, using fire? in Portland I said that was WORSE than Jan 6th, because of how dangerous fire is.
-remember the lawyer marching w/BLM who was prosecuted for a molotov cocktail? Flipped out over that, too.

You can find every word of this whenever you want to use the search function. It's all there, my man.


On the flip side, YA? You have said NOTHING about the stuff our team has said and done. Actually that's not true....you've been worse. You've ignored it AND made excuses for it. For years. Oh, and blamed the Dems for Trump. Remember THAT one?

Yet you want to tell me about taking responsibility?

Nice we are even...
....i even dropped a handful of my posts for jhu72 this past weekend who tried your one-sized fits all tactics.

Even?

[MDlaxfan76]

Could it not be any more clear....

Oh, it's clear alright.

After 12 years of you letting it all slide from your party and criticizing NOTHING....you're on here telling the Dems to take responsibility, too.

Here's how you do what you're CLAIMING you want to do, YA:

Spend the next few months hammering your party, and not saying one word about the Dems.

Oh, and Old Salt, kram, and the rest of the posters who refuse to EVER criticize Republicans need to follow suit, and so the same. ONLY hit the Republicans.

That's what it would look like to "take equal responsibility". Your fellow posters wouldn't have to do a thing....and you wouldn't ASK them to do a thing.

Get it? And I'd wager any amount you'd like that you would NEVER do this.

And you letting it slide as well; which is my point. Take the opposite of what you just said, look in the mirror and walk the walk. Or are you just trying to stay in control of the scoreboard.

youth, in contrast to numerous posters on the right about Trump and MAGA, a fan has consistently critiqued Dems for all sorts of reasons and over many years.

I think his demand of total focus on criticizing Republicans for an extended period goes too far, other than as a rhetorical flourish, but the point is that the refusal for so many years to hold Trump and MAGA accountable for the increase in violent rhetoric, hot division, and actual domestic terror acts, leaves no credibility when doing a "there were good people on both sides" garbage argument today.

That said, I think we should welcome your and anyone else's newfound recognition of Trump/MAGA responsibility and your own responsibility for the increase in acceptance of violence for political purposes. Good, it's a step.

But then admit that the differences between "both sides" is very stark before demanding that the Dems and RINOs etc need to take responsibility too.

You'll very likely find more openness then.

[youthathletics]

There was a news report that violence began a sharp upturn in guess what year?? 2016. Surprised?

Weird, I don't get it. Obama?

I think he forgot that's also when ANTIFA and their sub-groups really got rolling, so yea Trump and those others did a number. Less we forgot the media was rolling in the cash, hiring journalists and remote correspondents like wildfire for clickbait and sensationalizing media, which trickled down to the social media realm.