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Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:53 pm
by old salt
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:36 pm
old salt wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:24 pm
Time to reopen the debate on wireless wiretapping of US citizens ?
If we can spy on Carter Page, why not domestic terrorists ?
How about we leave your partisan snipes out of this one, Salty.
Page wasn't a 'warrantless wiretap' nor should we need to go there to combat domestic terrorists.
We DO need to apply the same sort of urgency and sense of importance with this ideologically based threat as we do with other such ideological hate threats.
No need to be so defensive. You're doing the partisan sniping. It's a legit issue (again).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA_warra ... 80%932007)
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:06 pm
by youthathletics
Brother of Meadow Pollack understands it is much much more than a gun issue.
https://www.instagram.com/p/B0yoUrQnrcI/
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:17 pm
by old salt
Yep. Lots of factors, in addition to grabbing the guns & surveilling the internet.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:42 pm
by dislaxxic
Jeffrey Goldberg...no "DFH" he...
He’s Getting Worse
"I watched the video recording of the rally in Panama City shortly after reading the El Paso killer’s so-called manifesto. It is a document littered with phrases and rhetorical devices injected into mainstream discourse by the president and his supporters—talk of a “Hispanic invasion,” accusations that Democrats support “open borders,” and the like. As Trump faces the possibility that he will lose the presidency next year, he may become more enraged, and more willing to deploy the rhetoric of violence as a way to keep his followers properly motivated. The Panama City speech was an important moment in Trump’s ongoing effort to make the American presidency a vehicle in the cause of marginalizing and frightening racial minorities; the killings are a possible (and predictable) consequence of such rhetoric."
..
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 4:48 pm
by Trinity
How many mass shooters before Trump quoted their president before attacking innocents? Trump’s the Bin Laden of White Supremacy now. Americans have been killed in his name. Babies.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:02 pm
by Trinity
Federal Judge cites Cesar Sayoc’s defense that his infatuation with Trump helped propel him to send bomb packages to prominent Democrats. Judge says that “it matters” “within limits.” This isn’t going to be the last terrorist to raise this as a mitigating factor.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:14 pm
by Typical Lax Dad
Trinity wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:02 pm
Federal Judge cites Cesar Sayoc’s defense that his infatuation with Trump helped propel him to send bomb packages to prominent Democrats. Judge says that “it matters” “within limits.” This isn’t going to be the last terrorist to raise this as a mitigating factor.
Where has his buddy been? I haven’t seen him standing behind Trump with a sign since Sayoc was arrested....Anyone else notice that?
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:33 pm
by Brooklyn
GOP REP BLAMES OBAMA, 'DRAG QUEEN ADVOCATES,' MARIJUANA AND OPEN BORDERS FOR THE SHOOTINGS: 'THE LIST IS LONG. AND THE FURY WILL CONTINUE'
https://www.newsweek.com/dayton-ohio-sh ... er-1452526
She said that former President Barack Obama was to blame for a "disrespect to law enforcement," expressed anger at "snowflakes, who can't accept a duly-elected president," and took aim at the "the relaxing of laws against criminals (open borders)."
Keller finished the message by asking: "Did I forget anybody? The list is long. And the fury will continue."
That is one sick minded weirdo.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:33 pm
by Trinity
Dude got cut, scholarship pulled.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:36 pm
by MDlaxfan76
old salt wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:53 pm
MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:36 pm
old salt wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 3:24 pm
Time to reopen the debate on wireless wiretapping of US citizens ?
If we can spy on Carter Page, why not domestic terrorists ?
How about we leave your partisan snipes out of this one, Salty.
Page wasn't a 'warrantless wiretap' nor should we need to go there to combat domestic terrorists.
We DO need to apply the same sort of urgency and sense of importance with this ideologically based threat as we do with other such ideological hate threats.
No need to be so defensive. You're doing the partisan sniping. It's a legit issue (again).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NSA_warra ... 80%932007)
Well, it would be if applied to US citizens...but that's not actually what they did, right?
And certainly not done with Page which was under a FISA warrant.
But are you making an argument in favor of warrantless wiretaps? If ok for foreign terrorists, why not US citizens?
Should need a warrant either way, IMO, but unlike some folks I'm fine with those warrants being classified and handled through a FISA process. I want safeguards for such, but ok with me if those safeguards are in place and followed. I want layers of oversight of the process and I want partisanship kept out as it's really dangerous territory if political types order targeting of political foes.
I'm also ok with automated collection and analysis of communications in order to flag those who should be investigated further
under warrant. Seems to me that's definitely important so as to flag where to look, though I don't see social media posts, including on the dark web, as protected communications. You post, you give up your right not to be heard.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:53 pm
by old salt
I'm also ok with automated collection and analysis of communications in order to flag those who should be investigated further under warrant. Seems to me that's definitely important so as to flag where to look, though I don't see social media posts, including on the dark web, as protected communications. You post, you give up your right not to be heard.
Agree. This is an area where A I could really help.
If the algorithm spits out a suspect, then a human reviews it (with no names/id) & get's a warrant, if justified.
Bonus points for video game choices & time spent.
If it's as effective as whatever generates popup ads, it'll work.
They're a PITA nuisance. Might as well get some protection.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 6:13 pm
by MDlaxfan76
old salt wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 5:53 pm
I'm also ok with automated collection and analysis of communications in order to flag those who should be investigated further under warrant. Seems to me that's definitely important so as to flag where to look, though I don't see social media posts, including on the dark web, as protected communications. You post, you give up your right not to be heard.
Agree. This is an area where A I could really help.
If the algorithm spits out a suspect, then a human reviews it (with no names/id) & get's a warrant, if justified.
Bonus points for video game choices & time spent.
If it's as effective as whatever generates popup ads, it'll work.
They're a PITA nuisance. Might as well get some protection.
Yup, the tools are there, and the gov't has plenty of processing horsepower. At a minimum, the networks of ideological hate are trackable and can identify the most likely candidates for further radicalization turning to violence. I'm not sure we have enough data for AI to truly learn to profile these guys, but sure better to work that problem than to sit on our butts.
This requires serious resources. But that unit was largely dismantled by this Administration, so hopefully they realize that was a very misguided mistake and the funds flow.
Same techniques as we should apply to any ideological terrorist threat.
First step was admitting that it's real, growing, and very serious, ala Chris Wray's testimony.
Now, the $ and people need to get on it.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 6:45 pm
by cradleandshoot
So cradle and shoot looses his mind and decides to kill as many people as he can. I own only one weapon, my dad carried an M-1 Carbine from France to Germany. I consider myself extremely proficient in the use of this weapon. I have fired quite a few rounds now from this rifle. If I lose my mind and decide to start shooting people I will have a fanny pack of 20 round 30 caliber magazines for my rifle. The legendary 30 caliber carbine rifle from WW2 is every single bit the same "assault rifle" as any AR 15 type of weapon. I guaran damn tee every round I fired would be point plank... on target and even more fatal. I have made the same damn argument here before time and time again. Some of you folks are transfixed on high capacity magazines. Lets go back one more time and do the same freaking math... Five 30 round magazines of 5.56 nato ammo equals 150 rounds. Fifteen 10 rounds magazines equals 150 rounds of ammunition. Any swinging dick with any amount of experience in an M16/AR15 type weapon can swap out a magazine in 2/3 seconds. A little secret from my Army days... if you are swapping out a mag and somebody rushes you... hit them with the barrel of your rifle... after 20 rounds the barrel will already be hot enough to burn someones flesh off. Saw it happen first hand. We had finished a live fire and were getting a ride back down the hill on deuce and a half trucks. A GI handed his rifle to another GI trying to boost him up onto the truck. GI grabbed the rifle by the barrel and burned the flesh right off of his hands. Ugly... ugly... ugly.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:03 pm
by Typical Lax Dad
cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 6:45 pm
So cradle and shoot looses his mind and decides to kill as many people as he can. I own only one weapon, my dad carried an M-1 Carbine from France to Germany. I consider myself extremely proficient in the use of this weapon. I have fired quite a few rounds now from this rifle. If I lose my mind and decide to start shooting people I will have a fanny pack of 20 round 30 caliber magazines for my rifle. The legendary 30 caliber carbine rifle from WW2 is every single bit the same "assault rifle" as any AR 15 type of weapon. I guaran damn tee every round I fired would be point plank... on target and even more fatal. I have made the same damn argument here before time and time again. Some of you folks are transfixed on high capacity magazines. Lets go back one more time and do the same freaking math... Five 30 round magazines of 5.56 nato ammo equals 150 rounds. Fifteen 10 rounds magazines equals 150 rounds of ammunition. Any swinging dick with any amount of experience in an M16/AR15 type weapon can swap out a magazine in 2/3 seconds. A little secret from my Army days... if you are swapping out a mag and somebody rushes you... hit them with the barrel of your rifle... after 20 rounds the barrel will already be hot enough to burn someones flesh off. Saw it happen first hand. We had finished a live fire and were getting a ride back down the hill on deuce and a half trucks. A GI handed his rifle to another GI trying to boost him up onto the truck. GI grabbed the rifle by the barrel and burned the flesh right off of his hands. Ugly... ugly... ugly.
Those kids in columbine and in Newton had a ton of experience
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:34 pm
by old salt
The Sandy Point shooter was highly proficient. His mom took him to the range.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:21 am
by hooligan88
Look at the pic of all 250 shooters this year. Its out there. Its time to stop blaming a race.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:28 am
by Brooklyn
I'm sure Trump's heart is in the right place:
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:31 am
by MDlaxfan76
Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 7:03 pm
cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 6:45 pm
So cradle and shoot looses his mind and decides to kill as many people as he can. I own only one weapon, my dad carried an M-1 Carbine from France to Germany. I consider myself extremely proficient in the use of this weapon. I have fired quite a few rounds now from this rifle. If I lose my mind and decide to start shooting people I will have a fanny pack of 20 round 30 caliber magazines for my rifle. The legendary 30 caliber carbine rifle from WW2 is every single bit the same "assault rifle" as any AR 15 type of weapon. I guaran damn tee every round I fired would be point plank... on target and even more fatal. I have made the same damn argument here before time and time again. Some of you folks are transfixed on high capacity magazines. Lets go back one more time and do the same freaking math... Five 30 round magazines of 5.56 nato ammo equals 150 rounds. Fifteen 10 rounds magazines equals 150 rounds of ammunition. Any swinging dick with any amount of experience in an M16/AR15 type weapon can swap out a magazine in 2/3 seconds. A little secret from my Army days... if you are swapping out a mag and somebody rushes you... hit them with the barrel of your rifle... after 20 rounds the barrel will already be hot enough to burn someones flesh off. Saw it happen first hand. We had finished a live fire and were getting a ride back down the hill on deuce and a half trucks. A GI handed his rifle to another GI trying to boost him up onto the truck. GI grabbed the rifle by the barrel and burned the flesh right off of his hands. Ugly... ugly... ugly.
Those kids in columbine and in Newton had a ton of experience
cradle, you undoubtedly would be a dangerous guy with that M-1. Whether you really need to have it in your closet is also an interesting question, but let's stick to assault rifles; your math leaves out the speed of fire.
9 people were killed and 26 more wounded in Ohio...in 20 seconds. Then engaged. The shooter was killed within a total of 30 seconds. Do you really think you could have done that sort of damage in that time frame with your M-1 ?
Don't think so.
Could a less well trained assailant?
Now take that to 5 minutes.
But yeah, it's not just about the high capacity assault weapons and magazines, it's also about keeping ANY guns, (and bomb making materials, etc) out of the hands of those who are dangerous to themselves and others.
Can we do better? Yup.
Will it be sufficient? Nope.
It's not video games. It's specific ideologies of hate and, in some cases other motivations of anger and hate (ie bullying, sexual abuse, etc).
We need to walk and chew gum on these issues.
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:36 am
by Typical Lax Dad
old salt wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2019 11:34 pm
The Sandy Point shooter was highly proficient. His mom took him to the range.
Yes. Sandy Hook. The mom was the first to catch one. A mutual friend’s daughter was killed and many friends had kids in the building. Guns don’t kill, people do. He was efficient swapping out magazines as quickly as C&S. That’s a fact?
Re: CNN Says 'White Men' are the Biggest Terror Threat in US
Posted: Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:38 am
by MDlaxfan76
hooligan88 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 06, 2019 9:21 am
Look at the pic of all 250 shooters this year. Its out there. Its time to stop blaming a race.
hooligan, do you really think someone is 'blaming a race'?
Here on FanLax? A politician? A major media figure?
If so, who. Please provide the citation.
The issue being discussed is a specific hate ideology, white supremacy/white nationalism.
Yes, a key aspect is 'white'...because that's what is being used, in a twisted, bigoted, ignorant fashion by those who are sympathetic to those core views about race.
It's not unlike the Islamic extremist ideology with a twisted, bigoted, ignorant view of that religion.
Like most Muslims rejecting that hate and extremism, most whites reject white supremacy violence.
So, here we are in America...do we reject those racist views, or not?
Or do we want to defend 'whites'?