Johns Hopkins 2021

[steel_hop]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Uh, at the end of the day. It is absolutely about W/L. Being a nice guy might get you another year than if you were a jerk but at the end of the day, the top parameter that he is judge on is W/Ls. This aint rec league where everyone gets a trophy.

[Parputt]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Uh, at the end of the day. It is absolutely about W/L. Being a nice guy might get you another year than if you were a jerk but at the end of the day, the top parameter that he is judge on is W/Ls. This aint rec league where everyone gets a trophy.

Uh, at the end of the day, its not college football or B-Ball. Winning is important but obviously more important to the fan base than anyone else.
Its a NON REVENUE SPORT. No one outside of this little lacrosse bubble cares! I think it is misguided to think its all about W/L. I get the athlete mentality, its what we are trained to think but its just not reality for lacrosse.... I have been on search committees and can tell you first hand that what most of these AD's care about most is a high value person who will run a respected, clean, trouble free, community friendly, high academic achieving and mostly full paying program of future donors. Its not rec league but its not the NFL either. Wins are a bonus.

[stupefied]

Petro and 2020 JHU got a bailout... put it behind and look forward. One year deal

[Big Dog]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Uh, at the end of the day. It is absolutely about W/L. Being a nice guy might get you another year than if you were a jerk but at the end of the day, the top parameter that he is judge on is W/Ls. This aint rec league where everyone gets a trophy.

Uh, at the end of the day, its not college football or B-Ball. Winning is important but obviously more important to the fan base than anyone else. .... Wins are a bonus.

Uhh, I would bet big cyber dollars that playing on Memorial Day weekend (aka winning) is more important to the players than the fan base. You don't suit up for D1 just for a participation trophy.

[Mr. F]

Why all this talk about moving to DIII when, yes, we haven't been as dominant as we historically have, but we literally won the B1G tournament less than two years ago and clinched an AQ. Beat Maryland twice last year and pushed PSU into OT in the title game. Not to mention tournament appearances in 47 of the 49 NCAA tournaments. The landscape of college lacrosse is changing. That doesn't mean that Hop can't compete. It just means we won't be in the final four every year. It doesn't mean I'll be any less excited for each season.

[HopFan16]

Why all this talk about moving to DIII

Because people are stupid.

That's the answer to a lot of questions about what goes on in this thread.

Benson is doing a live YouTube commentary of the 2002 season opener against Princeton tomorrow at 8pm ET. Perfect opportunity for some of you to complain to him directly about the offense. Maybe jhu06 will tell him to bench Mabbett: https://twitter.com/jhumenslacrosse/sta ... 8664226817

[Big Dog]

Why all this talk about moving to DIII..... tournament appearances in 47 of the 49 NCAA tournaments. ...

Bcos missing any tourneys is unacceptable for Hopkins.

[WOMBAT, Mod Emeritus]

When are we going to get around to sacrificing a Virgin?

[jhu06]

Why all this talk about moving to DIII

Because people are stupid.

That's the answer to a lot of questions about what goes on in this thread.

Benson is doing a live YouTube commentary of the 2002 season opener against Princeton tomorrow at 8pm ET. Perfect opportunity for some of you to complain to him directly about the offense. Maybe jhu06 will tell him to bench Mabbett: https://twitter.com/jhumenslacrosse/sta ... 8664226817

who makes the 2-4 tee shirt, you or your fellow stay the course pals? A maryland lax fan should've paid a student who lives in the apartments you can see from the press box to hang a banner that says "NCAA Tournament wins at Homewood since 2012:Terp Wlax 2 Hop men 1". Then again it's maryland, a school whose most favorite alum (connie chung) was a newsreader, not a imaginative bunch.

In all sincerity hope you all+your families are safe healthy wise and financially w/jobs. Many happier days and warm victorious saturday spring afternoons ahead.

[44WeWantMore]

Probably the wrong place to be praising a Terp, but: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Julian_Simon

[OCanada]

Parputt. Exactly so. That was the primary reason there was a vacancy for DP to fill. The situations that developed at other schools over the next 15 years or so only reenforced it. There was a lot of discussion among ADs and coaches.

Lax isn’t hoops or Fball but at Hopkins it’s the equivalent or was.

I made the comment not to be surprised if Hopkins s ended up D-lll. There are people who believe the administration does not care to deal with the D -1 issues it brings with it. The administrative support has dropped way off. Seems like many here don’t grasp how many people it takes to maintain or just keep up at a National
Level. All they care about is W/L on the field not the nuts and bolts of building one. IMO they don’t know what they don’t know.

I hope every one is well and safe. I have had it with this thread.

[jhu06]

Parputt. Exactly so. That was the primary reason there was a vacancy for DP to fill. The situations that developed at other schools over the next 15 years or so only reenforced it. There was a lot of discussion among ADs and coaches.

Lax isn’t hoops or Fball but at Hopkins it’s the equivalent or was.

I made the comment not to be surprised if Hopkins s ended up D-lll. There are people who believe the administration does not care to deal with the D -1 issues it brings with it. The administrative support has dropped way off. Seems like many here don’t grasp how many people it takes to maintain or just keep up at a National
Level. All they care about is W/L on the field not the nuts and bolts of building one. IMO they don’t know what they don’t know.

I hope every one is well and safe. I have had it with this thread.

administrative support is a big excuse around here, but there's no actual reporting of that in any lacrosse publication, they have top ranked recruiting classes, a monster facility the size of the rest of the athletic department offices combined and no record of success since it was built. They have deep alumni ties to draw on for $. Either you've got evidence of kid x not getting through admissions or something else because it doesn't seem from the outside like they're lacking for anything except wins.

again no evidence about d3 other than message board discussion. not sure why we're discussing that.

[steel_hop]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Uh, at the end of the day. It is absolutely about W/L. Being a nice guy might get you another year than if you were a jerk but at the end of the day, the top parameter that he is judge on is W/Ls. This aint rec league where everyone gets a trophy.

Uh, at the end of the day, its not college football or B-Ball. Winning is important but obviously more important to the fan base than anyone else.
Its a NON REVENUE SPORT. No one outside of this little lacrosse bubble cares! I think it is misguided to think its all about W/L. I get the athlete mentality, its what we are trained to think but its just not reality for lacrosse.... I have been on search committees and can tell you first hand that what most of these AD's care about most is a high value person who will run a respected, clean, trouble free, community friendly, high academic achieving and mostly full paying program of future donors. Its not rec league but its not the NFL either. Wins are a bonus.

Because this isn't a 1 year issue but a decade long issue. There are plenty of coaches that can run respected, clean programs, etc. and also be competitive with other peer organizations and every couple three years make the final four. That is not happening with DP.

Hopkins will have made 1 FF in the last 12 years. Even in between 87 and 2005 championships - Hopkins made 10 out of the 16 FFs. No one is arguing for that type of run because there are more competitive programs. But, there is no excuse for Hopkins only making 1 FF over 12 years. And to be honest, over the last twelve years, it isn't like any of their Hopkins QFs games were close such that only a dumb shot on an open goal by a middie (AJ Haugen?) allowed Duke to come back from 2 goals down with 2 minutes to win the QF game in OT.

They are asking for a return to being competitive against peer programs. They are tired of watching poor goalie play, poor defense (i.e. guys running around like chickens with their heads cut off resulting in offensive players wide open on the crease), poor fundamentals, poor clearing, getting destroyed in playoff games, lack of adapting to the change in the game, etc. They are tired of appearing to fix one issue and another one popping up.

If you want to make a comparison. Think of it as Philadelphia Eagles with Andy Reid. He did all the things you stated above but was still fired. At some point a coach losses the ability to adapt and the lockerroom starts to tune him out. This eventually worked out for both Reid and the Eagles. Reid immediately got another job and was revitalized - his offense with the Eagles was generally West Coast type but transformed in KC into a completely different offense - stretch type under Smith and Mahomes. It worked out for the Eagles, too. While they had a mediocre coach in Kelly they quickly fired him and found someone else in Pederson and won the Super Bowl 5 years after firing Reid.

If you want lax example, look at UVA. They were mired in mediocre under Dom. His contract wasn't renewed (fired) - 3 years later they are hoisting the trophy. Does that mean Hopkins would do the same? No, but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

(Note, I also agree with HOP16 that the coronavirus save DP's job). One interesting twist would be if Hopkins said they would give him another year and he said "no" I want a longterm contract 3-4 years. I wonder what would happen then.

[steel_hop]

Why all this talk about moving to DIII

Because people are BORED

fixed that for you. Could still be dumb but bored is more likely.

[WOMBAT, Mod Emeritus]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Uh, at the end of the day. It is absolutely about W/L. Being a nice guy might get you another year than if you were a jerk but at the end of the day, the top parameter that he is judge on is W/Ls. This aint rec league where everyone gets a trophy.

Uh, at the end of the day, its not college football or B-Ball. Winning is important but obviously more important to the fan base than anyone else.
Its a NON REVENUE SPORT. No one outside of this little lacrosse bubble cares! I think it is misguided to think its all about W/L. I get the athlete mentality, its what we are trained to think but its just not reality for lacrosse.... I have been on search committees and can tell you first hand that what most of these AD's care about most is a high value person who will run a respected, clean, trouble free, community friendly, high academic achieving and mostly full paying program of future donors. Its not rec league but its not the NFL either. Wins are a bonus.

Because this isn't a 1 year issue but a decade long issue. There are plenty of coaches that can run respected, clean programs, etc. and also be competitive with other peer organizations and every couple three years make the final four. That is not happening with DP.

Hopkins will have made 1 FF in the last 12 years. Even in between 87 and 2005 championships - Hopkins made 10 out of the 16 FFs. No one is arguing for that type of run because there are more competitive programs. But, there is no excuse for Hopkins only making 1 FF over 12 years. And to be honest, over the last twelve years, it isn't like any of their Hopkins QFs games were close such that only a dumb shot on an open goal by a middie (AJ Haugen?) allowed Duke to come back from 2 goals down with 2 minutes to win the QF game in OT.

They are asking for a return to being competitive against peer programs. They are tired of watching poor goalie play, poor defense (i.e. guys running around like chickens with their heads cut off resulting in offensive players wide open on the crease), poor fundamentals, poor clearing, getting destroyed in playoff games, lack of adapting to the change in the game, etc. They are tired of appearing to fix one issue and another one popping up.

If you want to make a comparison. Think of it as Philadelphia Eagles with Andy Reid. He did all the things you stated above but was still fired. At some point a coach losses the ability to adapt and the lockerroom starts to tune him out. This eventually worked out for both Reid and the Eagles. Reid immediately got another job and was revitalized - his offense with the Eagles was generally West Coast type but transformed in KC into a completely different offense - stretch type under Smith and Mahomes. It worked out for the Eagles, too. While they had a mediocre coach in Kelly they quickly fired him and found someone else in Pederson and won the Super Bowl 5 years after firing Reid.

If you want lax example, look at UVA. They were mired in mediocre under Dom. His contract wasn't renewed (fired) - 3 years later they are hoisting the trophy. Does that mean Hopkins would do the same? No, but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

(Note, I also agree with HOP16 that the coronavirus save DP's job). One interesting twist would be if Hopkins said they would give him another year and he said "no" I want a longterm contract 3-4 years. I wonder what would happen then.

Not Haugen.

1997 at Byrd.

Andrew Godfrey

Thanks. I’ll go take my PTSD meds now.

[HopFan16]

If you want to make a comparison. Think of it as Philadelphia Eagles with Andy Reid. He did all the things you stated above but was still fired. At some point a coach losses the ability to adapt and the lockerroom starts to tune him out. This eventually worked out for both Reid and the Eagles. Reid immediately got another job and was revitalized - his offense with the Eagles was generally West Coast type but transformed in KC into a completely different offense - stretch type under Smith and Mahomes. It worked out for the Eagles, too. While they had a mediocre coach in Kelly they quickly fired him and found someone else in Pederson and won the Super Bowl 5 years after firing Reid.

Not really sure this is the comparison you want to make. Pederson worked under Reid for the Eagles for years and then followed him to KC. When he was hired as the head coach for the Eagles a few years later, he came in and basically installed a version of Reid's offense. This is a bit like saying Hopkins should fire Petro and then eventually hire Benson or Dwan as head coach. I don't think that's quite what you'd like them to do.

Anyway, the Eagles did have that miracle season in 2017 and Pederson deserves a lot of credit for that but the team has been pretty mediocre every other year with him at the helm. They are a combined 25-23 in his three other seasons with 1 combined playoff win. Sound familiar?

[kramerica.inc]

There's no guarantee Hopkins will be successful at D3 either.
A drop down doesn't mean the Hopkins talent remains at the D1 level.
They would enter the Centennial Conference, one of the toughest leagues in D3.

[44WeWantMore]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Uh, at the end of the day. It is absolutely about W/L. Being a nice guy might get you another year than if you were a jerk but at the end of the day, the top parameter that he is judge on is W/Ls. This aint rec league where everyone gets a trophy.

Uh, at the end of the day, its not college football or B-Ball. Winning is important but obviously more important to the fan base than anyone else.
Its a NON REVENUE SPORT. No one outside of this little lacrosse bubble cares! I think it is misguided to think its all about W/L. I get the athlete mentality, its what we are trained to think but its just not reality for lacrosse.... I have been on search committees and can tell you first hand that what most of these AD's care about most is a high value person who will run a respected, clean, trouble free, community friendly, high academic achieving and mostly full paying program of future donors. Its not rec league but its not the NFL either. Wins are a bonus.

Because this isn't a 1 year issue but a decade long issue. There are plenty of coaches that can run respected, clean programs, etc. and also be competitive with other peer organizations and every couple three years make the final four. That is not happening with DP.

Hopkins will have made 1 FF in the last 12 years. Even in between 87 and 2005 championships - Hopkins made 10 out of the 16 FFs. No one is arguing for that type of run because there are more competitive programs. But, there is no excuse for Hopkins only making 1 FF over 12 years. And to be honest, over the last twelve years, it isn't like any of their Hopkins QFs games were close such that only a dumb shot on an open goal by a middie (AJ Haugen?) allowed Duke to come back from 2 goals down with 2 minutes to win the QF game in OT.

They are asking for a return to being competitive against peer programs. They are tired of watching poor goalie play, poor defense (i.e. guys running around like chickens with their heads cut off resulting in offensive players wide open on the crease), poor fundamentals, poor clearing, getting destroyed in playoff games, lack of adapting to the change in the game, etc. They are tired of appearing to fix one issue and another one popping up.

If you want to make a comparison. Think of it as Philadelphia Eagles with Andy Reid. He did all the things you stated above but was still fired. At some point a coach losses the ability to adapt and the lockerroom starts to tune him out. This eventually worked out for both Reid and the Eagles. Reid immediately got another job and was revitalized - his offense with the Eagles was generally West Coast type but transformed in KC into a completely different offense - stretch type under Smith and Mahomes. It worked out for the Eagles, too. While they had a mediocre coach in Kelly they quickly fired him and found someone else in Pederson and won the Super Bowl 5 years after firing Reid.

If you want lax example, look at UVA. They were mired in mediocre under Dom. His contract wasn't renewed (fired) - 3 years later they are hoisting the trophy. Does that mean Hopkins would do the same? No, but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

(Note, I also agree with HOP16 that the coronavirus save DP's job). One interesting twist would be if Hopkins said they would give him another year and he said "no" I want a longterm contract 3-4 years. I wonder what would happen then.

Not Haugen.

1997 at Byrd.

Andrew Godfrey

Thanks. I’ll go take my PTSD meds now.

I believe that was the final straw for LaxFi at Byrd.

[WOMBAT, Mod Emeritus]

While I do suspect he comes back for at least another year...

Based on what? His stellar 2020 season, or the stellar dozen seasons preceding it?

You should all count yourselves LUCKY to have him. Look at the big picture! He develops good men and is a solid role model. Not just about W/L. Everybody thinks they can do better until then next guy faces the same and additional issues. The grass is NOT always greener. Not many upgrades available in that mold... there just isn't.

Uh, at the end of the day. It is absolutely about W/L. Being a nice guy might get you another year than if you were a jerk but at the end of the day, the top parameter that he is judge on is W/Ls. This aint rec league where everyone gets a trophy.

Uh, at the end of the day, its not college football or B-Ball. Winning is important but obviously more important to the fan base than anyone else.
Its a NON REVENUE SPORT. No one outside of this little lacrosse bubble cares! I think it is misguided to think its all about W/L. I get the athlete mentality, its what we are trained to think but its just not reality for lacrosse.... I have been on search committees and can tell you first hand that what most of these AD's care about most is a high value person who will run a respected, clean, trouble free, community friendly, high academic achieving and mostly full paying program of future donors. Its not rec league but its not the NFL either. Wins are a bonus.

Because this isn't a 1 year issue but a decade long issue. There are plenty of coaches that can run respected, clean programs, etc. and also be competitive with other peer organizations and every couple three years make the final four. That is not happening with DP.

Hopkins will have made 1 FF in the last 12 years. Even in between 87 and 2005 championships - Hopkins made 10 out of the 16 FFs. No one is arguing for that type of run because there are more competitive programs. But, there is no excuse for Hopkins only making 1 FF over 12 years. And to be honest, over the last twelve years, it isn't like any of their Hopkins QFs games were close such that only a dumb shot on an open goal by a middie (AJ Haugen?) allowed Duke to come back from 2 goals down with 2 minutes to win the QF game in OT.

They are asking for a return to being competitive against peer programs. They are tired of watching poor goalie play, poor defense (i.e. guys running around like chickens with their heads cut off resulting in offensive players wide open on the crease), poor fundamentals, poor clearing, getting destroyed in playoff games, lack of adapting to the change in the game, etc. They are tired of appearing to fix one issue and another one popping up.

If you want to make a comparison. Think of it as Philadelphia Eagles with Andy Reid. He did all the things you stated above but was still fired. At some point a coach losses the ability to adapt and the lockerroom starts to tune him out. This eventually worked out for both Reid and the Eagles. Reid immediately got another job and was revitalized - his offense with the Eagles was generally West Coast type but transformed in KC into a completely different offense - stretch type under Smith and Mahomes. It worked out for the Eagles, too. While they had a mediocre coach in Kelly they quickly fired him and found someone else in Pederson and won the Super Bowl 5 years after firing Reid.

If you want lax example, look at UVA. They were mired in mediocre under Dom. His contract wasn't renewed (fired) - 3 years later they are hoisting the trophy. Does that mean Hopkins would do the same? No, but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

(Note, I also agree with HOP16 that the coronavirus save DP's job). One interesting twist would be if Hopkins said they would give him another year and he said "no" I want a longterm contract 3-4 years. I wonder what would happen then.

Not Haugen.

1997 at Byrd.

Andrew Godfrey

Thanks. I’ll go take my PTSD meds now.

I believe that was the final straw for LaxFi at Byrd.

Yes, it was. 1995 was awful too, and there were several others.

[nyjay]

I made the Andy Reid comparison a couple of weeks ago - point being that there's just a time when change is necessary. I'm even willing to live with a Chip Kelly. Lest you forget, Chip's first year was a ton of fun (against Wash on MNF week one). Yes it did then get painful. But I'm OK if the next coach at Hop isn't there for 10 years. DP is a good guy and a good coach. The whole program is just unbelievably stale at this point and change is needed, even if the new guy isn't as good a coach as DP.