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Anybody watch Harvard's loss vs. UMass? UMass is a team that never gets a lot of attention but is "low key good" as they say. Wondering if this was a great UMass performance, an underwhelming Harvard one, or something in the middle.

The Orfling wrote: ↑Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:43 pm Anybody watch Harvard's loss vs. UMass? UMass is a team that never gets a lot of attention but is "low key good" as they say. Wondering if this was a great UMass performance, an underwhelming Harvard one, or something in the middle.

Harvard led most of the way, but UMass won 16 of the 25 FO's and kept right in it, then pulled away at the end.
Those 7 additional possessions were the difference as overall the game was otherwise pretty even.

UMass actually had 3 more TO's and 4 less (non-FO) GB's, and HU went 3 out of 7 on penalty opportunities, whereas UMass went 0 for 4. But UMass took 50 shots, only 25 on goal...but that was 3 more than HU with both tenders making 13 saves.

UMass has a plenty solid team, but that's a game that needs to be won.
Yale should handle them going away, given its strength at X.

Thanks, MDlaxfan76. UMass always plays Yale tough -- beat them in 2017 and gave them their closest game in the NCAA tournament last year until the final game vs. Duke -- and I am sure they always get up for their "in-state rival" Harvard.

I was doing the (very unscientific) "look at the schedule and predict results" exercise for Harvard and it seems like the Crimson will have their work cut out for them to finish over .500. I believe I heard from the parent of a graduating Harvard 2018 senior that Harvard's aggregate record was exactly .500 for the last four years (2015 - 2018) which really does seem tough to square with the talent coming onto Harvard Yard during that time period. Of course there's still lots of lacrosse to play.

The Orfling wrote: ↑Sat Feb 23, 2019 7:51 pm Thanks, MDlaxfan76. UMass always plays Yale tough -- beat them in 2017 and gave them their closest game in the NCAA tournament last year until the final game vs. Duke -- and I am sure they always get up for their "in-state rival" Harvard.

I was doing the (very unscientific) "look at the schedule and predict results" exercise for Harvard and it seems like the Crimson will have their work cut out for them to finish over .500. I believe I heard from the parent of a graduating Harvard 2018 senior that Harvard's aggregate record was exactly .500 for the last four years (2015 - 2018) which really does seem tough to square with the talent coming onto Harvard Yard during that time period. Of course there's still lots of lacrosse to play.

It's indeed "tough to square". A lot of factors, for sure.

Some 'snake bit' on injuries (but why is that?), some I'd argue due to the turnover in assistants, two of whom were disasters.

My son got most of his minutes in the net in 2015 when two AA level defenders were both out for the season. But more importantly, they haven't had a strong FOGO stay healthy for an entire season, and have generally suffered mightily as a result. Combine that with in general poor GB play by midfielders and it really doesn't matter how good some of the players may be. In that .500 2015 season, they were just 165-223 at X, 42.5%. Overall GB's, 433-482, almost the same differential. In some of the games they lost, the differential was crucial. E.g. In Dartmouth's upset in 2OT, the Big Green won 22 of 27 FO's, usually clean for a fast break. Otherwise that's a 7-5 regular season and an Ivy bid, likely an NCAA bid. Tough to win those games, though they did do so in 2 games when blown out at X versus BU and Cornell. That's been the achilles' heel, IMO, as they've had top notch rated FOGO's matriculate, yet for a variety of reasons they haven't produced as expected. Mostly due to injuries.

The following year was particularly disastrous as they were loaded with mature, proven players plus a great sophomore class. Should have been a strong NCAA bid year. Brutally bad coaching with new assistants destroyed that season IMO. Same group for 2017's 6-7 season, ridiculously bad locker room as a result. 2018 returned to positive territory, with new assistants, but with a much weaker schedule. 2019 tougher schedule again.

Head coach would seem to be in his last year, or at least that appeared to be the presumption among potential assistants for 2019, when looking for a replacement for O coordinator Justin Turri who jumped to Michigan after just one season at HU. I'd heard very good reports on Turri. They couldn't find a taker, so promoted their new Ops Director to a full Assistant job and brought in another Ops director.

I agree that it looks doubtful that this season will be better from a record perspective than 2017's 6-7 record, as that overall tough season began 4-0.

That all said, I wouldn't write-off this bunch of players as it's still quite early. We could well see them gel and upset some folks.

Ouch. Tough OT loss for the Crimson.

faircornell wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:24 pm Ouch. Tough OT loss for the Crimson.

Yikes. How much longer can this go on...

Ouch! Leading 10-3 with 9 min to go in the 3rd, win probability near 95%, and then … 8 unanswered goals by Holy Cross, including the 2OT game winner ….

CU77 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:58 pm Ouch! Leading 10-3 with 9 min to go in the 3rd, win probability near 95%, and then … 8 unanswered goals by Holy Cross, including the 2OT game winner ….

Harvard took a timeout in first OT. Successfully lost the ball on a shot clock violation. Way to draw it up

runrussellrun wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:52 pm

CU77 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:58 pm Ouch! Leading 10-3 with 9 min to go in the 3rd, win probability near 95%, and then … 8 unanswered goals by Holy Cross, including the 2OT game winner ….

Harvard took a timeout in first OT. Successfully lost the ball on a shot clock violation. Way to draw it up

What was amazing was that Harvard did not take a shot? At end of 4th, they took 3 but had to give the ball to HC when clock expired.

The HC FOGO got crazy hot down the stretch. Fun fact: He spends a ton of time working with the Harvard FOGO coach in the off season.

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:57 pm

runrussellrun wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:52 pm

CU77 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:58 pm Ouch! Leading 10-3 with 9 min to go in the 3rd, win probability near 95%, and then … 8 unanswered goals by Holy Cross, including the 2OT game winner ….

Harvard took a timeout in first OT. Successfully lost the ball on a shot clock violation. Way to draw it up

What was amazing was that Harvard did not take a shot? At end of 4th, they took 3 but had to give the ball to HC when clock expired.

Thinking the Harvard play by play time and sequence is a little off.

runrussellrun wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:01 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:57 pm

runrussellrun wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:52 pm

CU77 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:58 pm Ouch! Leading 10-3 with 9 min to go in the 3rd, win probability near 95%, and then … 8 unanswered goals by Holy Cross, including the 2OT game winner ….

Harvard took a timeout in first OT. Successfully lost the ball on a shot clock violation. Way to draw it up

What was amazing was that Harvard did not take a shot? At end of 4th, they took 3 but had to give the ball to HC when clock expired.

Thinking the Harvard play by play time and sequence is a little off.

Brutal loss. Young team.

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:04 pm

runrussellrun wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:01 pm

Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:57 pm

runrussellrun wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:52 pm

CU77 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:58 pm Ouch! Leading 10-3 with 9 min to go in the 3rd, win probability near 95%, and then … 8 unanswered goals by Holy Cross, including the 2OT game winner ….

Harvard took a timeout in first OT. Successfully lost the ball on a shot clock violation. Way to draw it up

What was amazing was that Harvard did not take a shot? At end of 4th, they took 3 but had to give the ball to HC when clock expired.

Thinking the Harvard play by play time and sequence is a little off.

Brutal loss. Young team.

Yup, Holy Cross has some younglings playing.

MDlaxfan76: Harvard led most of the way, but UMass won 16 of the 25 FO's and kept right in it, then pulled away at the end.
Those 7 additional possessions were the difference as overall the game was otherwise pretty even.

One of our little burgh's best ever FO guys chose HU. Guess I was naive when I assumed HU would be flush at X for years. An unfair expectation on my part. Hell lacrosse is ephemeral. He remains a terrific young man and will no doubt be successful in whatever endeavor he chooses to pursue.

Son las Cosas de la Vida.

Gave up 8 straight unanswered goals to lose in 2OT is horrendous and demoralizing. Yikes. To Holy Cross nonetheless!

they might as well bring back Coach A at this point

Rick's Frisbie, through his family foundation, funds the head coach's chair. Is it time to find a different person to sit in that seat? Certainly, Rick looks as if he could step on the field tomorrow and play. He's had the Midas touch in so many endeavors. As such, I wonder if he'd consider taking the coaching reins?

Yikes, 22 of 26 FO's, 58 shots to 35 shots.

Sure can't blame HU's tender, who made either 24 saves (according to IL) or 19 saves according to HU box score. Either way, outstanding.

Graff with 6 points.

IL's write-up:

Holy Cross executed one of the great comebacks of the 2019 season, scoring eight-straight goals to top Harvard, 11-10, in double-overtime.

Check out the full StringKing Scoreboard for all of the stats and scores from Tuesday night's slate of games.

The decisive goal in second overtime came when Sean Mullaney dodged down the alley and fed Will Spangenberg, who touched it in and completed the comeback. The Crusaders were down 10-3 early in the third, and their run started with three goals in less than 30 seconds to end the quarter, two of them Mullaney scores.

Face-off specialist Dan O’Connell won 18 of 26 draws, going 11 of 13 from the second half through the second overtime. Holy Cross outshot Harvard 61 to 34, out-groundballed 31 to 23 and cleared a perfect 15 of 15.

Holy Cross beat Harvard by the same score —also in double-overtime— last season.

Harvard goalie had Kyle Mullin had 24 saves, including three in the first overtime that included a point-blank stop.

Connor Waldron (2, 1), Kevin Kodzis (2G), Mullaney (3, 2), Spangenberg (1, 2) and Justin Lynskey (1, 1) had multi-point games.

Ryan Graff scored four goals and two assists for the 0-3 Crimson, who face Hartford on Saturday. Holy Cross is at Loyola.

Game announcers said Harvard has wilted in 2nd half in all games this year...

Is this team in shape?

tech37 wrote: ↑Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:14 pm Game announcers said Harvard has wilted in 2nd half in all games this year...

Is this team in shape?

I do know that 2013-2016 teams were 'in shape'. Very much so.
IMO, however, to the point of potentially contributing to unnecessary injury, and/or 'dead legs' without adequate recovery times.

Someone with closer insight would have to respond to the current season.