Same Party, Different House
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Fitting that Geiersbach & Aldave had a hand in 6 out of UNC’s 8 goals & the other 2 being scored on free positions. Good for them
Yep. And they're not the only ones.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:53 pm Who's joking? Once the possession clock came into being -- and the players had to win the game on the field -- Northwestern became a good, not great, team.
My heart is always with Northwestern, as well—(except when they play Boston College).LarryGamLax wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 5:44 pm Am I missing something? Why is NU being battered about for using strategy and the clock to win back-to-back Championships(2011, 2012) against more talented opponents? Both of the teams they beat should have pressured out, taken the ball and rammed it in the goal. The problem is neither did that and they both lost. Kudos to KAH. She didn't always do that when she had more talent overall. Remember what she did in 2009? And if I were on her staff, I would have pushing to set the National Record. HA!
Northwestern is STILL a great program, IMO. A lot of you also said that Maryland wasn't a great program anymore after the last two seasons, BUT, I guess you changed your minds, huh? You're entitled to do that. It's just that I don't understand how some can kick dirt on a non-great program going to their second consecutive Final Four, but throw praises of greatness to a program that has won 2 National Championships in the last eight years, but zero in the previous 19 years? I respect that program but I clearly see the flaws and I'm sure many of you do as well. You just act like you don't see them, but your eyesight is just fine when it comes to NU.
And once again to make it crystal clear...UNC by 5+ , but my heart is with NU.
I have no dog in this kennel but curious why you think this? They seem to be doing ok, at least this year. They average just under 16 gpg and give up an average of just over 11.5. Seems with in the realm of the other "successful" shot clock era teams. They have lost 4 this year. Their pace of play seems fairly consistent, at least to me from what I have seen.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 6:36 amI am being a little facetious. But I don't think the NU coaching staff has adapted to the shot clock era and the new pace of play the way some other coaches and staff did.OuttaNowhereWregget wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:18 amYou’re probably being facetious, I can’t tell, but there was a 6 year gap between the last national championship Northwestern won in 2012 and the advent of the shot clock in 2018.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:53 pmWho's joking? Once the possession clock came into being -- and the players had to win the game on the field -- Northwestern became a good, not great, team. Here's hoping UNC pounds them into a running clock by the third quarter.LarryGamLax wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:44 pmSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 6:32 am Hard to imagine North Carolina losing this game, since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions. Still, this should be a good game. Like the SBU-UNC game, I think the story of this game will end up being Carolina's defense giving Gilbert and Co. a long and difficult day. UNC 16-10.
Seacoaster polishing up his comedy act. "since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions." Yuck, Yuck Yuck. What a knee slapper! Ladies and Gentlemen, the comedy stylings of "Shecky Seacoaster".
Just can't let go of 2012, right? HA!
I simply cannot see how KAH and staff can come up with a realistic strategy that would slow down the UNC offense. Madison Doucette needs to have another 10-12 save game in order for the Wildcats to get the W. NU will score, but I know Taylor Moreno will make saves too. NU has to win at both ends and break even with the Draw...to win the game. However, UNC can play a solid all-around game and win by 5+.
I think we should start with the reality that I am an anonymous poster who knows a little about this game, criticizing a coaching staff that has multiple championships under their belts. So, there's that to consider.Bart wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 7:34 amI have no dog in this kennel but curious why you think this? They seem to be doing ok, at least this year. They average just under 16 gpg and give up an average of just over 11.5. Seems with in the realm of the other "successful" shot clock era teams. They have lost 4 this year. Their pace of play seems fairly consistent, at least to me from what I have seen.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 6:36 amI am being a little facetious. But I don't think the NU coaching staff has adapted to the shot clock era and the new pace of play the way some other coaches and staff did.OuttaNowhereWregget wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:18 amYou’re probably being facetious, I can’t tell, but there was a 6 year gap between the last national championship Northwestern won in 2012 and the advent of the shot clock in 2018.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:53 pmWho's joking? Once the possession clock came into being -- and the players had to win the game on the field -- Northwestern became a good, not great, team. Here's hoping UNC pounds them into a running clock by the third quarter.LarryGamLax wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:44 pmSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 6:32 am Hard to imagine North Carolina losing this game, since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions. Still, this should be a good game. Like the SBU-UNC game, I think the story of this game will end up being Carolina's defense giving Gilbert and Co. a long and difficult day. UNC 16-10.
Seacoaster polishing up his comedy act. "since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions." Yuck, Yuck Yuck. What a knee slapper! Ladies and Gentlemen, the comedy stylings of "Shecky Seacoaster".
Just can't let go of 2012, right? HA!
I simply cannot see how KAH and staff can come up with a realistic strategy that would slow down the UNC offense. Madison Doucette needs to have another 10-12 save game in order for the Wildcats to get the W. NU will score, but I know Taylor Moreno will make saves too. NU has to win at both ends and break even with the Draw...to win the game. However, UNC can play a solid all-around game and win by 5+.
How has KAH not adapted? UMD averages just over 16 gpg. They give up far fewer.
I think offensively they seem to have adapted fairly well. Defensively? I guess you can make the argument there. If you are going to go with goals against then there are many teams in worse shape......
You could argue that this is a year off thing and they will go back to something else next year I suppose.
Fair enough. You see things through your lens which is how we all see it. I took a look at the season statistics for the final four teams.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 8:26 amI think we should start with the reality that I am an anonymous poster who knows a little about this game, criticizing a coaching staff that has multiple championships under their belts. So, there's that to consider.Bart wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 7:34 amI have no dog in this kennel but curious why you think this? They seem to be doing ok, at least this year. They average just under 16 gpg and give up an average of just over 11.5. Seems with in the realm of the other "successful" shot clock era teams. They have lost 4 this year. Their pace of play seems fairly consistent, at least to me from what I have seen.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 6:36 amI am being a little facetious. But I don't think the NU coaching staff has adapted to the shot clock era and the new pace of play the way some other coaches and staff did.OuttaNowhereWregget wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:18 amSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:53 pmWho's joking? Once the possession clock came into being -- and the players had to win the game on the field -- Northwestern became a good, not great, team. Here's hoping UNC pounds them into a running clock by the third quarter.LarryGamLax wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:44 pmSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 6:32 am Hard to imagine North Carolina losing this game, since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions. Still, this should be a good game. Like the SBU-UNC game, I think the story of this game will end up being Carolina's defense giving Gilbert and Co. a long and difficult day. UNC 16-10.
Seacoaster polishing up his comedy act. "since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions." Yuck, Yuck Yuck. What a knee slapper! Ladies and Gentlemen, the comedy stylings of "Shecky Seacoaster".
Just can't let go of 2012, right? HA!
I simply cannot see how KAH and staff can come up with a realistic strategy that would slow down the UNC offense. Madison Doucette needs to have another 10-12 save game in order for the Wildcats to get the W. NU will score, but I know Taylor Moreno will make saves too. NU has to win at both ends and break even with the Draw...to win the game. However, UNC can play a solid all-around game and win by 5+.
You’re probably being facetious, I can’t tell, but there was a 6 year gap between the last national championship Northwestern won in 2012 and the advent of the shot clock in 2018.
How has KAH not adapted? UMD averages just over 16 gpg. They give up far fewer.
I think offensively they seem to have adapted fairly well. Defensively? I guess you can make the argument there. If you are going to go with goals against then there are many teams in worse shape......
You could argue that this is a year off thing and they will go back to something else next year I suppose.
And then there's the obvious bias: I just do not like the way NU plays the games. Their offense is not multi-dimensional, or interesting, or challenging. They rely on hero ball half of the time. This was particularly true when Scane was healthy: give the ball to Izzy, let her dodge, re-dodge, and maybe re-re-dodge and get a shot off. Even now, it is the Gilbert show. Nothing against those two athletes. But compared to the offenses of their peers -- UNC, UMD, BC -- they are easier to game plan for than any of the others. Over the course of a season, you try to develop more threats, and NU hasn't really done that, as far as I can see anyway.
I think it might be fairer to say that I am just a Wildcat-hating a**hat. Larry says it's 2012. He may be right.Bart wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 8:57 amFair enough. You see things through your lens which is how we all see it. I took a look at the season statistics for the final four teams.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 8:26 amI think we should start with the reality that I am an anonymous poster who knows a little about this game, criticizing a coaching staff that has multiple championships under their belts. So, there's that to consider.Bart wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 7:34 amI have no dog in this kennel but curious why you think this? They seem to be doing ok, at least this year. They average just under 16 gpg and give up an average of just over 11.5. Seems with in the realm of the other "successful" shot clock era teams. They have lost 4 this year. Their pace of play seems fairly consistent, at least to me from what I have seen.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 6:36 amI am being a little facetious. But I don't think the NU coaching staff has adapted to the shot clock era and the new pace of play the way some other coaches and staff did.OuttaNowhereWregget wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:18 amSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:53 pmWho's joking? Once the possession clock came into being -- and the players had to win the game on the field -- Northwestern became a good, not great, team. Here's hoping UNC pounds them into a running clock by the third quarter.LarryGamLax wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:44 pmSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 6:32 am Hard to imagine North Carolina losing this game, since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions. Still, this should be a good game. Like the SBU-UNC game, I think the story of this game will end up being Carolina's defense giving Gilbert and Co. a long and difficult day. UNC 16-10.
Seacoaster polishing up his comedy act. "since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions." Yuck, Yuck Yuck. What a knee slapper! Ladies and Gentlemen, the comedy stylings of "Shecky Seacoaster".
Just can't let go of 2012, right? HA!
I simply cannot see how KAH and staff can come up with a realistic strategy that would slow down the UNC offense. Madison Doucette needs to have another 10-12 save game in order for the Wildcats to get the W. NU will score, but I know Taylor Moreno will make saves too. NU has to win at both ends and break even with the Draw...to win the game. However, UNC can play a solid all-around game and win by 5+.
You’re probably being facetious, I can’t tell, but there was a 6 year gap between the last national championship Northwestern won in 2012 and the advent of the shot clock in 2018.
How has KAH not adapted? UMD averages just over 16 gpg. They give up far fewer.
I think offensively they seem to have adapted fairly well. Defensively? I guess you can make the argument there. If you are going to go with goals against then there are many teams in worse shape......
You could argue that this is a year off thing and they will go back to something else next year I suppose.
And then there's the obvious bias: I just do not like the way NU plays the games. Their offense is not multi-dimensional, or interesting, or challenging. They rely on hero ball half of the time. This was particularly true when Scane was healthy: give the ball to Izzy, let her dodge, re-dodge, and maybe re-re-dodge and get a shot off. Even now, it is the Gilbert show. Nothing against those two athletes. But compared to the offenses of their peers -- UNC, UMD, BC -- they are easier to game plan for than any of the others. Over the course of a season, you try to develop more threats, and NU hasn't really done that, as far as I can see anyway.
This is a list of the top 10 goal scorers in terms of goals scored:
NW: 74,49,44,29,20,18,17,17,16,15- with a total of 138 assists
UNC: 64,53,50,43,31,29,19,11,10,9-with a total of 187 assists
UMd:: 66,61,57,30,27,24,18,15,10,8-with a total of 143 assists
BC: 82,69,53,41,37,25,18,9,6,4-with a total of 142 assists
So it appears you are right. NW relies on Ms Gilbert more in terms of the second leading scorer. But in terms of overall breadth of scoring it seems that given the top 10 scorers NW is on par or better than almost everyone else. I also see hero ball as one person going 1 v 1 at the expense of everyone else. If that is the case it would suggest that the number of assists for each team playing the hero ball would be that much lower but over the season we see that each team with the exception of UNC is right around the same. UNC is clearly head and shoulders above the rest in this category (and why I like their offense so much).
Now granted I have not taken into account when and at what point in the game a goal is scored. That is an entirely different ball of wax and one well above my attention span. It also does not take into account who got the assists or when they were awarded, again well above my attention span.
This is also not to say you are wrong. I kind of thought the same when I started to look at things. I just find the data a bit different than what were my original thoughts.
Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 9:07 amI think it might be fairer to say that I am just a Wildcat-hating a**hat. Larry says it's 2012. He may be right.Bart wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 8:57 amFair enough. You see things through your lens which is how we all see it. I took a look at the season statistics for the final four teams.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 8:26 amI think we should start with the reality that I am an anonymous poster who knows a little about this game, criticizing a coaching staff that has multiple championships under their belts. So, there's that to consider.Bart wrote: ↑Thu May 26, 2022 7:34 amI have no dog in this kennel but curious why you think this? They seem to be doing ok, at least this year. They average just under 16 gpg and give up an average of just over 11.5. Seems with in the realm of the other "successful" shot clock era teams. They have lost 4 this year. Their pace of play seems fairly consistent, at least to me from what I have seen.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 6:36 amI am being a little facetious. But I don't think the NU coaching staff has adapted to the shot clock era and the new pace of play the way some other coaches and staff did.OuttaNowhereWregget wrote: ↑Wed May 25, 2022 3:18 amSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:53 pmWho's joking? Once the possession clock came into being -- and the players had to win the game on the field -- Northwestern became a good, not great, team. Here's hoping UNC pounds them into a running clock by the third quarter.LarryGamLax wrote: ↑Tue May 24, 2022 7:44 pmSeacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Fri May 20, 2022 6:32 am Hard to imagine North Carolina losing this game, since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions. Still, this should be a good game. Like the SBU-UNC game, I think the story of this game will end up being Carolina's defense giving Gilbert and Co. a long and difficult day. UNC 16-10.
Seacoaster polishing up his comedy act. "since NU can't run down the clock and reduce the game to four or five possessions." Yuck, Yuck Yuck. What a knee slapper! Ladies and Gentlemen, the comedy stylings of "Shecky Seacoaster".
Just can't let go of 2012, right? HA!
I simply cannot see how KAH and staff can come up with a realistic strategy that would slow down the UNC offense. Madison Doucette needs to have another 10-12 save game in order for the Wildcats to get the W. NU will score, but I know Taylor Moreno will make saves too. NU has to win at both ends and break even with the Draw...to win the game. However, UNC can play a solid all-around game and win by 5+.
You’re probably being facetious, I can’t tell, but there was a 6 year gap between the last national championship Northwestern won in 2012 and the advent of the shot clock in 2018.
How has KAH not adapted? UMD averages just over 16 gpg. They give up far fewer.
I think offensively they seem to have adapted fairly well. Defensively? I guess you can make the argument there. If you are going to go with goals against then there are many teams in worse shape......
You could argue that this is a year off thing and they will go back to something else next year I suppose.
And then there's the obvious bias: I just do not like the way NU plays the games. Their offense is not multi-dimensional, or interesting, or challenging. They rely on hero ball half of the time. This was particularly true when Scane was healthy: give the ball to Izzy, let her dodge, re-dodge, and maybe re-re-dodge and get a shot off. Even now, it is the Gilbert show. Nothing against those two athletes. But compared to the offenses of their peers -- UNC, UMD, BC -- they are easier to game plan for than any of the others. Over the course of a season, you try to develop more threats, and NU hasn't really done that, as far as I can see anyway.
This is a list of the top 10 goal scorers in terms of goals scored:
NW: 74,49,44,29,20,18,17,17,16,15- with a total of 138 assists
UNC: 64,53,50,43,31,29,19,11,10,9-with a total of 187 assists
UMd:: 66,61,57,30,27,24,18,15,10,8-with a total of 143 assists
BC: 82,69,53,41,37,25,18,9,6,4-with a total of 142 assists
So it appears you are right. NW relies on Ms Gilbert more in terms of the second leading scorer. But in terms of overall breadth of scoring it seems that given the top 10 scorers NW is on par or better than almost everyone else. I also see hero ball as one person going 1 v 1 at the expense of everyone else. If that is the case it would suggest that the number of assists for each team playing the hero ball would be that much lower but over the season we see that each team with the exception of UNC is right around the same. UNC is clearly head and shoulders above the rest in this category (and why I like their offense so much).
Now granted I have not taken into account when and at what point in the game a goal is scored. That is an entirely different ball of wax and one well above my attention span. It also does not take into account who got the assists or when they were awarded, again well above my attention span.
This is also not to say you are wrong. I kind of thought the same when I started to look at things. I just find the data a bit different than what were my original thoughts.
