January 6, 2021: Insurrection or “normal tourist” visitation?

[MDlaxfan76]

Possibly.

I think it's a big reach at this point to actually convict those most responsible for inciting the violence.

Which makes it no less important to fully investigate and understand...and if the evidence is sufficiently clear, to prosecute and convict.

Show trials have great value, especially in election years.

I don't expect any prosecutions unless they have the documentary and testimonial evidence necessary to convict on the charges (we ain't talking Senate politics). We don't have a kangaroo court system, and Garland appears to understand and respect that completely.

[MDlaxfan76]

It's a conspiracy cradle...Pelosi and Pence were in cahoots and wanted the rednecks to break into the building and threaten everyone's lives, heck they wanted to be martyrs...apparently, it was a huge error to shoot a first amendment protestor climbing through a window, spoiled the plan...

The sad part is that some people would believe what you are saying. IMO the answer is much more simple. The government did not see bad people crashing planes into our buildings. 20 years later our government never thought our own people would assault our own capital. In failing to prepare we have prepared to fail. If no other lesson was learned maybe this will be the last time any enraged horde of angry people ever choose to or be allowed to assault our capital building. It sounds like you have a wonderful relaxing cruise. My wife and I hope to do a Mediterranean cruise next year. Spain and Southern Italy are two places we want to see.

Thanks, but, well...I just tested positive for COVID. Sore throat, headache, achy, a little fever yesterday...but no difficulty breathing, loss of taste or smell, so likely Omicron. Hopefully on tail end of symptoms.

I'm not big on cruising as a way to vacation, but I do see the appeal. Hope you have a wonderful cruise next year to the Mediterranean.

Let me get this straight...

You of all people went on a cruise in the middle of a pandemic when we know Omicron is surging and breaking through? Amazing...

Yup, that's how much I love my wife.

Even without Covid looming much less raging, you'd normally have to pull my fingernails out to get me on one of these tourist trap cruises in the Caribbean. So, I initially took that tack back in early 2020 (pre COVID) when her family was booking a cruise for that coming summer...boy, was that a mistake. It's what they wanted to do, and it was the first time in over a decade that they would all be together at one time, 89-yr old mother with some dementia loved cruises...then COVID hit and we spent months arguing about whether we should be going on a cruise (I was big time in the doghouse)...then it was canceled, rebooked for Xmas-NY that year (worst week for my son's work)....then canceled...meanwhile I'd smartened up and shut up...then canceled and rebooked for last summer...canceled...but then they squeezed in a cruise with their mother (now heavily in dementia)...pretty disastrous given dementia, so they booked for this past week without mom, just 3 siblings and their kids and spouses etc...my son said he'd make it work...I shut up...Covid was waning...but then burst back...all on ship were vaccinated, tested immediately prior to going on ship, masked indoors, and half occupancy/density...but obviously not enough with Omicron. I'm not surprised. All family members boosted prior to trip. Niece and her fiance were in from Paris for trip, have tested negative.

My 65-yr-old basement dwelling, Trumpist Jan 6 Capitol steps, diabetes, brother-in-law is taking another cruise starting this Saturday and has two more scheduled later this spring...nuts.

We're back in Florida, hunkered down, quarantining. Symptoms persist. Ugh.

[dislaxxic]

“I’M JUST THERE TO OPEN THE ENVELOPES:” THE SELECT COMMITTEE AND DOJ INVESTIGATIONS CONVERGE AT MIKE PENCE

You might not understand this from following just traditional news outlets, but over the course of a year, the news-friendly January 6 Select Committee and even the public parts of the locked-down DOJ investigation have met at a common pivot point in their investigation of January 6: on Trump’s efforts to pressure Mike Pence to violate the Constitution. Trump did so, first, with personal pressure. Then he sent his mob.

The pressure on Pence is how Trump’s plotting in advance of January 6 affirmatively led directly to — not just through inaction, but through action — specific steps taken by confessed mobsters to assault the Capitol.

[snip]

There is a direct line of corrupt intent from the moment where Trump asked Pence, “If these people say you had the power, wouldn’t you want to [exercise it]?” and efforts that his mobsters — both those who planned this in advance and those who reacted to Trump’s incitement — made at the Capitol. Some of the most central players in the attack on the Capitol have testified under oath that they understood their goal to be pressuring Mike Pence. In pursuit of that, they broke into the Capitol, they assaulted cops, they occupied the Mike Pence’s seat.

Bolded text...them there are words describing a federal crime, boyz 'n grrls...

..

[CU88]

Classic video of Faux News from The Daily Show:

https://twitter.com/TheDailyShow/status ... 6034038786

[cradleandshoot]

It's a conspiracy cradle...Pelosi and Pence were in cahoots and wanted the rednecks to break into the building and threaten everyone's lives, heck they wanted to be martyrs...apparently, it was a huge error to shoot a first amendment protestor climbing through a window, spoiled the plan...

The sad part is that some people would believe what you are saying. IMO the answer is much more simple. The government did not see bad people crashing planes into our buildings. 20 years later our government never thought our own people would assault our own capital. In failing to prepare we have prepared to fail. If no other lesson was learned maybe this will be the last time any enraged horde of angry people ever choose to or be allowed to assault our capital building. It sounds like you have a wonderful relaxing cruise. My wife and I hope to do a Mediterranean cruise next year. Spain and Southern Italy are two places we want to see.

Thanks, but, well...I just tested positive for COVID. Sore throat, headache, achy, a little fever yesterday...but no difficulty breathing, loss of taste or smell, so likely Omicron. Hopefully on tail end of symptoms.

I'm not big on cruising as a way to vacation, but I do see the appeal. Hope you have a wonderful cruise next year to the Mediterranean.

Let me get this straight...

You of all people went on a cruise in the middle of a pandemic when we know Omicron is surging and breaking through? Amazing...

Yup, that's how much I love my wife.

Even without Covid looming much less raging, you'd normally have to pull my fingernails out to get me on one of these tourist trap cruises in the Caribbean. So, I initially took that tack back in early 2020 (pre COVID) when her family was booking a cruise for that coming summer...boy, was that a mistake. It's what they wanted to do, and it was the first time in over a decade that they would all be together at one time, 89-yr old mother with some dementia loved cruises...then COVID hit and we spent months arguing about whether we should be going on a cruise (I was big time in the doghouse)...then it was canceled, rebooked for Xmas-NY that year (worst week for my son's work)....then canceled...meanwhile I'd smartened up and shut up...then canceled and rebooked for last summer...canceled...but then they squeezed in a cruise with their mother (now heavily in dementia)...pretty disastrous given dementia, so they booked for this past week without mom, just 3 siblings and their kids and spouses etc...my son said he'd make it work...I shut up...Covid was waning...but then burst back...all on ship were vaccinated, tested immediately prior to going on ship, masked indoors, and half occupancy/density...but obviously not enough with Omicron. I'm not surprised. All family members boosted prior to trip. Niece and her fiance were in from Paris for trip, have tested negative.

My 65-yr-old basement dwelling, Trumpist Jan 6 Capitol steps, diabetes, brother-in-law is taking another cruise starting this Saturday and has two more scheduled later this spring...nuts.

We're back in Florida, hunkered down, quarantining. Symptoms persist. Ugh.

What goes around comes around. Your only priority is to take care of yourself and your immediate family. Screw your brother in law. I don't say that to be mean. He should know better . He can't afford to get sick. He doesn't understand the risk factors involved??

[cradleandshoot]

Classic video of Faux News from The Daily Show:

https://twitter.com/TheDailyShow/status ... 6034038786

A faux news report filtered via another source.

[PizzaSnake]

It's a conspiracy cradle...Pelosi and Pence were in cahoots and wanted the rednecks to break into the building and threaten everyone's lives, heck they wanted to be martyrs...apparently, it was a huge error to shoot a first amendment protestor climbing through a window, spoiled the plan...

The sad part is that some people would believe what you are saying. IMO the answer is much more simple. The government did not see bad people crashing planes into our buildings. 20 years later our government never thought our own people would assault our own capital. In failing to prepare we have prepared to fail. If no other lesson was learned maybe this will be the last time any enraged horde of angry people ever choose to or be allowed to assault our capital building. It sounds like you have a wonderful relaxing cruise. My wife and I hope to do a Mediterranean cruise next year. Spain and Southern Italy are two places we want to see.

Thanks, but, well...I just tested positive for COVID. Sore throat, headache, achy, a little fever yesterday...but no difficulty breathing, loss of taste or smell, so likely Omicron. Hopefully on tail end of symptoms.

I'm not big on cruising as a way to vacation, but I do see the appeal. Hope you have a wonderful cruise next year to the Mediterranean.

Let me get this straight...

You of all people went on a cruise in the middle of a pandemic when we know Omicron is surging and breaking through? Amazing...

Yup, that's how much I love my wife.

Even without Covid looming much less raging, you'd normally have to pull my fingernails out to get me on one of these tourist trap cruises in the Caribbean. So, I initially took that tack back in early 2020 (pre COVID) when her family was booking a cruise for that coming summer...boy, was that a mistake. It's what they wanted to do, and it was the first time in over a decade that they would all be together at one time, 89-yr old mother with some dementia loved cruises...then COVID hit and we spent months arguing about whether we should be going on a cruise (I was big time in the doghouse)...then it was canceled, rebooked for Xmas-NY that year (worst week for my son's work)....then canceled...meanwhile I'd smartened up and shut up...then canceled and rebooked for last summer...canceled...but then they squeezed in a cruise with their mother (now heavily in dementia)...pretty disastrous given dementia, so they booked for this past week without mom, just 3 siblings and their kids and spouses etc...my son said he'd make it work...I shut up...Covid was waning...but then burst back...all on ship were vaccinated, tested immediately prior to going on ship, masked indoors, and half occupancy/density...but obviously not enough with Omicron. I'm not surprised. All family members boosted prior to trip. Niece and her fiance were in from Paris for trip, have tested negative.

My 65-yr-old basement dwelling, Trumpist Jan 6 Capitol steps, diabetes, brother-in-law is taking another cruise starting this Saturday and has two more scheduled later this spring...nuts.

We're back in Florida, hunkered down, quarantining. Symptoms persist. Ugh.

Be sure to see him off with a cheery “bon voyage!!”

[cradleandshoot]

MD I hope you get well ASAP. We don't agree on much but this forum is better off because of your opinions. I have learned a lot from your posts. IMO that knowledge comes from paying attention to people you may not agree with.

[ardilla secreta]

It's a conspiracy cradle...Pelosi and Pence were in cahoots and wanted the rednecks to break into the building and threaten everyone's lives, heck they wanted to be martyrs...apparently, it was a huge error to shoot a first amendment protestor climbing through a window, spoiled the plan...

The sad part is that some people would believe what you are saying. IMO the answer is much more simple. The government did not see bad people crashing planes into our buildings. 20 years later our government never thought our own people would assault our own capital. In failing to prepare we have prepared to fail. If no other lesson was learned maybe this will be the last time any enraged horde of angry people ever choose to or be allowed to assault our capital building. It sounds like you have a wonderful relaxing cruise. My wife and I hope to do a Mediterranean cruise next year. Spain and Southern Italy are two places we want to see.

Thanks, but, well...I just tested positive for COVID. Sore throat, headache, achy, a little fever yesterday...but no difficulty breathing, loss of taste or smell, so likely Omicron. Hopefully on tail end of symptoms.

I'm not big on cruising as a way to vacation, but I do see the appeal. Hope you have a wonderful cruise next year to the Mediterranean.

Let me get this straight...

You of all people went on a cruise in the middle of a pandemic when we know Omicron is surging and breaking through? Amazing...

Yup, that's how much I love my wife.

Even without Covid looming much less raging, you'd normally have to pull my fingernails out to get me on one of these tourist trap cruises in the Caribbean. So, I initially took that tack back in early 2020 (pre COVID) when her family was booking a cruise for that coming summer...boy, was that a mistake. It's what they wanted to do, and it was the first time in over a decade that they would all be together at one time, 89-yr old mother with some dementia loved cruises...then COVID hit and we spent months arguing about whether we should be going on a cruise (I was big time in the doghouse)...then it was canceled, rebooked for Xmas-NY that year (worst week for my son's work)....then canceled...meanwhile I'd smartened up and shut up...then canceled and rebooked for last summer...canceled...but then they squeezed in a cruise with their mother (now heavily in dementia)...pretty disastrous given dementia, so they booked for this past week without mom, just 3 siblings and their kids and spouses etc...my son said he'd make it work...I shut up...Covid was waning...but then burst back...all on ship were vaccinated, tested immediately prior to going on ship, masked indoors, and half occupancy/density...but obviously not enough with Omicron. I'm not surprised. All family members boosted prior to trip. Niece and her fiance were in from Paris for trip, have tested negative.

My 65-yr-old basement dwelling, Trumpist Jan 6 Capitol steps, diabetes, brother-in-law is taking another cruise starting this Saturday and has two more scheduled later this spring...nuts.

We're back in Florida, hunkered down, quarantining. Symptoms persist. Ugh.

What’s next? Riding your Vespa to Sturgis?

[jhu72]

It's a conspiracy cradle...Pelosi and Pence were in cahoots and wanted the rednecks to break into the building and threaten everyone's lives, heck they wanted to be martyrs...apparently, it was a huge error to shoot a first amendment protestor climbing through a window, spoiled the plan...

The sad part is that some people would believe what you are saying. IMO the answer is much more simple. The government did not see bad people crashing planes into our buildings. 20 years later our government never thought our own people would assault our own capital. In failing to prepare we have prepared to fail. If no other lesson was learned maybe this will be the last time any enraged horde of angry people ever choose to or be allowed to assault our capital building. It sounds like you have a wonderful relaxing cruise. My wife and I hope to do a Mediterranean cruise next year. Spain and Southern Italy are two places we want to see.

Thanks, but, well...I just tested positive for COVID. Sore throat, headache, achy, a little fever yesterday...but no difficulty breathing, loss of taste or smell, so likely Omicron. Hopefully on tail end of symptoms.

I'm not big on cruising as a way to vacation, but I do see the appeal. Hope you have a wonderful cruise next year to the Mediterranean.

Let me get this straight...

You of all people went on a cruise in the middle of a pandemic when we know Omicron is surging and breaking through? Amazing...

Yup, that's how much I love my wife.

Even without Covid looming much less raging, you'd normally have to pull my fingernails out to get me on one of these tourist trap cruises in the Caribbean. So, I initially took that tack back in early 2020 (pre COVID) when her family was booking a cruise for that coming summer...boy, was that a mistake. It's what they wanted to do, and it was the first time in over a decade that they would all be together at one time, 89-yr old mother with some dementia loved cruises...then COVID hit and we spent months arguing about whether we should be going on a cruise (I was big time in the doghouse)...then it was canceled, rebooked for Xmas-NY that year (worst week for my son's work)....then canceled...meanwhile I'd smartened up and shut up...then canceled and rebooked for last summer...canceled...but then they squeezed in a cruise with their mother (now heavily in dementia)...pretty disastrous given dementia, so they booked for this past week without mom, just 3 siblings and their kids and spouses etc...my son said he'd make it work...I shut up...Covid was waning...but then burst back...all on ship were vaccinated, tested immediately prior to going on ship, masked indoors, and half occupancy/density...but obviously not enough with Omicron. I'm not surprised. All family members boosted prior to trip. Niece and her fiance were in from Paris for trip, have tested negative.

My 65-yr-old basement dwelling, Trumpist Jan 6 Capitol steps, diabetes, brother-in-law is taking another cruise starting this Saturday and has two more scheduled later this spring...nuts.

We're back in Florida, hunkered down, quarantining. Symptoms persist. Ugh.

... you've had a lobotomy right?

[CU88]

Classic video of Faux News from The Daily Show:

https://twitter.com/TheDailyShow/status ... 6034038786

A faux news report filtered via another source.

by cradleandshoot » Fri Aug 13, 2021 8:57 am
Mr moderator, deactivate my account.
You have heck this forum up to making it nothing more than a joke. I hope you are happy.
This is cradle and shoot signing out.

[old salt]

Possibly.

I think it's a big reach at this point to actually convict those most responsible for inciting the violence.

Which makes it no less important to fully investigate and understand...and if the evidence is sufficiently clear, to prosecute and convict.

Show trials have great value, especially in election years.

I don't expect any prosecutions unless they have the documentary and testimonial evidence necessary to convict on the charges (we ain't talking Senate politics). We don't have a kangaroo court system, and Garland appears to understand and respect that completely.

I was referring to the House Select Comm. Do you expect any referrals for prosecution from them which will result in convictions ? If not, that makes them a show trial -- imo.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Possibly.

I think it's a big reach at this point to actually convict those most responsible for inciting the violence.

Which makes it no less important to fully investigate and understand...and if the evidence is sufficiently clear, to prosecute and convict.

Show trials have great value, especially in election years.

I don't expect any prosecutions unless they have the documentary and testimonial evidence necessary to convict on the charges (we ain't talking Senate politics). We don't have a kangaroo court system, and Garland appears to understand and respect that completely.

I was referring to the House Select Comm. Do you expect any referrals for prosecution from them which will result in convictions ? If not, that makes them a show trial -- imo.

[CU88]

By Jimmy Carter

Mr. Carter was the 39th president of the United States.

One year ago, a violent mob, guided by unscrupulous politicians, stormed the Capitol and almost succeeded in preventing the democratic transfer of power. All four of us former presidents condemned their actions and affirmed the legitimacy of the 2020 election. There followed a brief hope that the insurrection would shock the nation into addressing the toxic polarization that threatens our democracy.

However, one year on, promoters of the lie that the election was stolen have taken over one political party and stoked distrust in our electoral systems. These forces exert power and influence through relentless disinformation, which continues to turn Americans against Americans. According to the Survey Center on American Life, 36 percent of Americans — almost 100 million adults across the political spectrum — agree that “the traditional American way of life is disappearing so fast that we may have to use force to save it.” The Washington Post recently reported that roughly 40 percent of Republicans believe that violent action against the government is sometimes justified.

Politicians in my home state of Georgia, as well as in others, such as Texas and Florida, have leveraged the distrust they have created to enact laws that empower partisan legislatures to intervene in election processes. They seek to win by any means, and many Americans are being persuaded to think and act likewise, threatening to collapse the foundations of our security and democracy with breathtaking speed. I now fear that what we have fought so hard to achieve globally — the right to free, fair elections, unhindered by strongman politicians who seek nothing more than to grow their own power — has become dangerously fragile at home.

After I left the White House and founded the Carter Center, we worked to promote free, fair and orderly elections across the globe. I led dozens of election observation missions in Africa, Latin America and Asia, starting with Panama in 1989, where I put a simple question to administrators: “Are you honest officials or thieves?” At each election, my wife, Rosalynn, and I were moved by the courage and commitment of thousands of citizens walking miles and waiting in line from dusk to dawn to cast their first ballots in free elections, renewing hope for themselves and their nations and taking their first steps to self-governance. But I have also seen how new democratic systems — and sometimes even established ones — can fall to military juntas or power-hungry despots. Sudan and Myanmar are two recent examples.

For American democracy to endure, we must demand that our leaders and candidates uphold the ideals of freedom and adhere to high standards of conduct.

First, while citizens can disagree on policies, people of all political stripes must agree on fundamental constitutional principles and norms of fairness, civility and respect for the rule of law. Citizens should be able to participate easily in transparent, safe and secure electoral processes. Claims of election irregularities should be submitted in good faith for adjudication by the courts, with all participants agreeing to accept the findings. And the election process should be conducted peacefully, free of intimidation and violence.

Second, we must push for reforms that ensure the security and accessibility of our elections and ensure public confidence in the accuracy of results. Phony claims of illegal voting and pointless multiple audits only detract from democratic ideals.

Third, we must resist the polarization that is reshaping our identities around politics. We must focus on a few core truths: that we are all human, we are all Americans and we have common hopes for our communities and our country to thrive. We must find ways to re-engage across the divide, respectfully and constructively, by holding civil conversations with family, friends and co-workers and standing up collectively to the forces dividing us.

Fourth, violence has no place in our politics, and we must act urgently to pass or strengthen laws to reverse the trends of character assassination, intimidation and the presence of armed militias at events. We must protect our election officials — who are trusted friends and neighbors of many of us — from threats to their safety. Law enforcement must have the power to address these issues and engage in a national effort to come to terms with the past and present of racial injustice.

Lastly, the spread of disinformation, especially on social media, must be addressed. We must reform these platforms and get in the habit of seeking out accurate information. Corporate America and religious communities should encourage respect for democratic norms, participation in elections and efforts to counter disinformation.

Our great nation now teeters on the brink of a widening abyss. Without immediate action, we are at genuine risk of civil conflict and losing our precious democracy. Americans must set aside differences and work together before it is too late.

[MDlaxfan76]

It's a conspiracy cradle...Pelosi and Pence were in cahoots and wanted the rednecks to break into the building and threaten everyone's lives, heck they wanted to be martyrs...apparently, it was a huge error to shoot a first amendment protestor climbing through a window, spoiled the plan...

The sad part is that some people would believe what you are saying. IMO the answer is much more simple. The government did not see bad people crashing planes into our buildings. 20 years later our government never thought our own people would assault our own capital. In failing to prepare we have prepared to fail. If no other lesson was learned maybe this will be the last time any enraged horde of angry people ever choose to or be allowed to assault our capital building. It sounds like you have a wonderful relaxing cruise. My wife and I hope to do a Mediterranean cruise next year. Spain and Southern Italy are two places we want to see.

Thanks, but, well...I just tested positive for COVID. Sore throat, headache, achy, a little fever yesterday...but no difficulty breathing, loss of taste or smell, so likely Omicron. Hopefully on tail end of symptoms.

I'm not big on cruising as a way to vacation, but I do see the appeal. Hope you have a wonderful cruise next year to the Mediterranean.

Let me get this straight...

You of all people went on a cruise in the middle of a pandemic when we know Omicron is surging and breaking through? Amazing...

Yup, that's how much I love my wife.

Even without Covid looming much less raging, you'd normally have to pull my fingernails out to get me on one of these tourist trap cruises in the Caribbean. So, I initially took that tack back in early 2020 (pre COVID) when her family was booking a cruise for that coming summer...boy, was that a mistake. It's what they wanted to do, and it was the first time in over a decade that they would all be together at one time, 89-yr old mother with some dementia loved cruises...then COVID hit and we spent months arguing about whether we should be going on a cruise (I was big time in the doghouse)...then it was canceled, rebooked for Xmas-NY that year (worst week for my son's work)....then canceled...meanwhile I'd smartened up and shut up...then canceled and rebooked for last summer...canceled...but then they squeezed in a cruise with their mother (now heavily in dementia)...pretty disastrous given dementia, so they booked for this past week without mom, just 3 siblings and their kids and spouses etc...my son said he'd make it work...I shut up...Covid was waning...but then burst back...all on ship were vaccinated, tested immediately prior to going on ship, masked indoors, and half occupancy/density...but obviously not enough with Omicron. I'm not surprised. All family members boosted prior to trip. Niece and her fiance were in from Paris for trip, have tested negative.

My 65-yr-old basement dwelling, Trumpist Jan 6 Capitol steps, diabetes, brother-in-law is taking another cruise starting this Saturday and has two more scheduled later this spring...nuts.

We're back in Florida, hunkered down, quarantining. Symptoms persist. Ugh.

What goes around comes around. Your only priority is to take care of yourself and your immediate family. Screw your brother in law. I don't say that to be mean. He should know better . He can't afford to get sick. He doesn't understand the risk factors involved??

I've "explained" my brother-in-law a few times...'on the spectrum'.
But I love my wife...

[MDlaxfan76]

Possibly.

I think it's a big reach at this point to actually convict those most responsible for inciting the violence.

Which makes it no less important to fully investigate and understand...and if the evidence is sufficiently clear, to prosecute and convict.

Show trials have great value, especially in election years.

I don't expect any prosecutions unless they have the documentary and testimonial evidence necessary to convict on the charges (we ain't talking Senate politics). We don't have a kangaroo court system, and Garland appears to understand and respect that completely.

I was referring to the House Select Comm. Do you expect any referrals for prosecution from them which will result in convictions ? If not, that makes them a show trial -- imo.

Yes, I do expect some referrals, we've already seen a couple. And I expect they'll result in convictions, yes.

How many more will depend on the evidence.

The House Select committee's job isn't prosecutorial, it's to examine and reveal all the facts they can and develop legislation to address going forward...that's what I expect them to do.

[dislaxxic]

Navarro’s Nonsense Narrative

Navarro ranks high among officials from the Trump administration whose words cannot be believed. He told the Daily Beast that his role was to supply Republicans with the evidence of voter fraud that formed “the legal predicate” for the plan. But in a December 2020 analysis of Navarro’s compilation of “evidence” — entitled “This might be the most embarrassing document created by a White House staffer”—the Washington Post’s Philip Bump wrote that Navarro’s document “throws out as near-certainties things that are unfounded, misrepresented or unimportant.”

His record of fabricating for personal advantage precedes his time in the White House. The New York Times reported that more than a dozen times in his academic books, he falsely quoted a fictitious expert he created, Ron Vara—a play on his own name. (Academics, of course, aren’t supposed to make up sources to confirm their theses, although of course Donald Trump has long had a penchant for doing something similar.)

The rules governing intellectual honesty are not the only ones with which Navarro has played fast and loose. He holds the dubious distinction, along with Kellyanne Conway, of being one of the few federal officials that the Office of Special Counsel has ever found to have knowingly and willfully violated the Hatch Act—the law prohibiting U.S. government employees from partisan campaigning on the taxpayer’s dime. While appearing on TV and in his capacity as director of the White House Office of Trade and Manufacturing Policy, and while using his official Twitter account, he attacked Joe Biden and Kamala Harris. Before the 2020 election, he also traveled to six swing states with glossy, economy-promoting binders that were “designed to sell the president to residents” there.

..

[MDlaxfan76]

Navarro’s Nonsense Narrative

Navarro ranks high among officials from the Trump administration whose words cannot be believed. He told the Daily Beast that his role was to supply Republicans with the evidence of voter fraud that formed “the legal predicate” for the plan. But in a December 2020 analysis of Navarro’s compilation of “evidence” — entitled “This might be the most embarrassing document created by a White House staffer”—the Washington Post’s Philip Bump wrote that Navarro’s document “throws out as near-certainties things that are unfounded, misrepresented or unimportant.”

His record of fabricating for personal advantage precedes his time in the White House. The New York Times reported that more than a dozen times in his academic books, he falsely quoted a fictitious expert he created, Ron Vara—a play on his own name. (Academics, of course, aren’t supposed to make up sources to confirm their theses, although of course Donald Trump has long had a penchant for doing something similar.)

The rules governing intellectual honesty are not the only ones with which Navarro has played fast and loose. He holds the dubious distinction, along with Kellyanne Conway, of being one of the few federal officials that the Office of Special Counsel has ever found to have knowingly and willfully violated the Hatch Act—the law prohibiting U.S. government employees from partisan campaigning on the taxpayer’s dime. While appearing on TV and in his capacity as director of the White House Office of Trade and Manufacturing Policy, and while using his official Twitter account, he attacked Joe Biden and Kamala Harris. Before the 2020 election, he also traveled to six swing states with glossy, economy-promoting binders that were “designed to sell the president to residents” there.

..

Navarro definitely deserves to go to jail...but the interesting thing here is his claim that so many were in on it.

[seacoaster]

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... ix/621167/

In the year since the Capitol, and American democracy, was savagely attacked, the beloved institution where I worked during earlier parts of my career, the Department of Justice, has been eerily silent on many events of that day. True, the department has done a terrific job at prosecuting some of the rank-and-file attackers, but thus far it has made no peep about investigations into former President Donald Trump, let alone his coterie of enablers, such as the former DOJ official Jeffrey Clark and former White House Chief of Staff Mark Meadows, or his ostensible attorneys, John Eastman and Rudy Giuliani. This investigation into high-level wrongdoing is the greatest test an attorney general could face. And right now, despite what he said in yesterday’s generally good speech, it is worth worrying about whether Merrick Garland is failing that test.

Caveats abound. Perhaps Garland’s critics have it wrong, and the silence about whether he is investigating Trump and his enablers is actually evidence of his supreme competence. Garland dropped hints in his speech yesterday that could suggest the existence of such an investigation, for example, when he said the department “remains committed to holding all January 6 perpetrators, at any level, accountable.” We are talking about a legendary public servant, someone who steered the Oklahoma City–bombing investigation to success as a Justice Department lawyer and later, in his two decades serving on our nation’s second-highest court, was never reversed once by the Supreme Court. Criminal investigations are generally secret, and perhaps what is going on is that Garland has proceeded apace, just not publicly. If so, the critics are premature, and Garland is doing exactly what he is supposed to do.

But what if that isn’t right? There is so far zero evidence of an actual investigation into Trump and his advisers. It’s been an entire year, and the governing U.S. Attorney’s Manual, which establishes the rules for federal prosecution, says, “When the community needs to be reassured that the appropriate law enforcement agency is investigating a matter … comments about or confirmation of an ongoing investigation may be necessary.” Moreover, if such an investigation were happening, it is likely that we would have learned of it by now, either through leaks or an interviewee saying something (or someone trying to block the inquiry through a public lawsuit, as the Trumps have done in New York). Law-enforcement officials know you can’t easily start such interviews a year or more after the fact—evidence disappears (a known issue with Trump folks) and memories fade. So it is very much worth worrying about whether the caution Garland cultivated as a judge—for you don’t sit on the nation’s second-highest court for two decades and avoid reversal without a heaping amount of caution—is driving his decision making today. If so, what would be the harm in “moving on” from what happened, as many top Republicans have argued?

Here’s the harm: The essence of the rule of law is to treat like parties equally. That’s why Lady Justice appears blindfolded, because she is to dole out justice impartially. I teach my criminal-law students that this is a “same yardstick” principle—what law is, at bottom, is a command to judge people according to the same yardstick, whether you like them or not. And that means that if there is serious evidence of crime, you don’t look the other way, no matter how hard prosecution may be. At the same time, that principle doesn’t mean Garland ought to be announcing criminal charges against Trump and his pals right now. Merrick Garland is the attorney general, not Santa Claus. It merely means that people, including high-ranking government officials, need to be interviewed and documents examined to determine whether probable cause exists. The yardstick principle asks us to pretend that those responsible were Democrats, and to use that thought experiment to decide whether an investigation is warranted.

When it comes to January 6, Attorney General Garland must realize that this yardstick points in a clear direction. As one senior government official put it, “There is no question—none—that President Trump is practically and morally responsible for provoking the events of the day. No question about it. The people who stormed this building believed they were acting on the wishes and instructions of their President … The leader of the free world cannot spend weeks thundering that shadowy forces are stealing our country and then feign surprise when people believe him and do reckless things.”

Moreover, given the public record already available—including evidence of “war rooms” at the Willard Hotel, bogus legal memos that circulated among senior government leaders, and even a member of Congress who is known to have worn body armor that day—it’s very hard to see how an investigation into all of this wouldn’t be required. To fail to investigate government officials, including the former president, who had to know that the attempt was to interfere with the counting of the vote, to say nothing of its potential for accompanying violence, is fantastically dangerous. The whole point of criminal law is to provide societal condemnation of evil acts and to deter them in the future. If government leaders and their private army of advisers can get away with encouraging a mob to, in 2021, stop one of our nation’s most solemn functions, the counting of electoral votes, what is to stop them from trying again in any other year?

Fortunately, criminal law provides serious sanctions for such behavior. It’s a crime, punishable by 20 years in jail, if someone “corruptly … impedes any official proceeding, or attempts to do so.” That’s just one of several possible laws at issue, but this one happens to have been upheld already by three different federal judges in criminal cases of those who attacked the Capitol on January 6. Two of those three judges were appointed by Trump.

The special committee in Congress examining these events can of course bring certain facts and behavior to light. But Congress is a poor man’s substitute for the awesome investigatory powers of the Justice Department. The DOJ’s prosecutors and agents know exactly how to conduct a criminal investigation, and have an array of law-enforcement tools available to them. And though Justice Louis Brandeis was right about sunlight being a disinfectant, when the microbes attack our democratic lifeblood—the functioning of elections—mere transparency is not going to be enough. It will take jail.

Our political system is based on the belief that an elected leader would not abuse their powers to stay in office. Entire fields of law are governed by the idea that government officials should not be second-guessed, and that their actions are presumed to be regular and entitled to deference. For the first 233 years of our republic, that view largely made sense, as presidents didn’t attempt to gain office through trying to nullify the public’s votes. But a world in which presidents do that sort of thing is markedly different: It allows someone to wrongfully gain the presidency, and then to wield the very same massive set of powers as their predecessors. That is why this investigation is so different from any other. Nothing less is at stake than protecting the architecture of the U.S. government. Right now, members of Congress who look complicit in the January 6 attack are refusing to cooperate with the congressional investigation, emboldened by their belief that there is no serious risk of Justice Department prosecution. A DOJ investigation would change that. It speaks to Attorney General Garland’s character that he has handled the investigation with so much tact. But we are at a national crossroads. If Garland doesn’t speak out about the investigation’s scope, the other guys will.

Oh, that senior public official who said there was “no question” about Trump being “practically and morally responsible” for the January 6 attack? His name is Mitch McConnell. And although he voted to acquit Trump of impeachment, he said that vote was solely because of his belief that Trump, as a former president, could not be impeached under our Constitution. But, he said, “President Trump is still liable for everything he did while he was in office, as an ordinary citizen … He didn’t get away with anything yet—yet. We have a criminal justice system in this country.”

It’s now up to Merrick Garland to run a criminal investigation to make sure that Trump and his advisers don’t get away with anything ever—ever.

[dislaxxic]

I'm praying every day that Garland is in fact doing the right thing. I believe he is. He is clearly smart enough, cognizant enough, to understand the stakes here, where the duty lies. His approach to the political aspects of this situation...forged in the fire he endured at the hands of Moscow Mitch, should, very clearly, give him the clarity he needs to do the right thing here, which is: blow through the political hijinx, the posturing, the attempt at bullying that has happened already and which will certainly elevate to a veritable (if not actual) firestorm once (and if) an indictment is entered. He has said all the right things so far, and i feel that DoJ is getting ever closer to bringing indictments. It's perhaps the most complex legal situation the country has ever faced, certainly unprecedented behavior by a disgraced former POTUS. I mean honestly, such a legal path could very possibly lead to a Nuremburg style situation, with a dozen or more ringleaders in the docket at once...can you IMAGINE?

I can...

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