2020 Elections - Trump FIRED

[Typical Lax Dad]

Yes. Qualification = living US citizen, residing in that district. Verified. One vote each.

Do you know how expensive it would be to verify that someone getting a registration isn't dead? And how long it would take to establish that?

And how easy it would be to hack that system?

We used to not have these problems when America was great. MAGA....these things worked!

[CU77]

god forbid more people vote...

That is exactly what the Republicans are against, and always have been.

[old salt]

You miss the point =>If you request an absent ballot, that is proof of life, it verifies you are still alive.

Then we're splitting hairs. You don't want proof that a voter is alive when casting a vote. You want proof that that someone who registers to vote is alive.

Correct. I don't want ballots sent to dead people.
Signature verification then further verifies that the person on the voter roll is alive & cast the vote.

[a fan]

Correct. I don't want ballots sent to dead people.

That's not the same thing as what you said before.

Ballots will ALWAYS be sent to dead people that were alive when they registered. I'm guessing I don't need to explain why.

[MDlaxfan76]

IF...
If a frog had wings...

come on, there are rigorous procedures to ensure that the signatures match, ballots are valid, and not 'harvested'...accepted procedures by both D's and R's, and there are tough penalties for anyone actually committing fraud.

want to improve on any of these procedures? Have at it...but don't restrict voting access because you're scared more votes may mean the other team will win...

The GOP needs to get off this horse, it's anti-American and an ultimate loser.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ballot-har ... ned-rules/

ballot harvesting — involves a law that allows third parties to collect and deliver ballots in some states.

...several states allow operatives..., as well as campaign volunteers and other third party advocates to collect completed, authenticated ballots.

In states where the practice is legal, volunteers or campaign workers can go directly to the homes of voters, collect the completed ballots, and drop them off en masse at polling places or election offices. In some states, ballot harvesters can be paid hourly for their work collecting ballots.

Critics fear that in states without restrictions on who can return a ballot on someone else's behalf, a third party could take advantage of the system by tampering with or discarding the ballots.

The GOP needs to game the new system as effectively as the (D)'s did.

Ballots (with postmarks) submitted via USPS theoretically provide security & a chain of custody,
but there are still cases of lost or misplaced ballots & postal workers prosecuted for fraud.
Are there sufficient Postal Inspectors to ensure the same level of security as in-person voting ?

How do you verify chain of custody & no ballot harvesting when drop boxes are used ?

Nonsense
Any such is detected because voters can check to see whether their vote has been registered or not...if there's a pattern of 'not' then the question becomes how...gets caught...that's what happened to the GOP fraud in Carolina...

...how many voters are going to know that, or take the trouble to do it ?
The purpose of voting by mail is to make it easier.
It should not require voters to investigate if their vote was counted.

Absolutely, however any distrust as to whether the mail got there (or if you handed your ballot to someone else to mail-potential 'harvesting') can be easily allayed by just checking online...if that doesn't happen, you let the election process know, and if in any pattern, that's how this type of possible fraud gets caught. Very difficult and unlikely to get away with anything of magnitude. Happened in Carolina a cycle ago and was caught. I'm all for throwing the book at any such fraudsters.

So it's too hard to go online, verify you address (= proof of life), & request an absentee ballot,
but the primary fraud detector is individual voters going on line to verify their ballot is received.
That makes no sense.
The reason ballot harvesting is illegal in some states is to reduce the opportunity for fraud.

Nope, the reason why is to make it harder for the votes to be done with any help. It's not to reduce fraud, that's entirely smokescreen...bought by some gullible folks, though, no doubt.

And yes, it makes a ton of sense...and it works. Any substantive fraud gets caught. And punished. As it should be.

So you're ok with ballot harvesting ?

not the way you mean it, but I don't have a problem with organizations assisting with collecting ballots to be dropped off.

[ggait]

Signature verification then further verifies that the person on the voter roll is alive & cast the vote.

Everyone does signature verification. In CO, less than 1% of ballots have signature problems.

Many many investigations, however, show that the problems arise when the GOP starts ratforking signature verification. Just like how they ratfork voter ID and everything else. They take something that is reasonable and then they pollute it with their vote suppressing partisan hackery -- to make sure that we don't get too many younger browner people voting. The horror!!

"Strict" signature matching is the same weasel game as "strict photo ID." Meaning a tool used to exclude voters, not to verify identity.

Why don't you just straight up advocate for a poll tax, Salty? It would be a much more direct way to achieve your objectives.

[Typical Lax Dad]

You miss the point =>If you request an absent ballot, that is proof of life, it verifies you are still alive.

Then we're splitting hairs. You don't want proof that a voter is alive when casting a vote. You want proof that that someone who registers to vote is alive.

Correct. I don't want ballots sent to dead people.
Signature verification then further verifies that the person on the voter roll is alive & cast the vote.

Rudy and Sid have a list of the dead people that voted?

[CU88]

Dave Wasserman @Redistrict

Fact: Biden won the presidency winning 85% of counties with a Whole Foods and 32% of counties with a Cracker Barrel - the widest gap ever.
11:12 AM · Dec 8, 2020

[a fan]

Rudy and Sid have a list of the dead people that voted?

They keep them in the same box that McCarthy put his list of known communists working in the Federal government.

[CU77]

McCarthy didn't keep his list of names in a box, he waved it around:

Speaking before the Ohio County Women’s Republican Club in Wheeling, West Virginia, Senator McCarthy waved before his audience a piece of paper. According to the only published newspaper account of the speech, McCarthy said that, “I have here in my hand a list of 205 [State Department employees] that were known to the Secretary of State as being members of the Communist Party and who nevertheless are still working and shaping the policy of the State Department.” In the next few weeks, the number fluctuated wildly, with McCarthy stating at various times that there were 57, or 81, or 10 communists in the Department of State. In fact, McCarthy never produced any solid evidence that there was even one communist in the State Department.

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-his ... department

[Typical Lax Dad]

McCarthy didn't keep his list of names in a box, he waved it around:

Speaking before the Ohio County Women’s Republican Club in Wheeling, West Virginia, Senator McCarthy waved before his audience a piece of paper. According to the only published newspaper account of the speech, McCarthy said that, “I have here in my hand a list of 205 [State Department employees] that were known to the Secretary of State as being members of the Communist Party and who nevertheless are still working and shaping the policy of the State Department.” In the next few weeks, the number fluctuated wildly, with McCarthy stating at various times that there were 57, or 81, or 10 communists in the Department of State. In fact, McCarthy never produced any solid evidence that there was even one communist in the State Department.

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-his ... department

60+ years ago and here we are. Really not that long ago in the grand scheme of things..... I imagine the commodore schmidlaps of the world figure the Votings Right Act has served its purpose....we good now.

[old salt]

Correct. I don't want ballots sent to dead people.

That's not the same thing as what you said before.

Ballots will ALWAYS be sent to dead people that were alive when they registered. I'm guessing I don't need to explain why.

That may be true in CO where everybody on the rolls is sent an unsolicited mail in ballot.
That would not be true in the states where you have to request an absentee ballot.
It's what I've been saying all along. You've misinterpreted or misunderstood.

[old salt]

Signature verification then further verifies that the person on the voter roll is alive & cast the vote.

Everyone does signature verification. In CO, less than 1% of ballots have signature problems.

Many many investigations, however, show that the problems arise when the GOP starts ratforking signature verification. Just like how they ratfork voter ID and everything else. They take something that is reasonable and then they pollute it with their vote suppressing partisan hackery -- to make sure that we don't get too many younger browner people voting. The horror!!

"Strict" signature matching is the same weasel game as "strict photo ID." Meaning a tool used to exclude voters, not to verify identity.

Why don't you just straight up advocate for a poll tax, Salty? It would be a much more direct way to achieve your objectives.

I'm really sick of hearing about CO. I'm talking about states that have not done this before &/or loosened their rules because of the pandemic.

Re signature matching, I prefer it be done via computer scan, then referred for human adjudication only when the computer rejects it.
Same with voter ID. Most states allow things like bank statements, utility bills, or even poll watchers vouching for the voter, if they don't have picture ID. Don't be such a cry baby.

[old salt]

McCarthy didn't keep his list of names in a box, he waved it around:

Speaking before the Ohio County Women’s Republican Club in Wheeling, West Virginia, Senator McCarthy waved before his audience a piece of paper. According to the only published newspaper account of the speech, McCarthy said that, “I have here in my hand a list of 205 [State Department employees] that were known to the Secretary of State as being members of the Communist Party and who nevertheless are still working and shaping the policy of the State Department.” In the next few weeks, the number fluctuated wildly, with McCarthy stating at various times that there were 57, or 81, or 10 communists in the Department of State. In fact, McCarthy never produced any solid evidence that there was even one communist in the State Department.

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-his ... department

60+ years ago and here we are. Really not that long ago in the grand scheme of things..... I imagine the commodore schmidlaps of the world figure the Votings Right Act has served its purpose....we good now.

You should know. You're almost as good as McCarthy in misrepresenting & slandering people who disagree with you.

[Typical Lax Dad]

McCarthy didn't keep his list of names in a box, he waved it around:

Speaking before the Ohio County Women’s Republican Club in Wheeling, West Virginia, Senator McCarthy waved before his audience a piece of paper. According to the only published newspaper account of the speech, McCarthy said that, “I have here in my hand a list of 205 [State Department employees] that were known to the Secretary of State as being members of the Communist Party and who nevertheless are still working and shaping the policy of the State Department.” In the next few weeks, the number fluctuated wildly, with McCarthy stating at various times that there were 57, or 81, or 10 communists in the Department of State. In fact, McCarthy never produced any solid evidence that there was even one communist in the State Department.

https://www.history.com/this-day-in-his ... department

60+ years ago and here we are. Really not that long ago in the grand scheme of things..... I imagine the commodore schmidlaps of the world figure the Votings Right Act has served its purpose....we good now.

You should know. You're almost as good as McCarthy in misrepresenting & slandering people who disagree with you.

Un huh. 1957 really wasn’t that long ago....seems like yesterday. We didn’t have all of these voting fraud problems. We need to get back to that....MAGA....gut the Voting Rights Act....let’s make it harder to vote because there were 1,300 instances of fraud....1,300/140,000,000 = There Must Be Another Reason.

[ggait]

I'm really sick of hearing about CO.

Fine.

Let's talk about AZ (75% early/absentee/mail ballots in 2016), GA (59%) and FL (68%). These three red states have done tons of alternate voting for many many years.

AZ, FL, GA were totally fine in 2016. FL is totally OK in 2020. But suddenly AZ and GA are not fine in 2020.

As a Banana Republican, you don't say a word about any state unless/until your guy loses.

But then it all becomes suspect, questionable, concerning, needs to be studied, , insecure, BS, BS, BS, BS, etc.

We know even you don't believe what you post.

[a fan]

That may be true in CO where everybody on the rolls is sent an unsolicited mail in ballot.
That would not be true in the states where you have to request an absentee ballot.
It's what I've been saying all along. You've misinterpreted or misunderstood.

Respectfully, you're not thinking it through.

What happens when someone registers to vote in 2019, and dies before the Nov. 2020 election?

This, obviously, happens all the time. I thought you got this.

What happens is completely natural, and is EXPECTED by every State.....registered voters die all the time. Obviously.

[MDlaxfan76]

I get confused as to whether Salty is saying this election was rife with fraudulent mail-in votes...OR... a future election would be.

He argues that because some states hadn't done it before, this election was what...full of fraud? Where? What evidence?

But then he says, well, we need to think about future rules...but why, if simply learning how to do it safely and securely is just a matter of paying attention and adopting the best practices of the more experienced states?

Salty, you attack others...but your arguments simply fail to persuade us that your real interest isn't just to restrict the votes of those brown folks you think might vote for the other side...

Conservatives need to learn how to appeal to a majority of voters, of all demographics, instead of being so obviously on the side of restricting access.

[old salt]

I'm really sick of hearing about CO.

Fine.

Let's talk about AZ (75% early/absentee/mail ballots in 2016), GA (59%) and FL (68%). These three red states have done tons of alternate voting for many many years.

AZ, FL, GA were totally fine in 2016. FL is totally OK in 2020. But suddenly AZ and GA are not fine in 2020.

As a Banana Republican, you don't say a word about any state unless/until your guy loses.

But then it all becomes suspect, questionable, concerning, needs to be studied, , insecure, BS, BS, BS, BS, etc.

We know even you don't believe what you post.

I'm more interested in PA, MI, WA & NV, all states which were extremely close, with significant statistical changes from 2016 to 2020, all of which had significant rules changes, which you, naturally blamed on (R) legislatures.

I've repeatedly brought up the still contested NY Congressional race in which they're still recounting, because they were unprepared for the ten fold increase in absentee ballots to be processed.

Speaking of partisan hackery, what I don't believe is your hand waving, nothing to see here, claims.
I say again -- I'm willing to wait & see what comes out of the various states.

[MDlaxfan76]

Baloney. "willing to wait"

Georgia was close and quite significantly different outcome.

You're way too obvious.