All Things Russia & Ukraine

[Kismet]

Should Ukraine seize this opportunity to sever the land bridge or conserve their forces, leaving a path for retreat of Russian forces from Kherson ?
Tough choice. Make it ez for Russian forces to surrender with assurances of humane treatment & prompt return home.
This might be the hoped for collapse of the Russian military in Ukraine.
Can the Russian air force stop Wagner's run to Moscow ?

On the military options, I would not provide any respite to forces who don't lay down their arms and run at this point. Need to thoroughly break their resolve and capabilities. They don't need any "land bridge" to do so. There may be a point at which to have a ceasefire to allow retreat, but that's not yet close, I'd think. I may be overestimating Russian regulars, but I think the full morale break won't happen without more pressure.

So long as Wagner holds Rostov-on-Don, Russian forces west of the Donbas are cut off.
The Russian HQ for the war is now held by Wagner. If the Ukrainians wait & watch, they may win this war without having to suffer any further losses of personnel & equipment, conserving them for their future defense forces.
Prighozin is blaming the military for taking Russia into war under false pretenses, he's not blaming Putin.

Then there are many unknowns - just picked up this AM that heavily armed Chechen forces under the head of the Chechen Republic, Ramzan Kadyrov, are reportedly en route to Rostov-on-Don to engage Wagner forces currently occupying the city. Other reports of Wagner columns moving north towards Moscow.

will have to wait and see what develops and who ends up in control after all this unfolds.

You have to believe Putin is very worried when he starts bringing up the 1917 revolution/civil war

[youthathletics]

Does China provide support?

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ppled.html

[MDlaxfan76]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

sure, Twitter feeds can be a little faster and detailed...just hate the comments...such idiots and jerks.

And yeah, the rotation on TV can be awful repetitive.

[a fan]

Putin's private aircraft just left Moscow for St Petersburg.

Lukashenko (President of Belarus) aircraft departed Minsk for Turkey overnight


Rut Roh

Allllllll because of small-weenie male ego.

Putin had his chance. All these years, he could have moved to make Russia America's vacationland. It's #1 trading partner. Just follow ol' Hill.

He chose the 1980's foreign policy over simple, easy, and profitable trade.

How hard are Obama and Hillary laughing? Sadly, they're not laughing, and know what a dangerous mess Putin has brought to the Russian people.

Russia has lost yet another generation to yet another fascist. Sad to watch.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Trump pacified Putin’s ego. Who knows what Trump green lit…..

[DocBarrister]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

[DocBarrister]

Prigozhin is Putin's ally. He's challenging Russia's military leadership, not Putin.

Putin says you’re wrong (as usual).

The Russian president has accused Yevgeny Prigozhin of “treason” after the warlord launched an uprising against Russia’s army, taking over at least one major Russian city.
In an emergency televised address on Saturday morning, Vladimir Putin said “the fate of our people is being decided”, accusing the Wagner group headed by Prigozhin of “armed mutiny” and vowing to “neutralise” the uprising.

“It’s an attempt to subvert us from inside. This is treason in the face of those who are fighting on the front,” a visibly angry Putin told the Russian public.

“This is a stab in the back of our troops and the people of Russia.”

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/ ... e-uprising

DocBarrister

Old Soldier should speak for himself

Alexander Vindmann agrees with me. Anyone who's been following this knows that Prigozhin has been Putin's most steadfast supporter.

Vindmann also called this a Black Swan event.

Reportedly on Wagner’s website:

It comes as a sinister message posted on the Wagner Telegram channel on Saturday said: 'Putin made the wrong choice. All the worse for him.

'Soon we will have a new president.'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ppled.html

DocBarrister

[MDlaxfan76]

Prigozhin is Putin's ally. He's challenging Russia's military leadership, not Putin.

Putin says you’re wrong (as usual).

The Russian president has accused Yevgeny Prigozhin of “treason” after the warlord launched an uprising against Russia’s army, taking over at least one major Russian city.
In an emergency televised address on Saturday morning, Vladimir Putin said “the fate of our people is being decided”, accusing the Wagner group headed by Prigozhin of “armed mutiny” and vowing to “neutralise” the uprising.

“It’s an attempt to subvert us from inside. This is treason in the face of those who are fighting on the front,” a visibly angry Putin told the Russian public.

“This is a stab in the back of our troops and the people of Russia.”

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/ ... e-uprising

DocBarrister

Old Soldier should speak for himself

Alexander Vindmann agrees with me. Anyone who's been following this knows that Prigozhin has been Putin's most steadfast supporter.

Vindmann also called this a Black Swan event.

Reportedly on Wagner’s website:

It comes as a sinister message posted on the Wagner Telegram channel on Saturday said: 'Putin made the wrong choice. All the worse for him.

'Soon we will have a new president.'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ppled.html

DocBarrister

Before or after the announced (supposed) pull back from a direct fight?

We truly don't know what is actually going on nor what twists this will take.

All speculation and maybe some wishful thinking.

[DocBarrister]

Prigozhin is Putin's ally. He's challenging Russia's military leadership, not Putin.

Putin says you’re wrong (as usual).

The Russian president has accused Yevgeny Prigozhin of “treason” after the warlord launched an uprising against Russia’s army, taking over at least one major Russian city.
In an emergency televised address on Saturday morning, Vladimir Putin said “the fate of our people is being decided”, accusing the Wagner group headed by Prigozhin of “armed mutiny” and vowing to “neutralise” the uprising.

“It’s an attempt to subvert us from inside. This is treason in the face of those who are fighting on the front,” a visibly angry Putin told the Russian public.

“This is a stab in the back of our troops and the people of Russia.”

https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2023/ ... e-uprising

DocBarrister

Old Soldier should speak for himself

Alexander Vindmann agrees with me. Anyone who's been following this knows that Prigozhin has been Putin's most steadfast supporter.

Vindmann also called this a Black Swan event.

Reportedly on Wagner’s website:

It comes as a sinister message posted on the Wagner Telegram channel on Saturday said: 'Putin made the wrong choice. All the worse for him.

'Soon we will have a new president.'

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... ppled.html

DocBarrister

Before or after the announced (supposed) pull back from a direct fight?

We truly don't know what is actually going on nor what twists this will take.

All speculation and maybe some wishful thinking.

Before.

Things are not going to end well for Prigozhin.

Putin will get his revenge … sooner or later.

Putin has been immeasurably harmed by this.

DocBarrister

[old salt]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

[MDlaxfan76]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

[old salt]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

He's Russian. You're not. Enough Russians agree with his version of history to keep him in power for decades now & to take his nation into a catastrophic war which they still support. He's led Russia since 1999 & revived Russian nationalism in the process. You can't expunge him from history.

[DocBarrister]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

He's Russian. You're not. Enough Russians agree with his version of history to keep him in power for decades now & to take his nation into a catastrophic war which they still support. You can't expunge him from history.

Your continued worship of Putin is shameful and repugnant.

Putin will ultimately wind up in the dustbin of history.

DocBarrister

[DocBarrister]

Turns out that Prigozhin has agreed to be whacked in Belarus.

Mercenaries halted their travel toward Moscow, Wagner Group leader Yevgeniy Prigozhin said in an audio message Saturday, a statement that appeared to end the immediate crisis after a day of troop advancement.

Criminal charges against Prigozhin will be dropped, and the Wagner boss will go to Belarus, said Kremlin spokesperson Dmitry Peskov. The guarantee that Prigozhin will be able to go to Belarus is based on Russian President Vladimir Putin’s word, according to Peskov. Pro-Kremlin media also reported that 15 Russian servicemen were killed in clashes with Wagner forces, though no official figures on casualties have been released. The Washington Post could not independently verify the casualties.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/20 ... prigozhin/

DocBarrister

[Typical Lax Dad]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

He's Russian. You're not. Enough Russians agree with his version of history to keep him in power for decades now & to take his nation into a catastrophic war which they still support. He's led Russia since 1999 & revived Russian nationalism in the process. You can't expunge him from history.

You ain’t either

[Typical Lax Dad]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

He's Russian. You're not. Enough Russians agree with his version of history to keep him in power for decades now & to take his nation into a catastrophic war which they still support. You can't expunge him from history.

Your continued worship of Putin is shameful and repugnant.

Putin will ultimately wind up in the dustbin of history.

DocBarrister

He likes his policies

[old salt]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

He's Russian. You're not. Enough Russians agree with his version of history to keep him in power for decades now & to take his nation into a catastrophic war which they still support. You can't expunge him from history.

Your continued worship of Putin is shameful and repugnant.

Putin will ultimately wind up in the dustbin of history.

DocBarrister

He likes his policies

I like stability & a balance of power which does not drag us into "foreign entaglements" that are not in our national interest & wars which are not an existential threat to our security. .

[Typical Lax Dad]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

He's Russian. You're not. Enough Russians agree with his version of history to keep him in power for decades now & to take his nation into a catastrophic war which they still support. You can't expunge him from history.

Your continued worship of Putin is shameful and repugnant.

Putin will ultimately wind up in the dustbin of history.

DocBarrister

He likes his policies

I like stability & a balance of power which does not drag us into "foreign entaglements" that are not in our national interest & wars which are not an existential threat to our security. .

Un huh. None of that matters anymore.

[old salt]

Good thread to follow on the current goings on: https://twitter.com/MarioNawfal/status/ ... 81473?s=20

I dunno, the other people's comments are off the wall.

But the moving news comments from the primary are interesting.

Just focus on the primary....I know it can be hard, but you can do it. It beats sitting in front of the boob tube listening to drivel and commercials.

Putin's speech is eloquent...& frightening. It might be one for the archives. This is a dangerous situation.

You do understand that Putin is a corrupt, fascist dictator and war criminal who intentionally attacks Ukrainian civilians and throws his enemies out of tall buildings (when he isn’t poisoning them)?

I might suggest it is time to stop worshipping the guy.

DocBarrister

Worship. ...the bad guys make history too. It was an eloquent summation of why he went to war in Ukraine, delivered to the Russian people at a crucial point in time. You don't have to agree or like it for it to be historic. You're perverting history in real time.

Actually, it was Putin "perverting history".

He's Russian. You're not. Enough Russians agree with his version of history to keep him in power for decades now & to take his nation into a catastrophic war which they still support. You can't expunge him from history.

Your continued worship of Putin is shameful and repugnant.

Putin will ultimately wind up in the dustbin of history.

DocBarrister

He likes his policies

I like stability & a balance of power which does not drag us into "foreign entaglements" that are not in our national interest & wars which are not an existential threat to our security. .

Un huh. None of that matters anymore.

You don't that yet. You don't know how this latest neocon adventure will play out & what the long term & unintended consequences will be.