Re: IMPEACHMENT ... If not now, WHEN?
Posted: Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:29 pm
I meant predominantly....my bad. Just a reminder, you were wrong last time.
Same Party, Different House
https://fanlax.com/forum/
I'm frequently 'wrong', never in doubt though...youthathletics wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:29 pm I meant predominantly....my bad. Just a reminder, you were wrong last time.
Too bad the FBI couldn't say the Steele Dossier was the predicate for starting the investigation, because by the time they were called to account, it had been discredited & all they had for a predicate was Papadop's London wine bar telephone game.MDLF76:
So, I just watched a clip of Horowitz definitively saying that that the Steele Dossier was not in any way used as a predicate for the opening of the investigation as it was not known to exist at that point.
While there is plenty to criticize about the Steele claims and the FISA process, the Trumpist conflation of the FISA on Carter Page with the actual predicates of the investigation is the real sham. It's always been a distraction from the very real reasons why Trump and those around him attracted so much attention in the context of a detected and very real Russian active measures campaign to benefit him and hurt his opponent.
Noticed you are dismissive of Parnas and Russia payment?
Oh, I believe you, and it's hard to disagree with any of that. This is a person who publicly chides a 16 year old. There is no bottom. We will just have to see if the country reaches that trough with him.DMac wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:09 pm Believe it or not, I do get that, sc. Unfortunately though, after all is said and done, Trump will claim victory inasmuch as he's still in office and is running for a second term. He'll drive home the witch hunt by the lunatic Ds story and his supporters will eat it up like a dog with a big fat juicy bone. All the rest of what you say (the important stuff) will mean nothing to them or his asz licking lot of R cronie crooks.
Carter Page had it tough. Whose else?cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:36 pm https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opin ... p-campaign Great article, Mr York states the case here very well. Did the FBI have the authority to initiate an investigation? Yes they did. Did they eff it up to the level of FUBAR... yes they did. When terms like .. confidential human sources(CHS) and under cover employee(UCE) start cropping up you already have some splainin to do. IMO the greatest misdeed done by the FBI... when they knew the FISA information was bogus they should have gone back to the judges that issued the warrants and made them aware of it. I am sure it was just a minor oversight on the part of the FBI... ooopsies.
The way to winning in 2020 is not through winning over Trump's base. It is by ginning up the people of whatever political persuasion who find his behavior abhorrently distasteful, and or criminal, and and or either oblivious to the Constitution and his oath of office, or outright dismissive of the entire concept. These are the people who will lead the charge, and finance the operation to convince enough voters who for whatever reason don't find the Dumpster a menace, but still would just as soon see him voted out of office, to get out to the polling booths and make that happen. That there may not be enough voters out there to make that happen is the democratic crossroads we are approaching this coming November, 2020.DMac wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:09 pm Believe it or not, I do get that, sc. Unfortunately though, after all is said and done, Trump will claim victory inasmuch as he's still in office and is running for a second term. He'll drive home the witch hunt by the lunatic Ds story and his supporters will eat it up like a dog with a big fat juicy bone. All the rest of what you say (the important stuff) will mean nothing to them or his asz licking lot of R cronie crooks.
Papadop, Flynn, & anyone who had to hire a lawyer, other than Manafort & Gates (who were already under investigation & got what they deserved -- except for extended solitary confinement.)Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:27 pmCarter Page had it tough. Whose else?cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:36 pm https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opin ... p-campaign Great article, Mr York states the case here very well. Did the FBI have the authority to initiate an investigation? Yes they did. Did they eff it up to the level of FUBAR... yes they did. When terms like .. confidential human sources(CHS) and under cover employee(UCE) start cropping up you already have some splainin to do. IMO the greatest misdeed done by the FBI... when they knew the FISA information was bogus they should have gone back to the judges that issued the warrants and made them aware of it. I am sure it was just a minor oversight on the part of the FBI... ooopsies.
Taibbi used to be a frequent guest on Morning Joe.
old salt wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 7:42 pmPapadop, Flynn, & anyone who had to hire a lawyer, other than Manafort & Gates (who were already under investigation & got what they deserved -- except for extended solitary confinement.)Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:27 pmCarter Page had it tough. Whose else?cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:36 pm https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opin ... p-campaign Great article, Mr York states the case here very well. Did the FBI have the authority to initiate an investigation? Yes they did. Did they eff it up to the level of FUBAR... yes they did. When terms like .. confidential human sources(CHS) and under cover employee(UCE) start cropping up you already have some splainin to do. IMO the greatest misdeed done by the FBI... when they knew the FISA information was bogus they should have gone back to the judges that issued the warrants and made them aware of it. I am sure it was just a minor oversight on the part of the FBI... ooopsies.
There was preliminary spying & investigating going on before July 31, 2016 --> the first meeting of Steele, in London, with an FBI agent from Rome, Halper's first contact with Page & Clovis, Halper telling journalists about Flynn's supposed 2014 honey trap dinner with Svetlana in London, as soon as Flynn joined the Trump campaign. I'm still waiting to learn which target # was Flynn, what else was done to him, & if the IG says anything about the leak of his call to Kislyak -- were they tapping Flynn or Kislyak ?
https://thefederalist.com/2018/05/21/pu ... tion-stat/
...under the attorney general’s guidelines the FBI may use extensive “information gathering activities” before launching an official “investigation.” Under the guidelines, the FBI may make an “assessment” “to obtain information about” a potential threat to national security.
At the assessment stage, the FBI may “seek information, proactively or in response to investigative leads,” “identify[] and obtain[] information about potential targets of or vulnerabilities to criminal activities . . . or threats to national security,” “seek[] information to identify potential human sources,” and “obtain[] information to inform or facilitate intelligence analysis.”
During the assessment phase, beyond obtaining publicly available information and using online resources, the FBI may “access and examine FBI and other Department of Justice records” and “request information from other federal, state, local, or tribal, or foreign governmental entities or agencies.” The FBI may also “use and recruit human sources,” “accept information voluntarily provided by governmental or private entities,” and “engage in observation or surveillance not requiring a court order.”
In addition to the one known informant, did the FBI use other informants or sources? Did the FBI reach out to foreign governmental entities or agencies? Did the FBI tail the Trump campaign staff, Trump organization employees, or his family? Did the FBI accept information about Trump and his campaign team from other foreign governments or private entities?
..after initiating a formal investigation, the FBI held even broader authority to conduct surveillance of the Trump campaign. Once the FBI launches a full-blown investigation, agents have the authority to conduct undercover operations and issue National Security Letters (NSL). The FBI may issue NSL without court approval.
This search allowed the FBI to review communications between Papadopoulos and Trump’s inner circle.
With these administrative subpoenas, agents may obtain detailed information about targeted individuals from communications providers, financial institutions, consumer credit agencies, and travel agencies. While we do not know how many NSLs the FBI used to target individuals connected with the Trump campaign or Trump organization, or when the FBI issued the NSLs, The New York Times confirmed last week that they were used in Crossfire Hurricane.
Additionally, following the launching of an investigation, the FBI may seek to use pen registers, trap and trace devices, electronic surveillance, and physical searches, pursuant to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. We know the FBI used these investigative methods beginning, at the latest, in October 2016, when the Obama Department of Justice obtained the first of four secret FISA court orders to monitor the communications of former Trump campaign adviser Carter Page. While Page was no longer associated with the Trump campaign when the FISC court issued the order, as former U.S. Attorney Andrew McCarthy has explained, this order also allowed the government to review prior communications between Page and campaign officials.
Further, from the court filings in the special counsel’s case against Papadopoulos, we know the FBI obtained a court order to search Papadopoulos’ email and Facebook accounts. This search allowed the FBI to review communications between Papadopoulos and Trump’s inner circle. We do not know when this court-ordered search took place or the factual predicate for the search.
We also know that following Trump’s surprise victory, but before his inauguration, the Obama administration listened in on a telephone call between Michael Flynn, Trump’s newly named national security advisor, and the Russian ambassador. What we don’t know is whether the government had tapped Flynn’s phone or intercepted the calls as part of normal surveillance of Russian officials. We also don’t know whether other members of the Trump campaign, transitional team, or current members of the administration were also targeted by the CIA, FBI, and National Security Agency. But it’s about time we do.
Ain’t got no sympathy for convicted felons.old salt wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 7:59 pmold salt wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 7:42 pmPapadop, Flynn, & anyone who had to hire a lawyer, other than Manafort & Gates (who were already under investigation & got what they deserved -- except for extended solitary confinement.)Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 6:27 pmCarter Page had it tough. Whose else?cradleandshoot wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:36 pm https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/opin ... p-campaign Great article, Mr York states the case here very well. Did the FBI have the authority to initiate an investigation? Yes they did. Did they eff it up to the level of FUBAR... yes they did. When terms like .. confidential human sources(CHS) and under cover employee(UCE) start cropping up you already have some splainin to do. IMO the greatest misdeed done by the FBI... when they knew the FISA information was bogus they should have gone back to the judges that issued the warrants and made them aware of it. I am sure it was just a minor oversight on the part of the FBI... ooopsies.
There was preliminary spying & investigating going on before July 31, 2016 --> the first meeting of Steele, in London, with an FBI agent from Rome, Halper's first contact with Page & Clovis, Halper telling journalists about Flynn's supposed 2014 honey trap dinner with Svetlana in London, as soon as Flynn joined the Trump campaign. I'm still waiting to learn which target # was Flynn, what else was done to him, & if the IG says anything about the leak of his call to Kislyak -- were they tapping Flynn or Kislyak ?https://thefederalist.com/2018/05/21/pu ... tion-stat/
after initiating a formal investigation, the FBI held even broader authority to conduct surveillance of the Trump campaign. Once the FBI launches a full-blown investigation, agents have the authority to conduct undercover operations and issue National Security Letters (NSL). The FBI may issue NSL without court approval.
This search allowed the FBI to review communications between Papadopoulos and Trump’s inner circle.
With these administrative subpoenas, agents may obtain detailed information about targeted individuals from communications providers, financial institutions, consumer credit agencies, and travel agencies. While we do not know how many NSLs the FBI used to target individuals connected with the Trump campaign or Trump organization, or when the FBI issued the NSLs, The New York Times confirmed last week that they were used in Crossfire Hurricane.
Additionally, following the launching of an investigation, the FBI may seek to use pen registers, trap and trace devices, electronic surveillance, and physical searches, pursuant to the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. We know the FBI used these investigative methods beginning, at the latest, in October 2016, when the Obama Department of Justice obtained the first of four secret FISA court orders to monitor the communications of former Trump campaign adviser Carter Page. While Page was no longer associated with the Trump campaign when the FISC court issued the order, as former U.S. Attorney Andrew McCarthy has explained, this order also allowed the government to review prior communications between Page and campaign officials.
Further, from the court filings in the special counsel’s case against Papadopoulos, we know the FBI obtained a court order to search Papadopoulos’ email and Facebook accounts. This search allowed the FBI to review communications between Papadopoulos and Trump’s inner circle. We do not know when this court-ordered search took place or the factual predicate for the search.
We also know that following Trump’s surprise victory, but before his inauguration, the Obama administration listened in on a telephone call between Michael Flynn, Trump’s newly named national security advisor, and the Russian ambassador. What we don’t know is whether the government had tapped Flynn’s phone or intercepted the calls as part of normal surveillance of Russian officials. We also don’t know whether other members of the Trump campaign, transitional team, or current members of the administration were also targeted by the CIA, FBI, and National Security Agency. But it’s about time we do.
Did you read the Mueller Report? We were supposed to do nothing? Wake up.youthathletics wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 8:29 pm An entire 2+ year investigation built on known lies, by hiring a knucklehead to expel bs Russian lies, only to investigate a US citizen, who was an opponent in a US election, AND the FBI and their lawyer intentionally deceived and modified paperwork to fraud the FISA court.
And the the scary part....the top echelon in the FBI did the very thing they are accusing Trump of. Using Russia propaganda to facilitate and deceive the American people to influence people and an election...past and present. And who was the lynchpin?.....the Clinton Crime Syndicate, covered under the bs story of “opposition research”.
Yup, I get that. Trump's base is the immoveable object/impenetrable fortress. If their fuhrer ordered the building of Auschwitz, USA Annex (paid for, of course, by the Germans) they'd be all in. Should be able to come out with some sort of nice new hat design and with a clever slogan on it for that too, MAGA hats are old news. As Donald says, he's already made America great again. Did better than Abe and all the rest of the Prezes. The greatly great one is the greatest of all, so says he and his base.calourie wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 7:18 pmThe way to winning in 2020 is not through winning over Trump's base. It is by ginning up the people of whatever political persuasion who find his behavior abhorrently distasteful, and or criminal, and and or either oblivious to the Constitution and his oath of office, or outright dismissive of the entire concept. These are the people who will lead the charge, and finance the operation to convince enough voters who for whatever reason don't find the Dumpster a menace, but still would just as soon see him voted out of office, to get out to the polling booths and make that happen. That there may not be enough voters out there to make that happen is the democratic crossroads we are approaching this coming November, 2020.DMac wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 5:09 pm Believe it or not, I do get that, sc. Unfortunately though, after all is said and done, Trump will claim victory inasmuch as he's still in office and is running for a second term. He'll drive home the witch hunt by the lunatic Ds story and his supporters will eat it up like a dog with a big fat juicy bone. All the rest of what you say (the important stuff) will mean nothing to them or his asz licking lot of R cronie crooks.
You heard him say the investigation was unjustified? Wake up. You mean the Comey that Handed the election to Trump?youthathletics wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 8:45 pm Yes I did....I also read and listened to Horowitz not clear Jim Conme.
You and old salt have spent the last several months to tell us this is 100% appropriate.youthathletics wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 8:29 pm And the the scary part....the top echelon in the FBI did the very thing they are accusing Trump of. Using Russia propaganda to facilitate and deceive the American people to influence people and an election...past and present.