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Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 6:01 pm
by Matnum PI
Richmond beat #7 UVA, #25 St. Bon, and #NR Towson and lost to #14 Duke, #10 J'ville, and #NR UNC. For obvious reasons, Richmond's position is less clear than Notre Dame's.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 6:05 pm
by Matnum PI
CU77 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 15, 2022 5:50 pmHere's an interesting question: there are many "closed loops" in the results where A > B > ... > C > A. What should happen to the ratings (any ratings, by any system) if we reverse the loop? That is, suppose that instead of A > B > ... > C > A, the results had been A < B < ... < C < A ? What should happen to the ratings?
KRACH's answer is nothing: reversing a loop does not change KRACH ratings at all.
The idea is that knowing A > B > C > A (the shortest loop) conveys no more or less information that A < B < C < A. We can't order these 3 teams based on these results; all we can do is say that their ratings should be closer to each other than they would be if those games had not been played at all.
A>B>C or C<B<A is the same thing. Just said differently. Makes sense that it wouldn't change the rankings.
The problem with A>B>C is... The rankings are rarely that linear. For D1 Men's Lacrosse, I might even say never.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 6:31 pm
by CU77
No, the comparison is
A beats B, B beats C, C beats A
vs
B beats A, C beats B, A beats C.
Re Richmond, I was using KRACH numbers as the ratings, which have UNC at #15.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 7:16 pm
by Matnum PI
CU77 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 15, 2022 6:31 pm
No, the comparison is
A beats B, B beats C, C beats A
vs
B beats A, C beats B, A beats C.
Re Richmond, I was using KRACH numbers as the ratings, which have UNC at #15.
A>B>C>A is the same as A>C>B>A. Just different values plugged in for the scenario. (Unless I'm missing something.)
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Fri Apr 15, 2022 7:30 pm
by CU77
I don't know what you mean by "the same".
In the first case, in the one game between A and B, A won.
In the second case, in the one game between A and B, B won.
I call those outcomes "different".
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2022 10:26 pm
by NovaLax17
DU-fan wrote: ↑Wed Apr 13, 2022 10:37 am
joewillie78 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 13, 2022 9:17 am
10stone5 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 12, 2022 10:25 pm
Good job Pollsters,
including St. Joe’s in your polls
they are very good,
to cite just one team.
If you look at my poll , I have them #13, and have pretty much listed them in my poll everyweek, and have been questioned on that a few times.
We will find out really how good they are when they face PENN later this month.
GOBIGRED
Joewillie78
St. Joe's is definitely a really good team. But, who is their biggest win? Hobart, Towson, Penn State? With losses to Drexel and Delaware, I think they are realistically in the 23-30 range, which is still very good in my opinion.
Further, what justification exits to rank St. Joe's ahead of Villanova when St. Joe's lost to Delaware and Drexel, but Nova beat Delaware and Drexel?
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 1:10 am
by 10stone5
NovaLax17 wrote: ↑Sat Apr 16, 2022 10:26 pm
DU-fan wrote: ↑Wed Apr 13, 2022 10:37 am
joewillie78 wrote: ↑Wed Apr 13, 2022 9:17 am
10stone5 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 12, 2022 10:25 pm
Good job Pollsters,
including St. Joe’s in your polls
they are very good,
to cite just one team.
If you look at my poll , I have them #13, and have pretty much listed them in my poll everyweek, and have been questioned on that a few times.
We will find out really how good they are when they face PENN later this month.
GOBIGRED
Joewillie78
St. Joe's is definitely a really good team. But, who is their biggest win? Hobart, Towson, Penn State? With losses to Drexel and Delaware, I think they are realistically in the 23-30 range, which is still very good in my opinion.
Further, what justification exits to rank St. Joe's ahead of Villanova when St. Joe's lost to Delaware and Drexel, but Nova beat Delaware and Drexel?
None, any more.
Both Zach Cole and Tucker Brown are injured.
Those are their two best players, Cole with something
potentially serious.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 3:15 pm
by CU77
KRACH top 25 after this morning's two games:
1. Maryland 11-0 3512
2. Princeton 9-2 1220
3. Georgetown 10-1 1182
4. Rutgers 11-2 933
5. Cornell 10-2 677
6. Virginia 9-3 537
7. Yale 7-3 504
8. Army 10-2 498
9. Jacksonville 12-2 433
10. OSU 8-4 411
11. Penn 5-4 389
12. Boston U 9-3 369
13. UNC 8-4 361
14. Harvard 7-3 347
15. Duke 10-5 326
16. Brown 7-4 313
17. St Josephs 10-2 293
18. Denver 7-5 269
19. Richmond 7-4 254
20. Notre Dame 5-4 247
21. Utah 7-3 243
22. Villanova 7-4 210
23. Lehigh 7-4 185
24. JHU 6-7 172
25. Bucknell 8-4 171
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 3:45 pm
by wgdsr
brown state firmly in the dance as of today. what a couple of weeks for them.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 4:40 pm
by ICGrad
wgdsr wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 3:45 pm
brown state firmly in the dance as of today. what a couple of weeks for them.
Are they? What are you basing this on?
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:29 pm
by wgdsr
ICGrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 4:40 pm
wgdsr wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 3:45 pm
brown state firmly in the dance as of today. what a couple of weeks for them.
Are they? What are you basing this on?
rpi.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:45 pm
by CU77
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
by ICGrad
Wow.
Odd that Penn, who only make the Ivies with significant help from other teams over the next couple of weekends, is @ #5 in the RPI. I guess that'll drop over the next couple of weeks, but I assume not very far. Are they a near-lock to make the NCAAs, even if they don't make the ILT?
Seems absurd.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:06 pm
by wgdsr
ICGrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
Wow.
Odd that Penn, who only make the Ivies with significant help from other teams over the next couple of weekends, is @ #5 in the RPI. I guess that'll drop over the next couple of weeks, but I assume not very far. Are they a near-lock to make the NCAAs, even if they don't make the ILT?
Seems absurd.
penn's sos is off the charts. they are #1 sos, unc is #3. they are .065 higher in rpi even tho their record is worse than unc's. absurd if those #s are accurate.
their schedule will carry them.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:12 pm
by pcowlax
ICGrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
Wow.
Odd that Penn, who only make the Ivies with significant help from other teams over the next couple of weekends, is @ #5 in the RPI. I guess that'll drop over the next couple of weeks, but I assume not very far. Are they a near-lock to make the NCAAs, even if they don't make the ILT?
Seems absurd.
That’s the question. All year it has looked like 3 and maybe 4 Ivys in the NCAA. But would they put in a team that doesn’t make the IL tourney? It is very possible one of the teams that seemed close to a lock for NCAA all year will miss ILT. What happens then?
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:18 pm
by Typical Lax Dad
pcowlax wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:12 pm
ICGrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
Wow.
Odd that Penn, who only make the Ivies with significant help from other teams over the next couple of weekends, is @ #5 in the RPI. I guess that'll drop over the next couple of weeks, but I assume not very far. Are they a near-lock to make the NCAAs, even if they don't make the ILT?
Seems absurd.
That’s the question. All year it has looked like 3 and maybe 4 Ivys in the NCAA. But would they put in a team that doesn’t make the IL tourney? It is very possible one of the teams that seemed close to a lock for NCAA all year will miss ILT. What happens then?
It’s possible. Not all the ILT teams are necessarily a lock for an at large.
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 7:35 pm
by masondixonlax
I made pole submissions but never got email confirmation so hopefully it went through
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:47 pm
by Chousnake
pcowlax wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:12 pm
ICGrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
Wow.
Odd that Penn, who only make the Ivies with significant help from other teams over the next couple of weekends, is @ #5 in the RPI. I guess that'll drop over the next couple of weeks, but I assume not very far. Are they a near-lock to make the NCAAs, even if they don't make the ILT?
Seems absurd.
That’s the question. All year it has looked like 3 and maybe 4 Ivys in the NCAA. But would they put in a team that doesn’t make the IL tourney? It is very possible one of the teams that seemed close to a lock for NCAA all year will miss ILT. What happens then?
For the past few years or so, the ACC has placed all 5 teams in the tourney. Why not 5 Ivies this year based on the strength of the conference?
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:52 pm
by lorin
Chousnake wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:47 pm
pcowlax wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:12 pm
ICGrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
Wow.
Odd that Penn, who only make the Ivies with significant help from other teams over the next couple of weekends, is @ #5 in the RPI. I guess that'll drop over the next couple of weeks, but I assume not very far. Are they a near-lock to make the NCAAs, even if they don't make the ILT?
Seems absurd.
That’s the question. All year it has looked like 3 and maybe 4 Ivys in the NCAA. But would they put in a team that doesn’t make the IL tourney? It is very possible one of the teams that seemed close to a lock for NCAA all year will miss ILT. What happens then?
For the past few years or so, the ACC has placed all 5 teams in the tourney. Why not 5 Ivies this year based on the strength of the conference?
I think Army win ends your chances of getting five teams in, could be wrong, plus ACC will get 4 teams in
Re: FanLax Forum Poll
Posted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:59 pm
by Unknown Participant
Chousnake wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 8:47 pm
pcowlax wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 6:12 pm
ICGrad wrote: ↑Sun Apr 17, 2022 5:56 pm
Wow.
Odd that Penn, who only make the Ivies with significant help from other teams over the next couple of weekends, is @ #5 in the RPI. I guess that'll drop over the next couple of weeks, but I assume not very far. Are they a near-lock to make the NCAAs, even if they don't make the ILT?
Seems absurd.
That’s the question. All year it has looked like 3 and maybe 4 Ivys in the NCAA. But would they put in a team that doesn’t make the IL tourney? It is very possible one of the teams that seemed close to a lock for NCAA all year will miss ILT. What happens then?
For the past few years or so, the ACC has placed all 5 teams in the tourney. Why not 5 Ivies this year based on the strength of the conference?
Agreed. Posters have been saying that the Ivy v Ivy internecine warfare will raise all teams' RPI, and it seems to be true. I don't really have a dog in the hunt, but would love to see Brown in the NCAAs.