Trump's Russian Collusion

[Typical Lax Dad]

It is certainly amazing that a man can be labeled so stupid, dumb, intellectually vacant....and yet not the FBI, Mueller, NSA, and darned agency can lock him down on something worthy gettin' his a$s outta here.

Maybe, juuuuust maybe....the people claiming all this are actually the ones with the problem they project onto 'our' POTUS.

Ask Vendetta Man

[youthathletics]

It is certainly amazing that a man can be labeled so stupid, dumb, intellectually vacant....and yet not the FBI, Mueller, NSA, and darned agency can lock him down on something worthy gettin' his a$s outta here.

Maybe, juuuuust maybe....the people claiming all this are actually the ones with the problem they project onto 'our' POTUS.

Ask Vendetta Man

I missed the analogy...who is this Vendetta Man?

[Typical Lax Dad]

It is certainly amazing that a man can be labeled so stupid, dumb, intellectually vacant....and yet not the FBI, Mueller, NSA, and darned agency can lock him down on something worthy gettin' his a$s outta here.

Maybe, juuuuust maybe....the people claiming all this are actually the ones with the problem they project onto 'our' POTUS.

Ask Vendetta Man

I missed the analogy...who is this Vendetta Man?

He comes up on your Twitter link. Just giving you a hard time. Have a great Thanksgiving and enjoy the time with your family.

[youthathletics]

It is certainly amazing that a man can be labeled so stupid, dumb, intellectually vacant....and yet not the FBI, Mueller, NSA, and darned agency can lock him down on something worthy gettin' his a$s outta here.

Maybe, juuuuust maybe....the people claiming all this are actually the ones with the problem they project onto 'our' POTUS.

Ask Vendetta Man

I missed the analogy...who is this Vendetta Man?

He comes up on your Twitter link. Just giving you a hard time. Have a great Thanksgiving and enjoy the time with your family.

Likewise TLD.

[ggait]

youthathletics wrote: ↑
Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:28 am
It is certainly amazing that a man can be labeled so stupid, dumb, intellectually vacant....and yet not the FBI, Mueller, NSA, and darned agency can lock him down on something worthy gettin' his a$s outta here.

1. If you are a criminal, it is very helpful to have absolute immunity from prosecution (i.e. DOJ OLC opinion).

2. If you are a criminal, it is very helpful to control the criminal justice apparatus that would potentially come after you. Especially when the head of the apparatus (AG Barr) basically believes that a sitting president is a king.

3. If a criminal, it is very helpful to be able to obstruct any potential investigators and/or impeachers (with little to no legal basis) by telling them to pound sand on any subpoenas for documents and testimony.

4. If a criminal, it is very helpful to have the power to potentially pardon yourself and your co-conspirators.

5. If a criminal, it is very helpful to have free unlimited resources (i.e. DOJ and WH Counsel office) to litigate/appeal endlessly your obstruction and baseless claims of immunity and privelege. Justice delayed is justice denied.

6. If a criminal, it is very helpful in the only possible legal proceeding against you to face a jury of your sycophantic servants, rather than a jury of your unconflicted objective peers.

In the longer term, the president is not a king or above the law. But in the short to medium term, a sleazy unscrupulous shameless gas-lighting president like Trump is in fact completely above the law. Especially when aided by a servile, fact-phobic GOP, state-run TV, and also Russian intelligence.

Compare Trump's outcomes (so far) as compared to Flynn, Manafort, Cohen, Stone, Papadop. And the risky futures faced by Lev, Igor and Rudy. It is good to be the king!

One can only imagine what Trump would do in a second term when he would no longer even be accountable to voters. The risks of four years of President Bernie/AOC/Marianne Williamson/Che Guevarra/etc. pale by comparison.

[Bandito]

youthathletics wrote: ↑
Wed Nov 27, 2019 11:28 am
It is certainly amazing that a man can be labeled so stupid, dumb, intellectually vacant....and yet not the FBI, Mueller, NSA, and darned agency can lock him down on something worthy gettin' his a$s outta here.

1. If you are a criminal, it is very helpful to have absolute immunity from prosecution (i.e. DOJ OLC opinion).

2. If you are a criminal, it is very helpful to control the criminal justice apparatus that would potentially come after you. Especially when the head of the apparatus (AG Barr) basically believes that a sitting president is a king.

3. If a criminal, it is very helpful to be able to obstruct any potential investigators and/or impeachers (with little to no legal basis) by telling them to pound sand on any subpoenas for documents and testimony.

4. If a criminal, it is very helpful to have free unlimited resources (i.e. DOJ and WH Counsel office) to litigate/appeal endlessly your obstruction and baseless claims of immunity and privelege. Justice delayed is justice denied.

5. If a criminal, it is very helpful in the only possible legal proceeding against you to face a jury of your sycophantic servants, rather than a jury of your unconflicted objective peers.

In the longer term, the president is not a king or above the law. But in the short to medium term, a sleazy unscrupulous shameless gas-lighting president like Trump is in fact completely above the law. Especially when aided by a servile, fact-phobic GOP, state-run TV, and also Russian intelligence.

Compare Trump's outcomes (so far) as compared to Flynn, Manafort, Cohen, Stone, Papadop. And the risky futures faced by Lev, Igor and Rudy. It is good to be the king!

One can only imagine what Trump would do in a second term when he would no longer even be accountable to voters. The risks of four years of President Bernie/AOC/Marianne Williamson/Che Guevarra/etc. pale by comparison.

You’re so triggered. You’re a socialist. You hate America and it’s people. You saying you’d vote for a known commie socialist who killed tons of innocent people shows how left Democrats have become. JFK would be a staunch Republican and Trump supporter today. Embarrassing even for someone as clueless and hateful as you.

[a fan]

Comrade Bandito! Here to give us the truth from our Federal Government again?

What does our Federal Government command we do this week?

Have you given away your personal property to Leader Trump yet? Bandito doesn't know what the Truth is. Only Leader Trump does. Only right thing to do here is to give Leader Trump your personal property.


Question: are you serving what Leader Trump commands we serve for Thanksgiving dinner? I don't want you serving anything that has not been approved by our Federal government.....

[MDlaxfan76]

MD - I was attending to a matter in Destin, FL at Jerry Jones house - yep I run in tight circles - weather was a tad chilly - where is your place? Still have never run into a Dartmouth or Hopkins grad - you all must go one to be doctors and lawyers excluding Bloomberg - that is interesting he is running for Prez. BTW reality smacks you in the face daily, it is how you deal with reality that matters. I grew up poor unlike many out here so I can get the reality - maybe you can as well over time - unimpressed with the college or degree it is what you do with it that matters.

RedfromMI - my grandfather was mayor of TC - my point was Russia was a point - many bad actors messing in our elections including Ukraine - step up as it ain't just the Russians messing- sorry I was down south for almost a week .

72 - had Hopkins had a good lax team, my son would have run into them in the NCAA's - NOPE. Homewood must have been built and created in 1920's? The turf must be original, I remember playing on that in the 1980's - be relevant again and maybe I would meet a Hopkins grad finally

afan, not a Fox fan- WSJ.

moving on to censuring - another bust. Schiff's eyes will really be bulging

We're over near Stuart. Harbour Ridge.
A lot of midwesterners.

Of course the college/degree matters far less than "what you do with it that matters". No argument there. Bugs me too when some see that as more than just one, rather early, indicator of 'smarts' and 'hard academic work'. Just not sure why someone earning a degree from a highly selective school, much less graduating with honors while playing a sport, would be seen as a negative...but it apparently it is for some folks. Seems strange to me, but then again, a lot of stuff seems strange to me these days.

And no, Ukraine didn't get involved in our election in '16. That's Trump/Fox/OANN/RT BS.
Some bad actors trying to get involved in '20, yes, but that's the Guiliani thread.

And no, Ukraine didn't get involved in our election in '16

You gots proof of that hombre? I am guessing that is your opinion. I can say that because since nobody in the US government ever investigated Ukraine meddling in 2016... we don't really know how many nations may have been diddle fritzing in our elections.

What we do know is that the conspiracy theory being peddled by Trump and the others is indeed total BS, emanating from Putin. According to our entire IC, and as validated by the heads of those agencies, all Trump appointees, and as further validated by the GOP Senate Intelligence Committee. Yes, they actually did investigate who was meddling and how and who wasn't.

Not sure anything can be locked down more than that.

This conspiracy theory is being described by the professionals as entirely Russian propaganda...but you want to buy Russian propaganda, go for it.

One thing for certain in this whole sordid affair is that there are no shortage of conspiracy theories. It is akin to the grassy knoll on steroids. There are a ton of possibilities to bounce back and forth. There just is not much proof to back any of them up. I wonder how our intell people could realistically put together anything. That would require a mole inside the Putin camp. That would be a mole that would have a very short life span when discovered.

cradle,
I don't know whether there's human intelligence involved ("a mole"), or how much such, but I do know that computers leave tracks and such have been referenced, albeit obliquely, in various reports. These are not only understood by the IC but also have been explained to the Senate Intelligence Committee. Apparently, the evidence is overwhelming.

And it is 100% contrary to the BS about Ukraine (Crowdstrike) etc being peddled by Putin and Trump as an alternate theory.

One of the real shames of the Trump era has been this dumbing down of our public's capacity to recognize when those with expertise and experience actually do 'know' something with a very high degree of certainty and specificity, as is this case.

There's always been a 'dumb' factor in America, those highly suggestible folks willing to believe cockamamy conspiracy theories, but this has grown quite substantially, led by the 'useful idiot' in the White House.

Now he wants you to believe that he didn't send Rudy to Ukraine, not sure what he was doing there, has other clients other than him, Rudy was personally offended during the campaign...do you believe this new nonsense that Rudy wasn't actually representing him in Ukraine?

I do not doubt our intell people know a lot about what went on. I am just cynical enough to believe that Putin is well aware of evidence that would be left on a computer in any of these shenanigans. This becomes a cat and mouse game as to what intell is believable and what you are being spoon fed. I have no idea what the truth is. I also believe that Putins folks are smart enough to send our folks on a bunch of high tech wild goose chases. I am not much of a crook but I understand rule #1 is do not use a computer when doing your dirty dealings. At least if you do not want anybody finding what it is your up to.

jiminy cradle, that's some mighty big ostrich behavior there. You do understand that the hacking was done by computer and the bots and trolls were done by computer? This really ain't rocket science to understand that computers were used. And that such leaves tracks?

Now you imagine that Putin had someone leave those tracks leading back to Russian military intelligence on purpose???

Wow, the desperation to believe anything, I mean anything, other than that our IC nailed it down as the Russians...and very specific Russians at that.

youth appears to be right with you in such desperation.

[old salt]

Russian disinformation :

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyl ... story.html

New York Times reporter Kenneth P. Vogel was on the Ukraine conspiracy story early and in depth. The question is, did his articles leave the wrong impression?

Vogel was the co-author of a disputed Times story in May that suggested that Joe Biden intervened in Ukraine in 2016 to help a company that employed the former vice president’s son, Hunter. As a staff writer at Politico in early 2017, he co-authored another piece that suggested that the Democratic National Committee had cooperated with Ukrainian efforts to thwart Republican candidate Donald Trump in the 2016 campaign.

Both articles have been cited by President Trump’s allies as support for a broader conspiracy theory: that Ukrainian sources sought to influence the 2016 election in Democrat Hillary Clinton’s favor and that Biden acted corruptly as vice president, thus justifying an investigation.

These unproven claims are a crucial part of Trump’s defense in the House impeachment inquiry. In fact, American intelligence agencies have concluded that Russia’s intelligence services, not Ukraine, worked to sway the election toward Trump. There is also no credible evidence that Biden intervened with Ukrainian officials to remove the country’s top prosecutor to help his son, who sat on the board of a company owned by a Ukrainian oligarch.

Vogel’s articles have been called into question — the Times story most prominently by Biden’s presidential campaign, and the Politico story by Politico’s own recent reporting.

Both Politico and the Times defended the reporter’s work, and Vogel told The Washington Post on Friday: “Not a single fact in either story has been successfully challenged. Both stories were prescient, revealing information that has come to play a central role in the impeachment saga.”

He added, “The Politico story revealed the genesis of Trump’s grudge against Ukraine, and the Times story exposed the Trump team’s pressure campaign against Ukraine.”

Vogel’s January 2017 Politico article (co-written with David L. Stern, now a freelance contributor to The Washington Post) extensively detailed Ukrainian efforts to undermine Trump in 2016, such as publicly questioning his fitness for office, disseminating documents implicating Paul Manafort, his campaign chairman at the time, in corruption and helping a Clinton ally research damaging information about him.

The lead of the story implied an equivalence with Russian efforts to undermine Clinton: “Donald Trump wasn’t the only presidential candidate whose campaign was boosted by officials of a former Soviet bloc country,” Vogel and Stern wrote, although the story later states that there is “little evidence” of the type of hacking and disinformation campaign waged by the Russians in 2016.

The story came up repeatedly during Wednesday’s impeachment hearing. Rep. Devin Nunes (R-Calif.) and Republican counsel Stephen R. Castor cited it several times in questioning diplomat William B. Taylor Jr., the acting ambassador to Ukraine. Both Nunes and Castor strongly suggested that the story validated Trump’s theory about Ukrainian officials during 2016.

Castor again brought up Vogel’s articles in Friday’s hearing to suggest that “influential elements of the Ukrainian establishment” were out to get Trump.

Vogel’s New York Times story, published May 1, was among the earliest to raise questions about Biden’s role in Ukraine during his time as vice president.

The Times story recounted Biden’s threat in March 2016 to withhold $1 billion in American loan guarantees if Ukraine’s leaders didn’t fire the country’s top prosecutor, who was long suspected of ignoring corruption in the country. It juxtaposed Biden’s advocacy with Hunter Biden’s role as a board member of Burisma Holdings, a Ukrainian natural gas company headed by a Ukrainian oligarch “who had been in the sights of the fired prosecutor general.” The article noted that the conflict-of-interest claim was being fanned by Trump’s personal lawyer, Rudolph W. Giuliani, and allies in the conservative media.

The suggestion that Joe Biden had acted improperly was driven home by the Web headline on the story: “Biden Faces Conflict of Interest Questions That Are Being Promoted by Trump and Allies.” The print headline on the front-page story raised an eyebrow, too: “For Biden, a Ukraine Matter That Won’t Go Away.”

In the months since the Vogel story’s publication, critics have slammed it, saying it advanced Trump and Giuliani’s smear campaign against Biden, a leading Democratic presidential candidate in 2020.

A Times spokeswoman, Eileen Murphy, said Vogel’s May 1 story is “accurate and consistent with our mission to seek the truth and help people understand the world.”

Politico spokesman Brad Dayspring also defended Vogel’s reporting. He said the 2017 article detailed instances in which Ukrainian officials “sought to raise questions” about Trump and his campaign, and detailed cooperation by Ukrainian officials with a Democratic National Committee consultant, Alexandra Chalupa, who was researching Manafort’s activities in Ukraine.

But Dayspring stressed that the article was limited in its assertions. It didn’t say these acts were comparable to Russia’s meddling in the 2016 election, nor did it assert a broader conspiracy, he said. It “did not state that the Ukrainian government conspired with the Clinton campaign or the DNC,” he said.

Murphy also noted what the Times story didn’t say — that Biden’s actions were intended to help his son. Instead, she said, it raised questions for the first time about whether Trump was behind an effort to push a foreign government to investigate a political opponent and exposed other ways in which Giuliani and Trump were seeking to “weaponize” allegations against Joe and Hunter Biden.

Baquet, in a brief email, said, “My only addition is that I believe Ken has done amazing work on this story.”

[old salt]

SecState Pompeo, yesterday's press conf :

https://www.c-span.org/video/?466814-1/ ... conference

ANY TIME THERE IS INFORMATION THAT INDICATES THAT ANY COUNTRY HAS MESSED WITH AMERICAN ELECTIONS, WE NOT ONLY HAVE A RIGHT BUT A DUTY TO MAKE SURE WE CHASE THAT DOWN. I SERVED AS CIA DIRECTOR FOR THE FIRST YEAR AND A HALF OF THIS ADMINISTRATION. I CAN ASSURE YOU THERE WERE MANY COUNTRIES THAT WERE ACTIVELY ENGAGED IN TRYING TO UNDERMINE AMERICAN DEMOCRACY, OUR RULE OF LAW, THE FUNDAMENTAL UNDERSTANDINGS WE HAVE HERE IN THE UNITED STATES, AND YOU SHOULD KNOW WE WERE DILIGENTLY, DILIGENTLY WORKING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ADDRESSED EACH OF THEM WITH EVERY TOOL OF AMERICAN POWER THAT WE HAD. SO WHOMEVER IT IS, BY THE WAY, IT'S NOT JUST -- I SAID NATIONS. IT'S NOT JUST STATE ACTORS. THERE ARE NON-STATE ACTORS, TOO WHO ARE OUT THERE ACTING IN WAYS THAT ARE DEEPLY INCONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO TO PROTECT OUR ELECTIONS. AMERICA SHOULD LEAVE NO STONE UNTURNED. WHATEVER NATION IT IS, IF WE HAVE INFORMATION THAT SO MUCH AS SUGGESTS THERE MIGHT HAVE BEEN INTERFERENCE OR AN EFFORT TO INTERFERE IN OUR ELECTIONS, WE HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO MAKE SURE THAT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE GET TO GO TO THE BALLOT BOX, CAST THEIR BALLOTS IN A WAY THAT IS UNIMPACTED BY THESE MALEVOLENT ACTORS TRYING TO UNDERMINE OUR WESTERN DEMOCRATIC VALUES.

[ggait]

JFK would be a staunch Republican and Trump supporter today. Embarrassing even for someone as clueless and hateful as you.

Actually, Ike would be considered a far left progressive today. Check out the 1956 (i.e. back when America was great) GOP platform. Pretty Bernie/AOC if you ask me. Pro-entitlements, pro-Union, pro-minimum wage, pro gender equality, pro refugee/immigrant. The guy was basically a pinko Commie.

https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-mete ... was-prett/

Happy Thanksgiving to all!!

[Typical Lax Dad]

[Trinity]

Manafort drew flies. That’s not the same as Ukraine meddling in our election.
#gotalktoRudy

[old salt]

Another IF TRUE smoke bomb. Diversion & cover to distract from IG & Durham investigations.

De ja Vu. All over again.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Another IF TRUE smoke bomb. Diversion & cover to distract from IG & Durham investigations.

De ja Vu. All over again.

Like “IF it were true” that Hillary was lying about Benghazi until you found out the truth. Enjoy your turkey.

[a fan]

Another IF TRUE smoke bomb. Diversion & cover to distract from IG & Durham investigations.

De ja Vu. All over again.

So Republicans and their media toadies are back with the "everyone has to tell the truth except Trump and the Republicans" game.

F off is my response to this Federalist piece.

F. Off.

[Trinity]

Let’s hear from Horowitz. Free carter page.

[Typical Lax Dad]

For the record: https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/invest ... 24084.html

[foreverlax]

SecState Pompeo, yesterday's press conf :

https://www.c-span.org/video/?466814-1/ ... conference

ANY TIME THERE IS INFORMATION THAT INDICATES THAT ANY COUNTRY HAS MESSED WITH AMERICAN ELECTIONS, WE NOT ONLY HAVE A RIGHT BUT A DUTY TO MAKE SURE WE CHASE THAT DOWN. I SERVED AS CIA DIRECTOR FOR THE FIRST YEAR AND A HALF OF THIS ADMINISTRATION. I CAN ASSURE YOU THERE WERE MANY COUNTRIES THAT WERE ACTIVELY ENGAGED IN TRYING TO UNDERMINE AMERICAN DEMOCRACY, OUR RULE OF LAW, THE FUNDAMENTAL UNDERSTANDINGS WE HAVE HERE IN THE UNITED STATES, AND YOU SHOULD KNOW WE WERE DILIGENTLY, DILIGENTLY WORKING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE ADDRESSED EACH OF THEM WITH EVERY TOOL OF AMERICAN POWER THAT WE HAD. SO WHOMEVER IT IS, BY THE WAY, IT'S NOT JUST -- I SAID NATIONS. IT'S NOT JUST STATE ACTORS. THERE ARE NON-STATE ACTORS, TOO WHO ARE OUT THERE ACTING IN WAYS THAT ARE DEEPLY INCONSISTENT WITH WHAT WE ARE TRYING TO DO TO PROTECT OUR ELECTIONS. AMERICA SHOULD LEAVE NO STONE UNTURNED. WHATEVER NATION IT IS, IF WE HAVE INFORMATION THAT SO MUCH AS SUGGESTS THERE MIGHT HAVE BEEN INTERFERENCE OR AN EFFORT TO INTERFERE IN OUR ELECTIONS, WE HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO MAKE SURE THAT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE GET TO GO TO THE BALLOT BOX, CAST THEIR BALLOTS IN A WAY THAT IS UNIMPACTED BY THESE MALEVOLENT ACTORS TRYING TO UNDERMINE OUR WESTERN DEMOCRATIC VALUES.

And who funds the non-state actors? I'd bet one of the states.

[Trinity]

Lie after lie falls apart. Better ask Barr and Rudy.