Trump's Russian Collusion

[ggait]

gg - we must have been watching a different channel - no points were scored - I would call it a loss or min a tie. Not sure what you saw.

Sondland talks directly to Trump on 7/26 (day after the infamous 7/25 call) out in the open in front of witnesses who will now be testifying. And then Sondland says in front of witnesses: "President Trump cares more about the investigations of Biden, which Giuliani was pressing for.”

That may not be points on the board -- yet. But that is an alley oop pass that can be dunked when Gordo comes back to testify next week.

[a fan]

aFan,
I am not the jury - the voters will be. I gave my candid observation.

You gave your candid observation of Democrats and witnesses. You still haven't used that same observation on what Trump admitted he did.

It does not fit your narrative.

My entire narrative comes directly from President Trump.

He told us on TV----it's there for you if you want to review it------that he asked the Ukrainian President to "investigate" Biden and his son after Biden announced he was running for President.

The WB, and any other testimony is wholly, entirely irrelevant to this voter....although the details are making it sound even worse. What Trump admitted to doing is illegal---violation of the FEC Rules---- and is entirely Nixonian.

If what he did is ok to you, that means you'd be ok if the next President did the same thing. An absurd position. You can't let a sitting President go after political rivals using the power of his office.

If all that Trump did is ask the UKr President to "investigate American corruption"??? I would have ZERO problem with that. None whatsoever.

But that's not what he did. So here we are.

[LandM]

gg,
Name a politician since Hamilton who may not have been so brazen and stupid that did not do the same thing? He was elected because he was NOT a politician. He is going to say some really off the cuff comments - what happens when the next Prez perhaps says the same silly things - Castro was off the cliff, was he serious? Schiff shut down most things people on the R side wanted to say but as you mentioned their rules and he can do that but it comes across as egotistical and take my ball - I guess we wait and see. He will be impeached, exonerated in the Senate and then win 2020 unless all of HRC fans push her to run again.

[LandM]

aFan,
Been around the block in business a few times - speaking for myself, the whole Hunter looks pretty f$cked up and yes, I have seen my fair share of conflicts of interest - does not make it illegal - I used this before and was widely criticized - optics - the Hubble could not save him

[old salt]

It is surprising that Amb Taylor was not aware of the Jan 2017 POLITICO article detailing the activities of DNC staffer Chalupa & Ukrainian officials in the 2016 campaign. You would think that would be part of his turnover brief when he came back into the job.

[old salt]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

[CU77]

gg,
Name a politician since Hamilton who may not have been so brazen and stupid that did not do the same thing?

The first 44 names on this list:

https://www.whitehouse.gov/about-the-wh ... residents/

[Trinity]

He hates corruption but awarded himself the G7.

[youthathletics]

Democrat Logic, defined clearly, buy a democrat: https://twitter.com/RepMattGaetz/status ... 23362?s=20 #ClownShow #WhackaMole

[old salt]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

Amb Taylor testified that he was part of the "regular" channel & Amb Volker, Amb Sondland & Rudy G were the "irregular" channel.

Taylor indicated that he was fine with the dual channels, so long as they were working toward the same "overall direction & purpose."
That being -- an Oval Office meeting & release of military aid, without delay.
Taylor only became concerned about the dual channels when their means about how to achieve those goals began to diverge.
At that point, it became a turf battle, Taylor became alarmed & began expressing his concern to his State Dept superiors.

[Peter Brown]

Meanwhile, the stock market keeps racing upward...

[ggait]

gg,
Name a politician since Hamilton who may not have been so brazen and stupid that did not do the same thing?

Sure there's some pols who engage in bribery. But certainly not all. Actually quite few.

The alleged conduct is literally the same thing as asking for a bag of money in exchange for the granting of a building permit. It is just that simple.

[calourie]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

Amb Taylor testified that he was part of the "regular" channel & Amb Volker, Amb Sondland & Rudy G were the "irregular" channel.

Taylor indicated that he was fine with the dual channels, so long as they were working toward the same "overall direction & purpose."
That being -- an Oval Office meeting & release of military aid, without delay.
Taylor only became concerned about the dual channels when their means about how to achieve those goals began to diverge.
At that point, it became a turf battle, Taylor became alarmed & began expressing his concern to his State Dept superiors.

So the regular channel is Sate Department business as usual, and the back channel to no business as usual unless a damaging statement is made about both a political rival's involvement in a settled matter and a debunked conspiracy theory is reinvigorated in a US public forum by a foreign country's president. Can't see what could possibly be wrong with conducting business in such a mafia-like thuggish manner. Whistleblower-Schmistleblower. Next.

[ggait]

Democrat Logic, defined clearly, buy a democrat: https://twitter.com/RepMattGaetz/status ... 23362?s=20 #ClownShow #WhackaMole

Here's the problem with the hearsay defense.

A testifies: B told me that C said XYZ. OK that's hearsay.

Then B testifies: C told me XYZ. That's corroboration and not hearsay.

Then C testifies: I told XYZ to B. That's also corroboration and not hearsay.

[Typical Lax Dad]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

Amb Taylor testified that he was part of the "regular" channel & Amb Volker, Amb Sondland & Rudy G were the "irregular" channel.

Taylor indicated that he was fine with the dual channels, so long as they were working toward the same "overall direction & purpose."
That being -- an Oval Office meeting & release of military aid, without delay.
Taylor only became concerned about the dual channels when their means about how to achieve those goals began to diverge.
At that point, it became a turf battle, Taylor became alarmed & began expressing his concern to his State Dept superiors.

The memos should clear it all up. That’s how it’s done at most large organizations when trig battles occur. Post a link when you have a minute.

[jhu72]

gg - we must have been watching a different channel - no points were scored - I would call it a loss or min a tie. Not sure what you saw.

Sondland talks directly to Trump on 7/26 (day after the infamous 7/25 call) out in the open in front of witnesses who will now be testifying. And then Sondland says in front of witnesses: "President Trump cares more about the investigations of Biden, which Giuliani was pressing for.”

That may not be points on the board -- yet. But that is an alley oop pass that can be dunked when Gordo comes back to testify next week.

Orange Duce claims there never was a phone call. Well that puts and end to that. White House phone logs will tell a different story I would think. Peter Welch has it right. The guy who started all this is named Donald Trump. What a putz.

[old salt]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

Amb Taylor testified that he was part of the "regular" channel & Amb Volker, Amb Sondland & Rudy G were the "irregular" channel.

Taylor indicated that he was fine with the dual channels, so long as they were working toward the same "overall direction & purpose."
That being -- an Oval Office meeting & release of military aid, without delay.
Taylor only became concerned about the dual channels when their means about how to achieve those goals began to diverge.
At that point, it became a turf battle, Taylor became alarmed & began expressing his concern to his State Dept superiors.

The memos should clear it all up. That’s how it’s done at most large organizations when trig battles occur. Post a link when you have a minute.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?466134-1/ ... eorge-kent

[Typical Lax Dad]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

Amb Taylor testified that he was part of the "regular" channel & Amb Volker, Amb Sondland & Rudy G were the "irregular" channel.

Taylor indicated that he was fine with the dual channels, so long as they were working toward the same "overall direction & purpose."
That being -- an Oval Office meeting & release of military aid, without delay.
Taylor only became concerned about the dual channels when their means about how to achieve those goals began to diverge.
At that point, it became a turf battle, Taylor became alarmed & began expressing his concern to his State Dept superiors.

The memos should clear it all up. That’s how it’s done at most large organizations when trig battles occur. Post a link when you have a minute.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?466134-1/ ... eorge-kent

Were the memos introduced as evidence? Don’t want to scroll though 5 hours. At what minute mark should I look for the memos?

[old salt]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

Amb Taylor testified that he was part of the "regular" channel & Amb Volker, Amb Sondland & Rudy G were the "irregular" channel.

Taylor indicated that he was fine with the dual channels, so long as they were working toward the same "overall direction & purpose."
That being -- an Oval Office meeting & release of military aid, without delay.
Taylor only became concerned about the dual channels when their means about how to achieve th.ose goals began to diverge.
At that point, it became a turf battle, Taylor became alarmed & began expressing his concern to his State Dept superiors.

The memos should clear it all up. That’s how it’s done at most large organizations when trig battles occur. Post a link when you have a minute.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?466134-1/ ... eorge-kent

Were the memos introduced as evidence? Don’t want to scroll though 5 hours. At what minute mark should I look for the memos?

I don't know what memos you're referencing. Taylor sent a classified cable to Pompeo expressing his concern.
To review Amb Taylor's opening statement go to 00:48:55 on the video or scroll down on the transcript & click on Show Full Text.
He discusses the regular & irregular channels in his opening statement.

[Typical Lax Dad]

To help appreciate the urgency of this second batch of lethal military aid to Ukraine, here's what they got in the first batch, in addition to 150 Javelins.
https://www.military.com/kitup/2017/12/ ... raine.html
https://uawire.org/us-gives-ukraine-cou ... ery-radars
https://www.janes.com/article/87863/ukr ... ield-tests

That's why Amb Taylor couldn't tell Schiff that the delay lead to any additional Ukrainian casualties.

https://www.defensenews.com/congress/20 ... p-delayed/

The U.S. has committed more than $1.5 billion in security assistance to Ukraine since 2014, when Russian-backed separatists began driving tanks through eastern Ukraine. The latest equipment was largely more of the same aid the U.S. previously supplied, aimed at helping Ukraine monitor and secure its borders, deploy its forces more safely and effectively, and make progress toward NATO interoperability.

The Defense Department’s tranche was set to include sniper rifles, rocket-propelled grenade launchers, counter-artillery radars, electronic warfare detection and secure communications, night vision equipment, and military medical supplies and treatment. The department previously included counter-sniper equipment, Humvees and tactical drones as well.

The State Department funding included $115 million for a broad array of purposes, to buy American-produced weapons through the Foreign Military Financing program, but also to provide advisers and training to boost Ukraine’s NATO interoperability: English language labs, medical equipment and improvised bomb simulators. The funds could also pay for spare parts, sustainment and training for previously purchased U.S. gear.

What was the hold up?

Inter-governmental turf battle.

That explains it. Knew I could count on you. Can you post a copy of those inter-Government memos? I am sure they were all CYA and memorializing their actions.

Review Amb Taylor's testimony from today. He gives a play-by-play, tick-tock. Now, he's the official scorer.

Amb Taylor testified that he was part of the "regular" channel & Amb Volker, Amb Sondland & Rudy G were the "irregular" channel.

Taylor indicated that he was fine with the dual channels, so long as they were working toward the same "overall direction & purpose."
That being -- an Oval Office meeting & release of military aid, without delay.
Taylor only became concerned about the dual channels when their means about how to achieve th.ose goals began to diverge.
At that point, it became a turf battle, Taylor became alarmed & began expressing his concern to his State Dept superiors.

The memos should clear it all up. That’s how it’s done at most large organizations when trig battles occur. Post a link when you have a minute.

https://www.c-span.org/video/?466134-1/ ... eorge-kent

Were the memos introduced as evidence? Don’t want to scroll though 5 hours. At what minute mark should I look for the memos?

To review Amb Taylor's opening statement go to 00:48:55 on the video or scroll down on the transcript & click on Show Full Text.

I didn't see any exhibits of inter-departmental memos arguing about which department was going to give Ukraine aid. Where were the memos that discussed the delays because the two departments were battling over who would fund aid to Ukraine?