JUST the Stolen Documents/Mar-A-Lago/"Judge" Cannon Trial

[tech37]

Not making a pure comparison but I recall being put off by that comment, at the time I felt like Obama was a neophyte with limited experience and lacking substance but excellent at the modern media management (right FFG, in other words an empty suit, "tan" that is ) and was concerned his tune would change a lot once he had the seat.

[Farfromgeneva]

Not an empty suit, but I think he’s partly responsible for why the Democratic Party has gone harder to the right. Talked about anti war concepts then used drones, never closed Guantanamo, cash for clunkers is going to cost us dearly in 18-30mo I can almost guarantee. Think it’s more he said what he believed and also managed perception the way a current pro athlete does combined with lacking enough experience but didn’t want to go back to his base and explain that some of the ideals he pitched weren’t feasible on a technocratic level. Like some of Warren and sanders proposals, well intentioned but not practically implementable in a way which would get the output their promising.

Obama isn’t a bad guy and understands things in this country a lot better than the current president. Every time we have a technocratic heavy administration we want idealogues then when the rubber meets the road and the idealogues can’t deliver, and none of them really can for the people, we go back to wanting technocrats.

[wahoomurf]

Not making a pure comparison but I recall being put off by that comment, at the time I felt like Obama was a neophyte with limited experience and lacking substance but excellent at the modern media management and was concerned his tune would change a lot once he had the seat. Didn’t dislike the guy but was still in the camp of McCain understanding why with the crisis the country was tired of republicans in the WH. Think his BB game is overrated too, but not in the same camp.

But just like the nuclear option to jam through ACA, people need to be aware that it’ll all come back around on them and at that point it should be understood that t was coming and eat it. (Not to defend this president either)

I don’t disagree. Part of the reason why I hope rational minds prevail is that we could get someone worse than Trump. He has proven that customs and norms are almost meaningless. On the verge of being Kingdom like.

He has proven that customs and norms are almost meaningless.

I would add the rule of law and the Constitution to your list.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Not making a pure comparison but I recall being put off by that comment, at the time I felt like Obama was a neophyte with limited experience and lacking substance but excellent at the modern media management and was concerned his tune would change a lot once he had the seat. Didn’t dislike the guy but was still in the camp of McCain understanding why with the crisis the country was tired of republicans in the WH. Think his BB game is overrated too, but not in the same camp.

But just like the nuclear option to jam through ACA, people need to be aware that it’ll all come back around on them and at that point it should be understood that t was coming and eat it. (Not to defend this president either)

I don’t disagree. Part of the reason why I hope rational minds prevail is that we could get someone worse than Trump. He has proven that customs and norms are almost meaningless. On the verge of being Kingdom like.

He has proven that customs and norms are almost meaningless.

I would add the rule of law and the Constitution to your list.

+1000. It’s amazing to watch how quickly we have become Botswana.

[tech37]

Not an empty suit, but I think he’s partly responsible for why the Democratic Party has gone harder to the right. Talked about anti war concepts then used drones (one of the very few things I agreed with him on – 9/11 pi$$ed me off to my core), never closed Guantanamo (good), cash for clunkers is going to cost us dearly in 18-30mo I can almost guarantee. Think it’s more he said what he believed and also managed perception the way a current pro athlete does combined with lacking enough experience but didn’t want to go back to his base and explain that some of the ideals he pitched weren’t feasible on a technocratic level. Like some of Warren and sanders proposals, well intentioned but not practically implementable in a way which would get the output their promising.

Obama isn’t a bad guy and understands things in this country a lot better than the current president. Every time we have a technocratic heavy administration we want idealogues then when the rubber meets the road and the idealogues can’t deliver, and none of them really can for the people, we go back to wanting technocrats. Personally I think it has been more economy driven than anything else. Election of Trump is certainly an anomaly, a rejection of business-as-usual in Wash, and certainly a rejection of all things Clinton and the continuation of the so-called Obama legacy.

[wahoomurf]

Not making a pure comparison but I recall being put off by that comment, at the time I felt like Obama was a neophyte with limited experience and lacking substance but excellent at the modern media management and was concerned his tune would change a lot once he had the seat. Didn’t dislike the guy but was still in the camp of McCain understanding why with the crisis the country was tired of republicans in the WH. Think his BB game is overrated too, but not in the same camp.

But just like the nuclear option to jam through ACA, people need to be aware that it’ll all come back around on them and at that point it should be understood that t was coming and eat it. (Not to defend this president either)

I don’t disagree. Part of the reason why I hope rational minds prevail is that we could get someone worse than Trump. He has proven that customs and norms are almost meaningless. On the verge of being Kingdom like.

He has proven that customs and norms are almost meaningless.

I would add the rule of law and the Constitution to your list.

+1000. It’s amazing to watch how quickly we have become Botswana.

[holmes435]

Personally I think it has been more economy driven than anything else. Election of Trump is certainly an anomaly, a rejection of business-as-usual in Wash, and certainly a rejection of all things Clinton and the continuation of the so-called Obama legacy.

I don't see it that way at all. Trump only made it through the primaries because there were so many candidates splitting the vote combined with the winner-take all setup many states have for their R primary. So even though 60-70% of Republicans didn't want him in the first few rounds of primaries, the whole party got stuck with him.

Secondly, Clinton got a few million more votes than Trump, so clearly the nation as a whole wasn't rejecting all things Clinton and the Obama legacy. We're not talking about some kind of FDR or Nixon-like landslide victory.

[a fan]

a rejection of business-as-usual in Wash,

People keep saying this, and I don't get why.

Every single complaint about DC---corruption, nepotism, choosing winners and losers, not getting anything done, spending too much, borrowing too much------has gotten exponentially worse.

And yet Trump fans are cheering.

I don't know what other proof is needed to prove that nope, that's not why Trump was elected. It was obviously a different reason.

[tech37]

Personally I think it has been more economy driven than anything else. Election of Trump is certainly an anomaly, a rejection of business-as-usual in Wash, and certainly a rejection of all things Clinton and the continuation of the so-called Obama legacy.

I don't see it that way at all. Trump only made it through the primaries because there were so many candidates splitting the vote combined with the winner-take all setup many states have for their R primary. So even though 60-70% of Republicans didn't want him in the first few rounds of primaries, the whole party got stuck with him.

Secondly, Clinton got a few million more votes than Trump, so clearly the nation as a whole wasn't rejecting all things Clinton and the Obama legacy. We're not talking about some kind of FDR or Nixon-like landslide victory.

holmes, another Electoral College denier, can't fathom that HRC didn't get the needed votes, in the needed states, to actually win.

[tech37]

a rejection of business-as-usual in Wash,

People keep saying this, and I don't get why.

Every single complaint about DC---corruption, nepotism, choosing winners and losers, not getting anything done, spending too much, borrowing too much------has gotten exponentially worse.

And yet Trump fans are cheering.

I don't know what other proof is needed to prove that nope, that's not why Trump was elected. It was obviously a different reason.

You're being short-sighted. What Trump campaigned on and what has/is ultimately happening are two different things. The election was three years ago.

But, any Trump loyalty at this point is a backlash against the "resistance" more than anything else. Some of us keep warning that this will make Trump a lock for 2020. Keep on impeaching...

[a fan]

You're being short-sighted. What Trump campaigned on and what has/is ultimately happening are two different things. The election was three years ago.

If Trump approval ratings went down as a result of what he's actually doing, I'd agree with you. But since his approval ratings have been rock solid among these voters, It's obvious that TrumpFans are just fine with business as usual in DC, and they support and supported Trump for entirely different reasons than "they were sick of business as usual".

But, any Trump loyalty at this point is a backlash against the "resistance" more than anything else. Some of us keep warning that this will make Trump a lock for 2020. Keep on impeaching...

If that's true, we're a nation of morons. Supporting a politician who affects your family directly, even though you don't like what he's doing....with the idea that that will "stick it to the libs" is bottom of the barrel dumb.

But ok.

Personally, I think Trump will win because Corporate Dems didn't learn their lesson when they nominated Hillary....and they'll make us choose between the lesser of two evils again.

One year out, I have to say that I'll be surprised if Trump loses.

[Typical Lax Dad]

These guys need to get their panties out of a bunch and get over it..... Trump won.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-syri ... SKBN1X00ZO

[old salt]

These guys need to get their panties out of a bunch and get over it..... Trump won.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-syri ... SKBN1X00ZO

Your newfound concern about the plight of the Kurds & your sudden interest in our mission in Syria is most impressive.

[Typical Lax Dad]

These guys need to get their panties out of a bunch and get over it..... Trump won.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-syri ... SKBN1X00ZO

Your newfound concern about the plight of the Kurds & your sudden interest in our mission in Syria is most impressive.

My concern is with the decision making of the POTUS. You think those guys just need to get over it? They are mad that Hillary lost too.

[foreverlax]

These guys need to get their panties out of a bunch and get over it..... Trump won.

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-syri ... SKBN1X00ZO

Your newfound concern about the plight of the Kurds & your sudden interest in our mission in Syria is most impressive.

My concern is with the decision making of the POTUS. You think those guys just need to get over it? They are mad that Hillary lost too.

It's easier to make fun of those who see the failure of Trump's actions, then to actually condemn what he did - which is bail on the Kurds.

Of course Trump acts like he and his bone spurs were the real heroes.

"get over it" is now the new "whatever"....

[holmes435]

Personally I think it has been more economy driven than anything else. Election of Trump is certainly an anomaly, a rejection of business-as-usual in Wash, and certainly a rejection of all things Clinton and the continuation of the so-called Obama legacy.

I don't see it that way at all. Trump only made it through the primaries because there were so many candidates splitting the vote combined with the winner-take all setup many states have for their R primary. So even though 60-70% of Republicans didn't want him in the first few rounds of primaries, the whole party got stuck with him.

Secondly, Clinton got a few million more votes than Trump, so clearly the nation as a whole wasn't rejecting all things Clinton and the Obama legacy. We're not talking about some kind of FDR or Nixon-like landslide victory.

holmes, another Electoral College denier, can't fathom that HRC didn't get the needed votes, in the needed states, to actually win.

Where did I say anything about the Electoral College? We're talking about what voters wanted in the R primary and in the general election, try to keep up.

What you can't fathom is the fact that Clinton won the popular vote and more people wanted her in office than Trump. The election wasn't a rejection of Clinton and Obama policies - the voters did actually want them.

[tech37]

What you can't fathom is the fact that Clinton won the popular vote and more people wanted her in office than Trump. The election wasn't a rejection of Clinton and Obama policies - the voters did actually want them.

Nah, lesser of two evils holmes. Some voters thought Clinton was lesser of two evils and other voters Trump the lesser of two evils. Bottom line, two awful choices

[tech37]

What you can't fathom is the fact that Clinton won the popular vote and more people wanted her in office than Trump. The election wasn't a rejection of Clinton and Obama policies - the voters did actually want them.

Nah, lesser of two evils holmes. Some voters thought Clinton was lesser of two evils and other voters Trump the lesser of two evils. Bottom line, two awful choices

Sorry a fan, just read your post above. I wasn't lifting your "two evils" idea replying to holmes... we both thought the same thing ... for once

[MDlaxfan76]

What you can't fathom is the fact that Clinton won the popular vote and more people wanted her in office than Trump. The election wasn't a rejection of Clinton and Obama policies - the voters did actually want them.

Nah, lessor of two evils holmes. Some voters thought Clinton was lessor of two evils and other voters Trump the lessor of two evils. Bottom line, two awful choices

I sure thought it was two awful choices.
But you do keep skirting the fundamental point that more voters chose Clinton than Trump.

Unless you buy Trump's BS that that those millions more voters weren't actually Americans...

[a fan]

No problemo, tech.