JUST the Stolen Documents/Mar-A-Lago/"Judge" Cannon Trial

[LandM]

MD,
Anyone at his level who is leaking to the press is a scumbag. Worse he did it for personal gain then further lied about it. Anyone in the military who did that would be loss of pay and rank and whatever airman created the I drank to much at Turnberry bar and had to use my own money should spend a few weeks doing some hard time. I had a young kid who took his military issued Diners Club card and bought a big screen tv. Bill comes do and who does not have the funds? You guys are out here talking and giving ethics and conflict of interest lectures- might want to look in that mirror.

[Farfromgeneva]

Must be good to train not to think and live in an obtuse corridor.

How do rule based systems get created in the first place that are of any value if thinking and understanding are of no value. It’s just a shifting of responsibility, the more explicit the rules based system the less individual responsibility exists, which is clearly on display here. Can’t form independent values when one has been told how it is.

I can shout in bold letter too: POLITICIANS REPRESENT ALL AMERICANS IN A CONTEXT THAT IS ENTIRELY DIFFERENT THAN A REGIMENTED CHAIN OF COMMAND SYSTEM SO APPLYING A MILITARY SYSTEM TO THESE DISCUSSIONS IS STUPIDLY MYOPIC.

[LandM]

In the military they do teach you to think outside the box. We are not robots it just goes to show how petty and uneducated people are about what goes on. My accountant yesterday asked if an Academy is a college LMAO. So you think it is cool to leak to save your arse. Pretty pretentious

[foreverlax]

"You guys are out here talking and giving ethics and conflict of interest lectures- might want to look in that mirror."

[Farfromgeneva]

In the military they do teach you to think outside the box. We are not robots it just goes to show how petty and uneducated people are about what goes on. My accountant yesterday asked if an Academy is a college LMAO. So you think it is cool to leak to save your arse. Pretty pretentious

Blah blah blah. “I’m an expert on everything because I served and everyone else is stupid” (as if I don’t have Purple Heart medal family members and plenty of education about the military as well as knowing first hand a guy who graduated from West Point who regularly intentionally got younger girls drunk and took advantage of them while being sober and sill is serving with a pretty high level rank, the military isn’t exempt from or outside the law)

No leaking isn’t cool, I wouldn’t use the term “cool” in this topic, it’s an uneducated and petty way of describing the situation Mr use all caps to repeat something because you demand to be heard. There’s nothing “cool” about this discussion but your use of words speaks to the seriousness of your approach. And you don’t know that a person is leaking to save their “arse” it’s speculation. Pretty full of stuff that comes out of an “arse”.

Want to suggest a fight to me too? I’ve got size as age on you as will send first class mail to your house with an invitation to mine.

[CU88]

Actually was a leading FBI expert in Counterterrorism and organized crime, Russian and otherwise.

Meanwhile “Projects to upgrade airfields in Germany, Luxembourg, Great Britain, Hungary, and Slovakia have been shelved, leaving the bases unable to support U.S. and NATO airplanes.” NBC.

They need to relocate those bases closer to Trump resort properties.

Please tell me that you simply didn't read the rest of the story, and that's why you're making jokes.

"At Incirlik Air Base in Turkey, the entry-control point at the main gate is "degrading and not properly configured to provide proper protection for pedestrian and vehicle passage," the Air Force report says, adding there has been a "higher threat environment" there since the U.S. began operating in Syria.

"Security breaches have increased since the base began Operation Inherent Resolve Support," the report says. "If not funded, the main gate remains vulnerable to hostile penetration in the midst of contingency operations and an increased terrorist threat."



https://www.nbcnews.com/news/military/t ... s-n1054091

It is shocking that the r's are doing all of this BS.

[foreverlax]

Actually was a leading FBI expert in Counterterrorism and organized crime, Russian and otherwise.

Meanwhile “Projects to upgrade airfields in Germany, Luxembourg, Great Britain, Hungary, and Slovakia have been shelved, leaving the bases unable to support U.S. and NATO airplanes.” NBC.

They need to relocate those bases closer to Trump resort properties.

Please tell me that you simply didn't read the rest of the story, and that's why you're making jokes.

"At Incirlik Air Base in Turkey, the entry-control point at the main gate is "degrading and not properly configured to provide proper protection for pedestrian and vehicle passage," the Air Force report says, adding there has been a "higher threat environment" there since the U.S. began operating in Syria.

"Security breaches have increased since the base began Operation Inherent Resolve Support," the report says. "If not funded, the main gate remains vulnerable to hostile penetration in the midst of contingency operations and an increased terrorist threat."



https://www.nbcnews.com/news/military/t ... s-n1054091

It is shocking that the r's are doing all of this BS.

Not really...

[a fan]

MD,
Anyone at his level who is leaking to the press is a scumbag. Worse he did it for personal gain then further lied about it. Anyone in the military who did that would be loss of pay and rank and whatever airman created the I drank to much at Turnberry bar and had to use my own money should spend a few weeks doing some hard time. I had a young kid who took his military issued Diners Club card and bought a big screen tv. Bill comes do and who does not have the funds? You guys are out here talking and giving ethics and conflict of interest lectures- might want to look in that mirror.

You're compass is lost at sea.

Maybe I'm misreading your comment-----but are you trying to tell us that you think it's ok for soldiers to stay at Trump's property....


...while at the same, you think the guy who leaked the story about staying at Trump's property to the press should do hard time.

One is 100% ok, but the other is horribly wrong. Do I have this right?

[old salt]

MD,
Anyone at his level who is leaking to the press is a scumbag. Worse he did it for personal gain then further lied about it. Anyone in the military who did that would be loss of pay and rank and whatever airman created the I drank to much at Turnberry bar and had to use my own money should spend a few weeks doing some hard time. I had a young kid who took his military issued Diners Club card and bought a big screen tv. Bill comes do and who does not have the funds? You guys are out here talking and giving ethics and conflict of interest lectures- might want to look in that mirror.

You're compass is lost at sea.

Maybe I'm misreading your comment-----but are you trying to tell us that you think it's ok for soldiers to stay at Trump's property....


...while at the same, you think the guy who leaked the story about staying at Trump's property to the press should do hard time.

One is 100% ok, but the other is horribly wrong. Do I have this right?

In her Senate confirmation hearing, the incoming Sec of the AF said it's ok if the cost qualifies as best value.

Sen. Richard Blumenthal (D-Conn.) asked Barbara Barrett during her Senate Armed Services Committee confirmation hearing to commit to carrying out a servicewide policy that would bar service members from staying at Trump properties.

But Barrett declined to say she would prohibit the practice, instead saying that she would look at implementing “generic rules and regulations that look at the best value.”

Pressed by Blumenthal to promise to issue a prohibition, Barrett said, “I’ll take a look at it.”

Blumenthal said he hoped Barrett would provide a clearer answer to the committee before she is confirmed.

[a fan]

Of course she was F ing confirmed.

Remember this unethical stuff cuts in all directions. If she thinks this is ok----what else does she think is ok? And how is she training her subordinates?

Keep lowering the bar, fellas. What could possibly go wrong?


On completely, entirely unrelated note-----how are those ethical problems with your Deep State working out for you? What's that you say? They're following the rules, but are making ethically questionable decisions?

Boy. That sounds like a problem.

[old salt]

It is not a lapse of ethics or " questionable decision " for the USAF to continue using an air field, & a "best value" lodging option when needed, based on agreements made before Trump was elected.

If Trump's business enjoys a minimal benefit from the occasional, but necessary, best value lodging choice, that is reasonable.

Regarding fuel sales -- the contract price was negotiated under Obama. If fuel sales to transiting USAF acft which benefit from refueling there allows our ally, the UK, to keep that reliever airport in service, it's worth continuing. Especially if it avoids air traffic delays into congested London terminal airspace & reduces ramp loading at congested USAFE air bases. If Trump subsequently benefits from USAF mission planning protocols established well before he was elected, it is reasonable to continue, so long as it continues to benefit the USAF.

The situation has been examined & will now continue to be scrutinized for abuse by Congress & the media.

[a fan]

It is not a lapse of ethics or " questionable decision " for the USAF to continue using an air field, & a "best value" lodging option when needed, based on agreements made before Trump was elected.

If Trump's business enjoys a minimal benefit from the occasional, but necessary, best value lodging choice, that is reasonable.

No, it's not. You're a lost cause. You'd have NO PROBLEM understanding this if Trumpy had a little D by his name.

Let me ask you this, if you're supposedly looking out for the taxpayer and the USAF: how does it harm the taxpayer or the USAF if the supposedly small number of airmen are told not to stay at Trump's property? Well over a dozen properties to stay in, far closer to the airport, that meet the per diem requirement.

Take your time. Mull it over. Get back to us.

Regarding fuel sales -- the contract price was negotiated under Obama. If fuel sales to transiting USAF acft which benefit from refueling there allows our ally, the UK, to keep that reliever airport in service, it's worth continuing. Especially if it avoids air traffic delays into congested London terminal airspace & reduces ramp loading at congested USAFE air bases. If Trump subsequently benefits from USAF mission planning protocols established well before he was elected, it is reasonable to continue, so long as it continues to benefit the USAF.

It's a bandaid, and you know it. We need to make one of our "Air Force bases" in the UK usable by, you know, our freaking Air Force.

Otherwise? Why do we have 5 of them? Talk about a waste of money. Instead of asking that obvious question, you're here defending what you think is "Trump's right" to make money off the US taxpayer.

Or, if you prefer, have either the US or UK military buy the doggone airport if it's sooooo valuable. The airport was on life support before we showed up, no?

The situation has been examined & will now continue to be scrutinized for abuse by Congress & the media.

Yes. As it should be.

[old salt]

It is not a lapse of ethics or " questionable decision " for the USAF to continue using an air field, & a "best value" lodging option when needed, based on agreements made before Trump was elected.

If Trump's business enjoys a minimal benefit from the occasional, but necessary, best value lodging choice, that is reasonable.

No, it's not. You're a lost cause. You'd have NO PROBLEM understanding this if Trumpy had a little D by his name.

Let me ask you this, if you're supposedly looking out for the taxpayer and the USAF: how does it harm the taxpayer or the USAF if the supposedly small number of airmen are told not to stay at Trump's property? Well over a dozen properties to stay in, far closer to the airport, that meet the per diem requirement.

Take your time. Mull it over. Get back to us.

Regarding fuel sales -- the contract price was negotiated under Obama. If fuel sales to transiting USAF acft which benefit from refueling there allows our ally, the UK, to keep that reliever airport in service, it's worth continuing. Especially if it avoids air traffic delays into congested London terminal airspace & reduces ramp loading at congested USAFE air bases. If Trump subsequently benefits from USAF mission planning protocols established well before he was elected, it is reasonable to continue, so long as it continues to benefit the USAF.

It's a bandaid, and you know it. We need to make one of our "Air Force bases" in the UK usable by, you know, our freaking Air Force.

Otherwise? Why do we have 5 of them? Talk about a waste of money. Instead of asking that obvious question, you're here defending what you think is "Trump's right" to make money off the US taxpayer.

Or, if you prefer, have either the US or UK military buy the doggone airport if it's sooooo valuable. The airport was on life support before we showed up, no?

The situation has been examined & will now continue to be scrutinized for abuse by Congress & the media.

Yes. As it should be.

How do you know they haven't been told to only use Turnberry as a last option to keep the entire crew & passenger load together ?
They only used if on 6% of their layovers.
Nasty Natasha is criticizing them for just buying fuel at Prestwick, thereby helping it survive to protect Trump's investment in Turnberry.

I'd be happy to refuel up at Obama Intl, if it saved me from having to wait for flow control slot times to get in/out of RAF's Mildenhall & Lakenheath (the only 2 USAF bases in the UK with runways, btw). I'd even wear my tan flight suit.

Why buy, staff & maintain another USAF airbase in the UK, when we can use Prestwick for what we need (a 24/7/365 all weather, no traffic delay, refueling stopover point with discounted lodging below the per diem rate, available on short notice), just for buying fuel at a contracted discount rate. Whoever in the USAF was responsible for engineering this deal deserves a Meritorious Service Medal.

The Cold War is won (our USAF bases are closing). We're drawing down in W Europe. We can now stage out of Poland, Romania & Bulgaria. We just need UK air fields as a refueling stopover point (Prestwick) & one RAF (Lakenheath) to host a fighter & combat SAR wing, cocked & ready to deploy eastward, ...& already doing so on a rotational basis.

[a fan]

Why buy, staff & maintain another USAF airbase in the UK, when we can use Prestwick for what we need (a 24/7/365 all weather, no traffic delay, refueling stopover point with discounted lodging below the per diem rate, available on short notice), just for buying fuel at a contracted discount rate. Whoever in the USAF was responsible for engineering this deal deserves a Meritorious Service Medal.

If this is your pitch, why the F are the other bases open? Move it all to Prestwick.

Just stay away from Trump's place. Taxpayers win, USAF wins. And Trump is left to the private market to fill his hotel.


So why don't we do just that?

[old salt]

Why buy, staff & maintain another USAF airbase in the UK, when we can use Prestwick for what we need (a 24/7/365 all weather, no traffic delay, refueling stopover point with discounted lodging below the per diem rate, available on short notice), just for buying fuel at a contracted discount rate. Whoever in the USAF was responsible for engineering this deal deserves a Meritorious Service Medal.

If this is your pitch, why the F are the other bases open? Move it all to Prestwick.

Just stay away from Trump's place. Taxpayers win, USAF wins. And Trump is left to the private market to fill his hotel.


So why don't we do just that?

Are you feigning cluelessness, just to waste my time ? Prestwick is a civilian airport. I've explained this to you once already.
There's so much more to a USAF air base than refueling & lodging transiting transport aircraft.
Our 2 current USAF bases (w/runways) in the UK permanently house aircraft that are there to perform specific NATO missions.
They are not equipped to handle the volume of stopover traffic, now that the decision has been made to close RAF Mildenhall & the drawdown in personnel & capability has begun. Plus, Prestwick is better situated for air traffic flow control & has better weather.

When the Brits decided to close RAF Mildenhall, the USAF decided to consolidate our remaining UK based acft at RAF Lakenheath, move some eastward to a recently vacated USAF base in Germany, & route transport & tanker aircraft transiting northerly through UK airspace via Prestwick, through less congested Scottish airspace. It was a good idea, made for sound reasons. Losing the ability to use Prestwick would degrade our capability & should not be forced, just because Trump was elected. Impeach him or vote him out of office, but don't F with the military just for political revenge.

...& this isn't piddly stuff like a 1 yr delay on a stateside DOD school or child care center, or upgrading NATO facilities where we're already operating but our allies are too cheap to make the necessary investment to have us there to protect them. Prestwick is a stopover airport which allows us to move & support our forces between CONUS & downrange, at minimal cost & investment. When the throughput decreases, we can decrease traffic or even pull out without having to maintain another costly, underutilized air base complex.

[a fan]

Are you feigning cluelessness, just to waste my time ? Prestwick is a civilian airport. I've explained this to you once already.
There's so much more to a USAF air base than refueling & lodging transiting transport aircraft.
Our 2 current USAF bases (w/runways) in the UK permanently house aircraft that are there to perform specific NATO missions.
They are not equipped to handle the volume of stopover traffic, now that the decision has been made to close RAF Mildenhall & the drawdown in personnel & capability has begun. Plus, Prestwick is better situated for air traffic flow control & has better weather.

Great. So buy it.

I assumed you were following this more closely. The reason so many are up in arms over Trump's property and the Air Force presence there is that Prestwick was losing money to beat the band. Trump becomes President with a Hotel nearby? Suddenly, Prestwick is doing fine.

From 2018. That's last year, in case you didn't notice:

Chief executive Stewart Adams told MSPs a review had been launched to identify which operations at the loss-making airport were profitable and which were "a real drain on resource".

Giving evidence to the Scottish Parliament's rural economy and connectivity committee, he said: "The cost of passenger operations will be looked at.

"The passenger side of the business does not make money."

Prestwick was bought by the Scottish Government in 2013 for £1 to avert closure. MSPs on the committee said the airport had since been loaned £40 million but had lost as much since the acquisition - £25m - as it had in the previous four years.


Sounds to me like if the USAF pulls out, Prestwick shuts down. So despite your condescension, when in reality, you're not paying attention....yes. Buy it for the USAF if it's so important. And shut down whatever base isn't handling the air traffic anymore.


https://www.scotsman.com/news-2-15012/t ... -1-4757216

[old salt]

Are you feigning cluelessness, just to waste my time ? Prestwick is a civilian airport. I've explained this to you once already.
There's so much more to a USAF air base than refueling & lodging transiting transport aircraft.
Our 2 current USAF bases (w/runways) in the UK permanently house aircraft that are there to perform specific NATO missions.
They are not equipped to handle the volume of stopover traffic, now that the decision has been made to close RAF Mildenhall & the drawdown in personnel & capability has begun. Plus, Prestwick is better situated for air traffic flow control & has better weather.

Great. So buy it.

I assumed you were following this more closely. The reason so many are up in arms over Trump's property and the Air Force presence there is that Prestwick was losing money to beat the band. Trump becomes President with a Hotel nearby? Suddenly, Prestwick is doing fine.

From 2018. That's last year, in case you didn't notice:

Chief executive Stewart Adams told MSPs a review had been launched to identify which operations at the loss-making airport were profitable and which were "a real drain on resource".

Giving evidence to the Scottish Parliament's rural economy and connectivity committee, he said: "The cost of passenger operations will be looked at.

"The passenger side of the business does not make money."

Prestwick was bought by the Scottish Government in 2013 for £1 to avert closure. MSPs on the committee said the airport had since been loaned £40 million but had lost as much since the acquisition - £25m - as it had in the previous four years.


Sounds to me like if the USAF pulls out, Prestwick shuts down. So despite your condescension, when in reality, you're not paying attention....yes. Buy it for the USAF if it's so important. And shut down whatever base isn't handling the air traffic anymore.

https://www.scotsman.com/news-2-15012/t ... -1-4757216

.. ...I saw that Scotsman piece, & others since, using up my free reads in the process.

Why buy Prestwick, when we can have it for just the cost of buying contract fuel there. The price delta is minimal, compared to the cost of buying, maintaining & operating Prestwick. It's an ideal dual use airport that can accommodate commercial, corporate & non-tactical military aircraft, plus it's the location of the air traffic control center for the entire Scottish sector of UK air space. Plus, what about the loss of jobs & the economic impact of closing both Prestwick & Turnberry. Such ugly American provincialism, driven by irrational political pique..

[a fan]

Provincialism? Yeah. That's it. That's why everyone is upset.

All that Trump needs to do is send a one sentence memo, banning all US personnel from staying at his property, and Old Salt gets everything he wants.

As to why buy it? Ask me again in a few months. If i'm a UK MP who hates Trump, I'd shut down US access until Trump signs that memo.

[LandM]

aFan and TLD,
Sorry for the late reply - PSU football weekend - boring game - so far they are 3 and boring - but weekends start on Thursday and ends on Sunday Flat tire on trailer made it longer and now two weeks off before the season starts - so much for the IL watch. Gotta watch the boys in blue see what happens on Friday - Boise State is a tough game but so is a military academy;

I have also been veewy, veewy scared over a couple of billy bads out here - some people need to educate themselves that height, weight and age do not matter - it is all in what what you know and how many times you have used it

I then had to get my Honor Code book, Conflict of Interest policy and and any other ethics policies out so I was not swinging to far right or left

Bottom line is when on TDY you are given a daily per diem - there is no more money. You drink too much, eat too much, have sex too much.....comes out of your pocket, it is not like they do not tell tell you. Capt so and so - you get $150 per day - find your best accommodations - it is not like working for a company where they take care of all your accommodations and you put it it on an expense reports. The military says here is your daily pier diem. If you do not like it CHANGE THE RULES. So if a Trump property is the cheapest - yep I am staying there. Where is the conflict, I get x for my travels and I am maximizing my money.

Farfromgenieve - I live on west lake off of Parrish Street, 5 and 20 - I am sure you can find me. Only there until we know where PSU bowl game is - stop by - will be in Telluride after bowl game. The FBI, CIA, and Secret Service follow the same rules. My brother-in-law switched from a flight suit to a suit and tie and his last assignment was driving GW's limo around - he took care off all the Bushes and there was no difference for him. Gotta think outside the box and not be be naive.

TLD, there were places I actually turned my wife around as there was Trump gear all over the places - go to any LOVES and they are all over 90 and 80 - let me know your thoughts. I could have eaten gun salad with ammo onions - you guys need to get outside of the confines. BTW, that was for the sensible gun control tab but I get a bit tired between tabs.

[runrussellrun]

Why buy, staff & maintain another USAF airbase in the UK, when we can use Prestwick for what we need (a 24/7/365 all weather, no traffic delay, refueling stopover point with discounted lodging below the per diem rate, available on short notice), just for buying fuel at a contracted discount rate. Whoever in the USAF was responsible for engineering this deal deserves a Meritorious Service Medal.

If this is your pitch, why the F are the other bases open? Move it all to Prestwick.

Just stay away from Trump's place. Taxpayers win, USAF wins. And Trump is left to the private market to fill his hotel.


So why don't we do just that?

spare us all.........don't recall YOU evah uttering (writing) one word about OTHER elected officials divesting from the ownership in properties/business. Something about Sen. Feinstein's impeachement after her husband made out like a bandit from insider information........and Kato the limo driver. Where's the 24/7 story about that. Yawn, tRump has already won the election. Thanks taats.

CONFLICT of INTEREST is suddenly an i$$ue? Yup. NO ONE got rich off of the __________________(fill in the blank ) (F-35, USS Ford, Fat Leonard, VA in Aurora Colorado......etc. etc. etc. )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpX_WeJalbc