JUST the Stolen Documents/Mar-A-Lago/"Judge" Cannon Trial

[3rdPersonPlural]

.. ...are you saying the aircrews are ordered to stay at Turnberry ? Usually the aircrew's chooses where to stay from the available options.

As I gathered from the articles I read, Aircrews accommodations are booked for them by nototiously 'frugal' Master Sargents and the crew is on its own for how to convert their per diem into meals.

So I suspect that the office that books accommodations was somehow compelled to book the Turnberry.

[a fan]

double post

[a fan]

The Air Force confirmed that seven crew members stayed at Turnberry en route to Kuwait, but said “it did not appear” that they stayed at the hotel on the way back. There are more than two dozen hotels in and around Prestwick, but the Air Force said Trump Turnberry was the cheapest option available at the time and below the per diem allowance. POLITICO could not independently verify the room rates cited by the Air Force.

Dude. Just stop. Federal employees can't stay at a hotel owned by Trump, and line Trump's pockets with taxpayer money. Period.


Stop trolling. We're supposed to believe a man who spent his life following a strict ethical code "doesn't understand the problem here"??? Please.

Just stop. Find some other stupid thing he's done to defend. There's plenty to choose from, believe you me.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Trump is just wetting his beak.

[RedFromMI]

The Air Force confirmed that seven crew members stayed at Turnberry en route to Kuwait, but said “it did not appear” that they stayed at the hotel on the way back. There are more than two dozen hotels in and around Prestwick, but the Air Force said Trump Turnberry was the cheapest option available at the time and below the per diem allowance. POLITICO could not independently verify the room rates cited by the Air Force.

Dude. Just stop. Federal employees can't stay at a hotel owned by Trump, and line Trump's pockets with taxpayer money. Period.


Stop trolling. We're supposed to believe a man who spent his life following a strict ethical code "doesn't understand the problem here"??? Please.

Just stop. Find some other stupid thing he's done to defend. There's plenty to choose from, believe you me.

Trump himself has spent _one-third_ (283 days) of his time in office at one of his own properties, and occurred much governmental expense (Secret Service, staff) that flows into his own pockets. At his Mar-a-Lago resort, he makes it a point of personally knowing who his _entire_ membership list is. They are paying him for the privilege of staying there, and getting high level exposure to the office. So why should anyone be surprised to find out that the corruption just happens to go deeper than just what is on the surface?

[old salt]

The Air Force confirmed that seven crew members stayed at Turnberry en route to Kuwait, but said “it did not appear” that they stayed at the hotel on the way back. There are more than two dozen hotels in and around Prestwick, but the Air Force said Trump Turnberry was the cheapest option available at the time and below the per diem allowance. POLITICO could not independently verify the room rates cited by the Air Force.

Dude. Just stop. Federal employees can't stay at a hotel owned by Trump, and line Trump's pockets with taxpayer money. Period.

Stop trolling. We're supposed to believe a man who spent his life following a strict ethical code "doesn't understand the problem here"??? Please.

Just stop. Find some other stupid thing he's done to defend. There's plenty to choose from, believe you me.

I can't believe you are so obtuse as to not see this story for what it is. I have shown you documentation that the USAF is shifting their refueling stopover point on northern trans-Atlantic flights from RAF Mildenhall (where we are downsizing) to Prestwick. There was already a story in a UK tabloid about the airport operators using Turnberry for aircrew berthing.

Nasty Natasha ginned up a hit piece, based on the grumblings of some unnamed disgruntled aircrew member who probably wanted to stay someplace where he could pub crawl rather than golf, like his aircraft commander wanted to, OR as the USAF spokesman said, Turnberry was the best deal they could get, possibly on short notice.

All the other gratuitous details about other airports where the aircraft could refuel were chaff. There are obvious reasons why the mission was routed on a northern route via the UK (going between AK - Kuwait), rather than a southern route via all the other potential stopover airports listed. Nasty Natasha threw out a bunch of misleading detail which appear relevant to readers unfamiliar with the actual operational considerations.

The USAF already provided all the necessary answers in the Guardian article. With RAF Mildenhall downsizing, then closing, the USAF needs Prestwick as a northern route stopover refueling airport & is beginning to route more flights through there. The Prestwick airport operators got a deal for cut rate lodging & comp golf for transiting aircrews. Nasty Natasha's thrust was that the USAF is using Prestwick, just so aircrews can keep Trump's Turnberry in business, which is nuts, but since it slimes Trump, the TDS zombies follow the noise.

[Typical Lax Dad]

The Air Force confirmed that seven crew members stayed at Turnberry en route to Kuwait, but said “it did not appear” that they stayed at the hotel on the way back. There are more than two dozen hotels in and around Prestwick, but the Air Force said Trump Turnberry was the cheapest option available at the time and below the per diem allowance. POLITICO could not independently verify the room rates cited by the Air Force.

Dude. Just stop. Federal employees can't stay at a hotel owned by Trump, and line Trump's pockets with taxpayer money. Period.

Stop trolling. We're supposed to believe a man who spent his life following a strict ethical code "doesn't understand the problem here"??? Please.

Just stop. Find some other stupid thing he's done to defend. There's plenty to choose from, believe you me.

I can't believe you are so obtuse as to not see this story for what it is. I have shown you documentation that the USAF is shifting their refueling stopover point on northern trans-Atlantic flights from RAF Mildenhall (where we are downsizing) to Prestwick. There was already a story in a UK tabloid about the airport operators using Turnberry for aircrew berthing.

Nasty Natasha ginned up a hit piece, based on the grumblings of some unnamed disgruntled aircrew member who probably wanted to stay someplace where he could pub crawl rather than golf, like his aircraft commander wanted to, OR as the USAF spokesman said, Turnberry was the best deal they could get, possibly on short notice.

All the other gratuitous details about other airports where the aircraft could refuel were chaff. There are obvious reasons why the mission was routed on a northern route via the UK (going between AK - Kuwait), rather than a southern route via all the other potential stopover airports listed. Nasty Natasha threw out a bunch of misleading detail which appear relevant to readers unfamiliar with the actual operational considerations.

The USAF already provided all the necessary answers in the Guardian article. With RAF Mildenhall downsizing, then closing, the USAF needs Prestwick as a northern route stopover refueling airport & is beginning to route more flights through there. The Prestwick airport operators got a deal for cut rate lodging & comp golf for transiting aircrews. Nasty Natasha's thrust was that the USAF is using Prestwick, just so aircrews can keep Trump's Turnberry in business, which is nuts, but since it slimes Trump, the TDS zombies follow the noise.

In order to avoid the appearance of a conflict, easy to just find another place to stay. It’s called ethics.

[old salt]

The Air Force confirmed that seven crew members stayed at Turnberry en route to Kuwait, but said “it did not appear” that they stayed at the hotel on the way back. There are more than two dozen hotels in and around Prestwick, but the Air Force said Trump Turnberry was the cheapest option available at the time and below the per diem allowance. POLITICO could not independently verify the room rates cited by the Air Force.

Dude. Just stop. Federal employees can't stay at a hotel owned by Trump, and line Trump's pockets with taxpayer money. Period.

Stop trolling. We're supposed to believe a man who spent his life following a strict ethical code "doesn't understand the problem here"??? Please.

Just stop. Find some other stupid thing he's done to defend. There's plenty to choose from, believe you me.

I can't believe you are so obtuse as to not see this story for what it is. I have shown you documentation that the USAF is shifting their refueling stopover point on northern trans-Atlantic flights from RAF Mildenhall (where we are downsizing) to Prestwick. There was already a story in a UK tabloid about the airport operators using Turnberry for aircrew berthing.

Nasty Natasha ginned up a hit piece, based on the grumblings of some unnamed disgruntled aircrew member who probably wanted to stay someplace where he could pub crawl rather than golf, like his aircraft commander wanted to, OR as the USAF spokesman said, Turnberry was the best deal they could get, possibly on short notice.

All the other gratuitous details about other airports where the aircraft could refuel were chaff. There are obvious reasons why the mission was routed on a northern route via the UK (going between AK - Kuwait), rather than a southern route via all the other potential stopover airports listed. Nasty Natasha threw out a bunch of misleading detail which appear relevant to readers unfamiliar with the actual operational considerations.

The USAF already provided all the necessary answers in the Guardian article. With RAF Mildenhall downsizing, then closing, the USAF needs Prestwick as a northern route stopover refueling airport & is beginning to route more flights through there. The Prestwick airport operators got a deal for cut rate lodging & comp golf for transiting aircrews. Nasty Natasha's thrust was that the USAF is using Prestwick, just so aircrews can keep Trump's Turnberry in business, which is nuts, but since it slimes Trump, the TDS zombies follow the noise.

In order to avoid the appearance of a conflict, easy to just find another place to stay. It’s called ethics.

They stayed at the Marriott on the way home. Maybe Turnberry was the only place they could get on the outbound, or maybe some of the aircrew wanted to play a round at Turnberry. The reporting doesn't say (yet) whether or not they even played there.

[Typical Lax Dad]

The Air Force confirmed that seven crew members stayed at Turnberry en route to Kuwait, but said “it did not appear” that they stayed at the hotel on the way back. There are more than two dozen hotels in and around Prestwick, but the Air Force said Trump Turnberry was the cheapest option available at the time and below the per diem allowance. POLITICO could not independently verify the room rates cited by the Air Force.

Dude. Just stop. Federal employees can't stay at a hotel owned by Trump, and line Trump's pockets with taxpayer money. Period.

Stop trolling. We're supposed to believe a man who spent his life following a strict ethical code "doesn't understand the problem here"??? Please.

Just stop. Find some other stupid thing he's done to defend. There's plenty to choose from, believe you me.

I can't believe you are so obtuse as to not see this story for what it is. I have shown you documentation that the USAF is shifting their refueling stopover point on northern trans-Atlantic flights from RAF Mildenhall (where we are downsizing) to Prestwick. There was already a story in a UK tabloid about the airport operators using Turnberry for aircrew berthing.

Nasty Natasha ginned up a hit piece, based on the grumblings of some unnamed disgruntled aircrew member who probably wanted to stay someplace where he could pub crawl rather than golf, like his aircraft commander wanted to, OR as the USAF spokesman said, Turnberry was the best deal they could get, possibly on short notice.

All the other gratuitous details about other airports where the aircraft could refuel were chaff. There are obvious reasons why the mission was routed on a northern route via the UK (going between AK - Kuwait), rather than a southern route via all the other potential stopover airports listed. Nasty Natasha threw out a bunch of misleading detail which appear relevant to readers unfamiliar with the actual operational considerations.

The USAF already provided all the necessary answers in the Guardian article. With RAF Mildenhall downsizing, then closing, the USAF needs Prestwick as a northern route stopover refueling airport & is beginning to route more flights through there. The Prestwick airport operators got a deal for cut rate lodging & comp golf for transiting aircrews. Nasty Natasha's thrust was that the USAF is using Prestwick, just so aircrews can keep Trump's Turnberry in business, which is nuts, but since it slimes Trump, the TDS zombies follow the noise.

In order to avoid the appearance of a conflict, easy to just find another place to stay. It’s called ethics.

They stayed at the Marriott on the way home. Maybe Turnberry was the only place they could get on the outbound, or maybe some of the aircrew wanted to play a round at Turnberry. The reporting doesn't say (yet) whether or not they even played there.

Maybe not.

[old salt]

Good question.
Do they "offer that same inducement for the other courses"?
Who pays? And why?
Did this 'stop' cost the military more than another location would have?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... story.html

The Oversight Committee members cite a February 2018 story in the Guardian stating that the Defense Logistics Agency has helped shore up the airport’s income by stopping there for refueling during missions. Since October 2017, the Pentagon has spent $11 million on fuel at Prestwick.

In the letter, Cummings and Raskin say that the airport “reportedly has provided ‘cut-price rooms for select passengers and crew’ and ‘offered free rounds at Turnberry to visiting U.S. military and civilian air crews.’ ”

While that money has been spent during Trump’s presidency, the actual contract between the airport and the U.S. government was signed in October 2016, before Trump was elected.

Politico, which first reported the Oversight investigation, described one Air National Guard trip to Kuwait in which the crew stopped at Trump’s Turnberry property on the way there and back. Typically, crews refuel in locations where there are U.S. military bases.

The Air Force on Saturday defended the stopover in Glasgow en route to Kuwait and provided additional details about that trip, which took place from March 13 to March 19. The seven active-duty and Guard crew members stayed at the Trump property on the way there, but at a Marriott property on the way back, according to the Air Force. It said the Trump resort cost less than the Marriott and both properties were under the per diem rate of $166.

[old salt]

.. ...are you saying the aircrews are ordered to stay at Turnberry ? Usually the aircrew's chooses where to stay from the available options.

As I gathered from the articles I read, Aircrews accommodations are booked for them by nototiously 'frugal' Master Sargents and the crew is on its own for how to convert their per diem into meals.

So I suspect that the office that books accommodations was somehow compelled to book the Turnberry.

Maybe that's how it works now, but that wasn't my experience.
We were reimbursed for actual lodging costs (up to an approved max) then received an area based per diem rate, on top of the actual lodging cost.

They stayed at the Marriott on one leg. Turnberry was cheaper. Both were under the $166 max rate allowed).

[Typical Lax Dad]

Good question.
Do they "offer that same inducement for the other courses"?
Who pays? And why?
Did this 'stop' cost the military more than another location would have?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... story.html

The Oversight Committee members cite a February 2018 story in the Guardian stating that the Defense Logistics Agency has helped shore up the airport’s income by stopping there for refueling during missions. Since October 2017, the Pentagon has spent $11 million on fuel at Prestwick.

In the letter, Cummings and Raskin say that the airport “reportedly has provided ‘cut-price rooms for select passengers and crew’ and ‘offered free rounds at Turnberry to visiting U.S. military and civilian air crews.’ ”

While that money has been spent during Trump’s presidency, the actual contract between the airport and the U.S. government was signed in October 2016, before Trump was elected.

Politico, which first reported the Oversight investigation, described one Air National Guard trip to Kuwait in which the crew stopped at Trump’s Turnberry property on the way there and back. Typically, crews refuel in locations where there are U.S. military bases.

The Air Force on Saturday defended the stopover in Glasgow en route to Kuwait and provided additional details about that trip, which took place from March 13 to March 19. The seven active-duty and Guard crew members stayed at the Trump property on the way there, but at a Marriott property on the way back, according to the Air Force. It said the Trump resort cost less than the Marriott and both properties were under the per diem rate of $166.

Probably $1.00 less.....probably

[Typical Lax Dad]

.. ...are you saying the aircrews are ordered to stay at Turnberry ? Usually the aircrew's chooses where to stay from the available options.

As I gathered from the articles I read, Aircrews accommodations are booked for them by nototiously 'frugal' Master Sargents and the crew is on its own for how to convert their per diem into meals.

So I suspect that the office that books accommodations was somehow compelled to book the Turnberry.

Maybe that's how it works now, but that wasn't my experience.
We were reimbursed for actual lodging costs (up to an approved max) then received an area based per diem rate, on top of the actual lodging cost.

They stayed at the Marriott on one leg. Turnberry was cheaper. Both were under the $166 max rate allowed).

When in doubt, don’t kick up.

[LandM]

Man,
Some of you guys who never did a TDY should really not trust an article. Back in the day they gave you a daily rate - first TDY was LA Air Force Station - no Master Sgt making my reservations and I am doubtful today a Master Sgt would be making them - those folks have better things to do, like lead enlisted folks and tell officers from O-1 to O-3 what dumba$$ they are - E-3, I can buy that. LA is was $150 a day at that time - room, meals, etc. My boss as an O-3 says not to worry - I slept in a room that wherever I looked I saw myself, checking in the question was hourly or 8 hours - so I am going to assume the flyboys at Turnberry did the math, found the best rate and then I will further assume that the fine hosts found out they were a flight crew and probably got a few free hot meals, money in the pocket. That is how the game is played and there is nothing illegal or unethical about that. This one is such a stretch I actually banged my head on my desk.

BTW, TDY, three weeks in SA.......did the math and based on what I booked I was getting back enough unused money that in those days a big screen TV . First night stick to game plan, buddy from the Academy at 2AM bangs on my motel room door - I am thinking it is a fire alarm - nope he is drunk of his arse and we go hit a bar - by end of first week I had to send myself some money as I blew through my TDY pay ..Best part is we hooked up with a few others and scrambling out of a bar we ran over him - wheel marks and all - not choir boys. If you want it to be a business, operate it as such..........it is your tax dollars.

[seacoaster]

I am trying to figure out if you guys are willfully missing the point or, you know, the alternative.

Government employees and military service personnel, engaged in active service and using taxpayer dollars, should not be staying at an establishment owned by the President -- even if it is convenient, and even if the rate is good, and even if the golf nearby is world class.

Jesus; I am still remembering when you folks on the right were raving about President Obama in the tan suit and using the binder clip, and throwing a football in the Oval.

[a fan]

Man,
Some of you guys who never did a TDY should really not trust an article. Back in the day they gave you a daily rate - first TDY was LA Air Force Station - no Master Sgt making my reservations and I am doubtful today a Master Sgt would be making them - those folks have better things to do, like lead enlisted folks and tell officers from O-1 to O-3 what dumba$$ they are - E-3, I can buy that. LA is was $150 a day at that time - room, meals, etc. My boss as an O-3 says not to worry - I slept in a room that wherever I looked I saw myself, checking in the question was hourly or 8 hours - so I am going to assume the flyboys at Turnberry did the math, found the best rate and then I will further assume that the fine hosts found out they were a flight crew and probably got a few free hot meals, money in the pocket. That is how the game is played and there is nothing illegal or unethical about that. This one is such a stretch I actually banged my head on my desk.

You too? You think the issue we have is that a bunch of flyboys overspent their per diem? Or got a free muffin?

Tell me: which hotels did you stay at during your deployment that was owned by Clinton, Bush, Reagan, or Carter?

Think it over, and get back to us.

(dude, no one is complaining about the stupid crew...the crew isn't the problem)

[LandM]

afan,
No one you listed has owned a motel. No one you listed was a business owner, no one you listed owned a B&B - did you ever think a non-career politician would get elected to the big house - that big house must have been rocking with those Army boys

sea,
I appreciate many of the articles you post but no one violated a regulation - please give me the regulation that says military personnel cannot stay in a hotel owned by the President and the emoluments clause does not count as best I know that is for for foreign governments........

Help me out out here - you are paid a daily per diem based on where you are going. You look for the cheapest places, the cheapest food and drink and that is what you you do. There is NOTHING illegal about that - do not like it, change the rules. It is YOUR tax dollars.

I also want to clarify, when you go on camping trips the Master Sgt usually schedules your rides and drop off points - little more serious then a motel 8

[Typical Lax Dad]

afan,
No one you listed has owned a motel. No one you listed was a business owner, no one you listed owned a B&B - did you ever think a non-career politician would get elected to the big house - that big house must have been rocking with those Army boys

sea,
I appreciate many of the articles you post but no one violated a regulation - please give me the regulation that says military personnel cannot stay in a hotel owned by the President and the emoluments clause does not count as best I know that is for for foreign governments........

Help me out out here - you are paid a daily per diem based on where you are going. You look for the cheapest places, the cheapest food and drink and that is what you you do. There is NOTHING illegal about that - do not like it, change the rules. It is YOUR tax dollars.

I also want to clarify, when you go on camping trips the Master Sgt usually schedules your rides and drop off points - little more serious then a motel 8

It’s not illegal.

[a fan]

afan,
No one you listed has owned a motel. No one you listed was a business owner

The Bush's and Carter didn't own businesses or have large financial assets? You skip history at your, um, school? Peanut farm? Houston Astros ring a bell anywhere? Oil?

What did they do with their business holdings when the arrived in DC? It rhyme's with "blind trust". Not perfect, but better than what we have now.


But do I have this position of yours right? You really "don't understand the problem" when a sitting President owns an asset that's getting business from Federal Government employees?

Two guys who attended, um, some pretty specific schools that teach honor and integrity on a daily basis....and you're both telling me you don't get the problem here?

Trolling. You boys are yanking our chains. No other explanation is possible.

[Farfromgeneva]

Texas Rangers, but same state anyways. And let’s not forget “CraterAir” (really CaterAir, an early Carlyle Investment fun by Bush that failed when they were homing into the Iron Triangle and being James Baker and Spooky Frank Carlucci to go get that dirty sovereign money).