Sensible Gun Safety

[ABV 8.3%]

Harder to vote? Nonsense. The main thrust of abuse is poll closure and registration removal. Every state in the US requires a photo ID in order to register to vote. It's a fact.

All the stuff YOU are talking about, and that I added a lil more detail spice to, has NOTHING to do with requiring an ID.

But, are you sure you and me and AFAN agree that requiring a photo ID to vote is NOT, repeat NOT racist intent. You sure about this

BTW, since I have a LTC (license to carry) in the state of Massachusettes), doesn't EVERY state requiring your FID/LTC card, in addition to another form of photo ID?

Oh....that's right....states right to do their states rights thing...... Texas, you just show a drivers license and they hand you a gun? But, in Mass., you can't? Why are we looking to the FED govt. to solve this problem .

Is the LTC the same as LTBAG (license to buy a gun)? You know better..... you are not dumb..... All of those voter ID laws added were at the State level..... I don't know the answer but can you give me a reason why so many laws have gotten more restrictive since 2010? Been around since 1776 and in the last 9 years we have cramped down even more? What drove that decision?

Yes. In Massachusettes, you can NOT purchase a shotgun/long gun without a FID card. You can NOT purchase ammo without one either. What's the law in Nutmeg State?

You claim more restrictive laws since 2010? Citations?

but, again, you are not making any sense. Nor answering, what I think, are pretty straightforward questions. Watch my video link to understand what my point is. geez.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Harder to vote? Nonsense. The main thrust of abuse is poll closure and registration removal. Every state in the US requires a photo ID in order to register to vote. It's a fact.

All the stuff YOU are talking about, and that I added a lil more detail spice to, has NOTHING to do with requiring an ID.

But, are you sure you and me and AFAN agree that requiring a photo ID to vote is NOT, repeat NOT racist intent. You sure about this

BTW, since I have a LTC (license to carry) in the state of Massachusettes), doesn't EVERY state requiring your FID/LTC card, in addition to another form of photo ID?

Oh....that's right....states right to do their states rights thing...... Texas, you just show a drivers license and they hand you a gun? But, in Mass., you can't? Why are we looking to the FED govt. to solve this problem .

Is the LTC the same as LTBAG (license to buy a gun)? You know better..... you are not dumb..... All of those voter ID laws added were at the State level..... I don't know the answer but can you give me a reason why so many laws have gotten more restrictive since 2010? Been around since 1776 and in the last 9 years we have cramped down even more? What drove that decision?

Yes. In Massachusettes, you can NOT purchase a shotgun/long gun without a FID card. You can NOT purchase ammo without one either. What's the law in Nutmeg State?

You claim more restrictive laws since 2010? Citations?

but, again, you are not making any sense. Nor answering, what I think, are pretty straightforward questions. Watch my video link to understand what my point is. geez.

You ask a lot of questions. I am not looking to the federal government to address gun laws. Not every state has the same gun laws.... As for voter ID laws, I would hope that the federal government does not allow constitutional rights to be violated and, if necessary, step in to protect constitutional rights. As you are interested in the nutmeg state: https://lawcenter.giffords.org/gun-laws ... nnecticut/ I don't want to see the right to own a gun taken away. Just like I don't want voters disenfranchised because they are poor.

[ABV 8.3%]

How the F are the poor of Rutland Vermont or CHarlestown, WV disenfranchised ? You really ARE one of those people at the beginning of the video I posted.

Mr. Link man tld, no links for the claims you actually make? And since when did a wells fargo type guys evah give two feces about the poor?

[Typical Lax Dad]

How the F are the poor of Rutland Vermont or CHarlestown, WV disenfranchised ? You really ARE one of those people at the beginning of the video I posted.

Mr. Link man tld, no links for the claims you actually make? And since when did a wells fargo type guys evah give two feces about the poor?

Probably never. I didn't see your video. Re-post it. I have been to Charlestown, WN..... you know it's bad when there are no Dunkin' Donuts in a town (maybe State).

Here is one example: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/01/opin ... verty.html

Folks in Rutland and Charlestown have the same opportunities as Weston and Sudbury. You know better....... Nah.... we are worried about voter fraud... BTW, a friend's daugher was teaching in Revere ( I am pretty sure) ..... one of her middle school students was found in a river with hands cut off..... tough town.

[wahoomurf]

Probably never. I didn't see your video. Re-post it. I have been to Charlestown, WV..... you know it's bad when there are no Dunkin' Donuts in a town (maybe State).

Here is one example: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/01/opin ... verty.html

Folks in Rutland and Charlestown have the same opportunities as Weston and Sudbury. You know better....... Nah.... we are worried about voter fraud... BTW, a friend's daughter was teaching in Revere ( I am pretty sure) ..... one of her middle school students was found in a river with hands cut off..... tough town.

TLD: you know it's bad when there are no Dunkin' Donuts in a town (maybe State).

When families spend their money on Mountain Dew, Meth, and Heroin, not much $$$ left over for Donuts

[ardilla secreta]

How the F are the poor of Rutland Vermont or CHarlestown, WV disenfranchised ? You really ARE one of those people at the beginning of the video I posted.

Mr. Link man tld, no links for the claims you actually make? And since when did a wells fargo type guys evah give two feces about the poor?

Probably never. I didn't see your video. Re-post it. I have been to Charlestown, WN..... you know it's bad when there are no Dunkin' Donuts in a town (maybe State).

Here is one example: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/01/opin ... verty.html

Folks in Rutland and Charlestown have the same opportunities as Weston and Sudbury. You know better....... Nah.... we are worried about voter fraud... BTW, a friend's daugher was teaching in Revere ( I am pretty sure) ..... one of her middle school students was found in a river with hands cut off..... tough town.

C’mon fellers! It’s CHARLESTON WEST VIRGINNY, not Charlestown. It’s the state capitol. There are a handful of Dunkin Donuts in the area but only a MOron would go there when you have a bunch of Tudor’s Biscuit World. The coffee is about as lame but the biscuit breakfast sandwiches and sausage gravy are durn good.

[Typical Lax Dad]

How the F are the poor of Rutland Vermont or CHarlestown, WV disenfranchised ? You really ARE one of those people at the beginning of the video I posted.

Mr. Link man tld, no links for the claims you actually make? And since when did a wells fargo type guys evah give two feces about the poor?

Probably never. I didn't see your video. Re-post it. I have been to Charlestown, WN..... you know it's bad when there are no Dunkin' Donuts in a town (maybe State).

Here is one example: https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/01/opin ... verty.html

Folks in Rutland and Charlestown have the same opportunities as Weston and Sudbury. You know better....... Nah.... we are worried about voter fraud... BTW, a friend's daugher was teaching in Revere ( I am pretty sure) ..... one of her middle school students was found in a river with hands cut off..... tough town.

C’mon fellers! It’s CHARLESTON WEST VIRGINNY, not Charlestown. It’s the state capitol. There are a handful of Dunkin Donuts in the area but only a MOron would go there when you have a bunch of Tudor’s Biscuit World. The coffee is about as lame but the biscuit breakfast sandwiches and sausage gravy are durn good.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Good police work. Insanity.

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/08/21/us/cal ... cnn.com%2F

[holmes435]

Good police work. Insanity.

https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/08/21/us/cal ... cnn.com%2F

See this is the kind of thing we need to be focused on, tips from people. A large majority of mass shooters make their plans known in some way. Very few come out of left field. Also mass shootings, like suicides, are socially contagious. We see so many copycat threats after other mass shootings.

We could cut down on the already rare (but horrifying) mass shootings by increased investigation into tips. We already stop a lot, but this is a simple way to cut down on more without taking away rights. Both parties should be clamoring for this kind of stuff - it's low hanging fruit.

[DMac]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

Yes...people with guns intent on doing bad things.

[DMac]

Yes, and maybe a little more focus on people with bad intent rather than on more gun laws (useless) will be far more effective.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Yes, and maybe a little more focus on people with bad intent rather than on more gun laws (useless) will be far more effective.

I want to reduce the supply of guns and change the culture. We want it harder to vote but easier to load up with arms in the country.

[MDlaxfan76]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

Yes...people with guns intent on doing bad things.

Gee, an issue where it's not a binary choice?

Most NRA folks are for increased gun control, they know it's not really all or nothing.
And certainly true of most hunters. Like me.
Universal, federal background checks, no loopholes, no assault weapons and large magazines other than at well regulated gun ranges.
Strong majority support.

Also strong support for being able to flag mental health risks and threats for temporary restrictions.
But care to not label anyone who is depressed or has other mental health issues as 'dangerous' unless actually the case, which is relatively infrequent with those actually under medical care.

But there are those who want to play this as all or nothing.
Some on the left, but mostly it's the nut jobs on the right.
And boy does old Wayne still wield some power...where'd that money go?

[cradleandshoot]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

Yes...people with guns intent on doing bad things.

No... bad people intent on doing bad things will never be stopped. You just have never been introduced to the alternatives that are out there that don't involve guns. My own personal experience is the firebombs we use to make when we were 12 years old and looking for adventure. Really high tech stuff. I won't go in to the details but 12 ounces of gasoline sealed and pressurized and ignited upon impact is a devastating weapon of mass destruction. The traditional Molotov cocktail was a devastating weapon the Russians used very well. That is what improvised explosive devices are all about. While some of you out there are shitting your britches about 30 round magazines... just you all wait until the next generation of lunatics enters the arena of mass murder.

[MDlaxfan76]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

Yes...people with guns intent on doing bad things.

No... bad people intent on doing bad things will never be stopped. You just have never been introduced to the alternatives that are out there that don't involve guns. My own personal experience is the firebombs we use to make when we were 12 years old and looking for adventure. Really high tech stuff. I won't go in to the details but 12 ounces of gasoline sealed and pressurized and ignited upon impact is a devastating weapon of mass destruction. The traditional Malatov coctail was a devastating weapon the Russians used very well.

Whoa, we stop bad people from doing bad things all the time.
We just don't manage to stop them all.

You're of course right that bad people will do bad things...unless they are stopped.

One way is to make it difficult to get the mechanisms to do a lot of destruction fast. We actually do monitor the sale of certain kinds of materials, eg blasting caps, dynamite, etc. We track fertilizer purchases for unusual purchases...

But we know that someone with a knife can get a jet flown into a building, a person can drive a truck into a crowd. So, we adapt with new procedures on doors to protect pilots, we screen in various ways, we erect bollards to prevent attacks on large crowds, we screen backpacks before large events...

But the other way we 'stop' folks is to identify the 'bad people intent on doing bad things' ahead of time. We look at social media (we could and should do a much better job here), we have human intelligence targeting networks known to foment views consistent with those committing violent acts...for instance, we've done a rather remarkable job on foreign, islamic-extremist terrorist threats (in large part as a result of the help of the domestic Muslim community), not so well on domestic, white nationalist sorts of threats nor random attention seeking domestic threats. But that doesn't mean we can't focus more attention and indeed do better with these threats. We can and should.

So, I don't think we should throw our hands up and say we can't stop the bad guys.
We do, and we need to keep doing so, and find ways to do it better still...

[cradleandshoot]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

Yes...people with guns intent on doing bad things.

No... bad people intent on doing bad things will never be stopped. You just have never been introduced to the alternatives that are out there that don't involve guns. My own personal experience is the firebombs we use to make when we were 12 years old and looking for adventure. Really high tech stuff. I won't go in to the details but 12 ounces of gasoline sealed and pressurized and ignited upon impact is a devastating weapon of mass destruction. The traditional Malatov coctail was a devastating weapon the Russians used very well.

Whoa, we stop bad people from doing bad things all the time.
We just don't manage to stop them all.

You're of course right that bad people will do bad things...unless they are stopped.

One way is to make it difficult to get the mechanisms to do a lot of destruction fast. We actually do monitor the sale of certain kinds of materials, eg blasting caps, dynamite, etc. We track fertilizer purchases for unusual purchases...

But we know that someone with a knife can get a jet flown into a building, a person can drive a truck into a crowd. So, we adapt with new procedures on doors to protect pilots, we screen in various ways, we erect bollards to prevent attacks on large crowds, we screen backpacks before large events...

But the other way we 'stop' folks is to identify the 'bad people intent on doing bad things' ahead of time. We look at social media (we could and should do a much better job here), we have human intelligence targeting networks known to foment views consistent with those committing violent acts...for instance, we've done a rather remarkable job on foreign, islamic-extremist terrorist threats (in large part as a result of the help of the domestic Muslim community), not so well on domestic, white nationalist sorts of threats nor random attention seeking domestic threats. But that doesn't mean we can't focus more attention and indeed do better with these threats. We can and should.

So, I don't think we should throw our hands up and say we can't stop the bad guys.
We do, and we need to keep doing so, and find ways to do it better still...

You don't understand the technology out there that does not involve firearms. Improvised explosive devises are not limited to the war in the ME. A very small size devise could easily be brought in to a crowded bar at 1 am. If you have never seen what a firebomb is capable of doing when detonated in a confined space. Do a google search an enlighten yourself. You do not understand the different types of mass destruction out there that do not involve firearms. My guess is they will find their way to America sooner than you think. You do remember the pressure cooker bombs at the Boston Marathon? That was childs play with some of the stuff coming down the pike. Keep concentrating on those 30 round magazines... the real bad guys are light years ahead of you when it comes to knowing how to kill people in large numbers.

[MDlaxfan76]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

Yes...people with guns intent on doing bad things.

No... bad people intent on doing bad things will never be stopped. You just have never been introduced to the alternatives that are out there that don't involve guns. My own personal experience is the firebombs we use to make when we were 12 years old and looking for adventure. Really high tech stuff. I won't go in to the details but 12 ounces of gasoline sealed and pressurized and ignited upon impact is a devastating weapon of mass destruction. The traditional Malatov coctail was a devastating weapon the Russians used very well.

Whoa, we stop bad people from doing bad things all the time.
We just don't manage to stop them all.

You're of course right that bad people will do bad things...unless they are stopped.

One way is to make it difficult to get the mechanisms to do a lot of destruction fast. We actually do monitor the sale of certain kinds of materials, eg blasting caps, dynamite, etc. We track fertilizer purchases for unusual purchases...

But we know that someone with a knife can get a jet flown into a building, a person can drive a truck into a crowd. So, we adapt with new procedures on doors to protect pilots, we screen in various ways, we erect bollards to prevent attacks on large crowds, we screen backpacks before large events...

But the other way we 'stop' folks is to identify the 'bad people intent on doing bad things' ahead of time. We look at social media (we could and should do a much better job here), we have human intelligence targeting networks known to foment views consistent with those committing violent acts...for instance, we've done a rather remarkable job on foreign, islamic-extremist terrorist threats (in large part as a result of the help of the domestic Muslim community), not so well on domestic, white nationalist sorts of threats nor random attention seeking domestic threats. But that doesn't mean we can't focus more attention and indeed do better with these threats. We can and should.

So, I don't think we should throw our hands up and say we can't stop the bad guys.
We do, and we need to keep doing so, and find ways to do it better still...

You don't understand the technology out there that does not involve firearms. Improvised explosive devises are not limited to the war in the ME. A very small size devise could easily be brought in to a crowded bar at 1 am. If you have never seen what a firebomb is capable of doing when detonated in a confined space. Do a google search an enlighten yourself. You do not understand the different types of mass destruction out there that do not involve firearms. My guess is they will find their way to America sooner than you think. You do remember the pressure cooker bombs at the Boston Marathon? That was childs play with some of the stuff coming down the pike. Keep concentrating on those 30 round magazines... the real bad guys are light years ahead of you when it comes to knowing how to kill people in large numbers.

You seem to have not actually read my post.
I said nothing about guns or magazines in my post quoted.

And I said that we need to look at all the possibilities and adapt to those threats.
You're of course right that there are serious such threats.

But I didn't just focus on not selling dangerous materials to "bad people" when identifiable, I also said that we need to proactively identify the most likely to commit heinous acts and interdict them...that's true for foreign terrorists, foreign ideological recruitment/encouragement, domestic ideological recruitment/encouragement, or just lone whack jobs encouraging one another or otherwise expressing intent to do violence. We can and should do sophisticated digital threat identification and we should employ human intelligence wherever feasible,

We do SOME of this well, we need to do more and better.

Because you're right...the threats are serious.

Now, if YOU want to include guns in the conversation (it is the Sensible Gun Control thread), then yes, making it much more difficult to have the most lethal, rapid killing weapons available to those who would use them to do others harm is indeed worthwhile. And it's' very much the majority position.

But, as you point out, it's far from sufficient on its own.

[Brooklyn]

Harder to vote? Nonsense. The main thrust of abuse is poll closure and registration removal. Every state in the US requires a photo ID in order to register to vote. It's a fact.

Not so:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_ID_ ... _State.svg


Lake WOEbegone among them.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Hmmmm, so it's more about people than the guns.
Imagine that.

Yes...people with guns intent on doing bad things.

No... bad people intent on doing bad things will never be stopped. You just have never been introduced to the alternatives that are out there that don't involve guns. My own personal experience is the firebombs we use to make when we were 12 years old and looking for adventure. Really high tech stuff. I won't go in to the details but 12 ounces of gasoline sealed and pressurized and ignited upon impact is a devastating weapon of mass destruction. The traditional Molotov cocktail was a devastating weapon the Russians used very well. That is what improvised explosive devices are all about. While some of you out there are shitting your britches about 30 round magazines... just you all wait until the next generation of lunatics enters the arena of mass murder.

I see we stopped the Coast Guard terrorist and the nut out in California yesterday. Bad people looking to do bad things..... you mean wait for another McVeigh?