The Fourth Estate and Politics

[a fan]

Did you say you attended it in '91 or was it other protests ?

I was at protests.
A group of us went to National Airport and bought two separate groups of soldiers lunch, and thank them for their service. Some of them had Dads who were Vets and that's what they said to do.... the nicest thing we could do for returning troops---buy them a round. In hindsight, we should have bought them lunch without telling them....more of a charitable act that wasn't about my pompous young ego.

Did not attend the parade. Can't remember why----if I had a political reason or something. I frankly can't recall.

Was that GHWB honoring himself ?

Some said that, yes.....but only a few hardcore folks I knew at the time. But overall, folks were very much in support of the parade for the very reason you cited: not making mistake of treating Vietnam vets so poorly again. Celebrate the troops, not the war.

[old salt]

Did you say you attended it in '91 or was it other protests ?

I was at protests.
A group of us went to National Airport and bought two separate groups of soldiers lunch, and thank them for their service. Some of them had Dads who were Vets and that's what they said to do.... the nicest thing we could do for returning troops---buy them a round. In hindsight, we should have bought them lunch without telling them....more of a charitable act that wasn't about my pompous young ego.

Did not attend the parade. Can't remember why----if I had a political reason or something. I frankly can't recall.

Was that GHWB honoring himself ?

Some said that, yes.....but only a few hardcore folks I knew at the time. But overall, folks were very much in support of the parade for the very reason you cited: not making mistake of treating Vietnam vets so poorly again. Celebrate the troops, not the war.
So how do we celebrate the troops who've been serving since "91 ? Military discounts, pro forma "thank you for your service", stand up at neighborhood concerts ?

Why not a parade in the nation's capital, on national tv ? It was good enough for their predecessors in '91 & all the way back to the Civil War.
https://www.historynet.com/civil-war-grand-review.htm
It's not that much to ask.

[a fan]

Why not a parade in the nation's capital, on national tv ? It was good enough for their predecessors in '91 & all the way back to the Civil War.
It's not that much to ask.

I would LOVE that. Plan the thing. Start now. Hold the parade in two years. Do the best we can to represent as many "groups" of vets as possible.

And as I said: don't invite any politicians. All speeches from Vets themselves. Make it about the Troops and the people they protect. That simple change takes all the politics out. It would be a sight to behold.

[old salt]

Why not a parade in the nation's capital, on national tv ? It was good enough for their predecessors in '91 & all the way back to the Civil War.
It's not that much to ask.

I would LOVE that. Plan the thing. Start now. Hold the parade in two years. Do the best we can to represent as many "groups" of vets as possible.

And as I said: don't invite any politicians. All speeches from Vets themselves. Make it about the Troops and the people they protect. That simple change takes all the politics out. It would be a sight to behold.

That's all I've ever wanted. I'm now a Boeing stockholder. I'll suggest we sponsor it.
Will you comp the refreshments, or should I ask A-B.

[a fan]

Depends on how many Veterans show up. And A-B is a Belgian Company. How about Yuengling?

[old salt]

Good balanced discussion of the parade on PBS Newshour :

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/with- ... e-military

What I think the danger is, retired general officers, retired military analysts who come in, pick a side, make it look like they think that this is the worst possible thing for democracy. I think they bring this other credible source to what — and make a problem a lot worse than it actually is.

The fact that you had people complaining about troops working on the weekend, working on a holiday, away from their families, where was that same pushback from those general officers about keeping troops deployed overseas and going on seven, eight, nine deployments?

Every one of those officers — those soldiers that were there were likely volunteers. They'd love to talk about their equipment. They want to use it as a recruiting tool. They want to inspire those to serve as well.

So, again, his partisan critics in this case are on full overdrive, heated white hot, and it tarnished the event, based on a lot of things that they said.

[HooDat]

Conservative America is adrift at sea. The scary part for me is: where will they pull into port?

I agree with this statement, but I am curious if your nearly exclusive focus on the hypocrisy of republicans is because of their control of the White House or some other reason?

Because the Dems are lost at sea as well, and they seem to be paddling with all their might straight for Niagara Falls.

I get the idea of taking the most shots at who-ever is in power at the time, but I would argue (and think I have been very consistent in doing so) that it is the 0.1% that are in power and they have a darn good track record of corrupting/manipulating whomever is in "control" of our government. The d and the r make very little difference.

R's pretend they hate government and then go trillions in debt to hand out goodies. They pretend to be religious while condemning everyone around them.

D's pretend they give a crap about humans and then lead the biggest historical shift from a labor based economy to one that values capital above all else (creating the biggest income divide we have seen in a century). At the same time they (Clinton) led the way in exporting jobs in order to facilitate capital holders benefiting from labor that is cheaper than what it would cost to house and feed salves in the US.

[ABV 8.3%]

Conservative America is adrift at sea. The scary part for me is: where will they pull into port?

I agree with this statement, but I am curious if your nearly exclusive focus on the hypocrisy of republicans is because of their control of the White House or some other reason?

Because the Dems are lost at sea as well, and they seem to be paddling with all their might straight for Niagara Falls.

I get the idea of taking the most shots at who-ever is in power at the time, but I would argue (and think I have been very consistent in doing so) that it is the 0.1% that are in power and they have a darn good track record of corrupting/manipulating whomever is in "control" of our government. The d and the r make very little difference.

R's pretend they hate government and then go trillions in debt to hand out goodies. They pretend to be religious while condemning everyone around them.

D's pretend they give a dump about humans and then lead the biggest historical shift from a labor based economy to one that values capital above all else (creating the biggest income divide we have seen in a century). At the same time they (Clinton) led the way in exporting jobs in order to facilitate capital holders benefiting from labor that is cheaper than what it would cost to house and feed salves in the US.

And, most likely, why Trump will win again. It doesn't really matter who the President is. No, I take that back. The bigger the poop show, the better the distraction from issues that matter.
IE: Anyone else underwhelmed by the medias coverage of the actual process, the "what now" about the twitter nonsense that AOC is spewing about Pelosis' bashing? Did Congress APPROVE funding Trumps emergency wall, or not? Good luck reading simple details about this issue. Instead, we get hours and hours , pages and pages, of infotainment about AOC's understanding of a prison water fountain.

https://www.acorneng.com/security-plumbing-fixtures

[a fan]

Conservative America is adrift at sea. The scary part for me is: where will they pull into port?

I agree with this statement, but I am curious if your nearly exclusive focus on the hypocrisy of republicans is because of their control of the White House or some other reason?

The Republicans have Controlled Congress for all but two years of the last 10. So yes, I call them to account for the laws that they actually pass. There's almost nothing to criticize when it comes to the Federal Congressional Dems. Last big bill they passed was Obamacare. If you want to rehash that, let me know. I've got buckets of criticism at the ready.

D's pretend they give a dump about humans and then lead the biggest historical shift from a labor based economy to one that values capital above all else (creating the biggest income divide we have seen in a century). At the same time they (Clinton) led the way in exporting jobs in order to facilitate capital holders benefiting from labor that is cheaper than what it would cost to house and feed salves in the US.

Agree 1000%. So does the left. And this is why you're seeing AOC and the next generation fighting Pelosi et. al. Lefty Dem voters are on to the Corporate Dems BS...it's why Hillary lost. They're sick of the Corporate Dems and their nonsense.

So that's a second reason I'm easier them, as you put it. They are voting the Corporate Dems out--the very group that you and I, and even sixftstick can't stand. This is a GOOD thing, is it not? Voting out the corrupt Dems who serve the 1%? D Voters and some actual leaders are actively moving the party towards actually helping the bottom 50% earners. Pelosi is fighting them.

Meanwhile, the R's and their supporters are doubling down on their hypocrisy, and making government bigger than ever, and blowing the doors off of spending. I'm sick of it. Why would I vote for a party that doesn't believe the pillars of their own party? They aren't the party of small government. They stand for nothing.

That answer your question, or do you want more clarification?

[Typical Lax Dad]

Conservative America is adrift at sea. The scary part for me is: where will they pull into port?

I agree with this statement, but I am curious if your nearly exclusive focus on the hypocrisy of republicans is because of their control of the White House or some other reason?

Because the Dems are lost at sea as well, and they seem to be paddling with all their might straight for Niagara Falls.

I get the idea of taking the most shots at who-ever is in power at the time, but I would argue (and think I have been very consistent in doing so) that it is the 0.1% that are in power and they have a darn good track record of corrupting/manipulating whomever is in "control" of our government. The d and the r make very little difference.

R's pretend they hate government and then go trillions in debt to hand out goodies. They pretend to be religious while condemning everyone around them.

D's pretend they give a dump about humans and then lead the biggest historical shift from a labor based economy to one that values capital above all else (creating the biggest income divide we have seen in a century). At the same time they (Clinton) led the way in exporting jobs in order to facilitate capital holders benefiting from labor that is cheaper than what it would cost to house and feed salves in the US.

And, most likely, why Trump will win again. It doesn't really matter who the President is. No, I take that back. The bigger the poop show, the better the distraction from issues that matter.
IE: Anyone else underwhelmed by the medias coverage of the actual process, the "what now" about the twitter nonsense that AOC is spewing about Pelosis' bashing? Did Congress APPROVE funding Trumps emergency wall, or not? Good luck reading simple details about this issue. Instead, we get hours and hours , pages and pages, of infotainment about AOC's understanding of a prison water fountain.

https://www.acorneng.com/security-plumbing-fixtures

Too many DIPAs

[HooDat]

Conservative America is adrift at sea. The scary part for me is: where will they pull into port?

I agree with this statement, but I am curious if your nearly exclusive focus on the hypocrisy of republicans is because of their control of the White House or some other reason?

The Republicans have Controlled Congress for all but two years of the last 10. So yes, I call them to account for the laws that they actually pass. There's almost nothing to criticize when it comes to the Federal Congressional Dems. Last big bill they passed was Obamacare. If you want to rehash that, let me know. I've got buckets of criticism at the ready.

D's pretend they give a dump about humans and then lead the biggest historical shift from a labor based economy to one that values capital above all else (creating the biggest income divide we have seen in a century). At the same time they (Clinton) led the way in exporting jobs in order to facilitate capital holders benefiting from labor that is cheaper than what it would cost to house and feed salves in the US.

Agree 1000%. So does the left. And this is why you're seeing AOC and the next generation fighting Pelosi et. al. Lefty Dem voters are on to the Corporate Dems BS...it's why Hillary lost. They're sick of the Corporate Dems and their nonsense.

So that's a second reason I'm easier them, as you put it. They are voting the Corporate Dems out--the very group that you and I, and even sixftstick can't stand. This is a GOOD thing, is it not? Voting out the corrupt Dems who serve the 1%? D Voters and some actual leaders are actively moving the party towards actually helping the bottom 50% earners. Pelosi is fighting them.

Meanwhile, the R's and their supporters are doubling down on their hypocrisy, and making government bigger than ever, and blowing the doors off of spending. I'm sick of it. Why would I vote for a party that doesn't believe the pillars of their own party? They aren't the party of small government. They stand for nothing.

That answer your question, or do you want more clarification?

It does indeed. It confirms a lot of what I guessed at when "filling in the blanks". And by the way - my question was not a critique, it was an invitation to expand on some things you have been saying. I haven't thought it has been fair when some the "I don't care what they do, as long they have an r by their name" folks have accused you of being a dem shill.

Where I will prod a bit more is in the layers beneath your comments on AOC. I agree that she is a direct response to the Clinton corporate dems obvious control of the DNC. But I don't think she and her band are the responsible response. Once free everything becomes a way you can get elected (esp to the White House) democracy is toast. What I would love to see from the Dems is a good old fashioned Hubert Humphrey style democrat who is pulling for the little guys and defending them from the big money interests. Pro labor. Pro small business. If the dems are happy being the party that throws out outrageous ideas in the hope of moving the discourse but never actually winning the White House, then AOC is their gal.

I don't understand how the dems have fallen for the globalist bs. I understand the appeal of the veneer of let's all live in peace as one. But what about the beauty and sanctity of cultures? A move to one world order is the elimination of all cultures and everything they have to offer. More importantly, globalism has really only been about corporate profits....

[wahoomurf]

Flyovers are always crowd pleasers, though.

They certainly are. (thumbs up emoji).The Blue Angels are terrifyingly precise and put on a spectacular show.

But I must admit every time I watch such an event, I'm reminded of an old ditty, penned by William Gaines, publisher of the newly defunct MAD Magazine. To wit..."If I had the wings of an angel, and the balls of a great buffalo, I would fly over the mountain, and piss on the people below".

Suffice to say, it never made it to the magazine.

[a fan]

But I don't think she and her band are the responsible response. Once free everything becomes a way you can get elected (esp to the White House) democracy is toast.

We already have free everything. It's just not being directed by a Responsible Republican from the 1970's. Trump cut a check for $30 Billion to give to farmers with zero planning or thought. No one cared.

But more directly to your point: you're simply wrong. Every EU nation has more of the "free stuff" you're decrying, and not only are they doing fine, they are kicking our *ss in almost every category. Health, education, etc.

What I would love to see from the Dems is a good old fashioned Hubert Humphrey style democrat who is pulling for the little guys and defending them from the big money interests. Pro labor. Pro small business. If the dems are happy being the party that throws out outrageous ideas in the hope of moving the discourse but never actually winning the White House, then AOC is their gal.

You're assuming that voters never die, and millenials will never vote. And we'll never have a recession.

That said, I'm a moderate: I prefer YOUR path to what AOC is touting, obviously. Where is AOC's counterpart on the right? AOC is presenting voters with a choice. That's what makes our Democracy run properly.

As it stands, I think we can agree that we've had precious little choice at the ballot box over the last 20 years.

I don't understand how the dems have fallen for the globalist bs. I understand the appeal of the veneer of let's all live in peace as one. But what about the beauty and sanctity of cultures? A move to one world order is the elimination of all cultures and everything they have to offer. More importantly, globalism has really only been about corporate profits....

Globalism has worked great for the top 10% earners in America. That's who attends those $1000 a plate dinners that fattylax used to make fun of....

THAT is why Clinton et. al. fell for globalism. They were paid to do it. And more and more Dem voters are catching on every day.

[HooDat]

Globalism has worked great for the top 10% earners in America. That's who attends those $1000 a plate dinners that fattylax used to make fun of....

THAT is why Clinton et. al. fell for globalism. They were paid to do it. And more and more Dem voters are catching on every day.

and I think this is why I am so angry with the Dems. They sold out their constituents for power. And for the record, I don't believe the Clintons "fell" for anything, they knew exactly what they were doing and what it would take to win.

The Republicans, on the other hand, have historically never made any bones about the fact that they serve at the pleasure of the elite and the corporate interests. ...until Reagan came along and sold the blue collar crowd on patriotism and the Good Ol' US of A. The GOP has become pathetic, and remarkably stupid about how they have let xenophobes take over their party. The biggest boat they missed as a party was the latino vote. Demographically, the latino community should be hard core card-carrying republicans - family, church, small business, anti-union (at least at first). That is a LOT of political alignment that was wasted by racist republicans more devoted to their fears than to their country or at least their party....

[HooDat]

Where is AOC's counterpart on the right?

well the easy answer is sitting in the Oval Office. But the real answer is that the GOP has driven them all out, or they have left politics. The list I would line up includes:

Condi Rice
Collin Powell
Paul Ryan

There are one or two new-comers who could fill the bill - Dan Crenshaw being the most promising that I have seen in a while.

And then there is Rand Paul - but he is,to an extent, an outsider in his party as well.

[a fan]

Globalism has worked great for the top 10% earners in America. That's who attends those $1000 a plate dinners that fattylax used to make fun of....

THAT is why Clinton et. al. fell for globalism. They were paid to do it. And more and more Dem voters are catching on every day.

and I think this is why I am so angry with the Dems. They sold out their constituents for power. And for the record, I don't believe the Clintons "fell" for anything, they knew exactly what they were doing and what it would take to win.

Poor choice of words. Intentionally chose money over the people. Agree completely.

[a fan]

Where is AOC's counterpart on the right?

well the easy answer is sitting in the Oval Office. But the real answer is that the GOP has driven them all out, or they have left politics. The list I would line up includes:

Condi Rice
Collin Powell
Paul Ryan

There are one or two new-comers who could fill the bill - Dan Crenshaw being the most promising that I have seen in a while.

And then there is Rand Paul - but he is,to an extent, an outsider in his party as well.

Agree again. We're on the same page on so many things....

[runrussellrun]

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/116/hr3401


This bill was signed by the President on July 1st. Do an internet search for coverage . You will find little to nothing. No washingPost, no ny slimes. CNN/MSNBC/FOX.........nothing.

Why is that?

Interesting that all of the US Senators running for President did NOT vote.

And, 176 pretend CONservatives voted to support humanitarian aid for illegals detained. (sure, private prisons benefit ), but isn't this an example of reaching across the isle? Working together? It's get ZERO discussion in the MSM. Or even on this website.

Why is that?

[RedFromMI]

https://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/116/hr3401


This bill was signed by the President on July 1st. Do an internet search for coverage . You will find little to nothing. No washingPost, no ny slimes. CNN/MSNBC/FOX.........nothing.

Why is that?

Interesting that all of the US Senators running for President did NOT vote.

And, 176 pretend CONservatives voted to support humanitarian aid for illegals detained. (sure, private prisons benefit ), but isn't this an example of reaching across the isle? Working together? It's get ZERO discussion in the MSM. Or even on this website.

Why is that?

Search on WaPo yielded this in about a minute:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpos ... 22e276e784

https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpos ... 454f4b672b

https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions ... 4a49f2602c

https://www.washingtonpost.com/business ... 6d9a574e78

-- Trump himself said he did not know anything about the Facebook posts when he was asked about the story in the Oval Office last night. Then he praised Border Patrol agents. “I don’t know what they’re saying about members of Congress,” the president told reporters who had assembled to watch him sign the bill that passed Congress last week to appropriate $4.6 billion in emergency aid for the border. “I know that the Border Patrol is not happy with the Democrats in Congress. … The Border Patrol, they’re patriots. They’re great people. They love our country. They know what’s coming in.”

(from a longer article mostly about the CBP facebook page...

[runrussellrun]

GOP caves?

Classic garbage headlines from the washPost. what a joke they have become.

But, nice try. Find the article where tRump actually SIGNS the bill, making it into law. We'll be waiting.