2020 Elections - Trump FIRED

[Typical Lax Dad]

My reaction to Salty too.
The shame of it is that I suspect he actually believes what he's saying, at least up to the point when someone tells him he'd need to pay more taxes.

The folks being steered and redlined didn’t care, otherwise, they would have spoken up and those with power would have accommodated their wishes. Fed government shouldn’t be involved in enforcing individual rights.

[old salt]

My reaction to Salty too.
The shame of it is that I suspect he actually believes what he's saying, at least up to the point when someone tells him he'd need to pay more taxes.

Look at how it has worked out. As Biden said, forced busing was a liberal train wreck.
School choice, which included voluntary busing, magnet schools, & charter schools, is working.
What was your solution ? Send your kids to a private school or move to the 'burbs, based on the public schools available.
I'm married to a career public school teacher who taught in the communities in which we lived.

What does mandatory busing have to do with taxes ?

[Typical Lax Dad]

My reaction to Salty too.
The shame of it is that I suspect he actually believes what he's saying, at least up to the point when someone tells him he'd need to pay more taxes.

Look at how it has worked out. As Biden said, forced busing was a liberal train wreck.
School choice, which included voluntary busing, magnet schools, & charter schools, is working.
What was your solution ? Send your kids to a private school or move to the 'burbs, based on the public schools available.
I'm married to a career public school teacher who taught in the communities in which we lived.

What does mandatory busing have to do with taxes ?

I know plenty of kids that experienced forced busing. It worked out for them.

[old salt]

My reaction to Salty too.
The shame of it is that I suspect he actually believes what he's saying, at least up to the point when someone tells him he'd need to pay more taxes.

Look at how it has worked out. As Biden said, forced busing was a liberal train wreck.
School choice, which included voluntary busing, magnet schools, & charter schools, is working.
What was your solution ? Send your kids to a private school or move to the 'burbs, based on the public schools available.
I'm married to a career public school teacher who taught in the communities in which we lived.

What does mandatory busing have to do with taxes ?

I know plenty of kids that experienced forced busing. It worked out for them.

Interesting anecdote. The issue is whether or not forced busing produced the intended outcome.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desegregation_busing

Forced busing" was a term used by many to describe the mandates that generally came from the courts. Court-ordered busing to achieve school desegregation was used mainly in large, ethnically segregated school systems, including Boston, Massachusetts; Cleveland and Columbus, Ohio; Kansas City, Missouri; Pasadena and San Francisco, California; Richmond, Virginia; Detroit, Michigan; and Wilmington, Delaware. From 1972 to 1980, despite busing, the percentage of blacks attending mostly-black schools barely changed, moving from 63.6 percent to 63.3 percent.

The percentage of Northeastern black children who attended a predominantly black school increased from 67 percent in 1968 to 80 percent in 1980 (a higher percentage than in 1954)

[Typical Lax Dad]

My reaction to Salty too.
The shame of it is that I suspect he actually believes what he's saying, at least up to the point when someone tells him he'd need to pay more taxes.

Look at how it has worked out. As Biden said, forced busing was a liberal train wreck.
School choice, which included voluntary busing, magnet schools, & charter schools, is working.
What was your solution ? Send your kids to a private school or move to the 'burbs, based on the public schools available.
I'm married to a career public school teacher who taught in the communities in which we lived.

What does mandatory busing have to do with taxes ?

I know plenty of kids that experienced forced busing. It worked out for them.

Interesting anecdote. The issue is whether or not forced busing produced the intended outcome.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desegregation_busing

Forced busing" was a term used by many to describe the mandates that generally came from the courts. Court-ordered busing to achieve school desegregation was used mainly in large, ethnically segregated school systems, including Boston, Massachusetts; Cleveland and Columbus, Ohio; Kansas City, Missouri; Pasadena and San Francisco, California; Richmond, Virginia; Detroit, Michigan; and Wilmington, Delaware. From 1972 to 1980, despite busing, the percentage of blacks attending mostly-black schools barely changed, moving from 63.6 percent to 63.3 percent.

The percentage of Northeastern black children who attended a predominantly black school increased from 67 percent in 1968 to 80 percent in 1980 (a higher percentage than in 1954)

Most people I know were fine with it.....what about the people you know?

https://www.britannica.com/topic/busing

The court subsequently placed limitations on Swann when it ruled in Milliken v. Bradley (1974) that mandatory busing across school district boundaries could be implemented only where it could be shown that districts had enacted policies that caused the original segregation.

I wonder who enacted those policies, Old Segregationist

[old salt]

My reaction to Salty too.
The shame of it is that I suspect he actually believes what he's saying, at least up to the point when someone tells him he'd need to pay more taxes.

Look at how it has worked out. As Biden said, forced busing was a liberal train wreck.
School choice, which included voluntary busing, magnet schools, & charter schools, is working.
What was your solution ? Send your kids to a private school or move to the 'burbs, based on the public schools available.
I'm married to a career public school teacher who taught in the communities in which we lived.

What does mandatory busing have to do with taxes ?

I know plenty of kids that experienced forced busing. It worked out for them.

Interesting anecdote. The issue is whether or not forced busing produced the intended outcome.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desegregation_busing

Forced busing" was a term used by many to describe the mandates that generally came from the courts. Court-ordered busing to achieve school desegregation was used mainly in large, ethnically segregated school systems, including Boston, Massachusetts; Cleveland and Columbus, Ohio; Kansas City, Missouri; Pasadena and San Francisco, California; Richmond, Virginia; Detroit, Michigan; and Wilmington, Delaware. From 1972 to 1980, despite busing, the percentage of blacks attending mostly-black schools barely changed, moving from 63.6 percent to 63.3 percent.

The percentage of Northeastern black children who attended a predominantly black school increased from 67 percent in 1968 to 80 percent in 1980 (a higher percentage than in 1954)

Most people I know were fine with it.....what about the people you know?

https://www.britannica.com/topic/busing

The court subsequently placed limitations on Swann when it ruled in Milliken v. Bradley (1974) that mandatory busing across school district boundaries could be implemented only where it could be shown that districts had enacted policies that caused the original segregation.

I wonder who enacted those policies, Old Segregationist

Your name calling only illustrates your intolerance.

What about people I know ? OK, since you asked :

Except for 3 years overseas, we have resided in MD since 1978, with my wife teaching in public schools until she retired in 2003. We lived in southern MD (St Mary's & Calvert Counties) & watched it evolve from mostly rural to x-urban, driven, in part, by public school quality.
We didn't have to deal with forced busing. The schools were diverse, because the county population was diverse & housing patterns were dispersed. There were only 2 public HSs in each county when we arrived. My wife was part of the initial faculty of the 3rd new HS to open in each county.

We were on the recieving end of middle class flight (& it wasn't just white). Sprawl, BRAC relocation w/ DoD contractors, & generous state funded infrastructure, made them the 2 fastest growing counties in the state. We were not confronted by busing, first hand, but we were impacted tangentially by sprawl growth & the transformation of our communities, from rural small town to x-urban sprawl. That brought benefits & drawbacks -- loss of rural lifestyle, but increased amenities, consumer choices, & traffic congestion. Based on my wife's opinion, having also taught in MO, TX, CA, & DODDS (Japan & Spain), the SoMd public schools were outstanding, naturally diverse & sustained their excellence while growing. That was a big part of our decision to homestead there. Our 2 counties did not directly experience the impact of forced busing, but PG County was our neighbor "just up the road". We had friends & neighbors & my wife's former colleagues who taught in PG. This wiki summary is accurate :

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desegregation_busing

In 1974, Prince George's County, Maryland, became the largest school district in the United States forced to adopt a busing plan. The county, a large suburban school district east of Washington, D.C., was over 80 percent white in population and in the public schools. In some county communities close to Washington, there was a higher concentration of black residents than in more outlying areas. Through a series of desegregation orders after the Brown decision, the county had a neighborhood-based system of school boundaries. However, the NAACP argued that housing patterns in the county still reflected the vestiges of segregation. Against the will of the Board of Education of Prince George's County, the federal court ordered that a school busing plan be set in place. A 1974 Gallup poll showed that 75 percent of county residents were against forced busing and that only 32 percent of blacks supported it.

The transition was very traumatic as the court ordered that the plan be administered with "all due haste". This happened during the middle of the school term, and students, except those in their senior year in high school, were transferred to different schools to achieve racial balance. Many high school sports teams' seasons and other typical school activities were disrupted. Life in general for families in the county was disrupted by things such as the changes in daily times to get children ready and receive them after school, transportation logistics for extracurricular activities, and parental participation activities such as volunteer work in the schools and PTA meetings.

The federal case and the school busing order was officially ended in 2001, as the "remaining vestiges of segregation" had been erased to the court's satisfaction. Neighborhood-based school boundaries were restored. The Prince George's County Public Schools was ordered to pay the NAACP more than $2 million in closing attorney fees and is estimated to have paid the NAACP over $20 million over the course of the case.

[Typical Lax Dad]

My reaction to Salty too.
The shame of it is that I suspect he actually believes what he's saying, at least up to the point when someone tells him he'd need to pay more taxes.

Look at how it has worked out. As Biden said, forced busing was a liberal train wreck.
School choice, which included voluntary busing, magnet schools, & charter schools, is working.
What was your solution ? Send your kids to a private school or move to the 'burbs, based on the public schools available.
I'm married to a career public school teacher who taught in the communities in which we lived.

What does mandatory busing have to do with taxes ?

I know plenty of kids that experienced forced busing. It worked out for them.

Interesting anecdote. The issue is whether or not forced busing produced the intended outcome.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desegregation_busing

Forced busing" was a term used by many to describe the mandates that generally came from the courts. Court-ordered busing to achieve school desegregation was used mainly in large, ethnically segregated school systems, including Boston, Massachusetts; Cleveland and Columbus, Ohio; Kansas City, Missouri; Pasadena and San Francisco, California; Richmond, Virginia; Detroit, Michigan; and Wilmington, Delaware. From 1972 to 1980, despite busing, the percentage of blacks attending mostly-black schools barely changed, moving from 63.6 percent to 63.3 percent.

The percentage of Northeastern black children who attended a predominantly black school increased from 67 percent in 1968 to 80 percent in 1980 (a higher percentage than in 1954)

Most people I know were fine with it.....what about the people you know?

https://www.britannica.com/topic/busing

The court subsequently placed limitations on Swann when it ruled in Milliken v. Bradley (1974) that mandatory busing across school district boundaries could be implemented only where it could be shown that districts had enacted policies that caused the original segregation.

I wonder who enacted those policies, Old Segregationist

Your name calling only illustrates your intolerance.

What about people I know ? OK, since you asked :

Except for 3 years overseas, we have resided in MD since 1978, with my wife teaching in public schools until she retired in 2003. We lived in southern MD (St Mary's & Calvert Counties) & watched it evolve from mostly rural to x-urban, driven, in part, by public school quality.
We didn't have to deal with forced busing. The schools were diverse, because the county population was diverse & housing patterns were dispersed. There were only 2 public HSs in each county when we arrived. My wife was part of the initial faculty of the 3rd new HS to open in each county.

We were on the recieving end of middle class flight (& it wasn't just white). Sprawl, BRAC relocation w/ DoD contractors, & generous state funded infrastructure, made them the 2 fastest growing counties in the state. We were not confronted by busing, first hand, but we were impacted tangentially by sprawl growth & the transformation of our communities, from rural small town to x-urban sprawl. That brought benefits & drawbacks -- loss of rural lifestyle, but increased amenities, consumer choices, & traffic congestion. Based on my wife's opinion, having also taught in MO, TX, CA, & DODDS (Japan & Spain), the SoMd public schools were outstanding, naturally diverse & sustained their excellence while growing. That was a big part of our decision to homestead there. Our 2 counties did not directly experience the impact of forced busing, but PG County was our neighbor "just up the road". We had friends & neighbors & my wife's former colleagues who taught in PG. This wiki summary is accurate :

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desegregation_busing

In 1974, Prince George's County, Maryland, became the largest school district in the United States forced to adopt a busing plan. The county, a large suburban school district east of Washington, D.C., was over 80 percent white in population and in the public schools. In some county communities close to Washington, there was a higher concentration of black residents than in more outlying areas. Through a series of desegregation orders after the Brown decision, the county had a neighborhood-based system of school boundaries. However, the NAACP argued that housing patterns in the county still reflected the vestiges of segregation. Against the will of the Board of Education of Prince George's County, the federal court ordered that a school busing plan be set in place. A 1974 Gallup poll showed that 75 percent of county residents were against forced busing and that only 32 percent of blacks supported it.

The transition was very traumatic as the court ordered that the plan be administered with "all due haste". This happened during the middle of the school term, and students, except those in their senior year in high school, were transferred to different schools to achieve racial balance. Many high school sports teams' seasons and other typical school activities were disrupted. Life in general for families in the county was disrupted by things such as the changes in daily times to get children ready and receive them after school, transportation logistics for extracurricular activities, and parental participation activities such as volunteer work in the schools and PTA meetings.

The federal case and the school busing order was officially ended in 2001, as the "remaining vestiges of segregation" had been erased to the court's satisfaction. Neighborhood-based school boundaries were restored. The Prince George's County Public Schools was ordered to pay the NAACP more than $2 million in closing attorney fees and is estimated to have paid the NAACP over $20 million over the course of the case.

Segregationist doesn’t make you the R word. I find it funny actually!

I know people first hand so I don’t have to rely on someone’s interpretation.... I know plenty of people that were force bused and voluntarily bused.....guess what, they had similar outcomes... I was sitting at a bar last night and talked to a young woman from Scituate Mass about the Metco program. I knew someone that went there....It was a very good program by all measures. She was in town with her husband. Young couple that went to college locally....

[old salt]

Your anecdotes are interesting. If forced busing was successful, why is it no longer in use ?

[Typical Lax Dad]

Your anecdotes are interesting. If forced busing was successful, why is it no longer in use ?

White flight. Big difference in a city being 60/40 and one that is 90/10..... is what it is. Lots of issues impacted cities and contributed to White flight and middle class black flight.

[old salt]

Your anecdotes are interesting. If forced busing was successful, why is it no longer in use ?

White flight. Big difference in a city being 60/40 and one that is 90/10..... is what it is. Lots of issues impacted cities and contributed to White flight and middle class black flight.

Which illustrates what an ill conceived idea forced busing was. Americans exercised their free will & moved to where their kids could attend good local public schools, without being pawns in some contrived Orwellian race based lottery. It accelerated the decline of our cities & inner suburbs. It was a disaster for rational community planning. Biden was right to call it a liberal train wreck. It's just not "woke" to acknowledge the obvious.

[Typical Lax Dad]

Your anecdotes are interesting. If forced busing was successful, why is it no longer in use ?

White flight. Big difference in a city being 60/40 and one that is 90/10..... is what it is. Lots of issues impacted cities and contributed to White flight and middle class black flight.

Which illustrates what an ill conceived idea forced busing was. Americans exercised their free will & moved to where their kids could attend good local public schools, without being pawns in some contrived Orwellian race based lottery. It accelerated the decline of our cities & inner suburbs. It was a disaster for rational community planning. Biden was right to call it a liberal train wreck. It's just not "woke" to acknowledge the obvious.

[jhu72]

Ambition got the best of her.

Looking like Harris and Booker don't know when to let it go. Their argument with Biden isn't working. Both Bernie and Biden are falling because their age is catching up with them. Although you have to wonder, I am sure some democrats are, why does decreased mental acuity matter in a candidate when you are debating a republican with obvious mental acuity problems.

[runrussellrun]

I know people first hand so I don’t have to rely on someone’s interpretation.... I know plenty of people that were force bused and voluntarily bused.....guess what, they had similar outcomes... I was sitting at a bar last night and talked to a young woman from Scituate Mass about the Metco program. I knew someone that went there....It was a very good program by all measures. She was in town with her husband. Young couple that went to college locally....

METCO has nothing to do with busing. Strictly a Mass Soul (wachusett brewery) product. Knock it off with the comparison. .

[Typical Lax Dad]

I know people first hand so I don’t have to rely on someone’s interpretation.... I know plenty of people that were force bused and voluntarily bused.....guess what, they had similar outcomes... I was sitting at a bar last night and talked to a young woman from Scituate Mass about the Metco program. I knew someone that went there....It was a very good program by all measures. She was in town with her husband. Young couple that went to college locally....

METCO has nothing to do with busing. Strictly a Mass Soul (wachusett brewery) product. Knock it off with the comparison. .

How is your Summer?

[ggait]

School busing was a hot topic 50 years ago, but that issue was pretty much settled at least 25 years ago.

Conclusion -- even local, voluntary integration busing doesn't work and causes more harm than good. Public schools today are about as segregated as they were 50 years ago. Local schools districts now use open enrollment, magnet schools, charter schools and other methods to improve public school conditions -- which is really the root issue here rather than integration. And mandatory federally ordered busing is as timely a topic as whether VHS will win out over Betamax.

I would have loved to see one of the moderators nimbly steer the discussion over to Senator Bennet (a former reform-minded chief of the Denver Public Schools) or his former boss Mayor Hickenlooper to ask them if integration school busing had any relevance to their oversight and management of the DPS system. Probably not, since DPS ended that practice (right or wrong) in 1995. They also could have asked Mayor Pete what his experience has been managing the South Bend school system.

That could have been an interesting discussion and would have revealed Kamala's bit as an irrelevant reach hit job on Biden that won't age well over time. As well as a gift wedge type issue for Trump to exploit in a general election. I'm shorting Kamala stock.

But I'm shorting Biden stock too. Since he was so unprepared and flummoxed by such a lame attack.

[old salt]

So far -- Kamala is a one trick pony. She's proven that she can be an assassin when she has the power of being a Prosecutor, Senate inquisitor. or a scripted debate hit job. She'll play well with the Trump haters, seeking red meat. She has yet to show the ability to connect with the overall electorate sufficient to be a serious contender. Maybe her handlers will be able to soften her without it seeming phony, but ...Oprah she ain't.

[Typical Lax Dad]

School busing was a hot topic 50 years ago, but that issue was pretty much settled at least 25 years ago.

Conclusion -- even local, voluntary integration busing doesn't work and causes more harm than good. Public schools today are about as segregated as they were 50 years ago. Local schools districts now use open enrollment, magnet schools, charter schools and other methods to improve public school conditions -- which is really the root issue here rather than integration. And mandatory federally ordered busing is as timely a topic as whether VHS will win out over Betamax.

I would have loved to see one of the moderators nimbly steer the discussion over to Senator Bennet (a former reform-minded chief of the Denver Public Schools) or his former boss Mayor Hickenlooper to ask them if integration school busing had any relevance to their oversight and management of the DPS system. Probably not, since DPS ended that practice (right or wrong) in 1995. They also could have asked Mayor Pete what his experience has been managing the South Bend school system.

That could have been an interesting discussion and would have revealed Kamala's bit as an irrelevant reach hit job on Biden that won't age well over time. As well as a gift wedge type issue for Trump to exploit in a general election. I'm shorting Kamala stock.

But I'm shorting Biden stock too. Since he was so unprepared and flummoxed by such a lame attack.

+1

[jhu72]

Yea the economy is going to get Trump re-elected.

[jhu72]

Trump predicted to lose reelection in model that forecasted Democratic takeover of House in 2018

Turnout election.

[CU77]

The Ds in 2018 didn't run on giving free health care to illegals.

If Biden wasn't senile, the Ds would have a chance.