Trump's Russian Collusion

[jhu72]

I do not know how to update a post but sea:
what is a nosegay? I have allergies so pollen is not my friend
Also as far as my response being GOP - no I think it is how the average person is thinking as I have said, get in a car and drive and talk to people - big country and I hit my last state North Dakota in two weeks

I think you are correct that most folks are 'tired' of hearing about the investigation, heck all of the investigations into corruption in the Trump administration. It's exhausting.

But that's because there's such a huge amount of actual corruption. Not just the Russian matter and obstruction, but all the rest involving the Trump inner circle and the amazing amount of issues with political appointees. Truly unprecedented (in the modern era, including Nixon's 6).

Of course, most of those who are most 'tired' have not bothered to read the Mueller Report, indeed apparently even most GOP Reps and Senators have not. Instead they rely on the echo chamber of their preference. For those listening and watching the right wing stuff, you'd think that Trump and co were pure as driven snow. Just "fighting the Dems for us"...

Those pre-disposed to think the worst of Trump are in the echo chamber regurgitating daily whatever absurdity or outrage is of the moment. And it's indeed exhausting.

But none of this addresses the Constitutional duties of Congress and the imperative to be a check on the power of the Executive branch. That's what seacoaster was addressing, not whether people are 'tired'. He was specifically raising this unprecedented, sweeping claim of Executive Privilege on any and all oversight matters potentially embarrassing to the White House and the Trump Campaign.


My prediction is that we'll eventually see this claim be rejected overwhelmingly by SCOTUS.
I think that's Pelosi's gambit, that this rejection will come in time to be able to actually force testimony in a setting that the American public will actually pay attention to, getting past their being 'tired'. And that such testimony will reveal the rampant corruption.

I would bet on it! It is clear you can't get meaningful testimony in a time frame to make impeachment meaningful, so just make the legal battle part of your 2020 election year game plan. You should be able to get to the courts and likely a decision prior to the election and public testimony under court order by then. Trump's and Barr's delay tactic is likely to backfire.

[MDlaxfan76]

That's a pretty long list that, at least to me, get's a whole bunch of stuff wrong. But I think you're entirely sincere in your perspective, and may well be persuaded to see things at least a little differently through discussion, so here goes...

MD - Lars is a great guy, total respect and leader. Some day, if you want to hear, I will tell you about him yelling at my son in a cell call after he received his 1st semester grades and his hand-written notes on the bus at 2AM. Best to BC, help him if you can as he is a good man. Awesome on your son and yes I feel the same about my boss (not being negative at all sincerely mean it);

Quite agree re the 'boss'. In my case, she's actually the CEO of our co and I 'report' to her as COO and Co-Founder. Folks actually want to work for her, whereas I tend to be too much of hard_ss at times. Good team though.

To MD and sea - here is a dummy down version of a recap from my prospective using the Letterman approach:
1. The Russians messed in our elections - you live in a country that has been messing around in others for over 100 years - so look in the mirror;
I think that logic is like saying we use weapons to fight bad guys, why should we try to keep bad guys from using them against us?

Likewise, if a bad guy shoots a gun at your house, do you defend it or not? Or do you say 'heck, I shoot guns too'?

And much more importantly, how do you feel about if your neighbor or heck your policeman draws a map for them to your house, loads their gun for them, and then lies about it afterwards?

We can walk and chew gum on this. Russians are an adversary, we defend against their attacks, whatever they might be. And any citizen who helps them attack us, not ok in the slightest, much less one asking to be President.

We enforce our own laws.

2. People actually use Facebook for their news channel - Wow Nellie;
Yup, and Twitter and Instagram, etc with themes from whatever far right or far left extremist group wants to spread. The more extreme the messages, the more likely they will get positive or negative responses, which triggers further spread. It ain't Kansas any more. Cable news is balkanized as well, competing on the same basis for eyeballs.

3. A person with a cell phone has now become a reporter - Wow Nellie;
Well, yes, the cell phone camera captures interactions otherwise not caught on film. And we listen to and spread what our 'friends' tell us. Human nature. The tools are big megaphones.

4. Trump not thinking he would ever be elected tried to find dirt on his opponent - so what say you two about the Steele dossier and the Australian prof? They have done IMHO more damage to this country then the Russians;
Total red herring. Trump's team welcomed foreign intervention, knowing it was the Russians doing so, and then lied about it. That we found out did more damage than the Russians did? Hoo boy.

5. Trump being a business man - spouts off - I am equally guilty of that - because he is used to being in charge and when he says jump, people ask how high - he is not a politician - that was a give me;
Not being a 'politician', instead a 'business man', is no excuse for being a total tool, a slime ball, a cheat, a hater of others, etc, etc. Since I don't get the sense that you are a dishonest slime ball you're 'spouting off' is unlikely to be anywhere near the same as Trump's. Big difference. But let's also stop suggesting the Trump's not a politician. He's been around politics and politicians most of his adult life, buying them off, getting what he wanted. Always a critic of others claiming he could do it better, attracting notice. The nicest thing we can say about Trump as a 'business man' is that he was a successful brand builder. A marketer. Now, his brand was as a blustery jerk, a braggart, a collector of beautiful women and toys, gilt bathrooms, etc. Gauche to the max. But he did manage to parlay a distinct brand into a series of huge transactions, most of which lost huge amounts of OPM. I agree that he never thought he would actually win, rather it was a stunt to brand himself on the far right, with a populist image attractive to the same idiots who find gilt bathrooms attractive, all to create a far right media empire as his next business.

6. The 10 points outlined, except the lying is a frustrated person that won an election he never anticipated he would win - now he wins - I can see him doing a moon walk to a room with only him in it and saying What the heck did I just get myself into;

Yup, dog caught the bus. But that has nothing to do with the lying. That's a life long trait.

7. You had supposedly the smartest uber lawyers in the country review millions of documents spend close to $35 million in tax dollars and found that the above 6 points were true;

They found a heck of a lot more than that. The problem is that most folks haven't bothered to read it and the new AG spun it falsely, as did Trump, Fox, etc.

8. Now you have some chickensh$t lawyers in Congress trying to apiece a base so they are doing their due diligence. You have the investigator, investigating the investigator which is now investigating the investigator - Inspector Closue (spelling) would probably get lost in the translation;

Actually, just following the Constitution. And they were just elected overwhelmingly with that mandate. The investigators investigating the investigators is a smokescreen, albeit a scary one with an authoritarian bent.

9. If there was something wrong with Trump's tax returns, I am assuming the IRS would have found it by now - everything I own is in an LLC - if the whiz kids in Washington changed the laws maybe that would not be the case - but as long as the super genius people keep them in place we are taking every write-off that we can. I will go on a limb that it would take a whiz kid years to figure out his taxes - heck I do not understand ours so if our tax accountant says sign and he signs with me - I will sign;

We have no idea what the IRS has found or not, but we do know that the dept. which investigates the super complicated returns of the richest in our society has been gutted over the past decade by the GOP Congress. But please understand that the IRS is out gunned at that end of the spectrum in every era (just worse in the last decade). And if something is found incorrect the taxpayer, through his attorneys, just makes a deal to pay it off and all disappears.

10. Finally I have invested in 9 start-ups - I have gotten 5 tax write-offs - happens - high risk/high reward. I have met Steve Jobs - not a nice dude; I have met Bill Gates - if you know the history of Microsoft they did not invent the original code and had it not been for his rich dad lawyer in Seattle Bill would still be sleeping on a couch - I do not begrudge them. But after the meetings I would always check for my wallet.
Not sure what your point is here unless you're saying again that successful business people are sometimes jerks, sometimes unethical, etc. Absolutely. But it's not the only way to be successful, and its certainly not an excuse.

11. I will not get into my HRC email and Clinton Foundation how she is still standing is beyond me - too bad Bill could not just think with his big head - he probably could help the tide of division in this country.

Let it go on HRC. Our suspicions about her honesty cost her the Presidency. (along with other factors, yes, but the honesty question is what allowed there not to be a sufficient spotlight on Trump's dishonesty and corruption, which should have been disqualifying from the get go). Yes, Bill was smooth, a much better 'healer' by nature, but I track a lot of what we take for granted now to his 'leadership'.
best

[jhu72]

I do not know how to update a post but sea:
what is a nosegay? I have allergies so pollen is not my friend
Also as far as my response being GOP - no I think it is how the average person is thinking as I have said, get in a car and drive and talk to people - big country and I hit my last state North Dakota in two weeks

I think you are correct that most folks are 'tired' of hearing about the investigation, heck all of the investigations into corruption in the Trump administration. It's exhausting.

But that's because there's such a huge amount of actual corruption. Not just the Russian matter and obstruction, but all the rest involving the Trump inner circle and the amazing amount of issues with political appointees. Truly unprecedented (in the modern era, including Nixon's 6).

Of course, most of those who are most 'tired' have not bothered to read the Mueller Report, indeed apparently even most GOP Reps and Senators have not. Instead they rely on the echo chamber of their preference. For those listening and watching the right wing stuff, you'd think that Trump and co were pure as driven snow. Just "fighting the Dems for us"...

Those pre-disposed to think the worst of Trump are in the echo chamber regurgitating daily whatever absurdity or outrage is of the moment. And it's indeed exhausting.

But none of this addresses the Constitutional duties of Congress and the imperative to be a check on the power of the Executive branch. That's what seacoaster was addressing, not whether people are 'tired'. He was specifically raising this unprecedented, sweeping claim of Executive Privilege on any and all oversight matters potentially embarrassing to the White House and the Trump Campaign.


My prediction is that we'll eventually see this claim be rejected overwhelmingly by SCOTUS.
I think that's Pelosi's gambit, that this rejection will come in time to be able to actually force testimony in a setting that the American public will actually pay attention to, getting past their being 'tired'. And that such testimony will reveal the rampant corruption.

I would bet on it! It is clear you can't get meaningful testimony in a time frame to make impeachment meaningful, so just make the legal battle part of your 2020 election year game plan. You should be able to get to the courts and likely a decision prior to the election and public testimony under court order by then. Trump's and Barr's delay tactic is likely to backfire.

Looks like the Hope Hicks appearance before the House yesterday was a tactical mistake for OD and his toadies. The transcript shows the kinds of questions Trump lawyers claimed executive privilege on. Clear BS claim on these specific questions. House will use this before judge to show the unreasonableness of Trump's claim. Advantage Jerry Nadler.

[LandM]

MD,
I will try and work in reverse order - as stated I am the cliff note guy
1. I am over HRC - I think between the classified server information and the Clinton Foundation she is as big a sleazeball as the guy sitting in the left chair - call a spade a spade man - be consistent and people are not but I am over it and stop the investigations into her issues - Comey the ref signaled he is waving it off - do the same. But you have to admit when people are calling for an investigation and another and another because he lied, man oh man, never jerk in someone's back yard if yours is not clean;
2. It is unfortunate that BC thought with his little head - he might be helpful right about now;
3. I will admit that I still chuckle at "little rocket man" - that was damn funny - not Presidential but funny - he is never gonna pull that trigger I finally got my wife off the ceiling;
3. As stated = I did my own thing because I wanted to swim in my lane - as an adult you get to swim in the lanes you want to and if you do not like it swim in another lane;
4. He got elected because he punches people in the face, says what he wants to say and yes whether you like it or not, he is a businessman......he mocks the elite because he gets a rise out of them....maybe if you all would stop rising, he would stop punching.
Best
On a personal note - best damn thing was being called "gumpah" - never thought I would experience it but it was fun as he$$

[Chips O'Toole]

3. I will admit that I still chuckle at "little rocket man" - that was damn funny

Good god man. Don't say that. One of the few things about Trump that people seem to agree on is that he is completely humorless. No one has ever seen him laugh. No one can recall genuinely laughing at anything he has said. He only smiles for photos. It's all part of his personality disorder. Please don't go around telling people you think he's funny. As a titan of the capital markets and Bill Gates confidant, you have a well-earned reputation to preserve. Just tell people you like his immigration policies and judicial appointments -- your kind of people like to hear that. Don't go off script.

[LandM]

Chips,
I am the titanic of business - hit every iceberg once and a few twice - fortunately still sailing
Way off topic on this thread but Kim's grandpa, dad and Jr. now have played every President - they are bluffing so are the Iranians - not advocating anything more then mess around with the cyber stuff;
The world is not going to end under this Presidency but if you have the apple dumpling gang of Schiff and Nadler leading the charge - you will get another 4 more years.
Best

[MDlaxfan76]

MD,
I will try and work in reverse order - as stated I am the cliff note guy
1. I am over HRC - I think between the classified server information and the Clinton Foundation she is as big a sleazeball as the guy sitting in the left chair - call a spade a spade man - be consistent and people are not but I am over it and stop the investigations into her issues - Comey the ref signaled he is waving it off - do the same. But you have to admit when people are calling for an investigation and another and another because he lied, man oh man, never jerk in someone's back yard if yours is not clean;
2. It is unfortunate that BC thought with his little head - he might be helpful right about now;
3. I will admit that I still chuckle at "little rocket man" - that was damn funny - not Presidential but funny - he is never gonna pull that trigger I finally got my wife off the ceiling;
3. As stated = I did my own thing because I wanted to swim in my lane - as an adult you get to swim in the lanes you want to and if you do not like it swim in another lane;
4. He got elected because he punches people in the face, says what he wants to say and yes whether you like it or not, he is a businessman......he mocks the elite because he gets a rise out of them....maybe if you all would stop rising, he would stop punching.
Best
On a personal note - best damn thing was being called "gumpah" - never thought I would experience it but it was fun as he$$

Well, you and I disagree as to who is the greater sleaze. By a very wide margin.

Which in no way suggests that I don't think HRC was corrupt, a liar, an enabler. I also think she was a poor communicator, came across as entitled and elitist. Yes, Bill was the opposite on the latter dimensions.

I think she lost because Trump as corrupt sleaze ball wasn't adequately distinguishable from the Dem nominee. Bernie's supporters didn't show up, and GOP voters could credibly tell themselves various versions of 'whataboutism'.

I had the luxury of not having to make a choice (I live in MD so HRC was foregone conclusion) so my vote was a protest vote. But I agree with conservative Ana Navarro who said last night she'd vote for a "stump" over Trump in 2020. Doesn't matter who the Dems put up.

I quite disagree that he's a 'businessman' if by that you mean he's a successful businessman. Nope, most of his dough came from daddy, hundreds of millions utilizing tax loopholes and outright fraud to maximize the generational wealth transfer. He subsequently has lost far more money, though Other Peoples' Money, than he ever retained for himself.

I also think we shouldn't call someone a 'businessman' if they are primarily con artists and cheats. Was Madoff a 'businessman'? I don't think so. Similarly, I'm not willing to call a mob boss a 'businessman', nor those who are funded by mob bosses.

So, I don't cut Trump the slightest bit of slack because his career was not as a public servant.

And no, he doesn't 'mock the elite because he gets a rise out of them'.
All his life he's desperately wanted to be considered 'elite'. Still does.

Deep rooted insecurity has played out to gauche excess in every aspect of his life.

[Typical Lax Dad]

MD,
I will try and work in reverse order - as stated I am the cliff note guy
1. I am over HRC - I think between the classified server information and the Clinton Foundation she is as big a sleazeball as the guy sitting in the left chair - call a spade a spade man - be consistent and people are not but I am over it and stop the investigations into her issues - Comey the ref signaled he is waving it off - do the same. But you have to admit when people are calling for an investigation and another and another because he lied, man oh man, never jerk in someone's back yard if yours is not clean;
2. It is unfortunate that BC thought with his little head - he might be helpful right about now;
3. I will admit that I still chuckle at "little rocket man" - that was damn funny - not Presidential but funny - he is never gonna pull that trigger I finally got my wife off the ceiling;
3. As stated = I did my own thing because I wanted to swim in my lane - as an adult you get to swim in the lanes you want to and if you do not like it swim in another lane;
4. He got elected because he punches people in the face, says what he wants to say and yes whether you like it or not, he is a businessman......he mocks the elite because he gets a rise out of them....maybe if you all would stop rising, he would stop punching.
Best
On a personal note - best damn thing was being called "gumpah" - never thought I would experience it but it was fun as he$$

Well, you and I disagree as to who is the greater sleaze. By a very wide margin.

Which in no way suggests that I don't think HRC was corrupt, a liar, an enabler. I also think she was a poor communicator, came across as entitled and elitist. Yes, Bill was the opposite on the latter dimensions.

I think she lost because Trump as corrupt sleaze ball wasn't adequately distinguishable from the Dem nominee. Bernie's supporters didn't show up, and GOP voters could credibly tell themselves various versions of 'whataboutism'.

I had the luxury of not having to make a choice (I live in MD so HRC was foregone conclusion) so my vote was a protest vote. But I agree with conservative Ana Navarro who said last night she'd vote for a "stump" over Trump in 2020. Doesn't matter who the Dems put up.

I quite disagree that he's a 'businessman' if by that you mean he's a successful businessman. Nope, most of his dough came from daddy, hundreds of millions utilizing tax loopholes and outright fraud to maximize the generational wealth transfer. He subsequently has lost far more money, though Other Peoples' Money, than he ever retained for himself.

I also think we shouldn't call someone a 'businessman' if they are primarily con artists and cheats. Was Madoff a 'businessman'? I don't think so. Similarly, I'm not willing to call a mob boss a 'businessman', nor those who are funded by mob bosses.

So, I don't cut Trump the slightest bit of slack because his career was not as a public servant.

And no, he doesn't 'mock the elite because he gets a rise out of them'.
All his life he's desperately wanted to be considered 'elite'. Still does.

Deep rooted insecurity has played out to gauche excess in every aspect of his life.

Yep

[LandM]

MD,
Anyone who has had a security clearance, well probably 80%, will tell you the server thing is worst then a business deal gone bad. Why?, no one is gonna die - she could have put lives at risk and more importantly had anyone with a clearance did what she did would have served time making big rocks into little rocks - call Ft. Leavenworth - it is in KS and it would be a min of 5 years;
The Clinton Foundation was pay to play all day long so who is the bigger sumbag between that and the server;
I know business people who have used daddy money - Bill Gates - and I know others that have tried a few times, failed, if you have never done business with the President how do you know what his track record is - some random Joe comes off the street and said he got ripped off - jeez man - look at what is going on with Google;
I am looking now at switching my vote state to CO as my vote in NY does not matter - and that is sad - every vote should matter but not here;
I shake my head that we do not have better people - Tulsi Gabhard is interesting BUT she will never get through the derby.
Best

[Chips O'Toole]

I had the luxury of not having to make a choice (I live in MD so HRC was foregone conclusion) so my vote was a protest vote.

Alternatively: "I made a choice -- a bad one. This one got past me stick-side high and it's not going to happen next time."

[Typical Lax Dad]

I had the luxury of not having to make a choice (I live in MD so HRC was foregone conclusion) so my vote was a protest vote.

Alternatively: "I made a choice -- a bad one. This one got past me stick-side high and it's not going to happen next time."

That’s impossible! How can people change their minds about Trump? That’s crazy talk!

[DMac]

I had the luxury of not having to make a choice (I live in MD so HRC was foregone conclusion) so my vote was a protest vote.

Alternatively: "I made a choice -- a bad one. This one got past me stick-side high and it's not going to happen next time."

Am glad to read this, and I actually think there might be a whole lot of others who feel the same way. Frankly, I think Trump goes down hard the next time around. 6' and his ilk will vote for him if he sh*ts on the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier cuz he's one of the losers who didn't make it, but I believe there are more who are questioning their decision last time around.
This is coming from a guy who said he didn't stand a snowball's chance in he!! of winning the first time around so what I think doesn't really mean jack...can hope though.

[Typical Lax Dad]

I had the luxury of not having to make a choice (I live in MD so HRC was foregone conclusion) so my vote was a protest vote.

Alternatively: "I made a choice -- a bad one. This one got past me stick-side high and it's not going to happen next time."

Am glad to read this, and I actually think there might be a whole lot of others who feel the same way. Frankly, I think Trump goes down hard the next time around. 6' and his ilk will vote for him if he sh*ts on the Tomb of the Unknown Soldier cuz he's one of the losers who didn't make it, but I believe there are more who are questioning their decision last time around.
This is coming from a guy who said he didn't stand a snowball's chance in he!! of winning the first time around so what I think doesn't really mean jack...can hope though.

Old attorneys that eat lunch same spot every day...3 of 4 voted Trump. Now only 1 will next time. One of the guys fought in Korea and married a Korean. Went back for the first time 2 years ago. He won’t vote for Chump this time around.

[MDlaxfan76]

I had the luxury of not having to make a choice (I live in MD so HRC was foregone conclusion) so my vote was a protest vote.

Alternatively: "I made a choice -- a bad one. This one got past me stick-side high and it's not going to happen next time."

[MDlaxfan76]

MD,
Anyone who has had a security clearance, well probably 80%, will tell you the server thing is worst then a business deal gone bad. Why?, no one is gonna die - she could have put lives at risk and more importantly had anyone with a clearance did what she did would have served time making big rocks into little rocks - call Ft. Leavenworth - it is in KS and it would be a min of 5 years;
The Clinton Foundation was pay to play all day long so who is the bigger sumbag between that and the server;
I know business people who have used daddy money - Bill Gates - and I know others that have tried a few times, failed, if you have never done business with the President how do you know what his track record is - some random Joe comes off the street and said he got ripped off - jeez man - look at what is going on with Google;
I am looking now at switching my vote state to CO as my vote in NY does not matter - and that is sad - every vote should matter but not here;
I shake my head that we do not have better people - Tulsi Gabhard is interesting BUT she will never get through the derby.
Best

As Anna Navarro said, "I'd vote for a stump" over Trump.

Like I said, I thought HRC was corrupt, a liar.

I agree that the server stuff, the destruction of the mobile devices, was a massive cover-up. What she was actually covering up, we'll likely never know. The Clintons were massively paranoid about their enemies, arguably for good reason, so it may not have been for any reason of importance to national security, indeed more likely it was about personal embarrassment. But in any case I do believe that it wasn't prosecutable, just like Trump's conspiracy with the Russians wasn't prosecutable. But Trump's is very much about national security, for sure.

The Clinton Foundation was both good works, and a corrupt pay to play IMO. We agree.

Sure, daddy's money plays a role in lots of folks' success, most notably (usually) in providing access to education and networks that are far less available to others. In Bill Gates' case it wasn't hundreds of millions or even millions of start-up capital, it was access to timesharing computers at his dad's university giving him a huge head start on most every other youngster of his generation. But let's also be clear, Gates built products, developed markets, built an enormous company employing huge numbers of people and a ton of people got very rich with him. He didn't lose massive amounts of Other Peoples Money. He turned OPM into massive gains. Lots to critique about his sharp business practices, you betcha, but it's a false comparison to Trump, who is corrupt to his core.

And actually I do personally know people who have done business with Trump. Corrupt to his core, a bully, a cheat, a liar. I've told the story before, but one of my very close buddies went toe to toe with Trump on behalf of his client who was being countersued for his $10mm claim to be paid. Trump countersued for $50mm. My buddy, former AUSA Southern District, who had taken down Columbians and Russian mob bosses, walked out of Trump's office with a $20mm check (again, his client had originally only wanted the $10mm he was owed).

I knew enough to know that he'd never get my vote. Problem was that HRC was massively flawed as well.

Others on this thread have had direct business interactions with Trump and knew him to be the fraud he is.

Again, "a stump" gets my vote this time over Trump.

[holmes435]

Imagine if Trump's staff and family were using personal email and unauthorized communications for state business. Imagine if Trump leaked (technically legal) classified info to people and our adversaries without consulting people it would affect. Imagine if there was a "Donald J Trump Foundation" that dissolved due to a "shocking pattern of illegality".



Trump's done the same shady stuff Clinton did. And much, much, much more. Yet he seems to get a pass by a huge portion of one party. It's quite a sad state of affairs.

[LandM]

Holmes = +45
And I also think we the public should be able to see all 535 people's tax returns. I would love to see how Maxine Waters wrote her husband's failed bank off and who pad for it - that was the talk of the town and how AOC paid her back due NY State business taxes and everyone else that serves this great country - I am betting you would have allot of entertaining observations. The taxpayers should hire an accounting firm and tax lawyers just to shift through them. To me that would be pop corn and Coors light with a side of vodka time

[LandM]

Sorry Holmes - as the President he can declassify any information so that does not really apply

[holmes435]

Sorry Holmes - as the President he can declassify any information so that does not really apply

I'm sorry that flew over your head - I thought I made it clear he can legally declassify information as I said it was technically legal. You missed the practical side, as he didn't mention it to anyone beforehand - even if he can legally declassify any information he wants, he puts many lives at risk by doing so without letting the rest of our intelligence committee know.

He can legally declassify every undercover CIA and DOJ operative instantly, right? You wouldn't support that though. . . . right?

[LandM]

Holmes - I missed the fly-by - reading comprehension - must have been stealth
And no, I do not believe anyone no matter the seat should have the ability to declassify without some procedure and willy nilly nor do I believe news organization should know and report military operations beforehand that to me is equally as dangerous, I could keep going with norisms but a new server would be required
We have an election coming in NY I guess on Tuesday as an Independent I am not allowed to vote in it