old salt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:12 am
.. Yes, you inserted Mattis in this thread, in the midst of our discussion about Russiagate, then when asked about it, you continue dodging my question.
Do you think Mattis would work for a CinC he thought was compromised by the Russians & not say anything about it now ?
Which is it ? For over 2 years, was Mattis a corrupt bootlicker who just wanted to have access to power, or a useful idiot for Trimp's Rissian puppet masters ? Was he getting a kick back on military contract fuel sales too ?
...or are you privy to intel on Trump that he's not ?
What part of the word 'agree' do you not understand?
Yes, I don't think Mattis thought Trump was in cahoots with Russia, at least not at the level where he was sure.
Which certainly does not make Mattis a 'useful idiot' for the Russians as it would appear that he was a bulwark, in his role, against various Russian interests.
There was clearly enormous friction between Trump and Mattis. Mattis disagreed, fundamentally, in Trump's approach to the world. He thinks of it as more than Russia, but rather a worldview difference.
But I would indeed be fascinated to know what Mattis actually thought and now thinks about Trump's footsie with Putin. Someday we may know.
OK. Got it -- you don't regard Mattis as a bootlicker or useful idiot.
You're just a better judge of character than he is & you have more knowledge about the situation & have a closer proximity to Trump from which to judge him. Seems reasonable to me. ...but I wouldn't hold your breath awaiting an epilogue from Mattis after Trump leaves office.
Hmmm…I didn’t hold my breath but sure turns out that your assessment was quite wrong.
Is it true that Trump has spoken directly and privately with Putin 7 times since leaving office?
Shocking if true, right?
You're going back 5 years for what ? What are you claiming ? Has Mattis said that Trump was compromised by the Russians ?
Since Mattis left office he has been very circumspect.
Mattis eventually saw Trump’s character and has not been afraid to make his assessment clear.
That I was earlier in such assessment, presumably, matters not at all in the accuracy of our assessments.
You were flat wrong in yours.
That said, while Mattis has recently made clear that he sees the US as very vulnerable to influence operations by Russia and other adversaries, I’m not aware of a direct public statement claiming he knows that Trump was ‘in cahoots “ with Putin. But he’s very clear about Trump’s character and stupidity and the danger to the US he therefore sees. Being vulnerable to Putin and other dictators’ flattery, money, and other assistance is just part of this danger.
My own view has long been that Trump, at a minimum, was and is a “useful idiot”. Whether he knowingly coordinated or knowingly caused others to coordinate campaign and other efforts with Putin and his representatives is less easy to prove with no shred of doubt. But man there’s sure a heck of a lot of evidence of consciousness of wrong doing.
And, 7 secret phone calls with Putin since leaving office…while strong arming GOP legislators to withhold defense funding to Ukraine. You ok with that because you ‘support his policies’?!
Let me help you, Salty.
Read the links and respond to what I wrote in full context.
old salt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:12 am
.. Yes, you inserted Mattis in this thread, in the midst of our discussion about Russiagate, then when asked about it, you continue dodging my question.
Do you think Mattis would work for a CinC he thought was compromised by the Russians & not say anything about it now ?
Which is it ? For over 2 years, was Mattis a corrupt bootlicker who just wanted to have access to power, or a useful idiot for Trimp's Rissian puppet masters ? Was he getting a kick back on military contract fuel sales too ?
...or are you privy to intel on Trump that he's not ?
What part of the word 'agree' do you not understand?
Yes, I don't think Mattis thought Trump was in cahoots with Russia, at least not at the level where he was sure.
Which certainly does not make Mattis a 'useful idiot' for the Russians as it would appear that he was a bulwark, in his role, against various Russian interests.
There was clearly enormous friction between Trump and Mattis. Mattis disagreed, fundamentally, in Trump's approach to the world. He thinks of it as more than Russia, but rather a worldview difference.
But I would indeed be fascinated to know what Mattis actually thought and now thinks about Trump's footsie with Putin. Someday we may know.
OK. Got it -- you don't regard Mattis as a bootlicker or useful idiot.
You're just a better judge of character than he is & you have more knowledge about the situation & have a closer proximity to Trump from which to judge him. Seems reasonable to me. ...but I wouldn't hold your breath awaiting an epilogue from Mattis after Trump leaves office.
Hmmm…I didn’t hold my breath but sure turns out that your assessment was quite wrong.
Is it true that Trump has spoken directly and privately with Putin 7 times since leaving office?
Shocking if true, right?
You're going back 5 years for what ? What are you claiming ? Has Mattis said that Trump was compromised by the Russians ?
Since Mattis left office he has been very circumspect.
Mattis eventually saw Trump’s character and has not been afraid to make his assessment clear.
That I was earlier in such assessment, presumably, matters not at all in the accuracy of our assessments.
You were flat wrong in yours.
That said, while Mattis has recently made clear that he sees the US as very vulnerable to influence operations by Russia and other adversaries, I’m not aware of a direct public statement claiming he knows that Trump was ‘in cahoots “ with Putin. But he’s very clear about Trump’s character and stupidity and the danger to the US he therefore sees. Being vulnerable to Putin and other dictators’ flattery, money, and other assistance is just part of this danger.
My own view has long been that Trump, at a minimum, was and is a “useful idiot”. Whether he knowingly coordinated or knowingly caused others to coordinate campaign and other efforts with Putin and his representatives is less easy to prove with no shred of doubt. But man there’s sure a heck of a lot of evidence of consciousness of wrong doing.
And, 7 secret phone calls with Putin since leaving office…while strong arming GOP legislators to withhold defense funding to Ukraine. You ok with that because you ‘support his policies’?!
Let me help you, Salty.
Read the links and respond to what I wrote in full context.
I don't need to wade through all your BS "context" & respond to your every supposition.
Show hard evidence of Trump being compromised by Russia.
Otherwise, you are just making unfounded accusations.
Do you think our IC does not have intercepts of those sinister ph calls ? Remember Flynn.
If there was anything in them that could harm Trump, it would have been leaked by now.
old salt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:12 am
.. Yes, you inserted Mattis in this thread, in the midst of our discussion about Russiagate, then when asked about it, you continue dodging my question.
Do you think Mattis would work for a CinC he thought was compromised by the Russians & not say anything about it now ?
Which is it ? For over 2 years, was Mattis a corrupt bootlicker who just wanted to have access to power, or a useful idiot for Trimp's Rissian puppet masters ? Was he getting a kick back on military contract fuel sales too ?
...or are you privy to intel on Trump that he's not ?
What part of the word 'agree' do you not understand?
Yes, I don't think Mattis thought Trump was in cahoots with Russia, at least not at the level where he was sure.
Which certainly does not make Mattis a 'useful idiot' for the Russians as it would appear that he was a bulwark, in his role, against various Russian interests.
There was clearly enormous friction between Trump and Mattis. Mattis disagreed, fundamentally, in Trump's approach to the world. He thinks of it as more than Russia, but rather a worldview difference.
But I would indeed be fascinated to know what Mattis actually thought and now thinks about Trump's footsie with Putin. Someday we may know.
OK. Got it -- you don't regard Mattis as a bootlicker or useful idiot.
You're just a better judge of character than he is & you have more knowledge about the situation & have a closer proximity to Trump from which to judge him. Seems reasonable to me. ...but I wouldn't hold your breath awaiting an epilogue from Mattis after Trump leaves office.
Hmmm…I didn’t hold my breath but sure turns out that your assessment was quite wrong.
Is it true that Trump has spoken directly and privately with Putin 7 times since leaving office?
Shocking if true, right?
You're going back 5 years for what ? What are you claiming ? Has Mattis said that Trump was compromised by the Russians ?
Since Mattis left office he has been very circumspect.
Mattis eventually saw Trump’s character and has not been afraid to make his assessment clear.
That I was earlier in such assessment, presumably, matters not at all in the accuracy of our assessments.
You were flat wrong in yours.
That said, while Mattis has recently made clear that he sees the US as very vulnerable to influence operations by Russia and other adversaries, I’m not aware of a direct public statement claiming he knows that Trump was ‘in cahoots “ with Putin. But he’s very clear about Trump’s character and stupidity and the danger to the US he therefore sees. Being vulnerable to Putin and other dictators’ flattery, money, and other assistance is just part of this danger.
My own view has long been that Trump, at a minimum, was and is a “useful idiot”. Whether he knowingly coordinated or knowingly caused others to coordinate campaign and other efforts with Putin and his representatives is less easy to prove with no shred of doubt. But man there’s sure a heck of a lot of evidence of consciousness of wrong doing.
And, 7 secret phone calls with Putin since leaving office…while strong arming GOP legislators to withhold defense funding to Ukraine. You ok with that because you ‘support his policies’?!
Let me help you, Salty.
Read the links and respond to what I wrote in full context.
I don't need to wade through all your BS "context" & respond to your every supposition.
Show hard evidence of Trump being compromised by Russia.
Otherwise, you are just making unfounded accusations.
Do you think our IC does not have intercepts of those sinister ph calls ?
If there was anything in them that could harm Trump, it would have been leaked by now.
Cowardly.
Trump Putin apologist.
I claim nothing more than useful idiot and I’ve been consistent that such is, at a minimum, obvious. More is speculative but certainly possible.
Mattis has definitely not been ‘circumspect’ but his assessment of Trump’s character and danger is irrelevant to you.
old salt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:12 am
.. Yes, you inserted Mattis in this thread, in the midst of our discussion about Russiagate, then when asked about it, you continue dodging my question.
Do you think Mattis would work for a CinC he thought was compromised by the Russians & not say anything about it now ?
Which is it ? For over 2 years, was Mattis a corrupt bootlicker who just wanted to have access to power, or a useful idiot for Trimp's Rissian puppet masters ? Was he getting a kick back on military contract fuel sales too ?
...or are you privy to intel on Trump that he's not ?
What part of the word 'agree' do you not understand?
Yes, I don't think Mattis thought Trump was in cahoots with Russia, at least not at the level where he was sure.
Which certainly does not make Mattis a 'useful idiot' for the Russians as it would appear that he was a bulwark, in his role, against various Russian interests.
There was clearly enormous friction between Trump and Mattis. Mattis disagreed, fundamentally, in Trump's approach to the world. He thinks of it as more than Russia, but rather a worldview difference.
But I would indeed be fascinated to know what Mattis actually thought and now thinks about Trump's footsie with Putin. Someday we may know.
OK. Got it -- you don't regard Mattis as a bootlicker or useful idiot.
You're just a better judge of character than he is & you have more knowledge about the situation & have a closer proximity to Trump from which to judge him. Seems reasonable to me. ...but I wouldn't hold your breath awaiting an epilogue from Mattis after Trump leaves office.
Hmmm…I didn’t hold my breath but sure turns out that your assessment was quite wrong.
Is it true that Trump has spoken directly and privately with Putin 7 times since leaving office?
Shocking if true, right?
You're going back 5 years for what ? What are you claiming ? Has Mattis said that Trump was compromised by the Russians ?
Since Mattis left office he has been very circumspect.
Mattis eventually saw Trump’s character and has not been afraid to make his assessment clear.
That I was earlier in such assessment, presumably, matters not at all in the accuracy of our assessments.
You were flat wrong in yours.
That said, while Mattis has recently made clear that he sees the US as very vulnerable to influence operations by Russia and other adversaries, I’m not aware of a direct public statement claiming he knows that Trump was ‘in cahoots “ with Putin. But he’s very clear about Trump’s character and stupidity and the danger to the US he therefore sees. Being vulnerable to Putin and other dictators’ flattery, money, and other assistance is just part of this danger.
My own view has long been that Trump, at a minimum, was and is a “useful idiot”. Whether he knowingly coordinated or knowingly caused others to coordinate campaign and other efforts with Putin and his representatives is less easy to prove with no shred of doubt. But man there’s sure a heck of a lot of evidence of consciousness of wrong doing.
And, 7 secret phone calls with Putin since leaving office…while strong arming GOP legislators to withhold defense funding to Ukraine. You ok with that because you ‘support his policies’?!
Let me help you, Salty.
Read the links and respond to what I wrote in full context.
I don't need to wade through all your BS "context" & respond to your every supposition.
Show hard evidence of Trump being compromised by Russia.
Otherwise, you are just making unfounded accusations.
Do you think our IC does not have intercepts of those sinister ph calls ?
If there was anything in them that could harm Trump, it would have been leaked by now.
Cowardly.
Trump Putin apologist.
I claim nothing more than useful idiot and I’ve been consistent that such is, at a minimum, obvious. More is speculative but certainly possible.
Mattis has definitely not been ‘circumspect’ but his assessment of Trump’s character and danger is irrelevant to you.
Putin’s lap dog at it again, i have said i consider him a fifth columnist. There is ample evidence to support your assertions
old salt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:12 am
.. Yes, you inserted Mattis in this thread, in the midst of our discussion about Russiagate, then when asked about it, you continue dodging my question.
Do you think Mattis would work for a CinC he thought was compromised by the Russians & not say anything about it now ?
Which is it ? For over 2 years, was Mattis a corrupt bootlicker who just wanted to have access to power, or a useful idiot for Trimp's Rissian puppet masters ? Was he getting a kick back on military contract fuel sales too ?
...or are you privy to intel on Trump that he's not ?
What part of the word 'agree' do you not understand?
Yes, I don't think Mattis thought Trump was in cahoots with Russia, at least not at the level where he was sure.
Which certainly does not make Mattis a 'useful idiot' for the Russians as it would appear that he was a bulwark, in his role, against various Russian interests.
There was clearly enormous friction between Trump and Mattis. Mattis disagreed, fundamentally, in Trump's approach to the world. He thinks of it as more than Russia, but rather a worldview difference.
But I would indeed be fascinated to know what Mattis actually thought and now thinks about Trump's footsie with Putin. Someday we may know.
OK. Got it -- you don't regard Mattis as a bootlicker or useful idiot.
You're just a better judge of character than he is & you have more knowledge about the situation & have a closer proximity to Trump from which to judge him. Seems reasonable to me. ...but I wouldn't hold your breath awaiting an epilogue from Mattis after Trump leaves office.
Hmmm…I didn’t hold my breath but sure turns out that your assessment was quite wrong.
Is it true that Trump has spoken directly and privately with Putin 7 times since leaving office?
Shocking if true, right?
You're going back 5 years for what ? What are you claiming ? Has Mattis said that Trump was compromised by the Russians ?
Since Mattis left office he has been very circumspect.
Mattis eventually saw Trump’s character and has not been afraid to make his assessment clear.
That I was earlier in such assessment, presumably, matters not at all in the accuracy of our assessments.
You were flat wrong in yours.
That said, while Mattis has recently made clear that he sees the US as very vulnerable to influence operations by Russia and other adversaries, I’m not aware of a direct public statement claiming he knows that Trump was ‘in cahoots “ with Putin. But he’s very clear about Trump’s character and stupidity and the danger to the US he therefore sees. Being vulnerable to Putin and other dictators’ flattery, money, and other assistance is just part of this danger.
My own view has long been that Trump, at a minimum, was and is a “useful idiot”. Whether he knowingly coordinated or knowingly caused others to coordinate campaign and other efforts with Putin and his representatives is less easy to prove with no shred of doubt. But man there’s sure a heck of a lot of evidence of consciousness of wrong doing.
And, 7 secret phone calls with Putin since leaving office…while strong arming GOP legislators to withhold defense funding to Ukraine. You ok with that because you ‘support his policies’?!
Let me help you, Salty.
Read the links and respond to what I wrote in full context.
I don't need to wade through all your BS "context" & respond to your every supposition.
Show hard evidence of Trump being compromised by Russia.
Otherwise, you are just making unfounded accusations.
Do you think our IC does not have intercepts of those sinister ph calls ?
If there was anything in them that could harm Trump, it would have been leaked by now.
Cowardly.
Trump Putin apologist.
I claim nothing more than useful idiot and I’ve been consistent that such is, at a minimum, obvious. More is speculative but certainly possible.
Mattis has definitely not been ‘circumspect’ but his assessment of Trump’s character and danger is irrelevant to you.
Putin’s lap dog at it again, i have said i consider him a fifth columnist. There is ample evidence to support your assertions
old salt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 15, 2019 1:12 am
.. Yes, you inserted Mattis in this thread, in the midst of our discussion about Russiagate, then when asked about it, you continue dodging my question.
Do you think Mattis would work for a CinC he thought was compromised by the Russians & not say anything about it now ?
Which is it ? For over 2 years, was Mattis a corrupt bootlicker who just wanted to have access to power, or a useful idiot for Trimp's Rissian puppet masters ? Was he getting a kick back on military contract fuel sales too ?
...or are you privy to intel on Trump that he's not ?
What part of the word 'agree' do you not understand?
Yes, I don't think Mattis thought Trump was in cahoots with Russia, at least not at the level where he was sure.
Which certainly does not make Mattis a 'useful idiot' for the Russians as it would appear that he was a bulwark, in his role, against various Russian interests.
There was clearly enormous friction between Trump and Mattis. Mattis disagreed, fundamentally, in Trump's approach to the world. He thinks of it as more than Russia, but rather a worldview difference.
But I would indeed be fascinated to know what Mattis actually thought and now thinks about Trump's footsie with Putin. Someday we may know.
OK. Got it -- you don't regard Mattis as a bootlicker or useful idiot.
You're just a better judge of character than he is & you have more knowledge about the situation & have a closer proximity to Trump from which to judge him. Seems reasonable to me. ...but I wouldn't hold your breath awaiting an epilogue from Mattis after Trump leaves office.
Hmmm…I didn’t hold my breath but sure turns out that your assessment was quite wrong.
Is it true that Trump has spoken directly and privately with Putin 7 times since leaving office?
Shocking if true, right?
You're going back 5 years for what ? What are you claiming ? Has Mattis said that Trump was compromised by the Russians ?
Since Mattis left office he has been very circumspect.
Mattis eventually saw Trump’s character and has not been afraid to make his assessment clear.
That I was earlier in such assessment, presumably, matters not at all in the accuracy of our assessments.
You were flat wrong in yours.
That said, while Mattis has recently made clear that he sees the US as very vulnerable to influence operations by Russia and other adversaries, I’m not aware of a direct public statement claiming he knows that Trump was ‘in cahoots “ with Putin. But he’s very clear about Trump’s character and stupidity and the danger to the US he therefore sees. Being vulnerable to Putin and other dictators’ flattery, money, and other assistance is just part of this danger.
My own view has long been that Trump, at a minimum, was and is a “useful idiot”. Whether he knowingly coordinated or knowingly caused others to coordinate campaign and other efforts with Putin and his representatives is less easy to prove with no shred of doubt. But man there’s sure a heck of a lot of evidence of consciousness of wrong doing.
And, 7 secret phone calls with Putin since leaving office…while strong arming GOP legislators to withhold defense funding to Ukraine. You ok with that because you ‘support his policies’?!
Let me help you, Salty.
Read the links and respond to what I wrote in full context.
I don't need to wade through all your BS "context" & respond to your every supposition.
Show hard evidence of Trump being compromised by Russia.
Otherwise, you are just making unfounded accusations.
Do you think our IC does not have intercepts of those sinister ph calls ?
If there was anything in them that could harm Trump, it would have been leaked by now.
Cowardly.
Trump Putin apologist.
I claim nothing more than useful idiot and I’ve been consistent that such is, at a minimum, obvious. More is speculative but certainly possible.
Mattis has definitely not been ‘circumspect’ but his assessment of Trump’s character and danger is irrelevant to you.
Putin’s lap dog at it again, i have said i consider him a fifth columnist. There is ample evidence to support your assertions
. Yes, you inserted Mattis in this thread, in the midst of our discussion about Russiagate, then when asked about it, you continue dodging my question.
