NIL, Title IX, Power 5, future of Lax et al

[Farfromgeneva]

I am also confident that their lawyers are good, and I believe they can get the NCAA a couple of years of breathing room.

Nothing they are doing would last ten minutes in front of the SCOTUS. But they know it's years before a case would show up there, which is why they're playing this game, imho.

Picture being an NCAA attorney, defending this "new deal" in front of Roberts or Kavanaugh:

Kavanaugh: "So after we told you in the last case you lost that you have to follow US labor laws, and that collusion is illegal...you and your team went back and crafted this deal that....if I have this straight....caps the number of student-employees each member school has, how much they can get paid for their work, and you did all of this without so much as talking with one single student-employee or their Union? Is that right?

Good luck with that, is all I have to say.

They're trying to keep the party going, and keep the money flowing to all these middlemen who have nothing to do with what happens on a field/court. That's all we're seeing now, imho.

Tear it all down. I can personally say as a former college athlete, I never felt I was an employee and I never felt my son was a school employee when he played more recently. I would shut it all down and turn it into club. You want to work as a professional athlete, go play pro ball. Ain’t nobody forcing you to go to college.

Limited my options in lab sciences a bit w practices but I was going econ anyways. Some trade offs you wouldn’t get in club no matter what but I don’t disagree. Club can be very highly funded and semi professional too.

[Farfromgeneva]

I am also confident that their lawyers are good, and I believe they can get the NCAA a couple of years of breathing room.

Nothing they are doing would last ten minutes in front of the SCOTUS. But they know it's years before a case would show up there, which is why they're playing this game, imho.

Picture being an NCAA attorney, defending this "new deal" in front of Roberts or Kavanaugh:

Kavanaugh: "So after we told you in the last case you lost that you have to follow US labor laws, and that collusion is illegal...you and your team went back and crafted this deal that....if I have this straight....caps the number of student-employees each member school has, how much they can get paid for their work, and you did all of this without so much as talking with one single student-employee or their Union? Is that right?

Good luck with that, is all I have to say.

They're trying to keep the party going, and keep the money flowing to all these middlemen who have nothing to do with what happens on a field/court. That's all we're seeing now, imho.

Tear it all down. I can personally say as a former college athlete, I never felt I was an employee and I never felt my son was a school employee when he played more recently. I would shut it all down and turn it into club. You want to work as a professional athlete, go play pro ball. Ain’t nobody forcing you to go to college.

I would say the one thing in this fight for rights that I could get behind is medical care, but that seems to be at the bottom of the list

Yep. That would be reasonable. Telling colleges that they have to have unlimited rosters with an unlimited pay scale for students is ridiculous. Fordham and Georgetown Football are robbing kids by forcing them to play football and not paying them a salary with no limit. $70k a year in Tuition and Room and Board isn’t enough.

No one is telling colleges that. All the SCOTUS is saying is that you can't collude to set wages and employee numbers.

Gtown can do what it pleases. Same as it ever was. In just can't work in concert with other schools to suppress wages or employee numbers...same as it ever was.

You played lacrosse though, right? I'd guess the reason you didn't feel like an employee is that you didn't play in front of 100K people who paid $80 a ticket to get in.....while watching your coach get seven figures, endorsement deals, while your school gets a share of a $1Billion deal with ESPN to show you run around on the field. So you feel you got a fair deal for playing in front of a few hundred fans.

All they're asking for are the same free market labor forces you and enjoy for our work.

That's it, and nothing more. Seems fair, and very American to me. Which means, of course, Gtown football players will be lucky if they keep their scholarships. What you are asking for is happening...they're tearing it all down, whether they know it yet, or not.

TLD played bball, his son played lax at Princeton.
Could have chosen virtually anywhere.

His comment was rhetorical hyperbole. I'm sure he understands the legal dynamics.

A lot of us, and I assume you as well, don't really want college sports 'torn down', but the superstructure of the NCAA is another matter.

Too 5-10 program recruit in multiple sports not just lax so saw plenty across programs and sports.

[Farfromgeneva]

I just don’t see college athletes as employees. Make them pay tuition and room and board like everyone else. Playing a college sport isn’t a livelihood. I would do something but it wouldn’t be a substitute for pro sports. The NFL should do away with forcing kids to wait 3 years after HS before they are eligible.

You're ignoring the flip side: what about the wages for Admin, coaches, and middle men? Are the kids the only people who should be capped?

UMich's Conry makes twice what many tenured professors make at Michigan...many are world class departments, top of the heap. That doesn't seem out of whack to you? Taxpayer on the hook for a $200k+ wage for a sport that loses money?

College sports lost its way....and it's the coaches and admin. making 100% of the choices as to where it is headed. The kids don't have a say in any of it.

I would let the air out of the balloon. That includes bloated athletic departments. Use the money to buy down the cost of attendance and improve the physical plant. I don’t see college athletes as employees. If these people don’t see the value of a degree from Georgia Tech, that’s their problem. Go to the NFL or the NFL or MLB (where they all have a wage scale), don’t go to college.

Just don’t do the generic mgt program or their b school (mba). Stick a stem at ga tech, I know intimately well.

[Farfromgeneva]

I am also confident that their lawyers are good, and I believe they can get the NCAA a couple of years of breathing room.

Nothing they are doing would last ten minutes in front of the SCOTUS. But they know it's years before a case would show up there, which is why they're playing this game, imho.

Picture being an NCAA attorney, defending this "new deal" in front of Roberts or Kavanaugh:

Kavanaugh: "So after we told you in the last case you lost that you have to follow US labor laws, and that collusion is illegal...you and your team went back and crafted this deal that....if I have this straight....caps the number of student-employees each member school has, how much they can get paid for their work, and you did all of this without so much as talking with one single student-employee or their Union? Is that right?

Good luck with that, is all I have to say.

They're trying to keep the party going, and keep the money flowing to all these middlemen who have nothing to do with what happens on a field/court. That's all we're seeing now, imho.

Tear it all down. I can personally say as a former college athlete, I never felt I was an employee and I never felt my son was a school employee when he played more recently. I would shut it all down and turn it into club. You want to work as a professional athlete, go play pro ball. Ain’t nobody forcing you to go to college.

I would say the one thing in this fight for rights that I could get behind is medical care, but that seems to be at the bottom of the list

Yep. That would be reasonable. Telling colleges that they have to have unlimited rosters with an unlimited pay scale for students is ridiculous. Fordham and Georgetown Football are robbing kids by forcing them to play football and not paying them a salary with no limit. $70k a year in Tuition and Room and Board isn’t enough.

No one is telling colleges that. All the SCOTUS is saying is that you can't collude to set wages and employee numbers.

Gtown can do what it pleases. Same as it ever was. In just can't work in concert with other schools to suppress wages or employee numbers...same as it ever was.

You played lacrosse though, right? I'd guess the reason you didn't feel like an employee is that you didn't play in front of 100K people who paid $80 a ticket to get in.....while watching your coach get seven figures, endorsement deals, while your school gets a share of a $1Billion deal with ESPN to show you run around on the field. So you feel you got a fair deal for playing in front of a few hundred fans.

All they're asking for are the same free market labor forces you and enjoy for our work.

That's it, and nothing more. Seems fair, and very American to me. Which means, of course, Gtown football players will be lucky if they keep their scholarships. What you are asking for is happening...they're tearing it all down, whether they know it yet, or not.

TLD played bball, his son played lax at Princeton.
Could have chosen virtually anywhere.

His comment was rhetorical hyperbole. I'm sure he understands the legal dynamics.

A lot of us, and I assume you as well, don't really want college sports 'torn down', but the superstructure of the NCAA is another matter.

No, I don't want it torn down. I'm genuinely worried about all non-revunue sports, and what's coming down the pike.

My preference? Would have been for the NCAA to regulate Coaches and Admins and middlemen wages so that this whole mess never happens. Keep it amateur with reasonable wages so the kids aren't exploited. Plow the TV money back into education instead of into bloated wages....I know, what a concept.

They CHOSE to line their own pockets instead. This choice is why it's all falling apart. The students had nothing to do with this mess.

The ncaa is a sro they were never going to do anything you want they exist to keep real regularity oversight away and benefit the owners. Been that way for its entire existence

[oldbartman]

With college back in session and NIL currently in place, does anyone actually know what schools, or a separately fund program associated with that school, are actually giving/paying NIL $$ to their men's lacrosse players? If so, how much??

[1766]

With college back in session and NIL currently in place, does anyone actually know what schools, or a separately fund program associated with that school, are actually giving/paying NIL $$ to their men's lacrosse players? If so, how much??

I'm not going to get into specific amounts but every team in the B1G has numerous players who have NIL deals. In addition to those at Rutgers, every player in the program gets Alston money. That goes across all sports at the University. I would think it would be the same at every Big Ten/Acc school.

[oldbartman]

Thanks 1766. If anyone can share more detailed info, it will be appreciated.

[OCanada]

With college back in session and NIL currently in place, does anyone actually know what schools, or a separately fund program associated with that school, are actually giving/paying NIL $$ to their men's lacrosse players? If so, how much??

I'm not going to get into specific amounts but every team in the B1G has numerous players who have NIL deals. In addition to those at Rutgers, every player in the program gets Alston money. That goes across all sports at the University. I would think it would be the same at every Big Ten/Acc school.

Well except for Johns hopkins

[10stone5]

With college back in session and NIL currently in place, does anyone actually know what schools, or a separately fund program associated with that school, are actually giving/paying NIL $$ to their men's lacrosse players? If so, how much??

This web site purports to be an ‘NIL Influencer Network’
with some data — hard to say how accurate it is,

https://pstgm.com/portal/index.cfm

According to that website, this guy, a 3 time NCAA champion wrestler earned $190,000,

https://pstgm.com/portal/profile.cfm?pu ... =Wrestling

They also claim a last year’s backup at faceoff for Princeton earned 6 figures.

[Farfromgeneva]

With college back in session and NIL currently in place, does anyone actually know what schools, or a separately fund program associated with that school, are actually giving/paying NIL $$ to their men's lacrosse players? If so, how much??

This web site purports to be an ‘NIL Influencer Network’
with some data — hard to say how accurate it is,

https://pstgm.com/portal/index.cfm

According to that website, this guy, a 3 time NCAA champion wrestler earned $190,000,

https://pstgm.com/portal/profile.cfm?pu ... =Wrestling

They also claim a last year’s backup at faceoff for Princeton earned 6 figures.

Imagine what Kurt angle would’ve earned…

https://www.espn.com/olympics/story/_/i ... 0-years-on

[OCanada]

Private equity is going to be moving into youth sportd. Don’t know if it has been mentioned yet

On another note my sister (major university CFO) was talking about the effects of potential changes with someone will versed in the arcana who said there will be major effects st all levels including D -lll

[Farfromgeneva]

Private equity is going to be moving into youth sportd. Don’t know if it has been mentioned yet

On another note my sister (major university CFO) was talking about the effects of potential changes with someone will versed in the arcana who said there will be major effects st all levels including D -lll

Already is.

Club systems were getting rolled up five years ago. But cost of capital will hinder services with no tangible asset deals being too highly levered

[Farfromgeneva]

Whatever happened to Clemson and fsu are someone they belong in the sec????

Calling doctor specious arguments for an answer.

[OCanada]

Thx for updating me

[steel_hop]

Private equity is going to be moving into youth sportd. Don’t know if it has been mentioned yet

On another note my sister (major university CFO) was talking about the effects of potential changes with someone will versed in the arcana who said there will be major effects st all levels including D -lll

Already is.

Club systems were getting rolled up five years ago. But cost of capital will hinder services with no tangible asset deals being too highly levered

Correct. True and some other other big national brands all have private money backing them. The guys that own 3D (and other club lax teams) support club teams across multiple sports.

Though it would really amuse me if PE bought into a athletic department like FSU was/is considering. Talk about mismatch priorities because it would be amusing to watch PE take a hatch job to an AD's staff given how bloated most of them are.

[OCanada]

Hopkins is now part of the NIL store.

[1766]

With college back in session and NIL currently in place, does anyone actually know what schools, or a separately fund program associated with that school, are actually giving/paying NIL $$ to their men's lacrosse players? If so, how much??

I'm not going to get into specific amounts but every team in the B1G has numerous players who have NIL deals. In addition to those at Rutgers, every player in the program gets Alston money. That goes across all sports at the University. I would think it would be the same at every Big Ten/Acc school.

Well except for Johns hopkins

Hopkins definitely has NIL deals. I'm not going do divulge amounts but it's out there.

[OCanada]

They do. Just joined the NIL store. What they don’t have is Austin like money that you noted went to all sports at BIG and ACC schools

[Farfromgeneva]

Stanford played Syracuse in football last night. FLy cross country for two programs very few care about. What a waste.

[44WeWantMore]

Wait until they have to do it for sports with multiple games per week.
It is almost as if Football drives and everybody else gets dragged behind.


Yes, I know.