Israel and West Bank Settlements

[cradleandshoot]

That being said it was the bad optics it symbolized that caused all the uproar. The majority of football fans take the game and what the flag means to them very seriously. For the NFL fan who deployed to Iraq and almost had his or her ass blown to pieces they clearly and understandably didn't get the message.

Of course he stated multiple times he wasn't protesting the flag or the anthem or the country.

Maybe you can go explain their uproar to the families of the innocent black kids killed by cops.

If he stayed in the locker room, you and they would still say he was disrespecting the flag and the anthem. I guess by "peaceful" protests you really mean "no" protests?

It is all about the optics as I already stated. Maybe you can explain to the families of all our service members that died in Iraq and Afghanistan many of whom were also black. To most of them that flag represents the sacrifice that their loved ones made. FFS they died for what that flag meant to them. The symbolism of what Kaepernick was saying was done in the wrong place and in the wrong way I would never deny his right to do it. He could have got his message across and not destroy his career in the process. He is a grown man who made a grown man decision and paid the grown man price. For the sake of this forum and humanity maybe it's time to put it to bed again?

FTR please don't attempt to speak for me. I'm not part of " you and they " You really have no business including me in whoever you think " they " are. I told you quite clearly how I feel that is just not the message you wanted to hear.

[NattyBohChamps04]

It is all about the optics as I already stated. Maybe you can explain to the families of all our service members that died in Iraq and Afghanistan many of whom were also black. To most of them that flag represents the sacrifice that their loved ones made. FFS they died for what that flag meant to them. The symbolism of what Kaepernick was saying was done in the wrong place and in the wrong way I would never deny his right to do it. He could have got his message across and not destroy his career in the process. He is a grown man who made a grown man decision and paid the grown man price. For the sake of this forum and humanity maybe it's time to put it to bed again?

FTR please don't attempt to speak for me. I'm not part of " you and they " You really have no business including me in whoever you think " they " are. I told you quite clearly how I feel that is just not the message you wanted to hear.

That's what protests are. To get your attention. We're still talking about it years later. The optics? That's just media talking heads' spin.

Of course many service members supported kneeling. They knew the reason why he did it and that he wasn't disrespecting them. Doesn't take a room temperature IQ to understand that.

The Veteran And NFL Player Who Advised Kaepernick To Take A Knee [...] Retired Army Green Beret Nate Boyer is the man who first convinced Colin Kaepernick to kneel during the national anthem.

Veterans take a knee in support of national anthem protests

What do veterans think about kneeling during the anthem? Views are diverse.

He knew the possible outcome of his peaceful protest, and he did it anyway. Not a lot of people have that conviction. Again, this is all because you want to see more "peaceful" protests. But when one happens? Nothing but complaints.

[cradleandshoot]

It is all about the optics as I already stated. Maybe you can explain to the families of all our service members that died in Iraq and Afghanistan many of whom were also black. To most of them that flag represents the sacrifice that their loved ones made. FFS they died for what that flag meant to them. The symbolism of what Kaepernick was saying was done in the wrong place and in the wrong way I would never deny his right to do it. He could have got his message across and not destroy his career in the process. He is a grown man who made a grown man decision and paid the grown man price. For the sake of this forum and humanity maybe it's time to put it to bed again?

FTR please don't attempt to speak for me. I'm not part of " you and they " You really have no business including me in whoever you think " they " are. I told you quite clearly how I feel that is just not the message you wanted to hear.

That's what protests are. To get your attention. We're still talking about it years later. The optics? That's just media talking heads' spin.

Of course many service members supported kneeling. They knew the reason why he did it and that he wasn't disrespecting them. Doesn't take a room temperature IQ to understand that.

The Veteran And NFL Player Who Advised Kaepernick To Take A Knee [...] Retired Army Green Beret Nate Boyer is the man who first convinced Colin Kaepernick to kneel during the national anthem.

Veterans take a knee in support of national anthem protests

What do veterans think about kneeling during the anthem? Views are diverse.

He knew the possible outcome of his peaceful protest, and he did it anyway. Not a lot of people have that conviction. Again, this is all because you want to see more "peaceful" protests. But when one happens? Nothing but complaints.

He had the conviction but why did someone need to talk him into it? That implies he wasn't sure. If I was that deeply concerned about a situation I wouldn't need any persuading from anyone. I will always disagree with his methodology and I will always give him credit for doing something he believed in. I suppose he is grateful enough to live in a country where he is free to make that symbolic statement. Had he been say a Chinese citizen living in China and made that same symbolic gesture at a public event I bet he might never have been seen or heard from again.

[PizzaSnake]

“ after a strike on a football pitch in a remote town in the occupied Golan Heights killed11 young people and a daylong barrage of rocket fire from Lebanon targeted Israeli territory.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/artic ... an-heights

Also obscene.

[Kismet]

It is all about the optics as I already stated. Maybe you can explain to the families of all our service members that died in Iraq and Afghanistan many of whom were also black. To most of them that flag represents the sacrifice that their loved ones made. FFS they died for what that flag meant to them. The symbolism of what Kaepernick was saying was done in the wrong place and in the wrong way I would never deny his right to do it. He could have got his message across and not destroy his career in the process. He is a grown man who made a grown man decision and paid the grown man price. For the sake of this forum and humanity maybe it's time to put it to bed again?

FTR please don't attempt to speak for me. I'm not part of " you and they " You really have no business including me in whoever you think " they " are. I told you quite clearly how I feel that is just not the message you wanted to hear.

That's what protests are. To get your attention. We're still talking about it years later. The optics? That's just media talking heads' spin.

Of course many service members supported kneeling. They knew the reason why he did it and that he wasn't disrespecting them. Doesn't take a room temperature IQ to understand that.

The Veteran And NFL Player Who Advised Kaepernick To Take A Knee [...] Retired Army Green Beret Nate Boyer is the man who first convinced Colin Kaepernick to kneel during the national anthem.

Veterans take a knee in support of national anthem protests

What do veterans think about kneeling during the anthem? Views are diverse.

He knew the possible outcome of his peaceful protest, and he did it anyway. Not a lot of people have that conviction. Again, this is all because you want to see more "peaceful" protests. But when one happens? Nothing but complaints.

He had the conviction but why did someone need to talk him into it? That implies he wasn't sure. If I was that deeply concerned about a situation I wouldn't need any persuading from anyone. I will always disagree with his methodology and I will always give him credit for doing something he believed in. I suppose he is grateful enough to live in a country where he is free to make that symbolic statement. Had he been say a Chinese citizen living in China and made that same symbolic gesture at a public event I bet he might never have been seen or heard from again.

Well, he was essentially blackballed by the NFL and denied the ability to make a living as a football player and essentially erased from professional football. How is that any different than your example?

[NattyBohChamps04]

He had the conviction but why did someone need to talk him into it? That implies he wasn't sure. If I was that deeply concerned about a situation I wouldn't need any persuading from anyone. I will always disagree with his methodology and I will always give him credit for doing something he believed in. I suppose he is grateful enough to live in a country where he is free to make that symbolic statement. Had he been say a Chinese citizen living in China and made that same symbolic gesture at a public event I bet he might never have been seen or heard from again.

I guess you didn't read the article as usual. Kaepernick was already sitting for the anthem in the preseason. The Green Beret player convinced him after a couple of games to kneel instead of sitting. Quote: "He initially advised Kaepernick to take a knee instead of sitting down during the anthem as a sign of respect."

Funny how kids kneeling down is a sign of respect during an injury.

And, you know, people - in my opinions and in my experience, kneeling's never been in our history really seen as a disrespectful act. I mean, people kneel when they get knighted. You kneel to propose to your wife, and you take a knee to pray. And soldiers often take a knee in front of a fallen brother's grave to pay respects. So I thought, if anything, besides standing, that was the most respectful. But, of course, that's just my opinion. - Nate Boyer

[cradleandshoot]

He had the conviction but why did someone need to talk him into it? That implies he wasn't sure. If I was that deeply concerned about a situation I wouldn't need any persuading from anyone. I will always disagree with his methodology and I will always give him credit for doing something he believed in. I suppose he is grateful enough to live in a country where he is free to make that symbolic statement. Had he been say a Chinese citizen living in China and made that same symbolic gesture at a public event I bet he might never have been seen or heard from again.

I guess you didn't read the article as usual. Kaepernick was already sitting for the anthem in the preseason. The Green Beret player convinced him after a couple of games to kneel instead of sitting. Quote: "He initially advised Kaepernick to take a knee instead of sitting down during the anthem as a sign of respect."

Funny how kids kneeling down is a sign of respect during an injury.

And, you know, people - in my opinions and in my experience, kneeling's never been in our history really seen as a disrespectful act. I mean, people kneel when they get knighted. You kneel to propose to your wife, and you take a knee to pray. And soldiers often take a knee in front of a fallen brother's grave to pay respects. So I thought, if anything, besides standing, that was the most respectful. But, of course, that's just my opinion. - Nate Boyer

Well maybe when everyone else is standing with their hands over their heart and some singing the words the intent becomes rather discombobulated as to the meaning. I always recall the public address announcers asking everyone to please stand for the playing of our national anthem. They even are polite enough to say please. If you choose to honor that request that is up to each person. I suppose we should be grateful that some disgruntled individual doesn't take it down from the flagpole and burn it. We should respect their right to express what feelings are in their heart.

[Typical Lax Dad]

He had the conviction but why did someone need to talk him into it? That implies he wasn't sure. If I was that deeply concerned about a situation I wouldn't need any persuading from anyone. I will always disagree with his methodology and I will always give him credit for doing something he believed in. I suppose he is grateful enough to live in a country where he is free to make that symbolic statement. Had he been say a Chinese citizen living in China and made that same symbolic gesture at a public event I bet he might never have been seen or heard from again.

I guess you didn't read the article as usual. Kaepernick was already sitting for the anthem in the preseason. The Green Beret player convinced him after a couple of games to kneel instead of sitting. Quote: "He initially advised Kaepernick to take a knee instead of sitting down during the anthem as a sign of respect."

Funny how kids kneeling down is a sign of respect during an injury.

And, you know, people - in my opinions and in my experience, kneeling's never been in our history really seen as a disrespectful act. I mean, people kneel when they get knighted. You kneel to propose to your wife, and you take a knee to pray. And soldiers often take a knee in front of a fallen brother's grave to pay respects. So I thought, if anything, besides standing, that was the most respectful. But, of course, that's just my opinion. - Nate Boyer

Well maybe when everyone else is standing with their hands over their heart and some singing the words the intent becomes rather discombobulated as to the meaning. I always recall the public address announcers asking everyone to please stand for the playing of our national anthem. They even are polite enough to say please. If you choose to honor that request that is up to each person. I suppose we should be grateful that some disgruntled individual doesn't take it down from the flagpole and burn it. We should respect their right to express what feelings are in their heart.

All that patriotism at NFL games is bought and paid for to appeal to gullible people like you.

https://archive.thinkprogress.org/nfl-d ... 82cebc7cd/

[cradleandshoot]

He had the conviction but why did someone need to talk him into it? That implies he wasn't sure. If I was that deeply concerned about a situation I wouldn't need any persuading from anyone. I will always disagree with his methodology and I will always give him credit for doing something he believed in. I suppose he is grateful enough to live in a country where he is free to make that symbolic statement. Had he been say a Chinese citizen living in China and made that same symbolic gesture at a public event I bet he might never have been seen or heard from again.

I guess you didn't read the article as usual. Kaepernick was already sitting for the anthem in the preseason. The Green Beret player convinced him after a couple of games to kneel instead of sitting. Quote: "He initially advised Kaepernick to take a knee instead of sitting down during the anthem as a sign of respect."

Funny how kids kneeling down is a sign of respect during an injury.

And, you know, people - in my opinions and in my experience, kneeling's never been in our history really seen as a disrespectful act. I mean, people kneel when they get knighted. You kneel to propose to your wife, and you take a knee to pray. And soldiers often take a knee in front of a fallen brother's grave to pay respects. So I thought, if anything, besides standing, that was the most respectful. But, of course, that's just my opinion. - Nate Boyer

Well maybe when everyone else is standing with their hands over their heart and some singing the words the intent becomes rather discombobulated as to the meaning. I always recall the public address announcers asking everyone to please stand for the playing of our national anthem. They even are polite enough to say please. If you choose to honor that request that is up to each person. I suppose we should be grateful that some disgruntled individual doesn't take it down from the flagpole and burn it. We should respect their right to express what feelings are in their heart.

All that patriotism at NFL games is bought and paid for to appeal to gullible people like you.

https://archive.thinkprogress.org/nfl-d ... 82cebc7cd/

You sound stupid.

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/veri ... 6606547da7

https://malaysia.news.yahoo.com/nfl-ret ... --nfl.html

[youthathletics]

https://vinnews.com/2024/07/30/israel-e ... -children/

[cradleandshoot]

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/veri ... 6606547da7

https://malaysia.news.yahoo.com/nfl-ret ... --nfl.html

So will the NFL turn its back on Pat Tillman? He could have stayed home and played football and made a comfortable living. Those bastards sent him home to Dover with an American Flag draped on his coffin. One thing about patriotism it's a great recruiting tool. Pat Tillman gave his life so CK had the freedom to make his gesture. I wonder if CK ever once thought about that sacrifice?

[Typical Lax Dad]

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/veri ... 6606547da7

https://malaysia.news.yahoo.com/nfl-ret ... --nfl.html

So will the NFL turn its back on Pat Tillman? He could have stayed home and played football and made a comfortable living. Those bastards sent him home to Dover with an American Flag draped on his coffin. One thing about patriotism it's a great recruiting tool. Pat Tillman gave his life so CK had the freedom to make his gesture. I wonder if CK ever once thought about that sacrifice?

We are one of the few countries that sing the national anthem before a domestic sporting event. It doesn’t seem stupid. It is stupid.

[Kismet]

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/veri ... 6606547da7

https://malaysia.news.yahoo.com/nfl-ret ... --nfl.html

So will the NFL turn its back on Pat Tillman? He could have stayed home and played football and made a comfortable living. Those bastards sent him home to Dover with an American Flag draped on his coffin. One thing about patriotism it's a great recruiting tool. Pat Tillman gave his life so CK had the freedom to make his gesture. I wonder if CK ever once thought about that sacrifice?

We are one of the few countries that sing the national anthem before a domestic sporting event. It doesn’t seem stupid. It is stupid.

Also the country that advocated the use of the Bellamy Salute to accompany the Pledge of Allegiance in 1892 until 1940.
That is until Hitler made it unfashionable in the 1930s..

[a fan]

https://www.wusa9.com/article/news/veri ... 6606547da7

https://malaysia.news.yahoo.com/nfl-ret ... --nfl.html

So will the NFL turn its back on Pat Tillman? He could have stayed home and played football and made a comfortable living. Those bastards sent him home to Dover with an American Flag draped on his coffin. One thing about patriotism it's a great recruiting tool. Pat Tillman gave his life so CK had the freedom to make his gesture. I wonder if CK ever once thought about that sacrifice?

We are one of the few countries that sing the national anthem before a domestic sporting event. It doesn’t seem stupid. It is stupid.

Also the country that advocated the use of the Bellamy Salute to accompany the Pledge of Allegiance in 1892.
That is until Hitler made it unfashionable in the 1930s..

The best part? Ask the average American Conservative what they think of the Federal Government. When they get done with the swearing and telling us how horrible it is, ask them why they think we should MANDATE the celebration of the flag the is the literal representation of the Federal Government. Or a song dedicated to the Federal Government.

It makes ZERO sense.

What WOULD make sense? Is if they made up a State song for Texas, and play THAT during TX football games. Same for OK, MT, GA, etc.

What they have done is made the Stars and Stripes the symbol of our American Military. Nope. We've got flags and symbols for every branch of our armed forces. The Flag is about the Federal Government. the UNITED states.


That said I LOVE standing for the anthem. And wouldn't give a second thought to someone sitting or kneeling.

Newsflash to Americans: the ENTIRE point of the anthem is that we're FREE to stand, sit, whatever, when it's on. This isn't commie Russia. Please stop acting like it is.

[old salt]

The best part? Ask the average American Conservative what they think of the Federal Government. When they get done with the swearing and telling us how horrible it is, ask them why they think we should MANDATE the celebration of the flag the is the literal representation of the Federal Government. Or a song dedicated to the Federal Government.

It makes ZERO sense.

What WOULD make sense? Is if they made up a State song for Texas, and play THAT during TX football games. Same for OK, MT, GA, etc.

What they have done is made the Stars and Stripes the symbol of our American Military. Nope. We've got flags and symbols for every branch of our armed forces. The Flag is about the Federal Government. the UNITED states.


That said I LOVE standing for the anthem. And wouldn't give a second thought to someone sitting or kneeling.

Newsflash to Americans: the ENTIRE point of the anthem is that we're FREE to stand, sit, whatever, when it's on. This isn't commie Russia. Please stop acting like it is.

For you -- it has to be ALL or NOTHING. That's why you will never understand.
You can love your country & appreciate the Federal govt, even be a part of it, & still understand when it is best limited & when it is better to defer to state & local govt, or the private sector. Limited Fed govt does not mean NO Fed govt.
There is no MANDATE to do anything regarding the flag.

[a fan]

For you -- it has to be ALL or NOTHING. That's why you will never understand.

That's your half-*ssed response to anything I write.

You can love your country & appreciate the Federal govt, even be a part of it, & still understand when it is best limited & when it is better to defer to state & local govt, or the private sector. Limited Fed govt does not mean NO Fed govt.

Never said it did. Pay attention.

Ask the Average conservative RIGHT NOW what they think about the Federal Government. You're moving the goalposts to some projection of what America CAN be. Not what it is.

Ask them about what it is now. Right now.

And again, when they stop swearing? There's my simple point: they do not like the Federal Government. And that is PRECISELY what the flag represents. Directly. Literally. Not my fault that others give their own reason as to what they think American Flag is.

There is no MANDATE to do anything regarding the flag.

Tell that to Colin K. And to your own political party who wants to mandate the Pledge of A.

If what you say here is true? No one would have so much as noticed Colin, or anyone else kneeling, protesting the American Federal Government's actions.

The same Federal Government you and your fellow R voters CLAIM to despise. You just don't like that I'm right about this. It's why your crew despised the BLM, who dared to tell America that the Government (run by Dems, not less) wasn't working for them. Instead of rallying to support them...what did you do?

Says it all, if you ask me.

[cradleandshoot]

For you -- it has to be ALL or NOTHING. That's why you will never understand.

That's your half-*ssed response to anything I write.

You can love your country & appreciate the Federal govt, even be a part of it, & still understand when it is best limited & when it is better to defer to state & local govt, or the private sector. Limited Fed govt does not mean NO Fed govt.

Never said it did. Pay attention.

Ask the Average conservative RIGHT NOW what they think about the Federal Government. You're moving the goalposts to some projection of what America CAN be. Not what it is.

Ask them about what it is now. Right now.

And again, when they stop swearing? There's my simple point: they do not like the Federal Government. And that is PRECISELY what the flag represents. Directly. Literally. Not my fault that others give their own reason as to what they think American Flag is.

There is no MANDATE to do anything regarding the flag.

Tell that to Colin K. And to your own political party who wants to mandate the Pledge of A.

If what you say here is true? No one would have so much as noticed Colin, or anyone else kneeling, protesting the American Federal Government's actions.

The same Federal Government you and your fellow R voters CLAIM to despise. You just don't like that I'm right about this. It's why your crew despised the BLM, who dared to tell America that the Government (run by Dems, not less) wasn't working for them. Instead of rallying to support them...what did you do?

Says it all, if you ask me.

# 1 I don't have a political party
#2 I don't hate our government as much as I don't trust our government.
I would support BLM if their mission statement wasn't so narrow. The Holocaust of black on black violence that plays out every day in Urban American cities just doesn't seem to find it's way to the BLM movement to any large degree. If black lives matter shouldn't all black lives matter especially if your black? Does it bother you that upper management at BLM made a lot of Is it not a fair question to say that a few privileged members profited rather handsomely? It doesn't matter what the cause but once enters the equation everything changes. Greed tends to do that to people.

[a fan]

# 1 I don't have a political party
#2 I don't hate our government as much as I don't trust our government.

I would support BLM if their mission statement wasn't so narrow. The Holocaust of black on black violence that plays out every day in Urban American cities just doesn't seem to find it's way to the BLM movement to any large degree.

Most of the folks who started BLM are lifelong community based advocates, and HAVE been working on this.

I've said this before: have you yelled at the American Cancer Society for not doing anything about American hunger? No, right? Because the American Cancer Society is about one thing.

Same for BLM. There's nothing weird about working on a single issue.

If black lives matter shouldn't all black lives matter especially if your black?

No. Because again, this is about ONE issue. Just like a whole mess of charities and NGO's. See above.

Does it bother you that upper management at BLM made a lot of Is it not a fair question to say that a few privileged members profited rather handsomely? It doesn't matter what the cause but once enters the equation everything changes. Greed tends to do that to people.

Not even a little on the making money. Plenty of NGO's make bank at management level. We donate bottles and private tours to over 50 different charities every years. We vet as much as we can with the time we have. Corruption happens. When it does, we stop donations. Dropped a Veterans charity over it. So yes, corruption bothers me. Doesn't mean I don't support a mission or goal.

It's a simple and fair point that no one here wants to answer: BLM tried to tell folks their government isn't working for them. Same exact message as MAGA. Why didn't the folks who feel the government isn't working for them say "welcome to the team, what can we do to help"?

[old salt]

For you -- it has to be ALL or NOTHING. That's why you will never understand.

That's your half-*ssed response to anything I write.

You can love your country & appreciate the Federal govt, even be a part of it, & still understand when it is best limited & when it is better to defer to state & local govt, or the private sector. Limited Fed govt does not mean NO Fed govt.

Never said it did. Pay attention.

Ask the Average conservative RIGHT NOW what they think about the Federal Government. You're moving the goalposts to some projection of what America CAN be. Not what it is.

Ask them about what it is now. Right now.

And again, when they stop swearing? There's my simple point: they do not like the Federal Government. And that is PRECISELY what the flag represents. Directly. Literally. Not my fault that others give their own reason as to what they think American Flag is.

There is no MANDATE to do anything regarding the flag.

Tell that to Colin K. And to your own political party who wants to mandate the Pledge of A.

If what you say here is true? No one would have so much as noticed Colin, or anyone else kneeling, protesting the American Federal Government's actions.

The same Federal Government you and your fellow R voters CLAIM to despise. You just don't like that I'm right about this. It's why your crew despised the BLM, who dared to tell America that the Government (run by Dems, not less) wasn't working for them. Instead of rallying to support them...what did you do?

Says it all, if you ask me.

All or Nothing again. No nuance. Maybe Kapernick was washed up, not worth the salary & definitely not worth the dissension he brought on himself. If he could have helped a team, somebody would have signed him.

Does the GOP platform Mandate the Pledge of Allegiance or standing for the NationaL Anthem ?