Accepting a pardon is an admission of guilt.DocBarrister wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 6:06 pmTrump doesn’t even express any remorse. Why should he receive a pardon?a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:54 pmI'm very confident my fellow Americans knew EXACTLY what they were voting for in Trump. I don't think this would have changed one vote.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:50 pmThat might be the smart political play, do it now instead of waiting. I do think it will ultimately happen.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:46 pmI will add: the best possible thing Biden could do is pardon him immediately. This isn't direct and dangerous election interference like GA. This was an utterly pointless cover up that served zero purpose, imho.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:22 pmYup, I agree with you. The crazy part is that until he is actually sentenced, this doesn't hurt his chances for election in November. I don't think today's ruling was surprising.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:17 pmYou tell me. I'm not a Republican. Can't speak for them.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:15 pmDid many voters think he wasn't going to get convicted? Certainly sounds like Trump accepted the fact as the trail wore on.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:12 pmWell, this just made America a whole lot more complicated.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:11 pm Verdict is in. Guilty apparently. Sounds like the Judge will confine Trump to House Arrest, not sure he is seeing the inside of prison cell.
Joe
What will Republican leaders and their voters do?
Joe
The Foxnews.com picture and headshot next to large font "Guilty" feels like a shot across Trump's bow.... will R's put up a felon as their leader?
Or will they play the "let's wait two years for an appeal, this doesn't count" card on 57 separate counts?
I have no clue.
Joe
Pardon him. Let the Republican voters decide if they want to nominate a convicted felon as their leader, and the leader of our country.
I disagree that it didn't matter, though. The election was won by an incredibly slim margin in a couple of states, so it's entirely possible that this story would have have swamped the attention even in the face of the Comey mouthing off, and moved the needle just enough to have avoided this nightmare altogether.
But it's very past tense.
My opinion, of course. And even if it would? Dispel the idea of the Federal "banana republic" when it comes to what are in my opinion, petty matters like this one. He didn't hurt anyone, or stiff a charity. Pardon him, and lets move on. Take the higher road.....
Pardoning him would also violate a foundational pillar of American democracy: NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW.
DocBarrister
Orange Duce
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Re: Orange Duce
"There is nothing more difficult and more dangerous to carry through than initiating changes. One makes enemies of those who prospered under the old order, and only lukewarm support from those who would prosper under the new."
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Re: Orange Duce
Strictly speaking, it isn’t.PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 6:46 pmAccepting a pardon is an admission of guilt.DocBarrister wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 6:06 pmTrump doesn’t even express any remorse. Why should he receive a pardon?a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:54 pmI'm very confident my fellow Americans knew EXACTLY what they were voting for in Trump. I don't think this would have changed one vote.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:50 pmThat might be the smart political play, do it now instead of waiting. I do think it will ultimately happen.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:46 pmI will add: the best possible thing Biden could do is pardon him immediately. This isn't direct and dangerous election interference like GA. This was an utterly pointless cover up that served zero purpose, imho.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:22 pmYup, I agree with you. The crazy part is that until he is actually sentenced, this doesn't hurt his chances for election in November. I don't think today's ruling was surprising.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:17 pmYou tell me. I'm not a Republican. Can't speak for them.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:15 pmDid many voters think he wasn't going to get convicted? Certainly sounds like Trump accepted the fact as the trail wore on.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:12 pmWell, this just made America a whole lot more complicated.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:11 pm Verdict is in. Guilty apparently. Sounds like the Judge will confine Trump to House Arrest, not sure he is seeing the inside of prison cell.
Joe
What will Republican leaders and their voters do?
Joe
The Foxnews.com picture and headshot next to large font "Guilty" feels like a shot across Trump's bow.... will R's put up a felon as their leader?
Or will they play the "let's wait two years for an appeal, this doesn't count" card on 57 separate counts?
I have no clue.
Joe
Pardon him. Let the Republican voters decide if they want to nominate a convicted felon as their leader, and the leader of our country.
I disagree that it didn't matter, though. The election was won by an incredibly slim margin in a couple of states, so it's entirely possible that this story would have have swamped the attention even in the face of the Comey mouthing off, and moved the needle just enough to have avoided this nightmare altogether.
But it's very past tense.
My opinion, of course. And even if it would? Dispel the idea of the Federal "banana republic" when it comes to what are in my opinion, petty matters like this one. He didn't hurt anyone, or stiff a charity. Pardon him, and lets move on. Take the higher road.....
Pardoning him would also violate a foundational pillar of American democracy: NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW.
DocBarrister
Plenty of folks pardoned who have maintained their innocence.
DocBarrister
@DocBarrister
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Re: Orange Duce
That was not an unreasonable prediction … not in our times.
Twelve jurors did their duty. Much gratitude to them.
DocBarrister
@DocBarrister
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Re: Orange Duce
Good point. The "moral exception"...DocBarrister wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 6:48 pmStrictly speaking, it isn’t.PizzaSnake wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 6:46 pmAccepting a pardon is an admission of guilt.DocBarrister wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 6:06 pmTrump doesn’t even express any remorse. Why should he receive a pardon?a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:54 pmI'm very confident my fellow Americans knew EXACTLY what they were voting for in Trump. I don't think this would have changed one vote.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:50 pmThat might be the smart political play, do it now instead of waiting. I do think it will ultimately happen.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:46 pmI will add: the best possible thing Biden could do is pardon him immediately. This isn't direct and dangerous election interference like GA. This was an utterly pointless cover up that served zero purpose, imho.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:22 pmYup, I agree with you. The crazy part is that until he is actually sentenced, this doesn't hurt his chances for election in November. I don't think today's ruling was surprising.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:17 pmYou tell me. I'm not a Republican. Can't speak for them.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:15 pmDid many voters think he wasn't going to get convicted? Certainly sounds like Trump accepted the fact as the trail wore on.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:12 pmWell, this just made America a whole lot more complicated.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:11 pm Verdict is in. Guilty apparently. Sounds like the Judge will confine Trump to House Arrest, not sure he is seeing the inside of prison cell.
Joe
What will Republican leaders and their voters do?
Joe
The Foxnews.com picture and headshot next to large font "Guilty" feels like a shot across Trump's bow.... will R's put up a felon as their leader?
Or will they play the "let's wait two years for an appeal, this doesn't count" card on 57 separate counts?
I have no clue.
Joe
Pardon him. Let the Republican voters decide if they want to nominate a convicted felon as their leader, and the leader of our country.
I disagree that it didn't matter, though. The election was won by an incredibly slim margin in a couple of states, so it's entirely possible that this story would have have swamped the attention even in the face of the Comey mouthing off, and moved the needle just enough to have avoided this nightmare altogether.
But it's very past tense.
My opinion, of course. And even if it would? Dispel the idea of the Federal "banana republic" when it comes to what are in my opinion, petty matters like this one. He didn't hurt anyone, or stiff a charity. Pardon him, and lets move on. Take the higher road.....
Pardoning him would also violate a foundational pillar of American democracy: NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW.
DocBarrister
Plenty of folks pardoned who have maintained their innocence.
DocBarrister
"3. Another function of a pardon has historically been protecting people who were seen as legally guilty but morally innocent. Returning to Story,
Besides; the law may be broken, and yet the offender be placed in such circumstances, that he will stand, in a great measure, and perhaps wholly, excused in moral and general justice, though not in the strictness of the law. What then is to be done? Is he to be acquitted against the law; or convicted, and to suffer punishment infinitely beyond his deserts?
Conviction followed by a pardon, Story argues, is a means of making sure the law is followed, but that "moral and general justice" is nonetheless served."
https://reason.com/volokh/2021/09/24/ac ... mit-guilt/
"There is nothing more difficult and more dangerous to carry through than initiating changes. One makes enemies of those who prospered under the old order, and only lukewarm support from those who would prosper under the new."
Re: Orange Duce
Moral and Trump don't belong in the same sentence.
Re: Orange Duce
I've been telling you all that Orange Cheato is a criminal. Well, now I'm apparently correct.
Re: Orange Duce
Biden is not governor of NY.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:47 pmI'm not so sure he'll be confined to House Arrest while awaiting appeal, which is undoubtedly coming. I think Judge will probably have him released on his own recognizance, maybe under Secret Service supervision? maybe with ankle bracelet, surrender of passport?JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:11 pm Verdict is in. Guilty apparently. Sounds like the Judge will confine Trump to House Arrest, not sure he is seeing the inside of prison cell.
Joe
I also think that if Biden wins, he'll pardon Trump on this one, 'for the good of healing the country'.
Maybe not on the other cases, let them play out.
STAND AGAINST FASCISM
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Re: Orange Duce
"Sen. J.D. Vance (R-Ohio) told Fox News on Thursday there should be inquiries about Trump’s case. “We need to be subpoenaing Judge Merchan and his daughter … Did George Soros ever talk to Alvin Bragg about using his power to go after Donald Trump?"
Senator Mike Lee: "I don’t respect this verdict."
Gun-toter Kyle Rittenhouse: "Today is a miscarriage of justice. Donald Trump should NOT of been found guilty."
Senator Mike Braun: "This case was a blatant abuse of our justice system as a political weapon by a radical prosecutor trying to interfere in the election, and the verdict proves that this was just a show trial all along."
Pretend lawyer Alina Habba: "Atrocity."
All the hits, all the deep analysis.
Senator Mike Lee: "I don’t respect this verdict."
Gun-toter Kyle Rittenhouse: "Today is a miscarriage of justice. Donald Trump should NOT of been found guilty."
Senator Mike Braun: "This case was a blatant abuse of our justice system as a political weapon by a radical prosecutor trying to interfere in the election, and the verdict proves that this was just a show trial all along."
Pretend lawyer Alina Habba: "Atrocity."
All the hits, all the deep analysis.
Re: Orange Duce
Guilty!!!
It has been proven a hundred times that the surest way to the heart of any man, black or white, honest or dishonest, is through justice and fairness.
Charles Francis "Socker" Coe, Esq
Charles Francis "Socker" Coe, Esq
- MDlaxfan76
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- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm
Re: Orange Duce
We basically agree, except for whether it’s an important crime and that it may have had an impact. I concede, of course, that it might not have. But an important crime, not petty except in comparison to even more egregious crimes .a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:54 pmI'm very confident my fellow Americans knew EXACTLY what they were voting for in Trump. I don't think this would have changed one vote.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:50 pmThat might be the smart political play, do it now instead of waiting. I do think it will ultimately happen.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:46 pmI will add: the best possible thing Biden could do is pardon him immediately. This isn't direct and dangerous election interference like GA. This was an utterly pointless cover up that served zero purpose, imho.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:22 pmYup, I agree with you. The crazy part is that until he is actually sentenced, this doesn't hurt his chances for election in November. I don't think today's ruling was surprising.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:17 pmYou tell me. I'm not a Republican. Can't speak for them.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:15 pmDid many voters think he wasn't going to get convicted? Certainly sounds like Trump accepted the fact as the trail wore on.a fan wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:12 pmWell, this just made America a whole lot more complicated.JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:11 pm Verdict is in. Guilty apparently. Sounds like the Judge will confine Trump to House Arrest, not sure he is seeing the inside of prison cell.
Joe
What will Republican leaders and their voters do?
Joe
The Foxnews.com picture and headshot next to large font "Guilty" feels like a shot across Trump's bow.... will R's put up a felon as their leader?
Or will they play the "let's wait two years for an appeal, this doesn't count" card on 57 separate counts?
I have no clue.
Joe
Pardon him. Let the Republican voters decide if they want to nominate a convicted felon as their leader, and the leader of our country.
I disagree that it didn't matter, though. The election was won by an incredibly slim margin in a couple of states, so it's entirely possible that this story would have have swamped the attention even in the face of the Comey mouthing off, and moved the needle just enough to have avoided this nightmare altogether.
But it's very past tense.
My opinion, of course. And even if it would? Dispel the idea of the Federal "banana republic" when it comes to what are in my opinion, petty matters like this one. He didn't hurt anyone, or stiff a charity. Pardon him, and lets move on. Take the higher road.....
But yes, pardon makes sense.
- MDlaxfan76
- Posts: 27118
- Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2018 5:40 pm
Re: Orange Duce
Ahh, you are 100% correct. He does not have such power in this case.jhu72 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:05 pmBiden is not governor of NY.MDlaxfan76 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:47 pmI'm not so sure he'll be confined to House Arrest while awaiting appeal, which is undoubtedly coming. I think Judge will probably have him released on his own recognizance, maybe under Secret Service supervision? maybe with ankle bracelet, surrender of passport?JoeMauer89 wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 5:11 pm Verdict is in. Guilty apparently. Sounds like the Judge will confine Trump to House Arrest, not sure he is seeing the inside of prison cell.
Joe
I also think that if Biden wins, he'll pardon Trump on this one, 'for the good of healing the country'.
Maybe not on the other cases, let them play out.
A fan and I have been exercising in mental masturbation, interruptus.
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Re: Orange Duce
Kyle Rittenhouse has found there is good money in right wing politics.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:19 pm "Sen. J.D. Vance (R-Ohio) told Fox News on Thursday there should be inquiries about Trump’s case. “We need to be subpoenaing Judge Merchan and his daughter … Did George Soros ever talk to Alvin Bragg about using his power to go after Donald Trump?"
Senator Mike Lee: "I don’t respect this verdict."
Gun-toter Kyle Rittenhouse: "Today is a miscarriage of justice. Donald Trump should NOT of been found guilty."
Senator Mike Braun: "This case was a blatant abuse of our justice system as a political weapon by a radical prosecutor trying to interfere in the election, and the verdict proves that this was just a show trial all along."
Pretend lawyer Alina Habba: "Atrocity."
All the hits, all the deep analysis.
“I wish you would!”
- youthathletics
- Posts: 15886
- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:36 pm
Re: Orange Duce
What was different in the Jon Edwards case vs Trumps?
A fraudulent intent, however carefully concealed at the outset, will generally, in the end, betray itself.
~Livy
“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
~Livy
“There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn’t true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.” -Soren Kierkegaard
Re: Orange Duce
A lot. Different facts. Different charges. Different venue. Different attorneys on both sides. Different defendant.
Re: Orange Duce
Once Donald Dump is in prison that's when we,
Make America GREAT Again!
Make America GREAT Again!
It has been proven a hundred times that the surest way to the heart of any man, black or white, honest or dishonest, is through justice and fairness.
Charles Francis "Socker" Coe, Esq
Charles Francis "Socker" Coe, Esq
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Re: Orange Duce
And in murdering people in the streets.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:59 pmKyle Rittenhouse has found there is good money in right wing politics.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:19 pm "Sen. J.D. Vance (R-Ohio) told Fox News on Thursday there should be inquiries about Trump’s case. “We need to be subpoenaing Judge Merchan and his daughter … Did George Soros ever talk to Alvin Bragg about using his power to go after Donald Trump?"
Senator Mike Lee: "I don’t respect this verdict."
Gun-toter Kyle Rittenhouse: "Today is a miscarriage of justice. Donald Trump should NOT of been found guilty."
Senator Mike Braun: "This case was a blatant abuse of our justice system as a political weapon by a radical prosecutor trying to interfere in the election, and the verdict proves that this was just a show trial all along."
Pretend lawyer Alina Habba: "Atrocity."
All the hits, all the deep analysis.
DocBarrister
@DocBarrister
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- Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:10 pm
Re: Orange Duce
Yep. Law and order party.DocBarrister wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 10:55 pmAnd in murdering people in the streets.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:59 pmKyle Rittenhouse has found there is good money in right wing politics.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:19 pm "Sen. J.D. Vance (R-Ohio) told Fox News on Thursday there should be inquiries about Trump’s case. “We need to be subpoenaing Judge Merchan and his daughter … Did George Soros ever talk to Alvin Bragg about using his power to go after Donald Trump?"
Senator Mike Lee: "I don’t respect this verdict."
Gun-toter Kyle Rittenhouse: "Today is a miscarriage of justice. Donald Trump should NOT of been found guilty."
Senator Mike Braun: "This case was a blatant abuse of our justice system as a political weapon by a radical prosecutor trying to interfere in the election, and the verdict proves that this was just a show trial all along."
Pretend lawyer Alina Habba: "Atrocity."
All the hits, all the deep analysis.
DocBarrister
“I wish you would!”
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- Joined: Tue Mar 05, 2019 8:36 pm
Re: Orange Duce
Like dRumpf's "rappinghoods?"DocBarrister wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 10:55 pmAnd in murdering people in the streets.Typical Lax Dad wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:59 pmKyle Rittenhouse has found there is good money in right wing politics.Seacoaster(1) wrote: ↑Thu May 30, 2024 9:19 pm "Sen. J.D. Vance (R-Ohio) told Fox News on Thursday there should be inquiries about Trump’s case. “We need to be subpoenaing Judge Merchan and his daughter … Did George Soros ever talk to Alvin Bragg about using his power to go after Donald Trump?"
Senator Mike Lee: "I don’t respect this verdict."
Gun-toter Kyle Rittenhouse: "Today is a miscarriage of justice. Donald Trump should NOT of been found guilty."
Senator Mike Braun: "This case was a blatant abuse of our justice system as a political weapon by a radical prosecutor trying to interfere in the election, and the verdict proves that this was just a show trial all along."
Pretend lawyer Alina Habba: "Atrocity."
All the hits, all the deep analysis.
DocBarrister
"There is nothing more difficult and more dangerous to carry through than initiating changes. One makes enemies of those who prospered under the old order, and only lukewarm support from those who would prosper under the new."
Re: Orange Duce
Wasn't this the "weakest" of the pending cases against 2xIMPOTUS o d?
Will the sentencing determination take into account his gag order violations; and anything he says against the Judge and Court up until July 11th?
Will the sentencing determination take into account his gag order violations; and anything he says against the Judge and Court up until July 11th?