All Americans 2024

[wgdsr]

At the end of the day USILA list is the one that matters anyway.

Why?

Submitted by college coaches and goes to a committee. Not a bunch of guys who have never played college lacrosse.

USILA also gives out the Enners, Schmeisser, etc. it’s the “official” list

Do you think USILA is above the politics and connections that every other organization in the world is subject to?

No. But I value their opinions more than IL, who takes voting input from random lacrosse twitter accounts and people who have never played college lacrosse, let alone D1. It’s also not like this is just me.. it’s been the list people point to for AA for as long as I remember.

USILA political like all the rest.

'political', sure, but not motivated to drive clicks with controversy. They have institutional motivations, not profit.

USILA is the official All-American list, anything else is media clickbait.
Doesn't mean media opinions aren't interesting to discuss and argue about, but it's not institutional.

I put Tewey in the institutional class, as that's become a continuous annual award recognized as such. Like the Heisman, however, it's distinct from AA status.

you can say the same about attackmen of the year, that has become he deserves something after 4 years award.

que? the turnbull?

Ha... I wouldn't have said it that way, but they have a point.

As the Tewaaraton has become increasingly attackmen-focused, its winners have diverged from Turnbull.

Some definitional differences, but Turnbull has recently been given to guys who had incredible careers, but were "just below" whoever won the Tewaaraton -- whether due to team performance (Brandau this year, Chris Gray multiple times) or just a slightly less noteworthy season (Ament vs. Spencer, Rice vs. Thompson).

cj kirst won it just last year. even throwing out the post-covid years for gray, where he had two 4 "fourth" years, spencer won it as a junior. so did fields. and thompson won it twice before his senior year. so did pannell. since the turn of the century, it's gone to an underclassman more often than not also.

the tewaaraton is both announced and voted on after the turnbull, i believe.

Gray great player but Nichturn had better year in 2022

nichturn was awesome, types of things that sports debates were made for.
but it's not been a lifetime achievement award.

Shall we settle on the "second best attackman" award?

considering the enners award is on a 12 year run of attackmen, often a different player, and voted by the same people at the same time... i can agree with that.

[Hooz123]

IL does not unilaterally decide anything. It's voted on by the media the same way the weekly polls are.

They also voted based on the regular season. So Brandau's inclusion is more than defensible. O'Neill is the clear outlier.

I would have had Shelly in over Kirst and either Malone or Kavanagh in over O'Neill but...is it really that big of a deal? Shelly and Kirst had the exact same number of points per game, except Kirst got the bulk of his in goals, while Shelly's were in assists, and Kirst's shooting percentage was a bit better. It's not crazy to argue he had the better regular season even if I would rather have Shelly on my team if I could pick.

And you can say a lot about the lax media but one thing you can't accuse them of being is biased against Pat Kavanagh. That guy gets more positive coverage than any player in the country. He's all over social media constantly and has his own personal publicist named Paul Carcaterra. If he didn't make first team it's probably because people who watch lacrosse for a living don't think he's one of the three best attackmen.

Krist and Shelly had the same number of points. Shelly's team is in playing for memorial day and one team didn't make the tournament. Case closed.

[Farfromgeneva]

Proving once again that charity cases exist at all colleges.

[coda]

IL does not unilaterally decide anything. It's voted on by the media the same way the weekly polls are.

They also voted based on the regular season. So Brandau's inclusion is more than defensible. O'Neill is the clear outlier.

I would have had Shelly in over Kirst and either Malone or Kavanagh in over O'Neill but...is it really that big of a deal? Shelly and Kirst had the exact same number of points per game, except Kirst got the bulk of his in goals, while Shelly's were in assists, and Kirst's shooting percentage was a bit better. It's not crazy to argue he had the better regular season even if I would rather have Shelly on my team if I could pick.

And you can say a lot about the lax media but one thing you can't accuse them of being is biased against Pat Kavanagh. That guy gets more positive coverage than any player in the country. He's all over social media constantly and has his own personal publicist named Paul Carcaterra. If he didn't make first team it's probably because people who watch lacrosse for a living don't think he's one of the three best attackmen.

Krist and Shelly had the same number of points. Shelly's team is in playing for memorial day and one team didn't make the tournament. Case closed.

I love Shelly's game, but Kirst had a better season

Pts/Game: Kirst 4.8/Shelly 4.8
GBs/game: Kirst 2.5/Shelly 1.25
Turnovers per game: Kirst 0.93/Shelly 2.25
CT/game: Kirst 1.14/Shelly .38
Shooting %: Kirst .33/Shelly .30

not sure the reason, but Shellenberger had a massive jump in turnovers this year. 21-22 in his first 3 years and that jumped to 36 this year

[Hooz123]

IL does not unilaterally decide anything. It's voted on by the media the same way the weekly polls are.

They also voted based on the regular season. So Brandau's inclusion is more than defensible. O'Neill is the clear outlier.

I would have had Shelly in over Kirst and either Malone or Kavanagh in over O'Neill but...is it really that big of a deal? Shelly and Kirst had the exact same number of points per game, except Kirst got the bulk of his in goals, while Shelly's were in assists, and Kirst's shooting percentage was a bit better. It's not crazy to argue he had the better regular season even if I would rather have Shelly on my team if I could pick.

And you can say a lot about the lax media but one thing you can't accuse them of being is biased against Pat Kavanagh. That guy gets more positive coverage than any player in the country. He's all over social media constantly and has his own personal publicist named Paul Carcaterra. If he didn't make first team it's probably because people who watch lacrosse for a living don't think he's one of the three best attackmen.

Krist and Shelly had the same number of points. Shelly's team is in playing for memorial day and one team didn't make the tournament. Case closed.

I love Shelly's game, but Kirst had a better season

Pts/Game: Kirst 4.8/Shelly 4.8
GBs/game: Kirst 2.5/Shelly 1.25
Turnovers per game: Kirst 0.93/Shelly 2.25
CT/game: Kirst 1.14/Shelly .38
Shooting %: Kirst .33/Shelly .30

not sure the reason, but Shellenberger had a massive jump in turnovers this year. 21-22 in his first 3 years and that jumped to 36 this year

A lot of those turnovers were honestly due to Millon. I think McCabe is going to be a freaking stud, but he's careless some times. Frosh jitters.

[coda]

IL does not unilaterally decide anything. It's voted on by the media the same way the weekly polls are.

They also voted based on the regular season. So Brandau's inclusion is more than defensible. O'Neill is the clear outlier.

I would have had Shelly in over Kirst and either Malone or Kavanagh in over O'Neill but...is it really that big of a deal? Shelly and Kirst had the exact same number of points per game, except Kirst got the bulk of his in goals, while Shelly's were in assists, and Kirst's shooting percentage was a bit better. It's not crazy to argue he had the better regular season even if I would rather have Shelly on my team if I could pick.

And you can say a lot about the lax media but one thing you can't accuse them of being is biased against Pat Kavanagh. That guy gets more positive coverage than any player in the country. He's all over social media constantly and has his own personal publicist named Paul Carcaterra. If he didn't make first team it's probably because people who watch lacrosse for a living don't think he's one of the three best attackmen.

Krist and Shelly had the same number of points. Shelly's team is in playing for memorial day and one team didn't make the tournament. Case closed.

I love Shelly's game, but Kirst had a better season

Pts/Game: Kirst 4.8/Shelly 4.8
GBs/game: Kirst 2.5/Shelly 1.25
Turnovers per game: Kirst 0.93/Shelly 2.25
CT/game: Kirst 1.14/Shelly .38
Shooting %: Kirst .33/Shelly .30

not sure the reason, but Shellenberger had a massive jump in turnovers this year. 21-22 in his first 3 years and that jumped to 36 this year

A lot of those turnovers were honestly due to Millon. I think McCabe is going to be a freaking stud, but he's careless some times. Frosh jitters.

UVA offense better with Millon at coming out of the box.