2024

[MDlaxfan76]

McCarthy courtesy of Salty:

Enforcing the law is politically good for the criminal.

Angers his cult supporters, fundraising goes up.

Therefore, the President should stop the state prosecutors and state judge from enforcing the law?

That's the logic?

[old salt]

McCarthy is saying that the Judge should see what's going on & not allow it.
It's making a mockery of him & the NY judicial system. The strategy is clear.
Throw as much irrelevant mud on Trump as possible. Keep him from campaigning.
The Judge let Stormy accuse Trump of rape....she got in a promo for Old Spice.
Whatever it takes. Weaponize the Judicial system. The ends justify the means.

[CU88a]

McCarthy is saying that the Judge should see what's going on & not allow it.
It's making a mockery of him & the NY judicial system. The strategy is clear.
Throw as much irrelevant mud on Trump as possible. Keep him from campaigning.
The Judge let Stormy accuse Trump of rape....she got in a promo for Old Spice.
Whatever it takes. Weaponize the Judicial system. The ends justify the means.

Did I miss the sarcasm font?

[a fan]

McCarthy courtesy of Salty:

Enforcing the law is politically good for the criminal.

Angers his cult supporters, fundraising goes up.

Therefore, the President should stop the state prosecutors and state judge from enforcing the law?

That's the logic?

TrumpNation will never change this stance, no matter what any of us say. This is the new Republican party, like it or not. Get used to it, because it ain't going anywhere, and it will instead get worse and worse and worse. Trump is a symptom, and nothing more.

[old salt]

This is the current Democrat Party.
It gives new meaning to the term "show trial"
Whatever it takes. The ends justify the means.
Imagine if every Clinton bimbo eruption had been litigated in Court.

[ggait]

Yup.

Trump treated worse than any other US president.

Even worse than Lincoln!

[a fan]

This is the current Democrat Party.
It gives new meaning to the term "show trial"
Whatever it takes. The ends justify the means.
Imagine if every Clinton bimbo eruption had been litigated in Court.

They DID go after Bill Clinton for that stuff, OS. How do you not remember this? Everything from Whitewater, to affairs with interns, to stuff about Cattle Futures, to affairs with that Paula Jones weirdo, all investigated by special prosecutor Fiske.

And that was BEFORE Ken Starr showed up. Remember him, the Reagan appointee? Started with WhiteWater, and just went anywhere he could find dirt. And Justice Kavanaugh was in on that game, remember? Starr dug up all that old stuff, and added in Jones, TravelGate, Lewinsky, etc. etc.

You're going to bail from this conversation, because you've forgotten that Republicans did this to Bill Clinton YEARS ago, and when that happened, your fellow Republicans cheered it all on. Hillary made the same complaints you're making now. Republicans laughed at her complaint.

Bill could have avoided all that if he wasn't such a philandering POS.

[PizzaSnake]

McCarthy is saying that the Judge should see what's going on & not allow it.
It's making a mockery of him & the NY judicial system. The strategy is clear.
Throw as much irrelevant mud on Trump as possible. Keep him from campaigning.
The Judge let Stormy accuse Trump of rape....she got in a promo for Old Spice.
Whatever it takes. Weaponize the Judicial system. The ends justify the means.

So, which are you hammering? Seems to be the table…

“Hammer the Law, Hammer the Facts, Hammer the Table”

[njbill]

The judge need not send Trump to any of the jails in Manhattan such as Rikers. He could order him to be confined in the holding cells in the courthouse. He could, in the first instance, impose a jail sentence of, say, six hours. Hold Trump in a courthouse cell after court has finished for the day and release him at, say, 10 p.m. Give him a taste. Incremental steps. If that doesn't work, then next time hold him overnight at the courthouse. He goes in after court is done for the day and is released the next morning in time for court. No interruption or delay in the proceedings. But: no cheeseburgers; no diet Cokes. Jailhouse gruel for Donnie. Trump will claim an 8th Amendment violation (cruel and unusual punishment) because he is such a wuss.

Remember. He is now a convicted criminal ten times over.

[old salt]

The Starr analogy is ridiculous. When Fiske's term as IC ended, Starr was appointed to fill the standing IC position by a 3 Judge panel. Clinton was President, Reno was AG. She asked for both Fiske & Starr. At that time, a standing IC was required by law.

First Fiske, then succeeded by Starr, were tasked to investigate Whitewater & the Foster suicide. Starr reported what he found. No charges resulted.

Starr was subsequently given irrefutable evidence, which he did not seek, of Clinton's witness tampering & attempt to suborn perjury with Lewinsky.

Clinton was not criminally charged nor tried in Court for any of that. Starr had the evidence dumped on him & the media already had the evidence.
Starr was assigned to investigate further by AG Reno. Clinton was impeached by the House but not convicted by the Senate.

Clinton was never prosecuted in Court for any of that. Starr did not go after Clinton for his "bimbo eruptions". He was inundated with evidence from private citizens, with extensive media coverage. Starr had to act on it, he was the serving Independent Counsel.

Kavanaugh's report on Foster's suicide did not implicate either Clinton or his Admin. It was a factual record.

The Whitewater investigation began because of criminal referrals by a RTC inveatigator who was investigating the failure of an Arkansas S&L.

The ClInton's trail followed them to DC. Carville didn't troll enough trailer parks with $100 bills.

[a fan]

The Starr analogy is ridiculous. When Fiske's term as IC ended, Starr was appointed to fill the standing IC position by a 3 Judge panel. Clinton was President, Reno was AG. She asked for both Fiske & Starr. At that time, a standing IC was required by law.

First Fiske, then succeeded by Starr, were tasked to investigate Whitewater & the Foster suicide. Starr reported what he found. No charges resulted.

Starr was subsequently given irrefutable evidence, which he did not seek, of Clinton's witness tampering & attempt to suborn perjury with Lewinsky.

Clinton was not criminally charged nor tried in Court for any of that. Starr had the evidence dumped on him & the media already had the evidence.
Starr was assigned to investigate further by AG Reno. Clinton was impeached by the House but not convicted by the Senate.

Clinton was never prosecuted in Court for any of that. Starr did not go after Clinton for his "bimbo eruptions". He was inundated with evidence from private citizens, with extensive media coverage. Starr had to act on it, he was the serving Independent Counsel.

Kavanaugh's report on Foster's suicide did not implicate either Clinton or his Admin. It was a factual record.

The Whitewater investigation began because of criminal referrals by a RTC inveatigator who was investigating the failure of an Arkansas S&L.

The ClInton's trail followed them to DC. Carville didn't troll enough trailer parks with $100 bills.

So to sum up, the "reason" Clinton is "different" is that Kavanaugh and Starr couldn't find any crimes to send Bill to court, and Trump needs to stop breaking laws.

Reno clearly was a "never-Clinton", and was the start of your Deep State. You've taught us that just because someone is in the same party as the perp, doesn't mean that the investigation isn't inherently corrupt. Reno should have left Bill alone instead of distracting Bill from doing the work voters elected Bill to do, just as you believe Comey should have left Trump alone.

My crazy idea is that everyone in America should have to follow its laws, and I'm perfectly fine with both Trump and Bill getting investigated for breaking them. You believe politicians should be allowed to do what they want without anyone getting in their way.

We disagree. And that's fine.

That said, you're forgetting that they let Trump get out of office before indicting him in NY and the other places. He's a civilian now.

[old salt]

^^^ You're arguing with yourself (as usual). I didn't think Clinton should have been prosecuted or impeached. Same with Trump.
They were investigated. Prosecutorial discretion applied.

Starr & Kavanaugh were assigned by Clinton's AG because of the IC Law, which no longer exists.

Trump is being prosecuted in State & Federal Courts. Clinton was not prosecuted in either.
That makes it the political weaponization of our Justice system(s).
Banana Republic stuff. This is a bad precedent. Trump would not be prosecuted if he were not running again.

[Seacoaster(1)]

Umm, OK:

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/05/08/us/r ... -loss.html

I"n 2010, Robert F. Kennedy Jr. was experiencing memory loss and mental fogginess so severe that a friend grew concerned he might have a brain tumor. Mr. Kennedy said he consulted several of the country’s top neurologists, many of whom had either treated or spoken to his uncle, Senator Edward M. Kennedy, before his death the previous year of brain cancer.

Several doctors noticed a dark spot on the younger Mr. Kennedy’s brain scans and concluded that he had a tumor, he said in a 2012 deposition reviewed by The New York Times. Mr. Kennedy was immediately scheduled for a procedure at Duke University Medical Center by the same surgeon who had operated on his uncle, he said.

While packing for the trip, he said, he received a call from a doctor at NewYork-Presbyterian Hospital who had a different opinion: Mr. Kennedy, he believed, had a dead parasite in his head.

The doctor believed that the abnormality seen on his scans “was caused by a worm that got into my brain and ate a portion of it and then died,” Mr. Kennedy said in the deposition.

Now an independent presidential candidate, the 70-year-old Mr. Kennedy has portrayed his athleticism and relative youth as an advantage over the two oldest people to ever seek the White House: President Biden, 81, and former President Donald J. Trump, 77. Mr. Kennedy has secured a place on the ballots in Utah, Michigan, Hawaii and, his campaign says, California and Delaware. His intensive efforts to gain access in more states could put him in a position to tip the election.

He has gone to lengths to appear hale, skiing with a professional snowboarder and with an Olympic gold medalist who called him a “ripper” as they raced down the mountain. A camera crew was at his side while he lifted weights, shirtless, at an outdoor gym in Venice Beach.

Still, over the years, he has faced serious health issues, some previously undisclosed, including the apparent parasite.

For decades, Mr. Kennedy suffered from atrial fibrillation, a common heartbeat abnormality that increases the risk of stroke or heart failure. He has been hospitalized at least four times for episodes, although in an interview with The Times this winter, he said he had not had an incident in more than a decade and believed the condition had disappeared.

About the same time he learned of the parasite, he said, he was also diagnosed with mercury poisoning, most likely from ingesting too much fish containing the dangerous heavy metal, which can cause serious neurological issues.

“I have cognitive problems, clearly,” he said in the 2012 deposition. “I have short-term memory loss, and I have longer-term memory loss that affects me.”

In the interview with The Times, he said he had recovered from the memory loss and fogginess and had no aftereffects from the parasite, which he said had not required treatment. Asked last week if any of Mr. Kennedy’s health issues could compromise his fitness for the presidency, Stefanie Spear, a spokeswoman for the Kennedy campaign, told The Times, “That is a hilarious suggestion, given the competition.”

The campaign declined to provide his medical records to The Times. Neither President Biden nor Mr. Trump has released medical records in this election cycle.

Doctors who have treated parasitic infections and mercury poisoning said both conditions can sometimes permanently damage brain function, but patients also can have temporary symptoms and mount a full recovery.

Some of Mr. Kennedy’s health issues were revealed in the 2012 deposition, which he gave during divorce proceedings from his second wife, Mary Richardson Kennedy. At the time, Mr. Kennedy was arguing that his earning power had been diminished by his cognitive struggles.

Mr. Kennedy provided more details, including about the apparent parasite, in the phone interview with The Times, conducted when he was on the cusp of getting on his first state ballot. His campaign declined to answer follow-up questions.

In the days after the 2010 call from NewYork-Presbyterian, Mr. Kennedy said in the interview, he underwent a battery of tests. Scans over many weeks showed no change in the spot on his brain, he said.

Doctors ultimately concluded that the cyst they saw on scans contained the remains of a parasite. Mr. Kennedy said that he did not know the type of parasite or where he might have contracted it, though he suspected it might have been during a trip through South Asia.

Several infectious disease experts and neurosurgeons said in separate interviews with The Times that, based on what Mr. Kennedy described, they believed it was likely a pork tapeworm larva. The doctors have not treated Mr. Kennedy and were speaking generally.

Dr. Clinton White, a professor of infectious diseases at the University of Texas Medical Branch in Galveston, said microscopic tapeworm eggs are sticky and easily transferred from one person to another. Once hatched, the larvae can travel in the bloodstream, he said, “and end up in all kinds of tissues.”

Though it is impossible to know, he added that it is unlikely that a parasite would eat a part of the brain, as Mr. Kennedy described. Rather, Dr. White said, it survives on nutrients from the body. Unlike tapeworm larvae in the intestines, those in the brain remain relatively small, about a third of an inch.

Some tapeworm larvae can live in a human brain for years without causing problems. Others can wreak havoc, often when they start to die, which causes inflammation. The most common symptoms are seizures, headaches and dizziness.

There are roughly 2,000 hospitalizations for the condition, known as neurocysticercosis, each year in the United States, according to the journal Emerging Infectious Diseases.

Scott Gardner, curator of the Manter Laboratory for Parasitology at the University of Nebraska-Lincoln, said that once any worm is in a brain, cells calcify around it. “And you’re going to basically have almost like a tumor that’s there forever. It’s not going to go anywhere.”

Dr. Gardner said it was possible a worm would cause memory loss. However, severe memory loss is more often associated with another health scare Mr. Kennedy said he had at the time: mercury poisoning.

Mr. Kennedy said he was then subsisting on a diet heavy on predatory fish, notably tuna and perch, both known to have elevated mercury levels. In the interview with The Times, he said that he had experienced “severe brain fog” and had trouble retrieving words. Mr. Kennedy, an environmental lawyer who has railed against the dangers of mercury contamination in fish from coal-fired power plants, had his blood tested.

He said the tests showed his mercury levels were 10 times what the Environmental Protection Agency considers safe.

At the time, Mr. Kennedy also was a few years into his crusade against thimerosal, a mercury-containing preservative used in some vaccines. He is a longtime vaccine skeptic who has falsely linked childhood inoculations to a rise in autism, as well as to other medical conditions.
In the interview, Mr. Kennedy said he was certain his diet had caused the poisoning. “I loved tuna fish sandwiches. I ate them all the time,” he said.

The Times described Mr. Kennedy’s symptoms to Elsie Sunderland, an environmental chemist at Harvard who has not spoken to Mr. Kennedy and responded generally about the condition.

She said the mercury levels that Mr. Kennedy described were high, but not surprising for someone consuming that quantity and type of seafood.

Mr. Kennedy said he made changes after these two health scares, including getting more sleep, traveling less and reducing his fish intake.

He also underwent chelation therapy, a treatment that binds to metals in the body so they can be expelled. It is generally given to people contaminated by metals, such as lead and zinc, in industrial accidents. Dr. Sunderland said that when mercury poisoning is clearly diet-related, she would simply recommend that the person stop eating fish. But another doctor who spoke to The Times said she would advise chelation therapy for the levels Mr. Kennedy said he had.

Mr. Kennedy’s heart issue began in college, he said, when it started beating out of sync.

In 2001 he was admitted to a hospital in Seattle while in town to give a speech, according to news reports. He was treated, and released the next day. He was hospitalized at least three additional times between September 2011 and early 2012, including once in Los Angeles, he said in the deposition. On that visit, he said, doctors used a defibrillator to shock his heart to reset the rhythm.

He said in the deposition that stress, caffeine and a lack of sleep triggered the condition. “It feels like there’s a bag of worms in my chest. I can feel immediately when it goes out,” he said.

He also said in the deposition and the interview that he had contracted hepatitis C through intravenous drug use in his youth. He said he had been treated and had no lingering effects from the infection.

Mr. Kennedy has spoken publicly about one other major health condition — spasmodic dysphonia, a neurological disorder that causes his vocal cords to squeeze too close together and explains his hoarse, sometimes strained voice.

He first noticed it when he was 42 years old, he said in the deposition. Mr. Kennedy for years made a significant amount of money giving speeches, and that business fell off as the condition worsened, he said.

He told an interviewer last year that he had recently undergone a procedure available in Japan to implant titanium between his vocal cords to keep them from involuntarily constricting."

[a fan]

^^^ You're arguing with yourself (as usual). I didn't think Clinton should have been prosecuted or impeached.

Great, I stand corrected. So now despite your claim Trump's treatment is new, you're telling me above that you know perfectly well that this has indeed happened before, and certainly not the domaine of the Dems. Starr and his team were Republicans. Trump is the second POTUS to receive this treatment, not the first. Hillary complained about this treatment in the 90's, and here you are complaining about it now in 2024.

So as I said, you think politicians should be immune to investigations or

Trump would not be prosecuted if he were not running again.

I argued the same for Hillary with the Benghazi game. And for Hunter's 6 year and counting "investigation" by a Republican prosecutor. Or, as you point out, Starr's handling of Clinton.

Welcome to DC. We can pass laws making these people immune from this sort of thing. Call your reps.

[old salt]

^^^ as usual, you are ignoring a significant difference. None of your whatsboutisms involved bringing criminal charges against a candidate or elected official in Federal or State Courts.

I did not say politicians should be immune from investigations, especially those initiated by Congress in their oversight role.
Most are done for accountability & do not result in referrals to DoJ & DoJ does not investigate & prosecute all referrals.
Again, none of your examples resulted in criminal prosecutions. THAT's the Banana Republic stuff, using a nation's Justice System as a political weapon to influence an election or to remove a candidate.

I agreed with Comey that Hillary should not be prosecuted because of the difficulty in proving intent.
Hillary was not prosecuted for Benghazi. The IC DoJ discovered her email "problem".

Hunter is not an elected official, He failed to pay his taxes, passed up a favorable misdemeanor plea deal, expecting lifetime immunity from other crimes (whose SOL's would soon expire). He's being prosecuted for his crimes & his failure to take a generous plea deal. He has no one to blame but himself. ...& that does not even address his irresponsible handling of a firearm.

[SCLaxAttack]

Bill Clinton was fined $90,686 in 1999 by US District Court Judge Susan Webber as part of a contempt of court plea for giving false testimony in the Paula Jones lawsuit. Neither Clinton nor Trump learned from Nixon.

[old salt]

^^^ That was not the result of a criminal investigation or prosecution by the DoJ or State AG.
Clinton perjured himself in a civil suit brought by an individual ?
Clinton was found in civil contempt, not criminal contempt.

[a fan]

^^^ as usual, you are ignoring a significant difference. None of your whatsboutisms involved bringing criminal charges against a candidate or elected official in Federal or State Courts.

To this day, you don't know what whataboutism is. Whataboutism is telling someone "person X did this bad thing too, therefore it's ok that person Y did a bad thing".

I'm telling you I want Americans prosecuted for breaking laws. Don't care if they broke laws or not. That's "aboutism", and applying the law equally.

I did not say politicians should be immune from investigations, especially those initiated by Congress in their oversight role.
Most are done for accountability & do not result in referrals to DoJ & DoJ does not investigate & prosecute all referrals.
Again, none of your examples resulted in criminal prosecutions.

Do you not realize how batsh9t crazy you sound? You've now moved the goalposts around so much to fit your worldview that you're on here telling a bunch of adults that you think that it's perfectly fine to investigate a politician----in this case, a sitting President Clinton, so long as there are no indictments handed out.

In other words, you're telling us that a politician is off the hook for wrongdoing if he's found to have broken a law, and at this point, the prosecutor is the bad guy. And the politician who broke laws is a good guy getting hit by a bad proscutor.

Read that again. This is a nutso way of looking at America.



Bill sat down at a deposition, FFS, Old Salt, and as a result Starr politically embarrassed Clinton in front of the whole world, even though he didn't commit a crime.

Here we have Trump who DID commit crimes, and you're telling us that it's "bad" that we dared to prosecute him for said crimes.

This is insane. And you're telling us that it's just a coincidence that you're a Republican giving Republican Trump a pass.....and a Republican telling us the Banana Republic that went after Dem Clinton was fine.

THAT's the Banana Republic stuff, using a nation's Justice System as a political weapon to influence an election or to remove a candidate.

Again, that's precisely what happened to Bill. They TRIED to remove him and/or weaken his political power.

Remember when you complained about how the mere investigation into Trump was interfering with Trump's ability to govern? How is it that this thinking doesn't apply to Bill Clinton, who was under investigation for four years by Starr?

You can't have it both ways. If you want to complain about Banana Republic stuff, that's a valid opinion. But you can't tell us Banana Republics are fine, so long as they are going after Democrats.

[CU88a]

Former House speaker Paul D. Ryan said in an interview Tuesday that he will not vote for former president Donald Trump in November, adding that he plans to write in another Republican candidate instead.

[Seacoaster(1)]

Former House speaker Paul D. Ryan said in an interview Tuesday that he will not vote for former president Donald Trump in November, adding that he plans to write in another Republican candidate instead.

He may not be Sununu, Barr and the other idiot-toadies to Orange Duce, but his gesture is largely empty. "I know democracy is on the line, and Trump is an odious proto-dictator, but I can't vote for the only candidate who can actually defeat him." Paul is a small time lightweight, trying to have things both ways, even when the chips are down.