2024 Bracketology

[coda]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

If ever there were a year to open up the tournament to others, this is that year. And if left to me, I’d be darn certain to throw a curveball at ND for their first game, giving them an unknown like St Joseph’s.

Also I would put you on the committee too, Coda; I have no idea who you root for.

I am a Michigan fan..

Roger that.

Duke’s performance today makes me want to limit the ACC representation in the NCAA tournament. The same goes for Maryland and the B1G.

Reward hungry scrappy teams.

The issue with the ACC is ceiling and floors. Duke has been up and done all year, but when they play their best, there maybe only 1 team in the country that can match that. Virginia is similar. As much as I want to leave UVa out for losing 4 straight, I still know they are one of a few teams that can win it all. You can say that for all 4 of the ACC teams. I don’t think you say that for the Big 10 or any other conference

[jrn19]

At some point you have to revisit RPI weighting. UVA is very likely in with no top 10 wins and strong losses. Meanwhile the Bubble IVY teams are out with better wins but also weaker RPI wins? Do I think UVA is a top 10 team? I do. Do i think losing to good teams means more than IVY good wins? I Don’t.

Maryland is a Top 10 win.

[HGK]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

If ever there were a year to open up the tournament to others, this is that year. And if left to me, I’d be darn certain to throw a curveball at ND for their first game, giving them an unknown like St Joseph’s.

Also I would put you on the committee too, Coda; I have no idea who you root for.

I am a Michigan fan..

Roger that.

Duke’s performance today makes me want to limit the ACC representation in the NCAA tournament. The same goes for Maryland and the B1G.

Reward hungry scrappy teams.

The issue with the ACC is ceiling and floors. Duke has been up and done all year, but when they play their best, there maybe only 1 team in the country that can match that. Virginia is similar. As much as I want to leave UVa out for losing 4 straight, I still know they are one of a few teams that can win it all. You can say that for all 4 of the ACC teams. I don’t think you say that for the Big 10 or any other conference

So eye test is now what % of the criteria?

[coda]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

If ever there were a year to open up the tournament to others, this is that year. And if left to me, I’d be darn certain to throw a curveball at ND for their first game, giving them an unknown like St Joseph’s.

Also I would put you on the committee too, Coda; I have no idea who you root for.

I am a Michigan fan..

Roger that.

Duke’s performance today makes me want to limit the ACC representation in the NCAA tournament. The same goes for Maryland and the B1G.

Reward hungry scrappy teams.

The issue with the ACC is ceiling and floors. Duke has been up and done all year, but when they play their best, there maybe only 1 team in the country that can match that. Virginia is similar. As much as I want to leave UVa out for losing 4 straight, I still know they are one of a few teams that can win it all. You can say that for all 4 of the ACC teams. I don’t think you say that for the Big 10 or any other conference

So eye test is now what % of the criteria?

That was just my opinion. but check RPI or any model and the ACC is still dominating.

[random observer]

Or even send GT to Md

Man, I hope so. This year you definitely prefer to be in the 2/3 bracket vs the 1/4.

I just ran it and I don’t see an advantage in seeding
#1 ND vs Albany- +10.3
#2 Duke vs Lehigh- +7.3
#3 Cuse vs Lehigh 15 - 8 +7
#4 Hop vs Towson 12- 10 +1.9
#5 Virgina vs St Joseph’s 14-11 +3.3
#6 Denver vs Michigan 11-11 -0.7
#7 Maryland vs Princeton 10-11 -0.2
#8 PSU vs Gtown +1.5

Wow, the Ivies go from a SIX bid league to a ONE bid league in 2 years. THAT has to be unprecedented.

Gobigred
Joewillie78

That's what happens when everyone's got covid eligibility, and only one league can't take advantage of it. There are multiple impact players on almost every top 10 team that would be in the ivy league if not for that rule imbalance.

[Farfromgeneva]

Army (one time #1 in the country) does not qualify?

Off the top of my head, I can’t think of another team that went from #1 to out-of-the-tournament in six weeks.

BU had their number this year. It would have been fun to see Army in the big dance where anything could happen.

Rutgers one year and Vermont one year

[jrn19]

Army (one time #1 in the country) does not qualify?

Off the top of my head, I can’t think of another team that went from #1 to out-of-the-tournament in six weeks.

BU had their number this year. It would have been fun to see Army in the big dance where anything could happen.

Rutgers one year and Vermont one year

When was Vermont #1?

[Finster]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

If ever there were a year to open up the tournament to others, this is that year. And if left to me, I’d be darn certain to throw a curveball at ND for their first game, giving them an unknown like St Joseph’s.

Also I would put you on the committee too, Coda; I have no idea who you root for.

I am a Michigan fan..

Roger that.

Duke’s performance today makes me want to limit the ACC representation in the NCAA tournament. The same goes for Maryland and the B1G.

Reward hungry scrappy teams.

The issue with the ACC is ceiling and floors. Duke has been up and done all year, but when they play their best, there maybe only 1 team in the country that can match that. Virginia is similar. As much as I want to leave UVa out for losing 4 straight, I still know they are one of a few teams that can win it all. You can say that for all 4 of the ACC teams. I don’t think you say that for the Big 10 or any other conference

So eye test is now what % of the criteria?

My eye test now says don’t invite Duke either.

Obviously I’m kidding (sort of), but underperformance drives me crazy in life. The teams which I feel are underperforming to the point I wish they’d be penalized for the tournament are Duke and Maryland. I see zero hunger.

I’m watching the Princeton Penn game. I’d give Penn credit for clawing their way back. That’s hunger. Duke is just lying down today. Embarrassing.

[random observer]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

You're right, Maryland is not a threat. But they earned an invite over any Ivy hopeful, who are not threats either. I mean, you can't be a threat if you lost to UNC, Brown, went 0-4 against 6-10 teams, or "limped in" by losing to Princeton twice in a row, who lost to non-threatening Maryland in one of Maryland's easier wins.

You can spin against any of the bubble teams, that's why the data matters. And UNC wasn't a threat in 2016 either.

If we did the threat or eye test then Notre Dame would be playing for a 3peat in national championships this year

I get your point, but no they wouldn't. 2022 Maryland was one of the best teams in the history of the sport, and idk why people act like ND would've been a serious threat to them. Sure, they played them to a two goal margin early in the season -- but that was at home during by far Maryland's most vulnerable stretch before they went supernova (that and their previous two games against Princeton and a terrible Cuse team where their most competitive games until the championship against Cornell).

[10stone5]

Three Pennsylvania schools in the NCAAs, a 4th came close - UPenn tbd.
4th time for Engineers.

[BigTurn]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

You're right, Maryland is not a threat. But they earned an invite over any Ivy hopeful, who are not threats either. I mean, you can't be a threat if you lost to UNC, Brown, went 0-4 against 6-10 teams, or "limped in" by losing to Princeton twice in a row, who lost to non-threatening Maryland in one of Maryland's easier wins.

You can spin against any of the bubble teams, that's why the data matters. And UNC wasn't a threat in 2016 either.

If we did the threat or eye test then Notre Dame would be playing for a 3peat in national championships this year

I get your point, but no they wouldn't. 2022 Maryland was one of the best teams in the history of the sport, and idk why people act like ND would've been a serious threat to them. Sure, they played them to a two goal margin early in the season -- but that was at home during by far Maryland's most vulnerable stretch before they went supernova (that and their previous two games against Princeton and a terrible Cuse team where their most competitive games until the championship against Cornell).

They played MD to 2 without Taylor. Offense completely transformed when he came back. I’m not saying they beat MD, but to act like they didn’t have a chance is a joke.

[rolldodge]

Or even send GT to Md

Man, I hope so. This year you definitely prefer to be in the 2/3 bracket vs the 1/4.

I just ran it and I don’t see an advantage in seeding
#1 ND vs Albany- +10.3
#2 Duke vs Lehigh- +7.3
#3 Cuse vs Lehigh 15 - 8 +7
#4 Hop vs Towson 12- 10 +1.9
#5 Virgina vs St Joseph’s 14-11 +3.3
#6 Denver vs Michigan 11-11 -0.7
#7 Maryland vs Princeton 10-11 -0.2
#8 PSU vs Gtown +1.5

I just don’t want Gtown to have to play ND in the quarters if they can get there.

[BigTurn]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

If ever there were a year to open up the tournament to others, this is that year. And if left to me, I’d be darn certain to throw a curveball at ND for their first game, giving them an unknown like St Joseph’s.

Also I would put you on the committee too, Coda; I have no idea who you root for.

I am a Michigan fan..

Roger that.

Duke’s performance today makes me want to limit the ACC representation in the NCAA tournament. The same goes for Maryland and the B1G.

Reward hungry scrappy teams.

The issue with the ACC is ceiling and floors. Duke has been up and done all year, but when they play their best, there maybe only 1 team in the country that can match that. Virginia is similar. As much as I want to leave UVa out for losing 4 straight, I still know they are one of a few teams that can win it all. You can say that for all 4 of the ACC teams. I don’t think you say that for the Big 10 or any other conference

So eye test is now what % of the criteria?

My eye test now says don’t invite Duke either.

Obviously I’m kidding (sort of), but underperformance drives me crazy in life. The teams which I feel are underperforming to the point I wish they’d be penalized for the tournament are Duke and Maryland. I see zero hunger.

I’m watching the Princeton Penn game. I’d give Penn credit for clawing their way back. That’s hunger. Duke is just lying down today. Embarrassing.

How about cuse then? Duke just blew their doors off 2 nights ago. If dukes out, then cuse has to go too

[10stone5]

Penn State might be the last in, they're close to not getting in.

Coaches should have made it clear to the team last night, they played as if they were already in.

[random observer]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

You're right, Maryland is not a threat. But they earned an invite over any Ivy hopeful, who are not threats either. I mean, you can't be a threat if you lost to UNC, Brown, went 0-4 against 6-10 teams, or "limped in" by losing to Princeton twice in a row, who lost to non-threatening Maryland in one of Maryland's easier wins.

You can spin against any of the bubble teams, that's why the data matters. And UNC wasn't a threat in 2016 either.

If we did the threat or eye test then Notre Dame would be playing for a 3peat in national championships this year

I get your point, but no they wouldn't. 2022 Maryland was one of the best teams in the history of the sport, and idk why people act like ND would've been a serious threat to them. Sure, they played them to a two goal margin early in the season -- but that was at home during by far Maryland's most vulnerable stretch before they went supernova (that and their previous two games against Princeton and a terrible Cuse team where their most competitive games until the championship against Cornell).

They played MD to 2 without Taylor. Offense completely transformed when he came back. I’m not saying they beat MD, but to act like they didn’t have a chance is a joke.

Their final game was a two goal win at home over a flawed Duke team that was nowhere near Maryland's level. What transformed their offense as much as anything was that they played against worse defenses down the stretch. I'm sorry but I wasn't remotely impressed with ND that year -- they feasted on bad Cuse and UNC teams, eked out two wins over a so-so Duke team, and lost to everyone else they played with a pulse. And you can't even say that many of the losses were impressive performances, which is why people overindex on the Maryland loss when they defend the Irish -- there's almost nothing else on their 12 game schedule to really point to that screams tournament contender at all, so they have to funnel the eye test towards that one performance. They got rinsed at home by Georgetown, and were beaten by 3-4 goals by average UVA and OSU teams. None of their losses were the type of 50/50 game that were lost by the flip of a coin.

They don't belong in the same sentence as this year's ND squad, let alone '22 Maryland -- which was at minimum a top 5 team in the history of the sport. FWIW I think they should've gotten the final at-large spot over Harvard, but they were no more likely to beat Maryland than any of the other teams with far more deserving resumes who got in ahead of them.

[BigTurn]

Tell me again why UVA is such an automatic? Yea, I get the RPI, but don’t you at least have to win some of those games, and not just play them? Wins against umd (do we know what they are , btw, from a quality perspective?), Harvard (didn’t make the Ivy tourney) and Mich (who before the Big10 tourney, hadn’t beaten anyone). 1-4 in ACC and have lost 4 straight.

Imagine what their RPI would be if they actually beat someone in the Top 10, and not just played them….

I don't see the case for UVA either. If anything, they're one of the few teams I feel has shown that they can't beat the top teams in the country.

Unfortunately for the bubble teams, they're also in a cushy position in the ACC where they can just lean on the RPI formula and fail upwards to a bid (and probably a seed).

Disregarding RPI and SOS, my eye test says Virginia belongs but Maryland doesn’t. Unless McNaney plays on his head, Maryland will just lose their first round game anyway; I’d give that slot to a team that plays to win.

Two other issues: ND has nothing to play for today while Duke might catapult to #2, amazingly. Yet ND plays with pride, so if you’re a Blue Devil, I wouldn’t count your chickens just yet.

Finally, how is Breschi on the committee? You think he’ll easily roll over for a deserving team over Tillman’s team, or Tiffany’s? These guys are friends. I’d rather nominate four Fanlax posters to be the committee. Not even kidding. JoeWillie, wgdsr, Wheels, Keno, and Blue Angel (and a few more in forgetting) seem to know strengths and weaknesses here better than Inside Lacrosse or any other pollster.

I agree 100%. There is something distasteful about UVa getting in losing 4 straight, but you can understand them getting in. Mostly because the individual talent is so good. They are a threat. Maryland is not a threat

You're right, Maryland is not a threat. But they earned an invite over any Ivy hopeful, who are not threats either. I mean, you can't be a threat if you lost to UNC, Brown, went 0-4 against 6-10 teams, or "limped in" by losing to Princeton twice in a row, who lost to non-threatening Maryland in one of Maryland's easier wins.

You can spin against any of the bubble teams, that's why the data matters. And UNC wasn't a threat in 2016 either.

If we did the threat or eye test then Notre Dame would be playing for a 3peat in national championships this year

I get your point, but no they wouldn't. 2022 Maryland was one of the best teams in the history of the sport, and idk why people act like ND would've been a serious threat to them. Sure, they played them to a two goal margin early in the season -- but that was at home during by far Maryland's most vulnerable stretch before they went supernova (that and their previous two games against Princeton and a terrible Cuse team where their most competitive games until the championship against Cornell).

They played MD to 2 without Taylor. Offense completely transformed when he came back. I’m not saying they beat MD, but to act like they didn’t have a chance is a joke.

Their final game was a two goal win at home over a flawed Duke team that was nowhere near Maryland's level. What transformed their offense as much as anything was that they played against worse defenses down the stretch. I'm sorry but I wasn't remotely impressed with ND that year -- they feasted on bad Cuse and UNC teams, eked out two wins over a so-so Duke team, and lost to everyone else they played with a pulse. And you can't even say that many of the losses were impressive performances, which is why people overindex on the Maryland loss when they defend the Irish -- there's almost nothing else on their 12 game schedule to really point to that screams tournament contender at all, so they have to funnel the eye test towards that one performance. They got rinsed at home by Georgetown, and were beaten by 3-4 goals by average UVA and OSU teams. None of their losses were the type of 50/50 game that were lost by the flip of a coin.

They don't belong in the same sentence as this year's ND squad, let alone '22 Maryland -- which was at minimum a top 5 team in the history of the sport. FWIW I think they should've gotten the final at-large spot over Harvard, but they were no more likely to beat Maryland than any of the other teams with far more deserving resumes who got in ahead of them.

I’m not arguing their tournament resume. They didn’t take care of business and it cost them, so be it. I agree that team was clearly are not as talented as this ND’s squad, or even last years. I just think they could’ve gave MD a game, but I’m not gonna argue over it.

[10stone5]

No chance for Quakers,

Tigers have (sort of, kind of) gotten to Carroll today.

[HGK]

Caroll great goalie but if you play that flat on arc you can’t hope for body saves. You have to attack.

[norcalhop]

Ivy is meh this year. So are most other conferences.

[keno in reno]

Dang this Notre Dame team is great. No idea how they lost to Gtown at home, but I'm they got one so they stay out of the GOAT conversation with the '22 Terps.