Cornell 2024

[RedIvy]

Just watching stats, almost all Penn States goals are assisted, are they getting feeds to the crease for door step goals and part of reason for low save rate?

[mfp]

Through three quarters, Cornell goalies' save percentage = 18% vs. 63% for Penn State. Saves are not just about the goalies, of course.

I was surprised to see that faceoffs are even. If feels like we're losing there too.

[Chousnake]

The clear has been terrible today. Why try to run through 2-3 defenders ? It's tough to see on the broadcast, but is nobody open for a pass on the clear? It's been too much 1 on 2 and 1 on 3 on the clear.

Just a bad day all around. Defense giving up too may open shots, rough day for the goalies, can't clear the ball, too many turnovers......Please make it stop. Time to forget this one and get ready for the league schedule.

[mfp]

The clear has been terrible today. Why try to run through 2-3 defenders ? Just a bad day all around. Defense giving up too may open shots, rough day for the goalies, can't clear the ball, too many turnovers......Please make it stop. Time to forget this one and get ready for the league schedule.

Yeah. Just a disaster all around. I hate the excuse that sometimes you have games like these that get out of control...but what else can you say? Cornell is not this bad. Absolutely not saying that they are better than Penn State, but this was not a representative showing. Still, the Cornell coaches and players need to own this performance.

[masondixonlax]

McNaney…. Why????? Just make the clear

[mfp]

There was a ground ball with 3:00-ish minutes to go in the 4th quarter that was emblematic of this game. Two Cornell players with clear path to picking up an easy ground ball. They don't communicate and end up giving the ground ball to Penn State.

[Finster]

McNaney…. Why????? Just make the clear

I think you’re in the wrong thread.

[joewillie78]

I think the future is NOW for Matt Tully. After things settled down a bit, he looked very solid.

I think he starts next week against a very good Princeton team.

Gobigred
Joewillie78

[WestVillCornell]

What’s going on w the defense??

Sloppy - no communication. Too aggressive on slides…

Need to get back to basics

[VeryRustyRed]

Not a good day. At all.
A few overarching points...for starters.
1) PSU dominated in Every phase of the game (including GB's all game). Our "best" area, ironically, may have been facing off.
2) The Penn State "Tambroni-coached" offense ain't a good match-up for Cornell. Think last year's game. Based on what I saw today, my guess is that the boys didn't watch tape of last year's Cornell-PSU game. They should have. Granted, this year is life without Adler.
3) This may have been the poorest defensive effort I've seen in many years, if not ever by Cornell.
Misc. Observations
-Things couldn't have started worse; I think we win the first F/O, get a good offensive possession, and Long gets a great look on an x-dodge and the goalie comes up big. Cornell has a great defensive possession against PSU's O. But with the clock down to 11 seconds, PSU scores when a Cornell defender turns his head and loses his man. Then Cornell losses 2 or 3 straight face-offs with PSU scoring on each possession. "Le deluge" has begun.
-While PSU won several one-on-one matchups, I couldn't believe how poorly connected we were on defense; time after consecutive time, poor coordination on shows, doubles, and slides --- while leaving one of two PSU players involved in picks open, or with tons of separation before a flailing defender could arrive. This really has to be cleaned up. There were times I thought I was watching a YouTube video of the same PSU goal, except different Cornell players' numbers were involved...but making the same fundamental judgement errors. Box played his heard out by did not have a good day. 6 and 35 had miserable days (whether it be poor judgement and/or lack of speed). Dooley's man was too fast for him - but he's 6'4" - he has to make better use of his 6' pole.
-Cornell got hung up several times and PSU scored almost every time, following a loss of concentration by a defender. Guys - either the goalie or the pole has to flush out the guy at x. Make them commit.
-At the end of the first half I thought to myself, PSU didn't take a bad shot the entire half; it will get better the second half. It didn't - rarely a bad PSU shot. JoeWillie - I have no idea why you would make the Tully vs. Knust comment. Relook at the 1st half tape. Tell me how many (if any) bad goals Knust gave up. Tully looked like a freshman in his first game to me.
-Great day in goal for PSU's tender. But he was no where near the reason why Cornell lost.
-Our EMO unit - I really believe we have the right personnel on the field. But as was the case vs. Denver, they seem so intent on getting the ball inside, that nothing happens; there are big shooters on the wings --- pull the trigger. We'll almost always have a backup anyway.
***Not much else to say. Watch the film - correct mistakes - get ready for a very important game next week.

[another fan]

Defense has been a problem all season. Today, a very good Penn State team completely exposed us. In addition to the comments about sloppiness, poor communication, over aggressive sliding, here's what I see. This was a near total team defensive breakdown, but some vulnerabilities seemed particularly noticeable. 88 and 50 are long and make some plays but can be run by. 33 is either hurt or has regressed. He seemed much more effective last year at lsm and maybe should be flipped with Rayhill. Of course, everybody looked better last year with Adler out there. Bozzi is a big loss, though Gilmartin has stepped up nicely. 35 is trying with a short stick, but struggles. 6 is experienced, but just cannot keep up with speed and creates extra problems for the rest of the D trying to cover for him. He also seems like an odd choice to get so much time as a face off wing. Man down D also struggles- lots of open door step cutters or hands free step downs with no defenders close by.

Penn State's goalie was fantastic and stole a few, but it was still not a great day for our offense either. Kirst, First, and Kelleher seemed like the only ones who could occasionally win a match up, but the combination of great goal tending and huge deficits had them forcing shots and not finishing opportunities. Long had chances, but was also stone walled a few times and failed to finish where he usually does. Man up is ineffective, especially for a team with as many good offensive players as we have. 23 scored a few inside man up goals last year but is not getting open inside, and seems to be passing up occasional opportunities from the outside. I saw Goldstein in uniform. I wonder whether trying him on man up is worth a shot.

Psyllos did well, particularly in the second half, but we know the loss of Cascadden will be a season-long issue.

We are a much better team than we showed today, but everybody, coaches and players, have lots of work to do. Somehow we need to both work on our deficits while not dwelling on the beating we took. Princeton will be a tough game, but opportunity for redemption. LGR

[ICGrad]

...but what else can you say? Cornell is not this bad.

Agreed. I can't remember a time I've seen a Cornell team look this bad. During an extended stretch in the 3rd, it was one unforced turnover after another. Literally missing their targets on passes and throwing the ball out of bounds. I think it happened on 3 straight possessions.

Ouch.

[ICGrad]

McNaney…. Why????? Just make the clear

I think you’re in the wrong thread.

Maybe he's purposefully trying to take our minds off of the Cornell debacle.

[ChadCascadden]

Old man football guy here. I’ve been in games like this with Parcells and Belichick. Solution is typically simpler than one would expect. Defense needed to be MORE aggressive to the point of being a man down all the time. When PSU ran two man games, BigRed should have been running THROUGH the pick like a freight train. Send a message. All mother fn day. You will pay to set a pick. Trust me, they’re think thrice the next time.

Offense needed to focus one thing: feeding the ball to CJ. Period. Run the entire thing through one man till they stop it. Feed the beast. (In my case, give the ball the Curtis Martin). Goalies had a rough day. It happens. FO did a decent job. But when you’re MORE AGGRESSIVE AND PHYSICAL, it sends a message to the other team/league that they are going to physically pay dearly no matter rain or shine and you better MF buckle up.

If you disagree with me then answer this question: what is the true identity of the team? Bet you don’t really know just yet. THAT is the real question. WHO are they really?

WHO ARE YOU?

May I suggest: Fast/SUPER Physical/SMART. (Sound familiar? Belichick)

This is a good team. Talent everywhere. Very capable.
Need to put a stake in the ground and declare it

WE ARE CORNELL!

[VeryRustyRed]

+++1!

[mfp]

WE ARE CORNELL!

Love this passion! Keep bringing it!

[faircornell]

If there's anything that Saturdays results show across the NCAA, it's that DI is an "any given day" type of situation this season.

Cornell has a ton of talent. The team will certainly be fired up for Princeton.

[VeryRustyRed]

'ChadC'
What I really liked about your post was the references to aggressiveness and team identity. While Adler is gone to graduation, THERE IS plenty of talent on this team. In retrospect, the boys did not have a good day & the coaches may not have had a great week in terms of game prep, but the seeming lack of aggressiveness, at least yesterday, stood out to me.

In regard to two observations/suggestions you made:
1) Running through picks instead of going underneath: In hoops, repeatedly going underneath picks is an absolute no-no (though it can be supported if a center effectively hedges and is able to recover). Lax is somewhat different, and runnig below picks was not the issue yesterday. The issue, time after time was a Very Poor job of coordinating on shows and doubles. The result was defenders getting caught in no man's land, unable to recover, or a late secondary slide leaving players uncovered or with lots of separation. Also, I want to review PSU goal highlights - my guess is that our defenders just aren't ACTIVELY using their sticks. So many hands free shots.
Additionally, Penn State's offense is very similar to that of Tambroni (as CU's HC), Milliman, and Coach B's - lots of ball movement, lots of player movement/cutting and redodges. Their dodges are more horizontal (reminds me of Princeton) than Cornell's north-south stuff. Defenders can afford to go underneath picks. But the communication and coordination MUST be there.
These comments aside, physical toughness was an issue yesterday (though it wasn't vs. Denver). 'Certainly don't want the "rep" as a finesse team.
2) Running the offense through CJ: Maybe we're thinking the same thing, but saying it differently. The offense typically runs through Long, rather than Kirst or is initiated via a north-south dodge to get the defense moving. Running it through Kirst exclusively will only cause opposing defenses to focus more on him (doubles or quick slides). What we want to happen is for Kirst to get lots of good looks. I'd rather get him matched up on a ss or secondary pole via two-man games. As it is, this season I think he's been unable to go right and get underneath his man. Far more (the great majority) of the time it's been curls to his strong hand where his defender can get support. Note - Kirst had 9 shots yesterday, twice as many as anyone else except Firth.

***Equally important with x's and o's is the intangible of (desired) team identity...and making it a reality.
My hope is that yesterday was a learning experience for everyone involved and we'll see a very different product on the field next Sunday against a good Princeton team.

[Ezra White]

'ChadC'
What I really liked about your post was the references to aggressiveness and team identity. While Adler is gone to graduation, THERE IS plenty of talent on this team. In retrospect, the boys did not have a good day & the coaches may not have had a great week in terms of game prep, but the seeming lack of aggressiveness, at least yesterday, stood out to me.

In regard to two observations/suggestions you made:
1) Running through picks instead of going underneath: In hoops, repeatedly going underneath picks is an absolute no-no (though it can be supported if a center effectively hedges and is able to recover). Lax is somewhat different, and runnig below picks was not the issue yesterday. The issue, time after time was a Very Poor job of coordinating on shows and doubles. The result was defenders getting caught in no man's land, unable to recover, or a late secondary slide leaving players uncovered or with lots of separation. Also, I want to review PSU goal highlights - my guess is that our defenders just aren't ACTIVELY using their sticks. So many hands free shots.
Additionally, Penn State's offense is very similar to that of Tambroni (as CU's HC), Milliman, and Coach B's - lots of ball movement, lots of player movement/cutting and redodges. Their dodges are more horizontal (reminds me of Princeton) than Cornell's north-south stuff. Defenders can afford to go underneath picks. But the communication and coordination MUST be there.
These comments aside, physical toughness was an issue yesterday (though it wasn't vs. Denver). 'Certainly don't want the "rep" as a finesse team.
2) Running the offense through CJ: Maybe we're thinking the same thing, but saying it differently. The offense typically runs through Long, rather than Kirst or is initiated via a north-south dodge to get the defense moving. Running it through Kirst exclusively will only cause opposing defenses to focus more on him (doubles or quick slides). What we want to happen is for Kirst to get lots of good looks. I'd rather get him matched up on a ss or secondary pole via two-man games. As it is, this season I think he's been unable to go right and get underneath his man. Far more (the great majority) of the time it's been curls to his strong hand where his defender can get support. Note - Kirst had 9 shots yesterday, twice as many as anyone else except Firth.

***Equally important with x's and o's is the intangible of (desired) team identity...and making it a reality.
My hope is that yesterday was a learning experience for everyone involved and we'll see a very different product on the field next Sunday against a good Princeton team.

What VRR & Chad said makes lots of sense. I couldn't watch either of our two losses, so take what I'm about to say with a grain of salt.

I played club lacrosse in graduate school, and what's been said reminds me of one game in particular. Our coach was a very good lacrosse player, who'd played in high school & college (D2, I think). He usually stayed on the sideline, but in this game he played his usual position of attack. It was a disaster. The coach kept dodging against a D that wouldn't let him dodge. He ran great practices and was a terrific teacher, but he never ran drills with us. Consequently, when we were on offense there was no sense of team play in this particular game. It was every man for himself. IIRC, we lost by almost as much as Cornell lost to PSU.

This year Cornell seems to have similar issues on defense.

Chad's comments about being aggressive is important, but we have to be careful about penalties (it seems they're being called more tightly than in the past, and our man-down still needs lots of improvement), and we have to match our style with our personnel. (E.g., don't expect 5'9" - 145# Goldstein to run through too many picks. Maybe in a year or two, when he's 5'10" & 175# and all muscle. Firth is 5'9" & 165#.) This shouldn't mean our more talented but less physically intimidating player should never get on the field: we just have to develop an identity and style that maximizes the personnel we have, which may mean pairing players that compliment each other.

I'd be interested to know how we stack up against other teams statistically by size and weight.

As someone who has not viewed either of our 2 losses (I did listen to the DU game), I realize I'm talking through my hat a bit. But judging from what's been said, team defense seems to be the first item on the agenda. Tailoring individual roles within the team seems to be the second.

[Farfromgeneva]

I need some clarification, feel like I’ve seen Wirtheim laying midfield hut his final ways lists attack. Am I lost on this one or is he regularly also playing moorings?